Slitherine

quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

As soon as Finnschafen is secure, get some fuel there by small TKs or AKLs to base PT boats. This will allow them to go out and stop his barges going into those nearby bases. I have Umboi built up as Japan, so I would take this base just to clear out the straits. Use some of your Beaufighters (or other FBs) at 100' to strafe his barges with range of only 2 or 3 hexes. He has plenty of barges, but make him pay for their use.

quote:

Ground combat at Finschhafen (100,126)

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 13113 troops, 230 guns, 276 vehicles, Assault Value = 504

Defending force 3530 troops, 24 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 119

Allied adjusted assault: 459

Japanese adjusted defense: 43

Allied assault odds: 10 to 1 (fort level 3)

Allied forces CAPTURE Finschhafen !!!

Japanese aircraft
no flights

Japanese aircraft losses
N1K1-J George: 10 destroyed
J2M3 Jack: 10 destroyed

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), forts(+), disruption(-), preparation(-)
fatigue(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
1403 casualties reported
Squads: 49 destroyed, 31 disabled
Non Combat: 27 destroyed, 2 disabled
Engineers: 27 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 17 (8 destroyed, 9 disabled)
Units retreated 5


Allied ground losses:
51 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 5 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 13 disabled
Vehicles lost 3 (2 destroyed, 1 disabled)


Assaulting units:
110th Combat Engineer Battalion
2nd Marine Division
1st USMC Tank Battalion

Defending units:
7th Garrison Unit
1st Raiding Regiment
6th Guards Inf. Rgt /1
36th Const Co
12th JAAF AF Coy

quote:

Ground combat at Buna (99,129)

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 16221 troops, 236 guns, 403 vehicles, Assault Value = 701

Defending force 16436 troops, 252 guns, 53 vehicles, Assault Value = 413

Allied adjusted assault: 227

Japanese adjusted defense: 499

Allied assault odds: 1 to 2 (fort level 4)

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), experience(-), supply(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
1781 casualties reported
Squads: 11 destroyed, 74 disabled
Non Combat: 4 destroyed, 24 disabled
Engineers: 7 destroyed, 15 disabled
Guns lost 39 (1 destroyed, 38 disabled)
Vehicles lost 2 (1 destroyed, 1 disabled)


Allied ground losses:
276 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 4 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 9 disabled
Engineers: 2 destroyed, 61 disabled


Assaulting units:
102nd Combat Engineer Regiment
1st USMC Corps Tank Battalion
3rd USMC Tank Battalion
1st Marine Division
II Aus Corps Engineer Battalion
I US Amphib Corps
2nd USMC Tank Bn /11

Defending units:
22nd Division
91st Infantry Regiment
47th Engineer Regiment
14th Garrison Unit
3rd Garrison Unit
55th Field AA Battalion
57th Field AA Battalion
39th Road Const Co
86th JAAF AF Coy
30th Field AA Machinecannon Company
Kure 7th SNLF
22nd JNAF AF Unit
16th AA Regiment
6th Garrison Unit /1

quote:

Morning Air attack on Darwin , at 76,124

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid detected at 60 NM, estimated altitude 9,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 20 minutes

Japanese aircraft
J2M2 Jack x 9
N1K1-J George x 8



Allied aircraft
B-17E Fortress x 12
B-24D Liberator x 3
B-24D1 Liberator x 64
B-24J Liberator x 23
PB4Y-1 Liberator x 12


Japanese aircraft losses
J2M2 Jack: 1 damaged
N1K1-J George: 1 destroyed, 7 damaged
N1K1-J George: 2 destroyed on ground
B6N2 Jill: 2 destroyed on ground
A6M5 Zero: 1 destroyed on ground
Ki-49-IIa Helen: 3 destroyed on ground

Allied aircraft losses
B-17E Fortress: 2 damaged
B-24D Liberator: 1 damaged
B-24D1 Liberator: 1 destroyed, 30 damaged
B-24J Liberator: 7 damaged
PB4Y-1 Liberator: 1 destroyed

Japanese ground losses:
14 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled



Airbase hits 29
Airbase supply hits 29
Runway hits 168 <--- BOOM!

