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SSG games on Steam - 5/29/2018 2:52:12 AM   
Rosseau

 

Posts: 2757
Joined: 9/13/2009
Status: offline 		Why the heck, not? Battles in Italy, Battlefront and Kharkov DoD work nicely under Win10, and Italy still has a wealth of scenarios on SSG's site.

I'm an old-timer, but am enjoying these games more than a lot of "current" wargames, and the AI has been matched by very few in recent years. Otherwise, the games will just continue to languish on Matrix's site. Worst case, a nice sale to generate revenue?

Of course, there may be a very real and practical reason they can't go the Steam route.
Post #: 1
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/29/2018 12:30:32 PM   
Blond_Knight


Posts: 1031
Joined: 5/15/2004
Status: offline 		Lack of support would be my guess. None of the titles you mentioned support wide-screen format. SSG is gone. Matrix/Slitherine probably either doesn't have the source code, doesn't have the legal rights to modify it, or doesn't have the people familiar with the code to make the time investment to make the changes.

(in reply to Rosseau)
Post #: 2
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/29/2018 1:07:28 PM   
zakblood


Posts: 22687
Joined: 10/4/2012
Status: offline 		plus steam charges for each game to be hosted so may not be worth the extra effort if it keeps sales going here etc i would guess

(in reply to Blond_Knight)
Post #: 3
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/29/2018 11:51:33 PM   
Rosseau

 

Posts: 2757
Joined: 9/13/2009
Status: offline 		Yes, too bad. The unit counters still look pretty good to me at 1024x768

(in reply to zakblood)
Post #: 4
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/30/2018 7:58:29 AM   
Pvt_Grunt

 

Posts: 327
Joined: 2/13/2007
From: Frankston Victoria
Status: offline 		BiI is a great game. Lots of mods too. They are all still available on the SSG Website which is nice, considering they havent released much since about 2010.


< Message edited by Pvt_Grunt -- 5/30/2018 8:02:16 AM >

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Post #: 5
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/30/2018 10:33:42 AM   
bazjak

 

Posts: 263
Joined: 9/1/2014
From: Wales UK
Status: offline 		Plus the fact that for very old games who in their right mind would pay that
Bring the price down a lot and you might just might get some sales
Surly a few sales of say £10 than none at all at the price you are still asking for a 13yo game £30.99 has got to be better than none at all
It might generate interest (as it has me now that i have seen all the extra scenarios that are on the SSG web page )

(in reply to Pvt_Grunt)
Post #: 6
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/30/2018 11:45:48 AM   
MrsWargamer


Posts: 1655
Joined: 6/18/2014
Status: offline 		Age doesn't make the price of wine go automatically down.
Age doesn't make antiques go down in price.
Age doesn't make art cheaper.

Why should age automatically make a game everyone is willing to call above grade, cheaper?

Yeah, some games in 2018 are not worth what they were in 2008 or 1998 or 1988. I remember playing games on my Nintendo (the first machine). I paid good money for those cartridges. Some I played to death, and some I never really played after the first while because they actually sucked.

But sometimes games are finite and sometimes not.

The only reason we are clamouring for a Steel Panthers successor is not because Steel Panthers has lost some of its value. Nope. The only problem with Steel Panthers is our newer computers and new OSs can't run a game that was perfectly fine in 2008 and 1998 in 2018. We don't need a Steel Panthers successor, we need a 486 computer and Windows 98 running on it :)

If I had that option, I wouldn't be waiting for a Steel Panthers successor, I wouldn't need it.
And you'd still be able to sell the General's Edition full price because it's still worth full price. If you can run it.

The same can be said for several wargames.

The same can be said for several board game wargames too.

_____________________________

Wargame, 05% of the time.
Play with Barbies 05% of the time.
Play with Legos 10% of the time.
Build models 20% of the time
Shopping 60% of the time.
Exlains why I buy em more than I play em.

(in reply to bazjak)
Post #: 7
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/30/2018 12:30:50 PM   
bazjak

 

Posts: 263
Joined: 9/1/2014
From: Wales UK
Status: offline 		When things dont sell in shops or are out of date they have a sale or reduce the price so your logic dosn't add up
Look at the forum for this game
Theres has not been a lot of action on this forum so i think that says it all

(in reply to MrsWargamer)
Post #: 8
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/30/2018 4:15:41 PM   
wodin


Posts: 10762
Joined: 4/20/2003
From: England
Status: offline 		Just wish an AI was done for that Stalingrad map for Battlefront game.

