RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR)

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RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/1/2011 2:23:41 PM

Flaviusx

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I don't like this suicidal attack business. It's just giving the other side free morale boosts and lowering your own. If you cannot contrive to win the attack on the first shot, you probably shouldn't be doing it at all, unless it's an amazingly important objective.

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RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/1/2011 2:36:16 PM

terje439

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bletchley_Geek

Not sure if it's in the latest Ammended version of the manual, came in some patch note. I was lucky to remember that when working on the Spanish translation for Chapter 15

Combats have a Coordination Difficulty value, which is computed by adding up the values corresponding to each unit involved in the attack:

Corps: +15
Division: +9
Bde (more than 2,000 men): +5
Bde (less than 2,000 men): +3
Rgt: +3

when the sum exceeds the value of 28, then attacking ground elements chances to fire will be reduced. This reduction is proportional to the degree in which the limit of 28 points is exceeded.

Artillery ground elements aren't affected as much as other types of ground elements, as long as combat takes places at long or medium ranges (range in tactical combat starts at long, and there several steps, where this range is progressively reduced).

SU's aren't counted towards this limit.

So in the combat example you gave, from what I can see in the screenshot, the Coordination Difficulty score was at least

15 (21st Rifle Corps) + 9 (5th Rifle Div) + 5 (87th Rifle Bde) + 5 (93rd Rifle Bde) = 34

there are four other combat units going unaccounted.

EDIT: Since Tactical Combat is so much of a Black Box, it's hard to account for this when deciding whether or not to attack and when. If anything, for the Soviet player, this means that he might end up doing more damage if he attacks in "waves". Here lies in part one of the reasons why Q-Ball's earlier advice on "suicidal attacks" is the way to go when trying to puncture a Germans held line.

WOW! Invaluable information there, and unfortunately one that works to my disadvantage.
My attacks this turn were mostly performed by 4 corps and 2 divisions giving a value of 78, or 3 times the allowed number

But at the same time, I need such masses of troops to be able to reach a 2:1 unmodified CV ratio.
Hmm no big fan of damned if I do, damned if I don't situations

Terje

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Post #: 242

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/1/2011 2:43:45 PM

terje439

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Flaviusx

I don't like this suicidal attack business. It's just giving the other side free morale boosts and lowering your own. If you cannot contrive to win the attack on the first shot, you probably shouldn't be doing it at all, unless it's an amazingly important objective.

I kind of agree with you, in that I am throwing away some 5-10.000 troops, and lowering my morale. However the big problem for me is the insane (from a USSR point of view) defensive CV of German (and Finnish) units in a level 3 fort.

If we look at the various parts;
-Axis' high defensive CV
-Not exactly Typhoons in the USSR airforce
-Lack of arty units on my side (my own fault, yet the pools are not exactly overflowing with tubes either)
-An attack should consist of mostly 2 corps from my side it seems

That would mean I would launch attacks in the 1:2 - 1:1 range at best, where the defender usually has some units in reserve, which again translates into doing nothing all winter but stand and look at the invaders and wait for them to resume their offensive in the winter with still close to full strength.

I am in the situation where I need to inflict some casualties on the offensive against units with superior morale. I NEED to soften them up before attacking.
Now if this game had a tactical combat like FoF and CoG, THAT would be something else

Terje

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to Flaviusx)

Post #: 243

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/1/2011 3:36:55 PM

BletchleyGeek

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quote:

ORIGINAL: terje439
WOW! Invaluable information there, and unfortunately one that works to my disadvantage.
My attacks this turn were mostly performed by 4 corps and 2 divisions giving a value of 78, or 3 times the allowed number

Thank you, but I didn't mean that these ROF reduction due to poor coordination was a HUGE issue, it's an issue to take into account in order to use your forces in the most efficient manner.

quote:

ORIGINAL: terje439
But at the same time, I need such masses of troops to be able to reach a 2:1 unmodified CV ratio.
Hmm no big fan of damned if I do, damned if I don't situations

Those on-map CV's you're seeing can be quite a red herring, and in an startingly number of occasions, just plainly misleading.

Consider the displayed CV of a German stack. Say it reads 24, and the fort level is 3. The actual CV of that stack is 6, not 24. Those extra 18 points are due to the multiplier effect of fortifications. So as gingerbread said, I think, by all means, bring to the party as many sapper regiments as the fort level in the hex, so it gets reduced before the actual shooting starts. Note that this is chance-based, so it's just a rule of thumb, that might or not work.

