Slitherine

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ORIGINAL: JohnDillworth

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If you keep pressing his fuel sources I bet he will get local shortages soon.
He burned helluvalot fuel.
He has more ships than historical.
You even kept a fuel center, occupied in your Sumatra campaign.
He lost the Burma fuel.

His stocks simply cant be ample.

He has a gazillion of those small tankers (if he didnt stop merchant ship production) but he will feel the loss of fuel.

John might have local fuel shortages but Dan's prefers his subs with the fleet so I don't think he has sunk a lot of merchant tonnage. I don't know Johns HI resources but I be he is not hurting for oil or resources. not so sure about fuel. As you say, there are a million of these tiny tankers. It's not the loss of these little tankers but now John probably has to increase escorts. I doubt he has the warships to dedicate but maybe some old Cl's

BTW Dan, when is the last time you has a bonafide 100% sighting of the KB?

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Those TKs were worth two points apiece, the PBs one each.

The horses looked good on the track but didn't pay off at the window.

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ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Can you elaborate a little on China? I have often wondered what it would be like to not take China as Japan. You lose a huge source of possible VPs, but then on the other hand if Japan is relatively quiet in China they have the opportunity to bank all that supply.

Does cutting the Burma Road handicap all of the China's offensive options so far for lack of supply?

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ORIGINAL: Canoerebel
The Burma Road has been open for a few days now. Too soon to tell what effect that will have on the pace of operations in China. I have a handful of Chinese units set to take replacements and a few Allies units moving into the theater.

I can't mount any real air campaign. But when I load Rangoon up with supply one of these days, we'll see if it flows into China.

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ORIGINAL: GetAssista

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ORIGINAL: Canoerebel
The Burma Road has been open for a few days now. Too soon to tell what effect that will have on the pace of operations in China. I have a handful of Chinese units set to take replacements and a few Allies units moving into the theater.

I can't mount any real air campaign. But when I load Rangoon up with supply one of these days, we'll see if it flows into China.

Burma Road openness adds 500 supply a day to Tsuyung, nothing else. So supply flow from the coast to Tsuyung and beyond is needed, and road network after Lashio is sketchy. Building up the bases on the route would help but I don't know if it would be enough to open way to meaningful flow.
I wonder if anyone has tried some proactive usage of command HQs to draw supply through. Like place HQ at Paoshan, wait for it to draw supply from Burma, then march it out of the base to free up the pile and let it flow further. Rince and repeat. Setting nearby Burma bases on stockpile can prevent the flowback

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ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

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ORIGINAL: GetAssista

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ORIGINAL: Canoerebel
The Burma Road has been open for a few days now. Too soon to tell what effect that will have on the pace of operations in China. I have a handful of Chinese units set to take replacements and a few Allies units moving into the theater.

I can't mount any real air campaign. But when I load Rangoon up with supply one of these days, we'll see if it flows into China.

Burma Road openness adds 500 supply a day to Tsuyung, nothing else. So supply flow from the coast to Tsuyung and beyond is needed, and road network after Lashio is sketchy. Building up the bases on the route would help but I don't know if it would be enough to open way to meaningful flow.
I wonder if anyone has tried some proactive usage of command HQs to draw supply through. Like place HQ at Paoshan, wait for it to draw supply from Burma, then march it out of the base to free up the pile and let it flow further. Rince and repeat. Setting nearby Burma bases on stockpile can prevent the flowback

You can accomplish the same thing with the supply spinner.

As Japan, I have had supply flow west through this area so I don't know why it wouldn't be able to flow east.

Building up the bases helps for supply to those bases only. The maximum draw can come from anywhere, and is not stopped along the way by a lower draw base. For example, Mandalay might have a maximum draw of only 500 but Lashio might be built higher to have a maximum draw of 1200. A supply route to Lashio traced through Mandalay will not be limited to 500 - it only takes into account the base of origination and the destination that needs the supplies.

Likewise, a ton of supply might flow through to Paoshan and beyond, but given the terrain and road categories, it is unlikely.


That's my understanding, anyway.

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ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Can you elaborate a little on China? I have often wondered what it would be like to not take China as Japan. You lose a huge source of possible VPs, but then on the other hand if Japan is relatively quiet in China they have the opportunity to bank all that supply.