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https://www.awargamersneedfulthings.co.uk/

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Post #: 9
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/30/2018 5:00:21 PM   
Kuokkanen

 

Posts: 3545
Joined: 4/2/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MrsWargamer

The only reason we are clamouring for a Steel Panthers successor is not because Steel Panthers has lost some of its value. Nope. The only problem with Steel Panthers is our newer computers and new OSs can't run a game that was perfectly fine in 2008 and 1998 in 2018. We don't need a Steel Panthers successor, we need a 486 computer and Windows 98 running on it :)

What happened to your old computer you used to play the game with? In any case, with little looking around you may find used computers for reasonable price with whatever operating system you want. What comes to Steel Panthers series, SPWAW, WinSPWW2, and WinSPMBT all work well enough on my newer computer with multicore Core i5 processor and Windows 7 (SPWAW needs a hack job though). But if you really want to play the original Steel Panthers, then look up and try DOSBox with it.

< Message edited by Kuokkanen -- 5/30/2018 5:01:05 PM >

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You know what they say, don't you? About how us MechWarriors are the modern knights, how warfare has become civilized now that we have to abide by conventions and rules of war. Don't believe it.

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(in reply to MrsWargamer)
Post #: 10
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/30/2018 5:06:25 PM   
MrsWargamer


Posts: 1655
Joined: 6/18/2014
Status: offline 		Oh my current rig and OS are currently cooperating, thanks to the awesome efforts of the fan community of course.

"When things dont sell in shops or are out of date they have a sale or reduce the price so your logic dosn't add up"

You don't know a great deal about retail do you bazjak :)


_____________________________

Wargame, 05% of the time.
Play with Barbies 05% of the time.
Play with Legos 10% of the time.
Build models 20% of the time
Shopping 60% of the time.
Exlains why I buy em more than I play em.

(in reply to Kuokkanen)
Post #: 11
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/30/2018 10:34:26 PM   
bazjak

 

Posts: 263
Joined: 9/1/2014
From: Wales UK
Status: offline 		Look at the forum
It's dead
No I don't know much about retail
Do you?
And this is not about Steel Panthers


(in reply to MrsWargamer)
Post #: 12
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/30/2018 11:03:45 PM   
MrsWargamer


Posts: 1655
Joined: 6/18/2014
Status: offline 		I actually do have retail experience. No not as a cashier dear :) I've business experience.

You buy a product from the source, they bill you in 3 months, you have 3 months to sell the product. If the product is still there in 3 months, you still have to pay for it, but now it's deadweight. It has to go. You sell it at a loss but you get it out of the store.

You publish a digital game. There is no physical product. Thus it remains worth what it is worth the moment you sell it. But the guy that designed it is, of course, the owner. He gets his portion. If the game sells 1000 copies, you make 1000 sales. If you price it at 50% off, well, that's different. Regardless, there's no bill to be paid in 3 months, because it's not a physical product.

Steam is all about selling to the masses as fast as possible. They do the same with digital books.

A 35 dollar hardcover is a nice product. But 10k hardcovers at 35 bucks while nice sounding, might not actually happen unless you are already a sought-after author. Most girls are lucky to sell paperbacks. Most girls are lucky to even sell paperbacks. Odds are a girl is lucky to sell anything at all other than self-published digital downloads. If one of my books sells 1000 1.99 downloads, I just made 2k And some days, that's all ya get.

Much as we hate to admit it, but wargame publishers are NOT mainstream. Not even close.
There's a reason why Slitherine Group isn't on a shelf. Heck brick and mortar stores these days have half their shelf space selling toys and t-shirts. The only reason I go into EB Games, is to buy Funko Pop Animation figures.

I think it is impressive that wargames sell at all sometimes.
But I'm not in a hurry to cheap them out of a few bucks either.

Telling the guys here to sell you a 40 dollar game 5 years later for 15, is the same as telling them to drop dead as a whole.
I won't lie, I'll use a sale when possible. But 90% of my catalogue of wargames were bought full year one price.

There actually IS a price point where you actually ARE asking them to give the game away for free.

_____________________________

Wargame, 05% of the time.
Play with Barbies 05% of the time.
Play with Legos 10% of the time.
Build models 20% of the time
Shopping 60% of the time.
Exlains why I buy em more than I play em.

(in reply to bazjak)
Post #: 13
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/31/2018 5:01:08 AM   
Rosseau

 

Posts: 2757
Joined: 9/13/2009
Status: offline 		What gets me is how good these games are compared to quite a few newer wargame releases.

Battles in Italy is easily worth $40 with the extra scenarios. But no one was very motivated to create much for Battlefront especially, which went Bn scale, included HQs and other stuff. I've created basic operational AIs and the tactical AI is so good it still works. It is true though that creating a scenario from scratch is a huge challenge.

