RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A)

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/1/2012 6:34:34 PM

Encircled

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So whats your gut instinct reckon then?

Port Blair?

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/1/2012 6:40:11 PM

Canoerebel

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I think it's probably Sabang with Port Blair a possibility. Anything beyond Sabang seems awfully risky for a player of Steve's caliber and native caution. But, here's the thing: I don't know just how risk-taking Steve might be open to, and I don't know just how much information he is acting on or missing. What if he thinks my carriers are guarding Australia? He'd be much bolder. What if he knows exactly where they are? It seems unlikely he'd penetrate too deep into the Bay of Bengal with so many of his carriers currently in NoPac (I don't know which ones exactly, but I know the roster includes Akagi and Ryujo plus at least a few others).

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/1/2012 6:42:18 PM

Cap Mandrake

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

I've been through a similar campaign against Q-ball two games back. The seizue of the bases is definately to disrupt transportation from India proper to the Assam frontier or else it's to create the appearance of a threat to serve as a distraction. Either way I don't think it will be effective. I have too many troops nearby to reclaim the two bases taken. As for Chittagong and poitns east, they aren't strongly held and typically I won't defend them strongly, though we're getting late enough into the game where I'm beginning to make movemetns in order to do so. For now, I think it will be pretty tough for Steve to go all the way to Assam/Chittagong region. He'd have to bypass Port Blair and Ceylon and he'd be deep in Indian country with large Allied forces able to threaten his path of retreat.

I agree. I was just trying to put a burr under your saddle for entertainment purposes.

A landing in India proper without the KB would be muy macho.

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/1/2012 7:39:17 PM

Canoerebel

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3/14/42

Indian Ocean: The Japanese amphibious armada passed Sabang and is making for Port Blair (or possibly a point further northwest like Akyab. BC Repulse TF sank the three enemy troop transports hung out in no man's land. These ships were carrying men, but I think they were serving as pickets mainly. The Allied carriers are 15 hexes due south (true) of the main enemy carreir TF. Now comes the time to sweat. My carriers will veer a bit to the NW as they begin to move toward Port Blair. If Steve knows where they are and wants to engage, or if he just chooses to change course a bit to the SW, a clash may occur. I think Formidable will link up and become part of my carrier force overnight. The time to sweat has come. I'm thinking Steve knows or has a good idea where my carriers are, in part because of his massive net of submarines.

China: No news yet.

Burma: The Japanese take lightly-held Lashio.

North America: I lost sight of the Japanese carriers today and there were no enemy raids whatsoever.

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/1/2012 8:27:02 PM

Cap Mandrake

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This is fun to watch.

Hard to believe anyone would voluntarilly land at Ayab and then walk up that crummy trail with all the tigers and snakes.

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/1/2012 8:32:04 PM

Capt. Harlock

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quote:

Minneapolis and Helena led a combat TF into Port Moresby, tanling with an IJN CL TF followed by a TF led by CA Furutaka. The Allies claimed one destroyer sunk and didn't lose any ships, but overall I was disappointed in the outcome. Minneapolis took a torp and will require some time in the yards.

Have to agree. Minneapolis and Helena are among the best cruisers you've got, while Furutaka is one of the four worst Japanese CA's.

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/1/2012 10:17:00 PM

pws1225

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Cap Mandrake

This is fun to watch.

Yep, I'm enjoying this game!

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 1:02:50 AM

princep01

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Good job with the repulse TF, Admiral Canoe. However, that attack might attract some enemy CV action, so I hope the Repulse TF manuvers to a safe distance.

Might I ask who is in charge of the Lex/Ent TF? Hasley? If so, I KNOW he is chafing at the bit to engage those CV/CVLs more closely. When their weren't tyhoons about, he was a pretty good fighting man.

Do your CVs show being detected? With all those subs in the screen, I suspect they have been sighted.

Again, it is just my 2 cents, but this is a nice opportunity to bruise Mr Q-Ball badly if you concentrate you available CV assets.

Good luck.....we are all swaeting witrh you under the Indian Ocean sun.

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 1:04:29 AM

princep01

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And my apologies, The opponent isn't Mr Q-Ball, but Admiral PJH. Mea culpa.

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 1:08:08 PM

TheLoneGunman_MatrixForum

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quote:

ORIGINAL: princep01

And my apologies, The opponent isn't Mr Q-Ball, but Admiral PJH.� Mea culpa.

