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No blizzard in November? - 10/31/2011 5:39:44 PM   
Oleg Mastruko


Posts: 4921
Joined: 10/21/2000
Status: offline 		I prefer random weather in my games, because it makes things more interesting and less predictable.

In one of my games blizzard came to one weather zone in turn 24, in November 41, ie one turn earlier than it usually occurs.

However, there were no blizzard effects (CV reduction etc) that turn. Is the game hard coded so that blizz effects occur in turn 25 even if the blizzard comes earlier to some parts of the map? Is this a bug or WAD?
Post #: 1
RE: No blizzard in November? - 10/31/2011 6:08:03 PM   
Joel Billings


Posts: 32265
Joined: 9/20/2000
From: Santa Rosa, CA
Status: offline 		22.3. FIRST WINTER RULE
The following rules impact the Axis player in the section of the map area delineated by
coordinates X>72 or X>54 AND Y<95 during Blizzard turns in any scenario that includes the
months of December 1941 through February 1942.


It should be more clear that it only happens in the months from Dec to Feb.

_____________________________

All understanding comes after the fact.
-- Soren Kierkegaard

(in reply to Oleg Mastruko)
Post #: 2
RE: No blizzard in November? - 10/31/2011 6:18:58 PM   
Oleg Mastruko


Posts: 4921
Joined: 10/21/2000
Status: offline 		So it's not really blizzard that froze poorly clad Germans to death reducing their combat value, it was when they saw Dec 41 on the calendar?

I mean weather model is funny as it is, but it does not make much sense to see German units fully combat ready during November blizzards, then reduced in the first week of December because some contrived rule says so even though weather didn't really change (blizzard to blizzard). If random weather brings blizzard earlier, then it should also bring a blizzard effects earlier.

Also, I believe that due to random weather Soviets may "lose" beneficial effects of blizzard if there is a random turn of snow anywhere in the blizzard period, so it's only fair to give them blizz effects in November (if it happens to blizz in November)

< Message edited by Oleg Mastruko -- 10/31/2011 6:20:55 PM >

(in reply to Joel Billings)
Post #: 3
RE: No blizzard in November? - 10/31/2011 6:29:14 PM   
heliodorus04


Posts: 1647
Joined: 11/1/2008
From: Nashville TN
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Oleg Mastruko

So it's not really blizzard that froze poorly clad Germans to death reducing their combat value, it was when they saw Dec 41 on the calendar?

I mean weather model is funny as it is, but it does not make much sense to see German units fully combat ready during November blizzards, then reduced in the first week of December because some contrived rule says so even though weather didn't really change (blizzard to blizzard). If random weather brings blizzard earlier, then it should also bring a blizzard effects earlier.

Also, I believe that due to random weather Soviets may "lose" beneficial effects of blizzard if there is a random turn of snow anywhere in the blizzard period, so it's only fair to give them blizz effects in November (if it happens to blizz in November)

+1, but is it codeable easily?

_____________________________

Fall 2021-Playing: Stalingrad'42 (GMT); Advanced Squad Leader,
Reading: Masters of the Air (GREAT BOOK!)
Rulebooks: ASL (always ASL), Middle-Earth Strategy Battle Game
Painting: WHFB Lizardmen leaders

(in reply to Oleg Mastruko)
Post #: 4
RE: No blizzard in November? - 10/31/2011 6:38:00 PM   
traemyn

 

Posts: 135
Joined: 1/21/2005
Status: offline 		I brought this issue up in the Suggestion thread but it didn't get any traction. There are other artificial rules that have been accepted as part of the game (1:1->2:1 for example - even more so now its just a couple of months). I assume they would love to have all of these kinds of rules out of the game but doubt they have the resources to fix them, and unfortunately this weather one doesn't seem to be a priority.

Do the majority of players play with Non-Random weather? I don't know.. but this issue doesn't get mentioned in AAR's a lot (if at all) so maybe that is the case..


(in reply to Oleg Mastruko)
Post #: 5
RE: No blizzard in November? - 10/31/2011 6:42:41 PM   
Oleg Mastruko


Posts: 4921
Joined: 10/21/2000
Status: offline 		I think the majority prefers pre-set weather. I hate it, because you know exactly which turn any of the very important, crippling events will happen. You should not know that. Basically I see random weather as the ONLY way of making the weather model less terrible than it is, ie marginally more interesting for players.

Apparently, though, some weather related events in the game are unreleated to weather. If that sounds completely crazy, that's because it is

(in reply to traemyn)
Post #: 6
RE: No blizzard in November? - 10/31/2011 6:57:59 PM   
JAMiAM

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Oleg Mastruko
Also, I believe that due to random weather Soviets may "lose" beneficial effects of blizzard if there is a random turn of snow anywhere in the blizzard period,...

