Matrix Games Forums

 Forums  Register  Login  Photo Gallery  Member List  Search  Calendars  FAQ 

My Profile  Inbox  Address Book  My Subscription  My Forums  Log Out

SBD vs. Helldiver

 
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> SBD vs. Helldiver Page: [1]
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
SBD vs. Helldiver - 3/4/2019 2:27:59 AM   
IdahoNYer


Posts: 2616
Joined: 9/6/2009
From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		Question for the Allied Fanboys....

Is it worthwhile swapping out SBD-5s for the SB2C-3 or waiting until the -4 shows up?

Concerned about the 2 service ratings more than anything else.

Thoughts?
Post #: 1
RE: SBD vs. Helldiver - 3/4/2019 2:35:34 AM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 13450
Joined: 11/16/2015
From: My Mother, although my Father had some small part.
Status: offline 		The SBD was considered the best dive bomber of the war. I prefer to stick with it.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to IdahoNYer)
Post #: 2
RE: SBD vs. Helldiver - 3/4/2019 2:39:47 AM   
Anachro


Posts: 2506
Joined: 11/23/2015
From: The Coastal Elite
Status: offline 		Barring real life issues, the SB2Cs, even the -3, do fine in game and I make use of either depending on what's available in the pools.

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 3
RE: SBD vs. Helldiver - 3/4/2019 11:25:22 AM   
HansBolter


Posts: 7704
Joined: 7/6/2006
From: United States
Status: offline 		SBD5 and especially SBD6 production rates are nowhere near adequate to service the ever expanding need.

I'm in September of '45 now and approximately 25% of my fleet air squadrons are still flying SBDs.

The pools of Son of Bitch Second Class airframes will far outstrip the pools of SBDs

_____________________________

Hans


(in reply to Anachro)
Post #: 4
RE: SBD vs. Helldiver - 3/4/2019 12:15:34 PM   
Macclan5


Posts: 1065
Joined: 3/24/2016
From: Toronto Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HansBolter

SBD5 and especially SBD6 production rates are nowhere near adequate to service the ever expanding need.

I'm in September of '45 now and approximately 25% of my fleet air squadrons are still flying SBDs.

The pools of Son of Bitch Second Class airframes will far outstrip the pools of SBDs



Concur with Hans.

The "5" is a solid mid game plane and solid Carrier TF upgrade as soon as possible. So in 43/44 I try to load up my CVs with the 5 extensively.

You / I / we can have '5s and 6s' on CV fleets but you also have to micromanage it (PDU On - obviously)

As I recall : A number of SOPAC / CENPAC USMC squadrons come fully equipped with the 5 ... downgrade the VMF - Updated the Carriers.

Problem is some of those VMF squadrons are also highly valuable off island airbases depending where you are in game.

So its a classic trade off.

Where and how do you need to project force - against your opponent.

By mid 44 - I 'buy in' for the SOB 2nd class.

< Message edited by Macclan5 -- 3/4/2019 12:16:09 PM >

_____________________________

A People that values its privileges above it's principles will soon loose both. Dwight D Eisenhower.

(in reply to HansBolter)
Post #: 5
RE: SBD vs. Helldiver - 3/5/2019 10:04:29 AM   
Barb


Posts: 2503
Joined: 2/27/2007
From: Bratislava, Slovakia
Status: offline 		SB2C carries more bombs (thus higher hit chance) than SBD.

Just switch the TBF/TBM to the Naval Search instead of the Dive bombers. Reserve SB2C only to Naval Strike and no search - helps keep the higher SR plane operational. TBF/TBM frames also carries a radar and was used in NavS/ASW at that time more than SB2C. (Early war it was SBD while TBD/TBF/TBM were reserved for torpedo strikes).

_____________________________


(in reply to Macclan5)
Post #: 6
RE: SBD vs. Helldiver - 3/5/2019 10:41:34 AM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 13450
Joined: 11/16/2015
From: My Mother, although my Father had some small part.
Status: offline 		I have never gotten to the late war as the computer always gives up in 1943 . . .

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to Barb)
Post #: 7
RE: SBD vs. Helldiver - 3/5/2019 11:25:32 AM   
HansBolter


Posts: 7704
Joined: 7/6/2006
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

I have never gotten to the late war as the computer always gives up in 1943 . . .



I too had this problem playing 20-30 games over a decade that never made it into '44.

My current game is the first to ever reach '44 let alone '45.

I'm playing scenario 40, AndyMac's Ironman Nasty Ported to Babes.

I did slow pace thing in late '43 and early '44 to ensure the AI would remain viable.

I never raided offensively with my carriers, using them only to cover invasions.

I'm in September '45 now prepping for the invasion of Kyushu.

