Some strategy questions for players

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Some strategy questions for players - 12/14/2014 2:51:58 AM

MisterBoats

Posts: 121
Joined: 6/29/2008
Status: offline

I am thoroughly hooked by WITW. It reminds me so much of WITP/AE in the way that I learn new things every day. The depth is very satisfying. Presently, I'm playing the '43-'45 scenario. I'd like to get some opinions from other players about the invasion of the Italian mainland.

1. I think a joint British/American landing at the base of the "heel" makes a lot of sense. Brindisi is a fair sized port and Taranto is nearby. Airfields ought to be fairly easy to secure. After a build-up period, a drive up along the eastern coast to Foggia seems possible, with no mountains in the way (or very few). Does anyone else share this view?

2. Is a Salerno landing necessary? I know it succeeded in real life, but I'd rather have a base on the Adriatic from which to operate.

3. What bases do you use for prepping for the mainland invasion? Tunis and Algiers seem to provide the highest prep points per turn. I'd like to use Palermo and/or Messina, but port repairs take a while. I may see what kind of support I get in Malta.

4. How many divisions do you assign to the mainland invasion? I want 8th and 5th Armies to invade, then possibly bring in the 7th Army, with Patton, for extra power. I'm not sure what forces to send to Sardinia and Corsica.

5. Is the capture of Rome necessary for ultimate victory? I don't want to replicate the historical campaign. I'd be happy to maintain a solid line, including Naples and Foggia, and leave it at that. This strategy might free up several more divisions for the invasion of southern France.

Thanks!

Post #: 1

RE: Some strategy questions for players - 12/14/2014 3:30:58 AM

NotOneStepBack

Posts: 915
Joined: 6/17/2011
Status: offline

1. I think this is a reasonable strategy, only one way to really know though!

2. It's not necessary, I played many games in beta and didn't do it.

3. You'll want to use the biggest ports, they give up prep points fastest.

4. Honestly, as many as possible, this invasion just cannot fail, otherwise you are SOL. It's the most important invasion in the game.

5. Maybe others can chime in here, but I think that it probably is unless you beelined to Berlin. I do wonder myself if invading Italy is even necessary, but I haven't tried a game where I didn't do it.

(in reply to MisterBoats)

Post #: 2

RE: Some strategy questions for players - 12/14/2014 3:31:38 AM

MrLongleg

Posts: 707
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Plymouth, MA, USA
Status: offline

Regarding 1 - without Sicily you won't have fighter cover there. Against the AI this is no problem, but against a human player you might get into serious trouble.

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MrLongleg

Life is too short to drink bad wine ;-)

(in reply to MisterBoats)

Post #: 3

RE: Some strategy questions for players - 12/14/2014 3:35:41 AM

Gorforlin

Posts: 80
Joined: 2/22/2012
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Haudrauf1962

Regarding 1 - without Sicily you won't have fighter cover there. Against the AI this is no problem, but against a human player you might get into serious trouble.

Just invade Corsica and Sardina, they are like to big CV's

(in reply to MrLongleg)

Post #: 4

RE: Some strategy questions for players - 12/14/2014 3:49:05 AM

MisterBoats

Posts: 121
Joined: 6/29/2008
Status: offline

Is it necessary to invade Corsica and Sardinia by amphibious assault, or just by using the ports taken over by the friendly Italian forces? I considered invading both islands with 7th Army units, then I noticed that a couple of ports were "liberated" when the Italians became allies. I suppose it's just a matter of preference. It just seems to take forever for amphibious HQs to produce enough points for 4-5 separate invasions.

(in reply to Gorforlin)

Post #: 5

RE: Some strategy questions for players - 12/14/2014 1:34:23 PM

carlkay58

Posts: 8650
Joined: 7/25/2010
Status: offline

MisterBoats, if you invade Corsica and Sardinia when the Italians come over to your side, you are adding a functioning port at full strength while the captured ports are usually damaged quite a bit. You only have the Italian units for 5 turns after the surrender so speed is of the essence. It is also nice to have the additional port which allows landing armored divisions and HQs easier.

(in reply to MisterBoats)

Post #: 6

RE: Some strategy questions for players - 12/14/2014 3:52:40 PM

marion61

Posts: 1688
Joined: 9/8/2011
Status: offline

My two cents! Sicily has to be taken and I usually let 7th Army do that, and I re-target my other TF's on turn one so they retain 49 prep points. The rule on Italian surrender is about to be changed in the next patch, but even after it's changed I won't change my tactics because I want to be in Italy on turn 2 and normally I use 8th Army for that. The Provisional Corps and one TF I use to invade Sardinia on turn 2 also. After the rule change for Italian surrender happens, I would probably send two TF's to take Sardinia.