We appear to be dragging GJ's AAR into this thread...

At any rate, I'm very excited to see what's going to happen Canoe!

I've stopped reading PH's version, as I want to stay surprised.

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 1:38:39 PM

Canoerebel

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We all experience the drama created by uncertainy, but here's soem of the factors I've been weighing over the past few turns (as I get ready to run the next turn having no idea if there was a big clash or nothing at all):

1. None of my carrier TFs have showed a detection level nor have they had an encounter with an IJ sub (otehr than aircraft reporting them). Does this mean Steve doesn't know my carriers are here despite allt he traffic? Unlikely, but not impossible.

2. My cruiser floatplanes keep reporting enemy subs. Is Steve assuming that all the activity is just combat shipping? Unlikely.

3. Did Steve get enough information from his last West Coast carrier raid to know that carrier fighters participiated in the CAP? If so, does he put this together with 1) or 2) and think my carriers are not in the IO? Unlikely.

4. Does he think my carriers are around Oz? Unlikley.

5. In addition to the big amphibious armada making for Port Blair (or further), Steve has some that appear to be outliers perhaps targeting Diego Garcia or the like. Is Steve rolling big dice here? If so, doesn't that mean he isn't aware that my carriers are present? This falls into the "too good to be true" category.

6. Just how many carriers does Steve have? I know Shokaku and Soryu are present, but cursor intel doesn't show a vast number of carrier aircraft. Can Ent/Lex/Indomitable/Formidable/Hermes handle what's out there? Possibly.

7. We are closer to Colombo than any decent IJ naval base (Steve's out on a limb since I still hold Singapore, though he can report to Georgetown and Rangoon in an emergency).

8. The Allies might be able to send good RAF fighters to Port Blair...but Japanense BBs might bomb the level-two airfield out of operation.

9. Does all this indicate Steve has pulled a big maskirovka and has been planning on India all along?

10. If so, how well have the Allies done to stymie such a move? Is the garrisoning of Diego, Attu, Socatra effective? Two Marine RCT and one Army RCT are in India with another Army RCT scheduled to leave Capetown in a week. An Oz division is at Karachi with most of another on ships now steaming that way (and SW of Cocos Island) with another Brit division arriving at Aden in a month...is all this enough to defend India properly?

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 2:27:42 PM

Canoerebel

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3/15/42

No major clashes today, but there's lots of power in close proximity. But what in the heck is Steve up to?

Enemy Disposition: The Japanese landed a small force at dot hex Little Andaman Island. No move on Sabang. No move on Port Blair. Two big TFs - one including heavy combat ships and another at least a CVE or CS - are close to Burma on a course that would take them to Rangoon. The main IJ carrier force is located just off the tip of Sumatra, which means it didn't move very far. My carriers are only 14 hexes to the WSW (true) and in good position to move due north to provide protection for Port Blair and to possibly threaten than enemy force moving towards Rangoon. There's also an enemy TF with combat power near Colombo (it forced some of my ASW TFs to retire). I don't think it's much, but it might be a picket or scout of some sort. The main enemy amphibious concentration is still near Sabang, as though Steve is uncertain where he's going now. Further out, I picked up signs a day or two ago that there might be an amphibious TF moving to the deep SW, on a heading that might mean Diego Garcia. I"ve got alot of thinking to do, but right now the Allies are in good position to block or contest any deep thrust. Sabang and Port Blair are vulnerable, but my carriers can now cover Ceylon, the other island or, if needed, Assam.

Enemy Intentions I am unsure. Could this be just to reinforce at Rangoon? That would be overkill. It still makes more sense that Steve orchestrated somehting major - Port Blair, Assam, Ceylon - that is still underway. And it's also possible Steve has picked up enough info to know my carriers are present in some force, so that he, in turn, isn't quite sure what to do now. Very tense.

Line in the Sand: I cannot save Sabang or Port Blair against a well-thought-out massive operation, so I won't impale myslef in trying. But at this date, I would fight hard to protect Ceylon and Diego Garcia, and probably NE India. Any major enemy moves that deep, though, would be rather risky, so I think they are unlikely but not entirely impossible.