No, there are no non-blizzard results during the Dec 41-Jan 42 portion in the "First Winter" period. Watch out for the first turn of Feb 42, however...

Having a blizzard result before the "First Winter" period should simply be seen as some slightly worse form of snow, much like it is during the rest of the war.

< Message edited by JAMiAM -- 10/31/2011 6:59:26 PM >

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Post #: 7
RE: No blizzard in November? - 10/31/2011 7:00:41 PM   
JAMiAM

 

Posts: 6165
Joined: 2/8/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Oleg Mastruko

I think the majority prefers pre-set weather. I hate it, because you know exactly which turn any of the very important, crippling events will happen. You should not know that. Basically I see random weather as the ONLY way of making the weather model less terrible than it is, ie marginally more interesting for players.

Agreed, and so strongly, in fact, that I will not play any game that has non-random weather.

(in reply to Oleg Mastruko)
Post #: 8
RE: No blizzard in November? - 10/31/2011 7:31:15 PM   
Encircled


Posts: 2024
Joined: 12/30/2010
From: Northern England
Status: offline 		+1

Playing a strategy game lasting as long as this one and playing so that you know exactly what the weather will be on Nov 4th 1943 is just bollocks.

_____________________________


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Post #: 9
RE: No blizzard in November? - 10/31/2011 11:30:57 PM   
pompack


Posts: 2582
Joined: 2/8/2004
From: University Park, Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Encircled

+1

Playing a strategy game lasting as long as this one and playing so that you know exactly what the weather will be on Nov 4th 1943 is just bollocks.



????

Are you agreeing or disagreeing with James?

No problem either way, but the way you stated it confused me

(in reply to Encircled)
Post #: 10
RE: No blizzard in November? - 11/1/2011 12:58:46 AM   
Commanderski


Posts: 927
Joined: 12/12/2010
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		I also random weather. That's the way weather is and both sides are affected. It can and does disrupt the best laid plans and you have to learn to adjust. I think the coldest weather was during the Dec - Feb time frame and that's what they are simulating. It wasn't so much as the snow but the cold that had the greatest affect on the Axis.

(in reply to pompack)
Post #: 11
RE: No blizzard in November? - 11/1/2011 2:04:41 AM   
Farfarer61

 

Posts: 713
Joined: 7/21/2004
Status: offline 		It is irritatingly fun to have random weather. Overall, I assess it disturbs the Axis much more though. Perhaps a) no Blizzard ever in the "Europe" zone and b) a chance of another Snow turn would even things out. When you have Mud Turns Roll across the weather zones at precisely the turns when that zone is "hot", the Axis effectively gets 3 turns in row of Mud where 50% of his forces are on offence. No one "knew" the winter of 41-42 was going to be what it was climate wise, so hey throw in just a tad of variety.

Playing Soviet, I of course insist on random weather :) In the Blizzard: " I will only hit you with a series of punishing left jabs this turn, instead of the usual right upper-cuts".


(in reply to Commanderski)
Post #: 12
RE: No blizzard in November? - 11/1/2011 3:12:49 PM   
TulliusDetritus


Posts: 5521
Joined: 4/1/2004
From: The Zone™
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Farfarer

Playing Soviet, I of course insist on random weather :) In the Blizzard: " I will only hit you with a series of punishing left jabs this turn, instead of the usual right upper-cuts".


You use your fists? I use a chainsaw

The Axis are not the only victim though. Random weather during the Blitzkrieg (a mud turn that is) did cost me on my current game (as Soviet) 10 rifle divisions in the Velikie Luki area

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Post #: 13
RE: No blizzard in November? - 11/1/2011 4:32:46 PM   
PeeDeeAitch


Posts: 1276
Joined: 1/1/2007
From: Laramie, Wyoming
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JAMiAM
Agreed, and so strongly, in fact, that I will not play any game that has non-random weather.


This is because James is a Weatherlord, capable of bringing down mud when his opponent leasts wants it.

_____________________________

"The torment of precautions often exceeds the dangers to be avoided. It is sometimes better to abandon one's self to destiny."

- Call me PDH

- WitE noob tester

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Post #: 14
RE: No blizzard in November? - 11/1/2011 5:09:55 PM   
Oleg Mastruko


Posts: 4921
Joined: 10/21/2000
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Farfarer
Overall, I assess it disturbs the Axis much more though.


That's because people stop playing to soon. In 43 and later variable weather disturbs Soviets more.

(in reply to Farfarer61)
Post #: 15
RE: No blizzard in November? - 11/10/2011 4:43:02 PM   
grosbil


Posts: 77
Joined: 10/8/2003
Status: offline 		I think a good solution could be an option to have historical weather till february 1942 and random weather after this date.
This avoid a poor german first attack due to mud or winter coming too soon...

(in reply to Oleg Mastruko)
Post #: 16
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