What SAG do you use to take on MTB's?

Matrix Games Forums

Forums Register Login Photo Gallery Member List Search Calendars FAQ

My Profile Inbox Address Book My Subscription My Forums Log Out

What SAG do you use to take on MTB's?

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Printable Version

All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> What SAG do you use to take on MTB's?

Page: [1]

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

What SAG do you use to take on MTB's? - 11/5/2014 11:04:40 PM

walkerd

Posts: 184
Joined: 10/7/2004
From: Sydney, Australia
Status: offline

Hi

Like it says on the lid. What do you use? DD's, CA's or even BB's.

Fighters on 100ft sweep really take too long. Especially at those slightly harder to get to bases on the edge.

Thanks

_____________________________

"Carpe diem" - Seize the day!

"Carpe Cerevisi" - Seize the beer!

Post #: 1

RE: What SAG do you use to take on MTB's? - 11/5/2014 11:26:11 PM

msieving1

Posts: 526
Joined: 3/23/2007
From: Missouri
Status: offline

DDs and CLs will generally eat MTBs for breakfast.

_____________________________

-- Mark Sieving

(in reply to walkerd)

Post #: 2

RE: What SAG do you use to take on MTB's? - 11/5/2014 11:33:56 PM

Lokasenna

Posts: 9297
Joined: 3/3/2012
From: Iowan in MD/DC
Status: offline

Fletchers.

1 or 2 good ones should do it.

(in reply to msieving1)

Post #: 3

RE: What SAG do you use to take on MTB's? - 11/6/2014 3:30:41 AM

btd64

Posts: 9973
Joined: 1/23/2010
From: Mass. USA. now in Lancaster, OHIO
Status: offline

TWO +1's....GP

_____________________________

Intel i7 4.3GHz 10th Gen,16GB Ram,Nvidia GeForce MX330

AKA General Patton

WPO,WITP,WITPAE-Mod Designer/Tester
DWU-Beta Tester
TOAW4-Alpha/Beta Tester

"Do everything you ask of those you command"....Gen. George S. Patton

(in reply to Lokasenna)

Post #: 4

RE: What SAG do you use to take on MTB's? - 11/6/2014 4:43:41 AM

witpqs

Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline

DDs. It's their purpose!

_____________________________

Intel Monkey: https://sites.google.com/view/staffmonkeys/home

(in reply to btd64)

Post #: 5

RE: What SAG do you use to take on MTB's? - 11/6/2014 6:09:22 AM

walkerd

Posts: 184
Joined: 10/7/2004
From: Sydney, Australia
Status: offline

Thanks for the responses.

My situation is one of my next targets had MTB's and my SAG has BB's and TB's. I was going to send in a DD force but unsure if I should include CA's in it. I know it depends on what they are going to meet, just did not want to risk a CA

_____________________________

"Carpe diem" - Seize the day!

"Carpe Cerevisi" - Seize the beer!

(in reply to witpqs)

Post #: 6

RE: What SAG do you use to take on MTB's? - 11/6/2014 2:46:49 PM

m10bob

Posts: 8622
Joined: 11/3/2002
From: Dismal Seepage Indiana
Status: offline

The original name of Destroyers was "Torpedo boat destroyers"..This was from WW1 IIRC..It was their original mission, to form a defensive block for the big boys.

_____________________________

(in reply to walkerd)

Post #: 7

RE: What SAG do you use to take on MTB's? - 11/6/2014 3:01:11 PM

crsutton

Posts: 9590
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
Status: offline

Moonlight is key-little boats are very dangerous when the moonlight is low. High moonlight and they can pretty much be ignored. But anything with decent guns and a little speed can usually take them on. I don't purposely send CAs after PTs but if the TF is going in for another mission, I don't fret about it. Old BBs in low moonlight are a no-no in any surface action. They are just a gift if you are sending them into PT or DD infested waters.

_____________________________

I am the Holy Roman Emperor and am above grammar.