China: Nine enemy units across the river from the Chinese defenses just north of Lanchow. By tomorrow, I'll have about 1400 AV there. I don't think Steve is ready yet to cross in strength, though he may try a reinforce probing assault. I have alot more troops on the way, but all are a week or more distant. If that desert/rough terrain is 3x, I can probably hold off a three to five division attack. I don't think Steve can bring more than that before my own reinforcements arrive. Elsewhere in China things are static, which means "good."

North America: Quiet.

Australia: Quiet, except that Port Moresby will fall tomorrow.

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 3:07:10 PM

Canoerebel

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Tough decision today. I was torn between keeping my carriers within supporting distance of Diego Garcia and moving them north to be in position to react to a move on Assam or Port Blair. I ultimately decided on the latter course for these reasons:

1. Port Blair's defenses are likely to surprise Steve and be able to hold out against anything up to a division or reinforced division. An American CD unit arrives tonight. The airfield just went to level three and has aviation support for 80 engines. I have a PBY squadron there with a good Hudson bomber squadron that will be joined by a good-skilled Blenheim squadron tomorrow. The AV is 205 with three forts and lots of supply.

2. That enemy picket or scout TF appears to be retiring to the SW, so she might stumble across my carriers if I stayed in place or moved south. There's a chance my carriers have evaded Steve's elaborate network of tripwires so that he won't be aware of their presence in the Bay of Bengal.

3. From their position tomorrow, they can respond rapidly to moves on Port Blair, Assam or Ceylon. They could be at Diego Garcia in, I think, two days.

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 3:26:51 PM

BBfanboy

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Having "demonstrated" at the gates of North America for three months hoping to provoke a carrier battle, PzJH seems to have determined your carriers are in the IO and is launching a massive "bait and trap" to get them. Why else would he dangle two CVs in the initial contacts, then send combat TFs and small amphib TFs in harms way, with a large amphib TF nearby to keep you in the area. Now your screen image shows a lot more carriers present and hanging back for a pounce rather than clearing the way for a landing somewhere. Nice cat and mouse scenario with the cat and mouse roles yet to be decided!

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 3:41:42 PM

Kereguelen

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1. If the IJN carriers you spotted did not move last turn, they are most likely escorting (protecting) a slower TF or did some refuelling.

2. It doesn't make any sense (to me) to move TF's along the western (map directions) coast of Sumatra if Port Blair is the target.

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 4:01:34 PM

Canoerebel

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He had to move them along the bottom side of Sumatra, because the Allies still hold Singapore (so he can't sail past that fortress).

Steve may be cat-and-mousing me, but here's a question I have. If he had good intel on my carrier force stationed for so long near Cocos Island, why didn't he pounce there?

Here are a few other details that might be of interest:

1. Lexington has never been in port. Enterprise visited Perth for a day or two several months ago. For basically the entire war, these two carriers have been near Cocos, awaiting a chance to pounce on a Japanese invasion TF or in good position to react to an IJ move on Oz or India. Taht means both carriers are still flying with incomplete air squadrons. So be it. (Of course, they'll report to Colombo to attend to matters as soon as this little campaign is complete).

2. The looming Battle of Lanchow may be the most important of the war. If Japan indeed is bringing five or more divisions way out here, and if the Allies succeed in blocking that force, then the Allies have won a huge victory. The Allies have a vast advantage in interior lines, meaning it would take Japan months to retrieve its army if it becomes stalemated way out there. (The Chinese force will actually reach 1730 tomorrow and each unit has a good leader - 50s or 60s - so I have high hopes for this campaign.)

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 4:30:10 PM

Kereguelen

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Oops, completely forgot about Singapore.

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 5:32:01 PM

Canoerebel

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3/16/42

An elaborate and tense dance continues to unfold....

Allied Carriers: A two-DD Japanese scouting force stumbles across the Allied carriers, which sortie in big numbers but ineffectively, which is rather embarrasing. SBDs manage a single hit on one DD. Now Steve knows exactly what he's facing.

Japanese Carriers: Several light carriers or CS are escorting what appears to be an invasion force making for Akyab, Cox's or Chittagong. The main Japanese carrier force is between Port Blair and Malaya, not in a good position to try to pursue my carriers.

Japanese Intentions: SigInt reports various units including 5th Div. in transports bound for Port Blair. Likelihood of accuracy pretty high. The force moving towads the Assam sector could reach the beaches before my carriers could arrive, but this could be a feint or, even if not, Steve might pull it back since he knows my carriers are fairly close.