The AI doesn't have much navy left and is bottled up in the HI anyway, but every major base has huge stacks of LCUs and 250+ fighters. There are 577 LCUs stacked in Tokyo with over 500 fighters.

Gotterdamerung is coming!



_____________________________

Hans


(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 8
RE: SBD vs. Helldiver - 3/5/2019 2:04:57 PM   
Macclan5


Posts: 1065
Joined: 3/24/2016
From: Toronto Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

I have never gotten to the late war as the computer always gives up in 1943 . . .




Depends what you want ?

Hans maybe a far better expert than I to address this - however I am assuming 'scored victory'.

I am playing through my 3rd full OC as the Allies with all the AI updates - but still essentially vanilla

Is the definition of victory:

1) The tactical score ratio ?

2) The occupation of Tokyo ?

In fairness - I have seen others opine that the last year of the war - 1944 / 45 verses the AI is a slugfest. Siege - surround - bombard - air bomb - rinse - repeat - repeat repeat if worried by the number and type of 'electron casualties you take'.

That is the AI has outstanding fortification building scripts and position troops adroitly on Okinawa / Iwo / Home Islands / last bit of Manchuria etc etc. I would attest that late 44 / early 45 is a 'slugfest' in my experience but I enjoy the goal of true 'almost historical end game'.

Landing(s) on the Home Islands with 100% prep - multi division - multi support still can take significant losses.

Iwo for example has been a real tough nut in all three instances - 30K troops - coastal artillery - Level 6+ fortifications - consistently. I have never attempted Amphib landings near Tokyo always preferring further afield points and marching to the capital.

Disclaimers
--

I was lucky enough to get three very different AI scripts each game.

I have experimented with different 'avenues' of attack i.e. Traditional vs Burma/China vs DEI northwards.

This time around I intend to make multiple saves and 'play with the bomb' outcome and effects




< Message edited by Macclan5 -- 3/5/2019 2:10:17 PM >

_____________________________

A People that values its privileges above it's principles will soon loose both. Dwight D Eisenhower.

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 9
RE: SBD vs. Helldiver - 3/5/2019 3:11:31 PM   
rustysi


Posts: 7472
Joined: 2/21/2012
From: LI, NY
Status: offline
quote:

Gotterdamerung is coming!


Ya think.

_____________________________

It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. Hume

In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

(in reply to Macclan5)
Post #: 10
RE: SBD vs. Helldiver - 3/5/2019 3:30:58 PM   
HansBolter


Posts: 7704
Joined: 7/6/2006
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rustysi

quote:

Gotterdamerung is coming!


Ya think.



The one really odd thing in these Ironman games is that the plethora of German units operating in the Indian and Pacific oceans keep on fighting after Germany has surrendered.

I'm still encountering U-Boats in September of '45.

_____________________________

Hans


(in reply to rustysi)
Post #: 11
RE: SBD vs. Helldiver - 3/5/2019 4:53:34 PM   
rustysi


Posts: 7472
Joined: 2/21/2012
From: LI, NY
Status: offline
quote:

I'm still encountering U-Boats in September of '45.




_____________________________

It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. Hume

In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

(in reply to HansBolter)
Post #: 12
RE: SBD vs. Helldiver - 3/5/2019 5:44:38 PM   
GetAssista

 

Posts: 2732
Joined: 9/19/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HansBolter
The one really odd thing in these Ironman games is that the plethora of German units operating in the Indian and Pacific oceans keep on fighting after Germany has surrendered.

I'm still encountering U-Boats in September of '45.

Being closer to Japan (and being supplied by Japan I guess) they got infused with some of that samurai spirit

(in reply to HansBolter)
Post #: 13
RE: SBD vs. Helldiver - 3/5/2019 6:11:01 PM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 13450
Joined: 11/16/2015
From: My Mother, although my Father had some small part.
Status: offline 		I put my Allied game on pause and I am now trying Japan.

In my Allied game, only the Akagi is left of the original 6 carriers and the Junyo is gone as well. Three CVLs and 2 CVEs as well as 4 BBs. It is currently May of 1942 and I have yet to lose an aircraft carrier. I need to see if there are better AI scripts out there. I think that I saw something about that.

quote:

GetAssista

Being closer to Japan (and being supplied by Japan I guess) they got infused with some of that samurai spirit


It is called saki . . .

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to GetAssista)
Post #: 14
RE: SBD vs. Helldiver - 3/6/2019 5:59:22 PM   
IdahoNYer


Posts: 2616
Joined: 9/6/2009
From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		Thanks guys, appreciate the input!

Barb - I think you nailed the solution!

Hans....you gotta try PBEM!

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 15
Page:   [1]
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> SBD vs. Helldiver Page: [1]
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI

4.766