Sigismund of Luxemburg

(in reply to m10bob)

Post #: 8

RE: What SAG do you use to take on MTB's? - 11/7/2014 9:30:14 AM

jmalter

Posts: 1673
Joined: 10/12/2010
Status: offline

You shouldn't depend on just one thing to defend against any particular threat, instead use a combination of forces to counter multiple threats.

- Search planes on NavS to find & increase detection of enemy TFs
- F & FB on Naval Attack at 100'
- SurfTFs of 4 identical radar-equipped DDs
- & high moonlight w/ good weather.

(in reply to crsutton)

Post #: 9

RE: What SAG do you use to take on MTB's? - 11/7/2014 1:23:32 PM

offenseman

Posts: 768
Joined: 2/24/2007
From: Sheridan Wyoming, USA
Status: offline

A few small, very maneuverable DDs.

_____________________________

Sometimes things said in Nitwit sound very different in English.

(in reply to jmalter)

Post #: 10

RE: What SAG do you use to take on MTB's? - 11/7/2014 1:47:18 PM

HansBolter

Posts: 7704
Joined: 7/6/2006
From: United States
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: m10bob

The original name of Destroyers was "Torpedo boat destroyers"..This was from WW1 IIRC..It was their original mission, to form a defensive block for the big boys.

Yes, but the Torpedo Boats they were created to hunt are not the MOTOR or PATROL torpedo boats of WWII.

The Torpedo Boats of WWI were more akin to light destroyers, about the size of a DE, with the speed of a DD.

A few of this class can still be found in WWII. I built a model of a German one that was only slightly smaller than the German DD in the same Heller multi-kit box.

< Message edited by HansBolter -- 11/7/2014 2:48:34 PM >

_____________________________

Hans

(in reply to m10bob)

Post #: 11

RE: What SAG do you use to take on MTB's? - 11/7/2014 3:33:25 PM

Amoral

Posts: 378
Joined: 7/28/2010
Status: offline

The Japanese DM class minesweepers have little to fear from the dutch PT boats. I send them in to mined hexes and they will regularly sink 4 or 5 times there number of PT boats before continuing on to sweep the hex.

(in reply to HansBolter)

Post #: 12

RE: What SAG do you use to take on MTB's? - 11/7/2014 5:57:54 PM

robinsa

Posts: 183
Joined: 7/24/2013
From: North Carolina
Status: offline

Why 4 and why identical radar ?

(in reply to jmalter)

Post #: 13

RE: What SAG do you use to take on MTB's? - 11/7/2014 11:15:38 PM

wdolson

Posts: 10398
Joined: 6/28/2006
From: Near Portland, OR
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: HansBolter

Yes, but the Torpedo Boats they were created to hunt are not the MOTOR or PATROL torpedo boats of WWII.

The Torpedo Boats of WWI were more akin to light destroyers, about the size of a DE, with the speed of a DD.

A few of this class can still be found in WWII. I built a model of a German one that was only slightly smaller than the German DD in the same Heller multi-kit box.

The Japanese still had some some ocean going torpedo boats in WW II. The Otori was one of them. I think they were mostly used as escorts during the war.

During WW I the mission of the torpedo boat destroyer and torpedo boat merged into the multi-role ship we know of. The dedicated torpedo craft operating with the blue water surface ships was an obsolete concept that was pretty much out dated by WW I.

It is ironic that PT boats did operate with larger ships at Surigao Strait though performing as a more or less independent screen to disrupt the Japanese and collect intel about the force approaching.

Bill

_____________________________

WitP AE - Test team lead, programmer

(in reply to HansBolter)

Post #: 14

RE: What SAG do you use to take on MTB's? - 11/10/2014 3:04:00 AM

robinsa

Posts: 183
Joined: 7/24/2013
From: North Carolina
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: robinsa

Why 4 and why identical radar ?

Let me ask this question in more general terms,
Do ships with the same equipment operate better together than ships with differing equipment (such as radars)?