So what I do - when I have corps in the attacking force or armies loaded to the gills with Sapper SU's and good leaders - is to think in the following terms:

1. On-map defensive CV is 24, hex fort level is 3
2. If the Fort level gets reduced by 0, def CV stays the same, then I'll need 48 CV
3. If the Fort level gets reduced by 1, def CV is 18, then I'll need 36 CV
4. If the Fort level gets reduced by 2, def CV is 12, then I'll need 24 CV
5. If the Fort level gets reduced by 3, def CV is 6, then I'll need 12 CV

Note that fort level reduction is chance based and depends on the Engineering level (some of it contributed by engineer elements in your on-map unit TOEs, other by Engineers) of the attacking force. I haven't done any testing, but it's fairly reasonable to assume that mild Fort level reductions are more likely than stronger reductions, and at the same time, the base chances are increased by the total engineering level. Can't give you any numbers on this - perhaps someone with a lot of time could get them - but I think it suffices with being aware of this.

A pessimistic estimate is that you'll be only to reduce by 1 level, and note that this would imply attacking with - according to the map display - 1.5:1 odds. I find it's a good rule of thumb.

Command and control is also very important: get rid of those negative modifiers because of several commands being involved. And for the important offensives, make sure the best & brightest are at the helm.

Last but not least, the "soft" factors. Ammo level, experience and fatigue levels can reduce (or multiply) the actual combat power of the unit to a vast degree. One thing with the Soviets that I think most people overlook is that until 1943 (?) Soviet units tend to suffer ammo shortages even when they're well supplied (this is somewhere in the Logistics chapter). And this can really reduce the ROF of the attacking force drastically.

Depending on how important is that attack for your plans, overcommitting - both SU's or combat units - is the way to go to stack the odds. Given WitE variability, you'll find yourself doing this whenever you are really after something.

Hope it helps, assessing combats in WitE is more an art than a science. Arithmetic alone will disappoint you quite often.

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RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/1/2011 4:13:43 PM

freeboy

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how true.. in on slit weather season my unit on the weather border went in and out of mud.. funny seeing it go from 1 to 15 ... I understand why this happens and it is odd...
but ok if forwarnded.. what is that old addage.. forewarned is for fore-armed

(in reply to BletchleyGeek)

Post #: 245

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/2/2011 12:26:33 AM

terje439

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Turn 81

Overall
Both sides launch attacks this turn. The Axis launch 6 attacks and score 2 retreats and 4 routs, while we launch 12 attacks scoring 3 held and 9 retreats. I am somewhat disappointed by one of our inflicted retreats. As we push 2 German mechanized divisions back, they only lose 18 AFVs, while one of our stacks that held (rifle corps with attached tank regiment) lose 78... I am losing heart in terms of keeping to attack, I am getting nowhere, and am instead alowing the Axis to destroy some of my forts because I had to gather an attacking force. I fear I made the wrong decision.
Losses are quite high on our side, not very high on the Axis side unfortunately. Numbers are reported at 35.000 Axis casualties to 96.000 on our side.
142.000 workers are returned to the manpower pool, and 92.000 are recruited this turn, leaving the manpower pool (active) at 2692.
Operation Fooled You must be considered to have failed, as the enemy panzer divisions seems to be moving north anyway.

Units
Nothing is built, but we get the usual airfield.
Although the ammount of new recruits was high this turn, so were our losses, so in the end we get a net increase of 134.000 troops this turn.

Partisans
With 17 active squads at the start of our turn, I am pleased to see 8 sabotague actions. That is one action per 2 active units, I can live with that a whole lot better than the Axis. Our planes decided to fly more supply missions again, making a total of 9 drops this turn. And the Axis seem to keep using quite a few units on anti-partisan duty, as they launch 9 attacks on partisans this turn, scoring 9 retreats.

Worries
I am not sure attacking is the right thing for me to do actually. My losses are way up, and the Axis losses are merely up. Besides I am not able to make any headway with my assaults, I just keep banging my head against the wall. I am considering falling back to my forts and let my strength rise and hope to grind the next Axis assault to a halt.