quote:

Morning Air attack on 9th Division, at 57,49 , near Toungoo

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid spotted at 20 NM, estimated altitude 12,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 7 minutes


Allied aircraft
Liberator II x 13
Liberator B.III x 13
Liberator GR.III x 16
Wellington Ic x 14
Wellington B.X x 13
B-17F Fortress x 11
B-24D Liberator x 21
B-24D1 Liberator x 46
B-24J Liberator x 73
B-25C Mitchell x 58


Allied aircraft losses
Liberator B.III: 3 damaged
B-24D1 Liberator: 5 damaged

Japanese ground losses:
152 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 10 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 53 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled

quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

Only two ways to get his damaged planes out of Darwin. Rail them to another base or lift them out by a Transport TF.

quote:

Yeah, I thought so too. But Erik has managed to make his planes disappear from bases with closed AF before. Even island ones. He has some way of doing this. I think he keeps a fragment or part of the unit somewhere else. And when the rest of the unit gets stuck somewhere he simply disbands it and the fragment becomes the parent. Its the only thing I can think of?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Crackaces

I can see that as possible. Planes would go into the pool and then the next turn the new parent, as long as they are supplied, draws planes and pilots from the pool.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DOCUP

Nice sig Joc.  That list is impressive to me.  I'm not far behind you and don't have one CV on it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

quote:

ORIGINAL: Crackaces

I can see that as possible. Planes would go into the pool and then the next turn the new parent, as long as they are supplied, draws planes and pilots from the pool.

All the 100+ AC stuck at Darwin was magically gone this turn. I reconned the other 2 bases on the rail and they are empty too. As I said before this is not the first time that has happened. Rather the 50th time. I actually asked Erik how he manged it.

I also said that if he is doing what I think he is I´m not too happy about it. Its certainly "creative use" of the engine and quite a fair stretch from reality to being able to teleport them away. If the AC gets returned to the pool instead of being destroyed as I suspect that is actually kind of abusive imo.

Right or wrong?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Crackaces

quote:

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

quote:

ORIGINAL: Crackaces

I can see that as possible. Planes would go into the pool and then the next turn the new parent, as long as they are supplied, draws planes and pilots from the pool.

All the 100+ AC stuck at Darwin was magically gone this turn. I reconned the other 2 bases on the rail and they are empty too. As I said before this is not the first time that has happened. Rather the 50th time. I actually asked Erik how he manged it.

I also said that if he is doing what I think he is I´m not too happy about it. Its certainly "creative use" of the engine and quite a fair stretch from reality to being able to teleport them away. If the AC gets returned to the pool instead of being destroyed as I suspect that is actually kind of abusive imo.

Right or wrong?

I took my current game and reproduced what you are discussing. I did not test damaged aircraft ... just undamaged and sure enough they all ended up in the aircraft pool -- the main unit able to add aircraft that turn if aircraft were in the pools.

I am a proponent the WitP AE is simply a game, and WitP AE is a similation of WWII warfare as much as a Civil War Chess set represents the American Civil War. BB firing main ammo at low quality targets, air raid detection at the target not the first possible sighting, routing units teleporting through rough jungle hexes .. need I say more? It is a very slippery slope once the home rules start.

Others will have a differing opinion ..

My own take is that a virtual process is taking place abstracting planes getting destroyed and being replaced .. and the eventual goal of forcing the airframes out is being accomplished. Albeit, I admit in a very "creative" way. In reality, just like the unlimited supply of the WC -- the IJ have pretty much enough airframe proudction that killing aircraft does not mean much ..the real focus might be on getting the bases required to force victory knowing that airframes will teleport like retreating ground units

My .02 ..

quote:

ORIGINAL: paullus99

I would definitely say that's a very "gamey" use of the engine & not the indications of a very "fair" player.

quote:

when he discovered how to do this? Or is this something everyone does and I didn´t know of it?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Crackaces

I took my current game and reproduced what you are discussing. I did not test damaged aircraft ... just undamaged and sure enough they all ended up in the aircraft pool -- the main unit able to add aircraft that turn if aircraft were in the pools.

quote:

. If they are undamaged, then disbanding/withdrawing them is the same as rebasing them, in fact even worse since there's a delay from the parent unit getting back up to full strength since you can only replenish 12 aircraft at a time every 6-7 days, and the pilots will have to be in transit for any length of time to rejoin the unit.

quote:

Ground combat at Buna (99,129)

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 15981 troops, 236 guns, 403 vehicles, Assault Value = 664

Defending force 12722 troops, 203 guns, 48 vehicles, Assault Value = 180

Allied engineers reduce fortifications to 2

Allied adjusted assault: 251

Japanese adjusted defense: 35

Allied assault odds: 7 to 1 (fort level 2)

Allied forces CAPTURE Buna !!!

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), disruption(-), experience(-), supply(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
5200 casualties reported
Squads: 195 destroyed, 5 disabled
Non Combat: 277 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 28 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 74 (71 destroyed, 3 disabled)
Vehicles lost 37 (37 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Units retreated 10
Units destroyed 2


Allied ground losses:
72 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 7 disabled


Defeated Japanese Units Retreating!

Assaulting units:
102nd Combat Engineer Regiment
1st Marine Division
3rd USMC Tank Battalion
1st USMC Corps Tank Battalion
II Aus Corps Engineer Battalion
I US Amphib Corps
2nd USMC Tank Bn /11

Defending units:
14th Garrison Unit
22nd Division
91st Infantry Regiment
3rd Garrison Unit
39th Road Const Co
Kure 7th SNLF
57th Field AA Battalion
22nd JNAF AF Unit
16th AA Regiment
47th Engineer Regiment
55th Field AA Battalion
86th JAAF AF Coy

quote:

Ground combat at 57,49 (near Toungoo)

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 51414 troops, 766 guns, 1660 vehicles, Assault Value = 2412

Defending force 29381 troops, 464 guns, 803 vehicles, Assault Value = 1060

Allied adjusted assault: 1241

Japanese adjusted defense: 1537

Allied assault odds: 1 to 2

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), leaders(+), experience(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
1943 casualties reported
Squads: 8 destroyed, 118 disabled
Non Combat: 2 destroyed, 37 disabled
Engineers: 2 destroyed, 27 disabled
Vehicles lost 189 (42 destroyed, 147 disabled) <-- Tihii


Allied ground losses:
2611 casualties reported
Squads: 135 destroyed, 180 disabled <-- 72nd Brigade being totally wrecked
Non Combat: 2 destroyed, 44 disabled
Engineers: 23 destroyed, 24 disabled
Guns lost 82 (12 destroyed, 70 disabled)
Vehicles lost 56 (7 destroyed, 49 disabled)


Assaulting units:
72nd British Brigade
Provisionl Tank Brigade
29th British Brigade
26th Indian Brigade
268th Motorised Brigade
150th RAC Regiment
16th Chindit Brigade
50th Tank Brigade
14th Chindit Brigade
22nd (East African) Brigade
255th Armoured Brigade
11th (East African) Division
254th Armoured Brigade
23rd Chindit Brigade
III Indian Corps

Defending units:
1st Tank Division
9th Division
31st Ind.Mixed Brigade
69th Field AA Battalion
8th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
2nd Hvy.Artillery Regiment
14th Mortar Battalion
40th Field AA Battalion
2nd RF Gun Battalion
20th AA Regiment
4th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
2nd Medium Mortar Battalion
9th RF Gun Battalion

quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

Your infantry Brigades will take it hard on any result that is less than 1:1. Get ready for it. Take out any unit that has close to or over 50% disablement of their major devices/squads. They will take on extra casualties in destroyed squads with unfavorable results.

Can you combine the Chindits into a division??

Where is your artillery?? Some AA would help fend off any bombing attacks.

quote:

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

Just a minute to spare. I had a talk with Erik about the situation. No foul play. He simply fly them away from a 100% damaged AF. Has that always been possible! Only damaged AC are left behind and in this case there were only a few (2-3).

I find it very strange that you are allowed to fly out AC from a totally wrecked AF. I took for granted that once a AF reached a certain level of damage you could no longer fly them out.