Yes, Steam is pretty wild. Battlestar Galactica Deadlock never interested me much, especially at $40. But now that it's 50% off, I am tempted.


(in reply to MrsWargamer)
Post #: 14
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/31/2018 6:06:52 AM   
zakblood


Posts: 22687
Joined: 10/4/2012
Status: offline 		it's a great game, if you like space game that is

(in reply to Rosseau)
Post #: 15
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/31/2018 7:23:20 AM   
bazjak

 

Posts: 263
Joined: 9/1/2014
From: Wales UK
Status: offline 		Would be interesting to know when the last few sales of this game were
If you look at the inactivity on the forum it was probably and long while ago
It's just sitting there collecting dust and not making any money but reduce the price and it will at least make something for someone
And you never know it could take off so don't shoot me down with all the retail jargon as it's a digital thing there's not a physical thing collecting dust


(in reply to zakblood)
Post #: 16
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/31/2018 8:31:12 AM   
rico21


Posts: 2990
Joined: 3/11/2016
Status: offline 		The major flaw of these good old games is their visual rendering. They attack the retina, dilate the pupil and cause a feeling of revulsion.
The new games, less good, are a visual oasis next door.

(in reply to Rosseau)
Post #: 17
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/31/2018 9:35:36 AM   
zakblood


Posts: 22687
Joined: 10/4/2012
Status: offline 		people can't moan about eye candy, as over the last few years, most complaints were about looking old and tired and not so hot / in the looks good department, so the eye candy has improved, to a point now where most new game that look old and tired, don't sell so well, so eye candy matters to the masses, but on the whole, it doesn't always make a game play any better, just nicer to look at and looks more modern,...

(in reply to rico21)
Post #: 18
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/31/2018 10:06:39 AM   
rico21


Posts: 2990
Joined: 3/11/2016
Status: offline 		The first criterion of the customers whatever the product and especially when it is new is the visual.
Amen.

(in reply to Rosseau)
Post #: 19
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/31/2018 2:24:44 PM   
Blond_Knight


Posts: 1031
Joined: 5/15/2004
Status: offline 		There something too about buying a 'dead game'. I don't understand it but I personally am less likely to invest in a dead game. Maybe its the knowledge that bugs will never be fixed, or that the community that makes scenarios, textures, or whatever mods are gone.

Unless that is, its heavily discounted. And I would counter that a digital products only value is what people are willing to pay for it.

(in reply to rico21)
Post #: 20
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/31/2018 2:52:16 PM   
bazjak

 

Posts: 263
Joined: 9/1/2014
From: Wales UK
Status: offline 		If its a dead game as you say then no sales are being made (could be said about a lot of games no just this one)
Discount the game by a certain amount and then people my see a bargain and bye said game
That way money will be raised for whoever it has to go to rather than nothing at all
I refer yet again to the dead forum
Surely that alone must say something

(in reply to Blond_Knight)
Post #: 21
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/31/2018 3:30:55 PM   
DonCzirr


Posts: 464
Joined: 10/3/2014
Status: offline 		I would buy "otherwise dead wargames" (with no changes to the AI / gameplay) at full price from Slitherine if they were just adjusted to work to my screen resolution (recent OS versions) and work well with Alt Tabbing.

I've seen that many of them like Eagle Day / Bombing the Reich / War Plan Orange etc have a lot of content - so I would not feel cheated (same with SSG games).

But with my work schedule, I have little time to tweak ini files, directx settings and reg keys to get things to functional (but still perhaps ugly / small).

I do enough of that at work to support angry users.


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Post #: 22
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/31/2018 6:15:05 PM   
Kuokkanen

 

Posts: 3545
Joined: 4/2/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MrsWargamer

A 35 dollar hardcover is a nice product. But 10k hardcovers at 35 bucks while nice sounding, might not actually happen unless you are already a sought-after author. Most girls are lucky to sell paperbacks. Most girls are lucky to even sell paperbacks. Odds are a girl is lucky to sell anything at all other than self-published digital downloads. If one of my books sells 1000 1.99 downloads, I just made 2k And some days, that's all ya get.

Hardcover version cost more than digital one. In here Finland a hardcover full colour BattleTech game rule book can cost up to 50 € while PDF version sells for measly $15 or so. And as one player sums it up:
quote:

Heck, most laptops weigh less than TacOps

I expect much of this to apply to video games as well.

quote:

Much as we hate to admit it, but wargame publishers are NOT mainstream. Not even close.

If they were, we would complain about the games even more than now.

quote:

Telling the guys here to sell you a 40 dollar game 5 years later for 15, is the same as telling them to drop dead as a whole.
I won't lie, I'll use a sale when possible.