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by terje439 -- 1/1/2012 4:38:23 PM >

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"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

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RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/2/2011 1:12:59 AM

terje439

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Turn 82

Overall
Yup, I am about to halt any offensive actions. The Axis out-attack me, launching a total of 14 attacks, scoring 3 held, 6 retreats and 5 routs. This is compared to our 11 attacks which scores 4 held and 7 retreats. And he out-attacks me with all his mobile units not engaged in the fighting, this is looking dangerous to me.
With increased number of attacks comes increased number of casualties, 40.000 Axis troops to our 101.000 is not good for me. I am losing alot of troops now, it is almost as bad as summer. One thing looks clear, there will be no "Kursk" from the USSR for a long time still. I just do not have the needed CV.
With 147.000 returning workers and 92.000 new ones, our manpower pool is getting alot of manpower this turn, yet the pool is now at 1844. In comparison my active armaments pool is at 546.000...

Units
The good news first. A new rifle division is given Guard status this turn. On the other hand, those 3 mechanized brigades we built earlier are combined into a corps this turn, and I order the construction of 4 fortified zones (these are placed in the rear with a max TOE of 50%. They are merely placed to keep my forts from degrading), and 6 rifle divisions. These divisions are built in the south as this is where my front is at its thinnest, and I have spotted 6 panzer divisions and 4 mechanized divisions down here.
Despite heavy losses this turn, we manage to score a net increase of 128.000 troops this turn.

Partisans
A drop in number of sabotague missions this turn with only 3 being made. We manage to launch 9 supply drops this turn, so hopefully this number will rise again. The German force 9 units to retreat, leaving us with 15 units on the map.

Worries
Oh yes, definitively losing heart. I will most likely stop my attacks next turn, it is doing nothing but wearing my forces down, not the Axis troops.

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by terje439 -- 1/1/2012 4:38:34 PM >

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to terje439)

Post #: 247

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/2/2011 3:04:25 AM

terje439

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Turn 83

Overall
Bad bad bad bad bad. The Axis are letting their panzer divisions loose it seems. Moscow is now threathened, and at this point, if Moscow falls, my entire line falls, and with that, the war is lost. Strangely enough, the German attacks south of Moscow makes it important to attack north of Moscow, so I do not call of my attacks this turn. I need to put pressure in some areas to relieve pressure on my own defensive fronts. I am not able to launch anything but aerial attacks on the Axis panzers shown below this turn, but I try to pack the hexes around them with units, hopefully I can hold for just a few more turns. Still, I will need to build more units I think, I will need to have every single hex around Moscow occupied by atleast a division come spring.
The Axis launched 9 attacks, scoring 1 held, 7 retreats and 1 rout. We actually perform one attack more than the Axis, and score 2 held and 8 retreats. This in return means losses are still up from those peaceful turns a mere 4 turns ago. This turn 37.000 Axis troops are removed from the roster, compared to 97.000 of our brave soldiers.
Combining the ammount of manpower returned to the pool and those recruited this turn, 230.000 workers are added to the pool this turn, but the active pool drops a little more this turn, and is now at 828.

Units
Beside the usual airfield, I give the order to create another 7 fortified areas this turn, once more with a max TOE of 50%. This is because I really need units to stem the panzer divisions' possible bid for Moscow, and thus I need those fortified areas to keep the fort levels up.
Our forces managed a net growth of 132.000 troops this turn.
Also of note, the mechanized corps created last turn is allready at 40 morale, but alas they are now committed to the defense of Moscow before they are really ready.

Partisans
The only bright spot of the day. 19 sabotague actions were undertaken this turn. Sadly we only managed 3 supply drops, so I guess the number of attacks will drop somewhat again next turn. The Axis perform 5 attacks on our partisan units, leaving us with 20 on the map at the start of our turn.

Worries
I estimate the risk for Moscow falling, and hence the war being lost, at a staggering 20%. Things are not at all good at the moment.

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by terje439 -- 1/1/2012 4:38:44 PM >

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to terje439)

Post #: 248

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/7/2011 10:04:58 PM

terje439

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Turn 84

Apologies
This turn took some time as my old gaming PC crashed completely, and then Win7 used the better part of an evening patching up on the new computer, then add half a day for me to realize how the most basic features of win7 works, before spending some more time installing old games.
Oh, and of course about an hour was spent finding the right background image for my desktop

Also, for some reason Paint is completely reworked in win7 as well, and I am not at all comfertable with it at the moment.