What's Next: Most of the Allied dive bombers report for duty to Akyab. Most of the torp squadrons, which don't have long legs, report to Madras where they can move on to Calcutta if their presence should be required. Lots of high-experience RAF Blenheim squadrons are posted at Calcutta and Delhi. This is all intended to contest an invasion of Akyab or further west. The Allied carriers will retire to the south and eventually seek port at Colombo or Bombay to replenish and upgrade. (The RN carriers will probably remain at sea to cover Diego Garcia.) The full scale fo the enemy opeation isn't clear yet and I'm not even sure of what the targets are. It could be something elaborate that might target Diego, Sabang, Port Blair and Akyab or a base west. Or it could be considerably smaller. Overall, though, the Allies are in good position to parry and thrust.

China: Eleven IJA units in the hex north of the hex north of Lanchow. My 1630 AV are in place with full supply and good leaders. I hope the enemy assault isn't coming yet, but it could any day. Probably the key battle to this point, and possibly the most important of the entire war.

North America: Mighty quiet.

Oz: Port Moresby falls. Otherwise quiet.

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 5:42:31 PM

Canoerebel

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Email just received from Steve: "I havent sees the turn yet, but if you moved your CVs towards Pt Blair, we will have a CV battle today."

Of course, we won't. :)

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 5:49:04 PM

Schlemiel

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You would deny the good readers of your AAR a carrier battle? No wonder Greyjoy beats you in reads ;)

Looks like a fun game so far, I'm interested to see how the various theaters develop.

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 5:49:39 PM

Canoerebel

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In turn, this tells me that Steve was maneuvering for a carrier battle, which tells me that I don't want to accept one since he thinks it's on terms to his liking.

Steve has orchestrated a massive operation, but of necessity it has been slow in unfolding. In part this is because of his maskirovka (such as not taking Singapore) but in part by the size, layers, and hard-to-pin-down nature of the Allied defenses and preparations. And that's exactly what the Allies are shooting for at this point in the game - Port Blair and redoubts like it cannot stave off an all-out Japanese move in March 1942, but they can serve as effective speed bumps. Steve is smart and will take smoe ground in this invasion, but my early-on evaluation is that the Allies have handled this pretty well.

(Steve's email comment could be disinformation, but I don't thinks so.)

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 6:05:39 PM

Encircled

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Could the Carriers that where bothering whales and suchlike in NORPAC and CONUS have made it back across the pacific to assist?

It sounds too far, but at flank speed?

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 6:06:37 PM

Canoerebel

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No, those carriers were off San Francisco four or five days ago. They are still in NoPac.

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 6:08:01 PM

Encircled

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Yeah, just realised as I posted

Memory issues are a problem as you get older at a guess!

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 7:25:14 PM

Historiker

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quote:

In turn, this tells me that Steve was maneuvering for a carrier battle, which tells me that I don't want to accept one since he thinks it's on terms to his liking.

Or this means that he is surprised by your strength and hopes you'll think exactly this.

You gotta love the mind games. It is a shame I don't talk more with my opponents about the game

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 7:36:02 PM

Canoerebel

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3/17/42

Japanese Invasion: It appears that the Japanese invasion target is Akyab (and perhaps other bases further to the rear, like Port Blair and Sabang). It's also possible that the Japanese armada could move further west, but that would risk facing the Allied airforce at Calcutta and Delhi.

The Locus: Allied air from Akyab, Delhi and Calcutta sortied in big numbers. The dive bombers managed several hits apiece on one-each troop-carrying xAP and xAK. 30 Blenheims sortied vs. a bombardment TF targeting Akyab, but all missed. The bombardment then tore up the airfield, rendering it useless. That forces the Allies to fight from Delhi and Calcutta, which probably means that the opportunity to strike a more significant blow has passed. If Steve does come ashore at Akyab (and/or Cox's or Chittagong), the Allies can fight hard to impede their progress as they move inland, using bombers for this purpose. I don't mind waging a war for NE India; it's the rest of the country that really concerns me. Allied troops have eliminated one pocket of IJ paratroops (at the base that Steve didn't take). Now a Marine regiment is moving on to the dot hex that did fall. I want Steve to see the Marines and consider what that could mean for him in India. It will take the troops a week to reach the Japanese-held base.

IJN Carriers: currently located just NW (true) of Andaman Island.

Allied Carriers: just east (true) of Ceylon, they will retire to either Colombo or Bombay.