Last December I bought first 5 Heroes of Might & Magic with all their DLC for around 10 € total. From Good Old Games. Today I played second of them for one more turn.



quote:

ORIGINAL: DonCzirr

But with my work schedule, I have little time to tweak ini files, directx settings and reg keys to get things to functional (but still perhaps ugly / small).

Someone else may have done that already and made it available on Internet. SPWAW has got a number of fan made solutions for wrong colours in Win7 and artillery screen problems in multicore processors.

_____________________________

You know what they say, don't you? About how us MechWarriors are the modern knights, how warfare has become civilized now that we have to abide by conventions and rules of war. Don't believe it.

MekWars

(in reply to MrsWargamer)
Post #: 23
RE: SSG games on Steam - 5/31/2018 10:28:20 PM   
DonCzirr


Posts: 464
Joined: 10/3/2014
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kuokkanen


quote:

ORIGINAL: DonCzirr

But with my work schedule, I have little time to tweak ini files, directx settings and reg keys to get things to functional (but still perhaps ugly / small).


Someone else may have done that already and made it available on Internet. SPWAW has got a number of fan made solutions for wrong colours in Win7 and artillery screen problems in multicore processors.



I've seen this at times - and it's great when it works.

But many times it just leads to running from forum to forum - trying various user offered tweaks.

I'd rather shell out the money to avoid the hassle - and enjoy my game time instead of schlepping around hoping to finally get a working game.

This would address Slitherine's issue from the other thread too - about coming up with new AIs from Programmer / Dev hybrids.

The old quality for a niche crowd is out there buried in aged engines.

For my taste, I'd be more interested (for a portion of their games) in them tracking down source codes, getting the required rights and revitalizing these old classics rather than struggling to find new competent wargaming Devs.

(I believe this happened quite successfully with TOAW IV?)






< Message edited by DonCzirr -- 5/31/2018 10:30:29 PM >

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Post #: 24
RE: SSG games on Steam - 6/1/2018 12:22:23 AM   
Grim.Reaper


Posts: 1355
Joined: 12/31/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bazjak

Would be interesting to know when the last few sales of this game were



During last year's Christmas sale, Battlefront, Battle in Italy, Battle in Normandy, Kharkov: Disaster on the Donets, and Korsun Pocket were all $9.99. I assume they will be the same in this year's sale, certainly seems like a decent price if you like these games.


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Post #: 25
RE: SSG games on Steam - 6/1/2018 5:48:19 AM   
bazjak

 

Posts: 263
Joined: 9/1/2014
From: Wales UK
Status: offline 		Thank you for that answer
But looking at the inactivity on the forum (B in I)couldn't have been many people who took the offer up
And it's still full price today
Like I side before if you got one sale at £10 surly that's better than nothing at all

(in reply to Grim.Reaper)
Post #: 26
RE: SSG games on Steam - 6/1/2018 10:20:24 AM   
Grim.Reaper


Posts: 1355
Joined: 12/31/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bazjak

Thank you for that answer
But looking at the inactivity on the forum (B in I)couldn't have been many people who took the offer up
And it's still full price today
Like I side before if you got one sale at £10 surly that's better than nothing at all


i have no idea on how many games are sold, only matrix knows. but i think you overestimate how many people participate in forums, especially older games even if they own it. typically people that post are folks that have issues with it or they are extreme fans. on an older game, less likely to do that but doesn’t necessarily mean not being bought or played.

so even after the big christmas sale at the price you suggested didn’t even increase forum activity so think that has little to do with it.

i can only assume that matrix feels they still are selling well enough to warrant the price, only they know the price point.


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Post #: 27
RE: SSG games on Steam - 6/1/2018 10:45:31 AM   
Okayrun3254


Posts: 173
Joined: 8/28/2014
Status: offline 		Those are great games. I own all of them, except for the space game. I also bought the new one Desert War, which is on Steam and Has excellent future possibilities. I am currently playing a fun PBEM scenario in this system. Hopefully the wargaming community supports this solid game, so we see ongoing enhancements and a eastern front game.

(in reply to Grim.Reaper)
Post #: 28
RE: SSG games on Steam - 6/1/2018 10:50:21 AM   
zakblood


Posts: 22687
Joined: 10/4/2012
Status: offline
quote:

Desert War
isn't on steam, do you mean Order of Battle Sandstorm by any chance? as that is on steam

(in reply to Okayrun3254)
Post #: 29
RE: SSG games on Steam - 6/1/2018 11:19:35 AM   
Okayrun3254


Posts: 173
Joined: 8/28/2014
Status: offline 		Oh yeah, I got steam mixed up with the PBEM server set up for Desert War.

(in reply to zakblood)
Post #: 30
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