Overall
Alot of action this turn, most of it behind the lines. The Axis keep pushing north towards Moscow, but I am also able to force some of their stacks back again. In the north I keep pushing the Axis backwards, and it is now a matter of who needs to readjust their front first.
The Axis launched 6 attacks on the line this turn, scoring 2 routs and 4 retreats. We on the other hand launched 13 attacks, scoring 5 held and 8 retreats, of which one of the held results was a bombardment by artillery only.
Our manpower pool saw 128.000 return this turn as well as 92.000 workers arriving from our centres around the empire, leaving the active pool at 4996 at the end of the turn.
A slight concern is that for the first time our active vehicle pool dipped below the 100.000 mark.

Units
Beside the usual airfield, I created 6 infantry divisions. I am too weak pretty much everywhere, so I need more units I am afraid.
Our units managed to report a net troop increase of 117.000 this turn despite heavy losses.

Partisans
It might seem the partisans are getting to the Axis as they went all out against my partisans this turn. No less than 15 attacks on my partisans forced the same number of units to retreat this turn. Nevertheless we still have 12 active units on the map, and these guys managed 4 sabotague actions this turn. Fortunately we also managed 9 supply drops this turn, so hopefully the number of active units will increase again.

Worries
The low losses the Germans take when they retreat is a concern. With the retreat of a panzer division and a mechanized division as well as attacks on two other panzer divisions, the total German AFV loss this turn is no more than 52.

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by terje439 -- 1/1/2012 4:38:56 PM >

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to terje439)

Post #: 249

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/7/2011 11:03:34 PM

terje439

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Turn 85

Overall
Noty alot of attacks by either side, yet both sides continue to slug on with their attacks. The Germans have managed to dislodge my Oka river line for good, I am not able to push them back. The good news I guess, is that none of my attacks failed. I launched 8 attacks, scoring 1 held and 7 retreats, where the held result was against an artillery barrage. The Germans as usual succeeded with all their attacks, scoring 1 rout and 4 retreats. It seems the panzer divisions are losing firepower though, I hope this trend continues.
Our manpower pool saw 132.000 workers returned to it, and 92.000 new recruits arrive this turn.

Units
One of our tank corps gained guard status, way to go guys!
I decided to disband two fortified areas as these were now in the frontline. As usual we get a new airfield this turn. The stack of unused airfields is really getting big now.
A net gain of 119.000 troops this turn is really welcome, as I will need as many men as possible to halt the Axis panzer divisions.

Partisans
Only 3 Axis attacks on my partisans this turn means we end the turn with 13 of them on the map. We also managed to get 5 sabotague missions undertaken, as well as 5 supply drops this turn.

Worries
The loss of the Oka-line is a concern.

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by terje439 -- 1/1/2012 4:39:05 PM >

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to terje439)

Post #: 250

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/7/2011 11:52:57 PM

gingerbread

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RE: Airbases

Could you post 3 numbers: The number of AB (CR - clear - none - AB - number top left), the number of Air groups (CR - Air groups - clear - number top left) and number of AG in NS (as AG plus select any AG with location reserve and press reserve - number top left).

In case you are wondering, if (#AG-#inNS)/#AB > 6 then you get a new AB.

(in reply to terje439)

Post #: 251

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 12:44:26 AM

terje439

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quote:

ORIGINAL: gingerbread

RE: Airbases

Could you post 3 numbers: The number of AB (CR - clear - none - AB - number top left), the number of Air groups (CR - Air groups - clear - number top left) and number of AG in NS (as AG plus select any AG with location reserve and press reserve - number top left).

In case you are wondering, if (#AG-#inNS)/#AB > 6 then you get a new AB.

Erm...I could try...
Just need to get a few things sorted out first though;
AB = airbases?
NS = national stockpile?
AG = airgroups?
CR = ?????

I know I have no airgroups in the national stockpile (as soon as they show up, they are transferred to an airfield).

Terje

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to gingerbread)

Post #: 252

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 12:50:24 AM

Flaviusx

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Needs more artillery divisions and rifle corps. Check the date: it's time for you to start cranking these things out.

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Post #: 253

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 12:51:04 AM

gingerbread

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Sorry for the cryptic post.