Does cutting the Burma Road handicap all of the China's offensive options so far for lack of supply?

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ORIGINAL: crsutton

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ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Can you elaborate a little on China? I have often wondered what it would be like to not take China as Japan. You lose a huge source of possible VPs, but then on the other hand if Japan is relatively quiet in China they have the opportunity to bank all that supply.

Does cutting the Burma Road handicap all of the China's offensive options so far for lack of supply?

Having completed a full campaign as the Allies, as long as the road is open and the Allied player floods Rangoon with supply the supply will flow easily into China. Likewise it drives me crazy that the Japanese player can attack out of China and supply a massive force in interior Burma. This just should not happen either way. For this reason I think the Japanese player must drive China out of the war. With the easy flow of supply and if there are no restrictions on moving other Allied units into China it is simply too easy for the Allies to build up major airbases. In addition, it is really easy for the Allies to invade China and with a viable Chinese force intact to assist, the open terrain in Southern China just devour the Japanese Army. Not to mention the drain on supply. Soooo....I think John is in a fairly poor position in China if Dan finds a way to exploit it. But then again John has a few problems in the PI as well. The only consolation is that it is a long walk into China from Burma and this might dampen any Allied player's enthusiasm.

So, unless the Japanese player is going for an auto victory elsewhere, taking out China is a must.

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ORIGINAL: witpqs

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ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

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ORIGINAL: GetAssista

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ORIGINAL: Canoerebel
The Burma Road has been open for a few days now. Too soon to tell what effect that will have on the pace of operations in China. I have a handful of Chinese units set to take replacements and a few Allies units moving into the theater.

I can't mount any real air campaign. But when I load Rangoon up with supply one of these days, we'll see if it flows into China.

Burma Road openness adds 500 supply a day to Tsuyung, nothing else. So supply flow from the coast to Tsuyung and beyond is needed, and road network after Lashio is sketchy. Building up the bases on the route would help but I don't know if it would be enough to open way to meaningful flow.
I wonder if anyone has tried some proactive usage of command HQs to draw supply through. Like place HQ at Paoshan, wait for it to draw supply from Burma, then march it out of the base to free up the pile and let it flow further. Rince and repeat. Setting nearby Burma bases on stockpile can prevent the flowback

You can accomplish the same thing with the supply spinner.

As Japan, I have had supply flow west through this area so I don't know why it wouldn't be able to flow east.

Building up the bases helps for supply to those bases only. The maximum draw can come from anywhere, and is not stopped along the way by a lower draw base. For example, Mandalay might have a maximum draw of only 500 but Lashio might be built higher to have a maximum draw of 1200. A supply route to Lashio traced through Mandalay will not be limited to 500 - it only takes into account the base of origination and the destination that needs the supplies.

Likewise, a ton of supply might flow through to Paoshan and beyond, but given the terrain and road categories, it is unlikely.


That's my understanding, anyway.

Building up those bases will help increase supply flow, but it still won't be enough to supply the LARGE force required to crack all the way through those mountain defenses in any reasonable time frame.

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ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

I've never played Japan, but I can understand using points as a legitimate measure of success or failure.

The Allied player eventually has to mold strategy towards victory points too. In an indirect way, that's what I've been doing all along.

But to this point, and for some time yet to come, I'm willing to trade victory points (the troops on Celebes, the value of xAP and 4EB, etc.) for ground. It's still too early to let points directly guide operational and strategic planning.

If points were my chief objective, I'd be more focused on making progress towards Rabaul and Port Moresby; Batavia, Soerabaja and Singapore. But the driving force has been to take the high ground ( Assam, Sumatra, Aleutians, Marshalls, DEI, Luzon), force John to commit his combat ships, and chew at them. That forumula worked, sometimes expensively and sometimes cheaply, until John simply stopped committing his navy in recent months.

The victory points come easier when the Kaigun collapses.

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But the driving force has been to take the high ground ( Assam, Sumatra, Aleutians, Marshalls, DEI, Luzon), force John to commit his combat ships, and chew at them. That forumula worked, sometimes expensively and sometimes cheaply, until John simply stopped committing his navy in recent months.