I don't use 8th Army to push too hard into Italy as it will cost too many VP's. They are mainly there to force the axis to commit several divisions to hold you there, so they can't be used to cover an invasion. If they decide not to hold you, then you get Southern Italy for free.

Don't use multiple TF's to cover two beaches that can be covered by one TF. If your invasion beaches are close, and touch the same sea hex, then you can use just one TF to get supplies onto the beaches. I put my TF's into ports and set them a target (planned) so that they are gaining prep points as soon as they can. It takes 50 prep points to launch an invasion, and combat units only require 30 prep points to join it. Ports don't have to be 100% fixed for TF's to use it to gain prep points. My 2nd invasion is from Sicily, not North Africa. This gives me time to make the preparations I need elsewhere to ensure my 2nd invasion is not pushed out, and that I have air cover.

If your not pushing the axis down in Italy some, those are forces that can be used against you in other places. Plus when you capture air bases in Italy, you can start to bomb Ploesti. Bomb the snot out of axis airfields with planes. They will either lose them, or move them farther north. Win/win!

I don't drop my paratroop divisions as regiments or brigades. Only a paratroop division can retreat if attacked during the next enemy ground phase. If I can't relieve them the next turn (two at the most) I won't use them. I always have my airborne units support an invasion, usually in the area I expect the toughest fights or to isolate units and/or ports. Don't invade into a port hex unless you have to. Isolate them during the invasion so that when you take it you have another port (and if you invade a port hex, the port is not functional until you repair it).

These are just some ideas to consider.

< Message edited by meklore61 -- 12/14/2014 5:14:54 PM >

(in reply to carlkay58)

Post #: 7

RE: Some strategy questions for players - 12/14/2014 5:55:58 PM

sfbaytf

Posts: 1122
Joined: 4/13/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: meklore61

My two cents! Sicily has to be taken and I usually let 7th Army do that, and I re-target my other TF's on turn one so they retain 49 prep points. The rule on Italian surrender is about to be changed in the next patch, but even after it's changed I won't change my tactics because I want to be in Italy on turn 2 and normally I use 8th Army for that. The Provisional Corps and one TF I use to invade Sardinia on turn 2 also. After the rule change for Italian surrender happens, I would probably send two TF's to take Sardinia.

I don't use 8th Army to push too hard into Italy as it will cost too many VP's. They are mainly there to force the axis to commit several divisions to hold you there, so they can't be used to cover an invasion. If they decide not to hold you, then you get Southern Italy for free.

Don't use multiple TF's to cover two beaches that can be covered by one TF. If your invasion beaches are close, and touch the same sea hex, then you can use just one TF to get supplies onto the beaches. I put my TF's into ports and set them a target (planned) so that they are gaining prep points as soon as they can. It takes 50 prep points to launch an invasion, and combat units only require 30 prep points to join it. Ports don't have to be 100% fixed for TF's to use it to gain prep points. My 2nd invasion is from Sicily, not North Africa. This gives me time to make the preparations I need elsewhere to ensure my 2nd invasion is not pushed out, and that I have air cover.

If your not pushing the axis down in Italy some, those are forces that can be used against you in other places. Plus when you capture air bases in Italy, you can start to bomb Ploesti. Bomb the snot out of axis airfields with planes. They will either lose them, or move them farther north. Win/win!

I don't drop my paratroop divisions as regiments or brigades. Only a paratroop division can retreat if attacked during the next enemy ground phase. If I can't relieve them the next turn (two at the most) I won't use them. I always have my airborne units support an invasion, usually in the area I expect the toughest fights or to isolate units and/or ports. Don't invade into a port hex unless you have to. Isolate them during the invasion so that when you take it you have another port (and if you invade a port hex, the port is not functional until you repair it).

These are just some ideas to consider.

Where in Southern Italy do you land the 8th Army? Isn't this a bit risky? You have 2 divided armies that can't support one another. Against the AI I could see this working, but against a skilled Axis human player sounds like a good way to lose an army.

If I understand correctly you will have 1 Army the 7th fighting on Sicily and the 8th on Southern Italy on turn 2 and if things go south how will the 7th be able to get to Southern Italy quickly...

(in reply to marion61)

Post #: 8

RE: Some strategy questions for players - 12/14/2014 6:30:06 PM

marion61

Posts: 1688
Joined: 9/8/2011
Status: offline

If you look at my AAR http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3724100 this is where. I have done it against a human player, and it's almost impossible in that narrow area for the axis troops coming south to dislodge you. There aren't enough of them, and the ones behind you can't afford to root you out because they will become isolated if you have manually set your air directives correctly. Get interdiction of the waters and you should have no problems staying ashore. Sardinia wasn't hard to take, and didn't require much air power. When the new Italian surrender rules happen, it will be harder I believe and more risky, but not un-doable.

(in reply to sfbaytf)

Post #: 9