AB = airbases? [g:Airbase, yes]
NS = national stockpile? [g: Should be NR and reads National Reserve]
AG = airgroups? [g: Air Groups, yes]
CR = ????? [g: Commander's Report screen ]

You're not letting worn down AG rest up in the NR? They recover morale when transferred to NR.

(in reply to terje439)

Post #: 254

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 6:15:20 AM

sveint

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It's only 1943, be patient and only attack when it is favorable. In 1944 things will be different.

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RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 1:18:46 PM

terje439

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Flaviusx

Needs more artillery divisions and rifle corps. Check the date: it's time for you to start cranking these things out.

The problem is the number of available artillery pieces in my pool. Seems there are never enough. Same with manpower, pool is more or less dry, but I will build some more.

Terje

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

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Post #: 256

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 1:20:55 PM

terje439

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quote:

ORIGINAL: gingerbread

Sorry for the cryptic post.

AB = airbases? [g:Airbase, yes]
NS = national stockpile? [g: Should be NR and reads National Reserve]
AG = airgroups? [g: Air Groups, yes]
CR = ????? [g: Commander's Report screen ]

You're not letting worn down AG rest up in the NR? They recover morale when transferred to NR.

Will do a count when I do my turn.
Rest!? Nah. I need every bomber available to reduce the enemy divisions I need to attack. The difference between a panzer division stack that has been targeted by 10 bombing runs and one that has not been targeted at all seems vast to me.

Terje

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to gingerbread)

Post #: 257

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 1:21:01 PM

Flaviusx

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Production of artillery pieces is on demand. Build the divisions, and they will come. (Provided you have the armament pool to sustain the demand.)

Manpower is a different story, to be sure.

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Post #: 258

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 1:22:28 PM

terje439

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sveint

It's only 1943, be patient and only attack when it is favorable. In 1944 things will be different.

Yet, if I halt my attacks in the north now, Moscow will pay for it. For the time being I need to put pressure on the Germans somewhere and thus forces them to keep some reserves available.

Terje

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to sveint)

Post #: 259

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 5:09:19 PM

Schmart

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It looks like you have a lot of rifle brigades on the map. By 1943, the Russians (historically) had very few independent rifle brigades left. You should be using them to flesh out Rifle Divisions and building up Rifle Corps. That way you can get more manpower into the front lines, and bring more firepower to bear against the enemy.

< Message edited by Schmart -- 12/8/2011 5:10:04 PM >

(in reply to terje439)

Post #: 260

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 5:56:44 PM

terje439

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Flaviusx

Production of artillery pieces is on demand. Build the divisions, and they will come. (Provided you have the armament pool to sustain the demand.)

Manpower is a different story, to be sure.

Aha, another piece of information I might have aquired if I actually read the manual I suppose. Did not know this, great info!

Terje

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to Flaviusx)

Post #: 261

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 5:58:06 PM

terje439

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Schmart

It looks like you have a lot of rifle brigades on the map. By 1943, the Russians (historically) had very few independent rifle brigades left. You should be using them to flesh out Rifle Divisions and building up Rifle Corps. That way you can get more manpower into the front lines, and bring more firepower to bear against the enemy.

Well, I cannot remove them without weakening the front right now, I need to make it gradual, first I need to build new units (a) then I can remove units (b), where (a) must always be > than (b).

Terje

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to Schmart)

Post #: 262

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 6:09:37 PM

Schmart

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quote:

ORIGINAL: terje439
Well, I cannot remove them without weakening the front right now, I need to make it gradual, first I need to build new units (a) then I can remove units (b), where (a) must always be > than (b).

Terje

I guess I understand. However, you are not removing units. You are making existing units stronger, allowing you to concentrate more strength against the enemy.

Rifle Brigades should be used to:
A - Merge 2 Rifle Bdes to form a Rifle Division
B - Merge with an existing weak Rifle Division to give the Division more strength
C - Merge 2 Rifle Divisions and 1 Rifle Brigade to form a Rifle Corps

(in reply to terje439)

Post #: 263

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 6:53:22 PM

Flaviusx

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I merge all my brigades into divisions in May of 42. They certainly should be gone by 1943. There's no benefit to doing this "gradually." It should be done all at once, and as early as possible.