Surely 3 old and 1 new must be better than 4 old ?

(in reply to robinsa)

Post #: 15

RE: What SAG do you use to take on MTB's? - 11/10/2014 8:46:47 AM

LargeSlowTarget

Posts: 4443
Joined: 9/23/2000
From: Hessen, Germany - now living in France
Status: offline

Not "identical radar" but "identical ships with radar".

I think it is not the same equipment that counts but the same speed and maneuver characteristics of ships of the same class which can prove benefitial in surface combats. Mixing ships with different speed and maneuver ratings may cause issues, like faster ships being tied-down by slower ships and thus losing an advantage.

This is what I use to hunt PTs/MTBs:

Night Time Surface Combat, near Madjene at 65,103, Range 9,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
DD Arashio
DD Natsugumo
DD Minegumo
DD Asagumo

Allied Ships
TM-4, Shell hits 3, and is sunk
TM-5, Shell hits 1, and is sunk
TM-6, Shell hits 1, and is sunk
TM-7, Shell hits 4, and is sunk
MTB 7, Shell hits 1
MTB 8, Shell hits 3, and is sunk

Maximum visibility in Clear Conditions and 60% moonlight: 12,000 yards
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 9,000 yards
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 9,000 yards
Imazato, Hiroshi crosses the 'T'
DD Asagumo engages MTB 8 at 9,000 yards
DD Natsugumo engages MTB 7 at 9,000 yards
DD Arashio engages MTB 7 at 9,000 yards
Range closes to 7,000 yards
DD Arashio engages MTB 8 at 7,000 yards
DD Natsugumo engages TM-5 at 7,000 yards
TM-5 sunk by DD Arashio at 7,000 yards
DD Minegumo engages TM-4 at 7,000 yards
Range closes to 3,000 yards
MTB 8 sunk by DD Arashio at 3,000 yards
DD Minegumo engages MTB 7 at 3,000 yards
TM-6 sunk by DD Natsugumo at 3,000 yards
DD Asagumo engages TM-4 at 3,000 yards
Range closes to 2,000 yards
DD Asagumo engages TM-4 at 2,000 yards
DD Arashio engages MTB 7 at 2,000 yards
TM-4 sunk by DD Asagumo at 2,000 yards
Range increases to 3,000 yards
DD Minegumo engages MTB 7 at 3,000 yards
DD Minegumo engages TM-7 at 3,000 yards
DD Natsugumo engages TM-7 at 3,000 yards
DD Arashio engages MTB 7 at 3,000 yards
Abbott J. orders Allied TF to disengage
Range closes to 2,000 yards
DD Asagumo engages TM-7 at 2,000 yards
TM-7 sunk by DD Minegumo at 2,000 yards
DD Arashio engages MTB 7 at 2,000 yards
DD Minegumo engages MTB 7 at 2,000 yards
DD Arashio engages MTB 7 at 2,000 yards
Range increases to 5,000 yards
Range increases to 7,000 yards
DD Asagumo engages MTB 7 at 7,000 yards
DD Minegumo engages MTB 7 at 7,000 yards
Range increases to 11,000 yards
DD Asagumo engages MTB 7 at 11,000 yards
DD Natsugumo engages MTB 7 at 11,000 yards
Task forces break off...

< Message edited by LargeSlowTarget -- 11/10/2014 9:47:31 AM >

_____________________________

AE Mod "Bottlenecks" UPDATED 01/2022

(in reply to robinsa)

Post #: 16

RE: What SAG do you use to take on MTB's? - 11/11/2014 3:50:03 AM

jmalter

Posts: 1673
Joined: 10/12/2010
Status: offline

Good clarification to my post, LST.

In general, TFs perform better when comprised of sister-ships.

For Torpedo-boat action, low moonlight PT TFs (by radar-equipped PTs governed by high Nav/Aggr commanders) are gonna bore in. Conversely, high moonlight favors the defense.

(in reply to LargeSlowTarget)

Post #: 17