China: 12 IJA units across the river near Lanchow now. Holding my breath here. Down near Ankang, the Chinese easily repulsed yet another IJA attack (actually took place the turn before). The Japense divisions there are beginning to wear thin now.

North America: Prince Rupert airfield goes to level three. Will Steve invade this base and Coal Harbor before the invasion bonus expires in 14 days? He has to or I think his North American adventure won't have any legs.

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 8/2/2012 7:39:54 PM >

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 9:23:17 PM

Canoerebel

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3/18/42

Bay of Bengal: The Japanese amphibious TF targets Chittagong and comes ashore in good order - the defense consists of the static fortress and an Indian brigade. Allied air sorties ineffectively, nicking one more transports. Four divisions come ashore, so they'll make quick work of the base. Allied airpower is configured as best as I can, so there may be some opportunities for torpedo strikes tomorrow (none of the torp squadrons flew today). Lots of enemy BBs present includng Yamata. Japanese carriers are mostly standing offshore about six hexes. LRCAP over the invasion fleet was about 50 strong.

Allied Defenses: The carriers refueled at Colombo and will head south a bit to clear the likely submarine zone. Two Marine regmients and two Indian divsiions are in the area and can offer the stoutest resistance. The chain of bases between Calcutta and Karachi/Bombay are garrisoned (or about to be) to prevent my troops getting isolated.

China: At least four IJA divisions are north of Lanchow. Possibly many more, but my bombers keep showing the same four. Cursor shows just ten IJA units across the river, so that's either inaccurate or (unlikely) the Japanese have pulled back.

Divsiion Reconciliation: I'll do a roster later today, but right now I know of one (2nd) in NoPac, one (56th) on Java, four at Chittagong (I think all four were part of the Clark Field seige), one (32nd) at Koepang (recently), and a host in China. When I do the reconciliation tab later today, that should tell me whethere there's any real threat posed to either Australia or North America at this point. I don't think so and I'm already moving some units to new bases where they may (or may not) rally to India's support. For instance, I already had a Marine regiment and 27th/C Div. in strat mode at Salt Lake prepared to move on to the East Coast and thence to Capetown. They won't leave East Coast unless I'm absolutely sure that whatever divisions Steve has left wouldn't be sufficient to mount a credible risk of invasion to ConUS.

North America: Quiet.

Australia: Quiet.

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 10:04:07 PM

crsutton

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It is getting interesting. You can forget about Greyjoy. The hits will be here for a few days.

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 10:16:07 PM

Lcp Purcell

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This is getting interesting, I have been looking at both AAR so I cant say much.

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RE: War and Peas - Hortlund (J) vs. Canoe (A) - 8/2/2012 10:25:58 PM

Canoerebel

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Here's information I have regarding the current disposition of Japanese divisions. I'm not sure my list has a place for every diviison in the game (I might have overlooked some that are on the map or can be formed by uniting the elements; if you spot any number that are missing but can be in the game, please let me know - like, is there a 3rd Div.?). There are alot in China and now a fair number in India/SRA. I think enough are left to mount a credible campaign in Oz, but not to pose a true threat to the USA.

1 - near Nanyang
2 - Canada
4 - Chitagong
5 - recent prep info for Port Blair, but current whereabouts unknown
6 - near Changsha
7 - Hokkaido
9 - probably Manchuria
10 - probably Manchuria
11 - probably Manchuria
12 - near Lanchow
13 - near Ankang
15 - near Changsha
16 - whereabouts unknown
17 - near Lanchow
18 - Chittagong
19 - Wuchang
25 - probably Manchuria
27 - near Lanchow
29 - Probably Manchuria
32 - near Nanyang
33 - whereabouts unknown
34 - whereabouts unknown
35 - somewhere in China
36 - near Ankang
37 - near Nanyang
38 - recently at Koepang, Timor
39 - near Changsha
40 - near Lanchow
41 - near Ankang
48 - Chittagong
52 - probably Manchuria
53 - probably Japan
54 - probably Japan
55 - unknown
56 - Java
57 - Manchuria
59 - Hami in northwestern China
68 - near Nanyang
104 - Canton?
110 - Paotang?
116 - Whereabouts unknown
Imperial Guards - Chittagong
4th Guards - unknown
6th Guards - unknown

(in reply to crsutton)

Post #: 810

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