Rifle brigades are crap. They can't dig. They can't defend. They can't attack. The old tactic of spamming forts with swarms of rifle brigades is basically dead, and a carpet of ant brigades is just going to get overrun by any serious German attack. Hell, to my way of thinking rifle divisions are ants. Rifle brigades are an ant's ant.

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RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 8:44:27 PM

terje439

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About my brigades, they perform a crucial role in that they are keeping my level 3 forts up, and in lack of other troops they are used as roadblocks. They still have to be attacked for the Axis to attack.

Terje

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RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 8:56:36 PM

Flaviusx

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You should be looking at transforming the Red Army into version 2.0 -- that version doesn't include pissy little rifle brigades. It's about the big boys, the rifle corps, artillery divisions, and mobile corps. Those rifle brigades are building blocks for real units. So far as ants go, you have rifle divisions for ant duty. You ought to have well over 400 rifle divisions once the brigades are consolidated. That's more than enough to form 100+ rifle corps with plenty of divisions left over for picket duty in quiet areas of the front.

You're not going to get to Berlin on time, or ever, with rifle brigades. Phase them out ASAP. Think big, not small.

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RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 8:57:44 PM

terje439

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Turn 86

Overall
The Axis keep pushing on Moscow, I keep pushing south of Moscow and in the north.
We performed 12 attacks this turn, scoring 5 held and 7 retreats. Two of the held results were artillery only attacks, so those are ok. The Axis on the other hand launched 7 attacks and scored 1 held, 2 rout and 4 retreats.
Losses are reported at 43.000 and 118.000 this turn.
Our manpower pool had 134.000 pair of hands returned to it and 92.000 fresh recruits this turn, ending at 9227 at the end of the turn. Our vehicle pool is back above 100.000, as we are now at 102.000. The armaments pool is at 683.000, so that is looking good.

Units
I created 9 rifle divisions, 2 artillery divisions (42 model), 2 rocket launcher divisions this turn. In addition I recieved one cavalry division and a rifle division alongside my always appearing airfield. 2 new fortified areas was removed this turn as they have performed their mission and their hexes were on the frontline all of a sudden.
Our forces increased by 110.000 this turn, which is a good number because of our high losses.

Partisans
The Axis launch 6 attacks on our partisans this turn, this leaves 14 active units on the map at the end of our turn. 9 supply drops were made, and our partisans repaid by performing 8 sabotague actions this turn.

Airfields
Numbers are given as number of airfields x number of squadrons on it.
2x1
1x3
3x6
1x7
6x8
59x9
For a total of 609 squadrons at 72 airfields.
And at the moment I have 22 unused airfields on the map.

Worries
Moscow...I will soon have to remake my entire frontline it seems.

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by terje439 -- 1/1/2012 4:39:47 PM >

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RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 9:51:10 PM

gingerbread

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Thanks for counting. 609/94>6 so you will be getting more Airbases.

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RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 10:16:57 PM

terje439

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Flaviusx

You should be looking at transforming the Red Army into version 2.0 -- that version doesn't include pissy little rifle brigades. It's about the big boys, the rifle corps, artillery divisions, and mobile corps. Those rifle brigades are building blocks for real units. So far as ants go, you have rifle divisions for ant duty. You ought to have well over 400 rifle divisions once the brigades are consolidated. That's more than enough to form 100+ rifle corps with plenty of divisions left over for picket duty in quiet areas of the front.

You're not going to get to Berlin on time, or ever, with rifle brigades. Phase them out ASAP. Think big, not small.

I hear you, but if I was to remove all my brigades in the next few turns, where do I get the needed command points? And what do I put in place of those removed units (1 corps = 2divs and 1 brigade after all) on my line?
When I allready state that I am too thinly spread it becomes difficult.
That being said, I agree with your view, but it cannot be done "overnight".

Terje

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RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) - 12/8/2011 10:19:53 PM

terje439

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quote:

ORIGINAL: gingerbread

Thanks for counting. 609/94>6 so you will be getting more Airbases.

Seems I should be getting another 8 then, ok thanks for clarifying.

So, what is the view amongst the people here, should I stack 6 aircraft units per airfield, and hence use alot more of them at the front, or keep them maxed out at 9 and have fewer units at the front?
I guess airfield attacks will be more devastating against a maxed out airfield, but the Axis aren't using airfield attacks...
Using more airfields means more congestion behind the front which is imo not a good thing...

Terje

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