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RE: Supply issues break the game

 
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RE: Supply issues break the game - 12/17/2018 12:55:40 AM   
Hubert Cater

 

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Joined: 7/22/2013
Status: offline 		For now we simply abstract this by reducing the max strength value ports, towns, cities and so on if they are not connected to a primary supply source. Granted Algeria and Tunis already start disconnected and reduced and don't change in value even after the Fall of Paris, but as mentioned above there are a lot of methods/mechanisms available to further reduce supply as needed.

It might not be perfect in all situations but it gets things pretty close to where they need to be without added complexity and complication.

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Post #: 31
RE: Supply issues break the game - 12/17/2018 5:55:13 PM   
Numdydar

 

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Joined: 2/13/2004
Status: offline 		But the game has the port at Algiers turn into a lv10! when the French capital moves there.

To get around this, you need to keep Paris in French hands UNTIL Algiers is captured so you do not have to worry about this nonsense.

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Post #: 32
RE: Supply issues break the game - 12/18/2018 10:14:31 AM   
griffon29200

 

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Unimportant and non essential for me

I like this game a lot !

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Post #: 33
RE: Supply issues break the game - 12/18/2018 10:47:00 AM   
PvtBenjamin

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Numdydar

But the game has the port at Algiers turn into a lv10! when the French capital moves there.

To get around this, you need to keep Paris in French hands UNTIL Algiers is captured so you do not have to worry about this nonsense.




One might also deduce there is a reason the Germans accepted Vichy in the real war and the next time I play I will accept Vichy because not doing so is a real headache.


If the Germans didn't accept Vichy and the French moved the Capital to Algiers isn't it quite possible the Allies would have considerably built up the port ability of Algiers and greatly increased troops & supply?

Allies control Gibraltar after all.



< Message edited by PvtBenjamin -- 12/18/2018 10:52:04 AM >

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Post #: 34
RE: Supply issues break the game - 12/19/2018 2:32:09 AM   
Numdydar

 

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Status: offline 		Sure but it would take a lot longer than a month to do that.

But it is pretty easy to get around this as I mentioned above. Of course its pretty gamey to keep Paris in French control while everything else is captured while you just wait for Algiers to fall. But hey, its just using one gamey trick to offset another so I am good

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Post #: 35
RE: Supply issues break the game - 12/19/2018 10:28:45 AM   
PvtBenjamin

 

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Status: offline 		It won't work in a PBEM game but whatever floats your boat

enjoy

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Post #: 36
RE: Supply issues break the game - 12/19/2018 1:25:39 PM   
Numdydar

 

Posts: 3211
Joined: 2/13/2004
Status: offline 		Since I do not play PBEM, so it is not an issue for me.

I do agree though that against a human player this would be a lot harder to do. Especially if France took troops out of France to Algeria to prevent something like this from happening.

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Post #: 37
RE: Supply issues break the game - 12/19/2018 1:40:14 PM   
Hubert Cater

 

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quote:

Sure but it would take a lot longer than a month to do that.


Thanks for the posts and we were looking into possibly slowing things down once a capital moves based on the converstation here, but in this example and in the case of the French capital moving to Algiers, since it starts at 5, it will only increase in strength, from 5 to 10, 1 strength point at a time and over 5 Allied turns.

10 game turns in total, which works out to about 5 months in game... so this doesn't feel all that offside does it?





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Post #: 38
RE: Supply issues break the game - 12/19/2018 7:27:10 PM   
Numdydar

 

Posts: 3211
Joined: 2/13/2004
Status: offline 		Not really as you are talking about lots of resources and heavy equipment, including construction ships, Engineers, etc.. Getting all of that there while the Italian Navy is running around would be very difficult. Instead of the Tokyo Express you would have the Roma Express lol.

Plus from pictures the harbor does not look like it could be expanded that greatly. If it was such a great location for a harbor of that size, it would have been developed up long before WWII started

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Post #: 39
RE: Supply issues break the game - 12/19/2018 10:03:08 PM   
Hubert Cater

 

Posts: 5199
Joined: 7/22/2013
Status: offline 		Perhaps but this is also a set of rules that apply across the board.

So the same rules apply if let's say the UK moves its capital to Egypt in War in Europe or to Australia here. At some point, and for game play reasons there is an argument to be made that a shifting in the location of the Capital will allow the major to eventually continue in a meaningful capacity thus the eventual return to strength 10 which allows for maximum supply, reinforcement and so on.

We can nitpick and apply special rules for situations like France and its move to Algiers, but do we really gain in terms of overall game play? Again, if we change it for Algiers, then it changes elsewhere in similar circumstances, or we introduce special rules that only then possibly get more confusing to remember etc.

The original concern was that Algiers jumped to strength 10 in one month, and after looking into it further, and seeing it is about 5 months, and that this gives an Axis player that planned accordingly to take into account the move to Algiers, enough reasonable time to continue to press France before it reaches full strength in North Africa, I think we are content to leave things as is considering all that I've noted just above.

< Message edited by Hubert Cater -- 12/19/2018 10:04:32 PM >

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Post #: 40
RE: Supply issues break the game - 12/20/2018 1:20:40 AM   
sPzAbt653


Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline 		Agree with Hubert, no need to add in special rules, especially when they are based on someones lack of knowledge of the rules of the game.

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Post #: 41
RE: Supply issues break the game - 12/20/2018 4:54:39 AM   
Numdydar

 

Posts: 3211
Joined: 2/13/2004
Status: offline 		Thanks sPzAbt653 for your kind words. They mean so much to me especially this time of year.

As I am sure you have never had any misunderstanding of rules in games you have played or issues with the way things were implemented.

As always Hubert has listened and decided not to do anything which is perfectly fine. I still say France should have another place to go after Algiers

Also I have found a solution to all of this so it no longer much matters as the game just forces the Axis to capture Algiers first then Paris if a complete conquest of France is wanted. So a gamey solution to a gamey problem

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Post #: 42
RE: Supply issues break the game - 12/20/2018 2:43:48 PM   
sPzAbt653


Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
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quote:

I am sure you have never had any misunderstanding of rules

I've had plenty but I don't trash talk the game and make half-assed rule change suggestions that waste the developers time. There are plenty of people here that can help you learn the game properly.

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Post #: 43
RE: Supply issues break the game - 12/21/2018 4:00:11 AM   
Numdydar

 

Posts: 3211
Joined: 2/13/2004
Status: offline 		Wow. Did you forget to take your nice pills?

It is your opinion that my suggestions are 'half-assed' which you are entitled to. Needless to say I do not think my suggestions were half assed at all. Nor do I think my discussions here are 'trashing the game'. Again your opinion.

It is MY opinion that the discussions here especially with Hubert have been very positive. So I am not sure why you have to start in with me like you are doing. But hey, if it helps you feel better in some way, keep on going

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Post #: 44
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