Slitherine

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ORIGINAL: btd64

Yes, some info on this is in 6.2.13 of the manual. It gives a hint anyway....GP

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ORIGINAL: Jorge_Stanbury

I think I asked that same question years ago, and Alfred replied that Yes, escorts will still consume at full speed

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ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

I don't know but run them at mission speed. Full speed creates damage.

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ORIGINAL: Jorge_Stanbury

I found it

https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3932120&mpage=1&key=cruise�

unless I misunderstood. lol there are a few tests done afterwards that I will read in detail

EDIT: post #15 proves escorts will consume at full rate

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ORIGINAL: Alfred

The "cruise" fuel consumption rate only applies when the entire distance traveled that turn was at cruise speed. If for any reason during that turn "maximum speed" is employed, the full speed fuel consumption rate is employed for all hexes traversed that turn.

Alfred

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ORIGINAL: Ian R

I had a look back through the 2016 change log (or more specifically, searched various search terms on the 100plus page pdf) and could see no reference to any post release change. So, either there is one and I missed it... or it was changed to 160 post manual, pre-release. Or ...

Or maybe we are reading the manual wrong, being too literal or whatever. Alfred did not say what the per hex endurance cost of full speed was in absolute terms. Only that you pay it for each hex moved that day, without apportioned [not Alfred's exact term) costings. It is possible that with die rolls and distances and the like randomising factors, that what the manual says is happening, and additionally that means you are paying an average cost of 160 per hex for all hexes in certain conditions, such as were in justus' anecdotal test. Look at this way, if you had cruise speed two, full speed three, and went full speed do you pay 3 x 160, 3 x 280, or 2 x 40 and 1 x 280? The last option is an average of 120 per hex. Throw in some random factors (and Michael might have put some in, as he did with one hex patrols and the like), and it is still muddy.

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ORIGINAL: geofflambert

It's all relative to the cruise speed of each ship. Slowing a warship down to the speed of a freighter is really inefficient for the warship and a lot of fuel will be wasted. There's no easy math here. How the game handles that I don't know.

How heavy the seas are is a factor too. DDs that have a max speed greater than a BB they are escorting will have difficulty keeping up in heavy seas, even at max speed if the BB is going cruise speed.

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ORIGINAL: dr.hal

After reading all the above AND the linked posts I think it's clear that for the question I raised, that of DDs and other "fast" ships embedded into a TF of AKs or other cargo ships, if the TF is moving at the FULL speed of the slowest cargo ship which is 14 and the SLOWEST DD or other "fast" ship has a cruise rate of 15 then NONE of the fast ships will be "charged" consumption at the FULL rate (like the AKs) but will indeed be charged the cruise rate (=40 fuel pts per hex). However if any one of the DDs or other "fast" ships cruise speed is less than 14, that particular ship would be charged the FULL speed consumption rate just like the cargo ships in the TF. Please understand that I didn't ask about damage to ships at "FULL" rate (I do know that moving at full causes damage) or anything else. If I've got this wrong please let me know.

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ORIGINAL: dr.hal

But BB, that flies in the face of what the manual (in 6.2.13) states "Since each ship checks the TF move against its own Cruising Speed, ships in the same TF can use up different amounts of endurance in the same move."

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ORIGINAL: brian800000


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ORIGINAL: pacificbetta

Thanks, that is what I thought, but ouch, the Tosu PBs have a fuel of 91, that means a range of less than 3 hex? So does that poor fella starts drawing down his endurance of 1700 after hex 3, or does he slow down the entire convoy to "refuel from other ships"?

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ORIGINAL: brian800000


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ORIGINAL: pacificbetta

Hijack the thread a little :P

Does anyone know how exactly is fule consumption of a ship calculated? The manual said fuel is deducted from endurance, does that mean for each endurance that the ship consume when it moves, it exhaust 1 fuel point?


I think for non carrier groups 1 endurance equals 1 mile at cruise speed. Full speed burns a lot more. Divide the endurance by 40 and you get the range in hexes.




No, I think fuel is just the amount of fuel points held by the ship. So if a PB has an endurance of 1700 and a max fuel point of 91, it can still go 40+ hexes without refueling. I assume fuel points are just burned in proportion to how far you have gone (ie, if you travel that PB 850 miles, you would burn about 45 fuel points).


IMHO, I don't think this quite explains it clearly enough for new players. So here goes an attempt to explain fuel consumption more fully/clearly.

The distance a ship can travel is determined by it's endurance number (see page 105 of the manual). Each hex travelled uses up a certain amount of endurance. At cruise (or lesser) speed, the endurance used up is 40 x number of hexes travelled. Hence at cruise speed a ship which travels 4 hexes reduces its starting endurance by 160 (ie 40 x 4). Travelling at flank speed, the endurance reduction is an additional 240 endurance per hex moved beyond the distance traversed which the cruise speed setting would have achieved.

The fuel points listed on a ship's screen should be read as the amount of fuel, measured in tonnes, in the fuel tanks. When refueling the ship, an equivalent fuel point (or tonne) will be removed from the port fuel stockpile. Hence if a ship has only 1 fuel point left out of its maximum 91, when it refuels it will transfer 90 fuel points (tonnes) from shore to its fuel tanks.

Note that different ship classes can burn fuel at different economy rates steaming at the same rate. Hence different ship endurance totals can result from the same fuel points.

Alfred

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ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

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ORIGINAL: dr.hal

But BB, that flies in the face of what the manual (in 6.2.13) states "Since each ship checks the TF move against its own Cruising Speed, ships in the same TF can use up different amounts of endurance in the same move."

I'll see if I can find Alfred's post on the subject. IIRC, he said something about the manual not being entirely correct on this subject.

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Alfred says:
The distance a ship can travel is determined by it's endurance number (see page 105 of the manual). Each hex travelled uses up a certain amount of endurance. At cruise (or lesser) speed, the endurance used up is 40 x number of hexes travelled. Hence at cruise speed a ship which travels 4 hexes reduces its starting endurance by 160 (ie 40 x 4). Travelling at flank speed, the endurance reduction is an additional 240 endurance per hex moved beyond the distance traversed which the cruise speed setting would have achieved.

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If you have a TF with a cruise speed of 4 (hexes) for all ships, and a full speed of 8 hexes, and it goes at full speed, and you do what the manual seems to say, the calculation you make is:

(40 x 4) + [(40 + 240) x 4] = 1280 endurance. Also, 1280/160 = 8.

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Just remember that it is endurance which is consumed and then converted into fuel.

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ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

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Just remember that it is endurance which is consumed and then converted into fuel.

Not to be too picky, but I thought that it was fuel that was converted into endurance points. The ships is refueled and the endurance increases.

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ORIGINAL: Alfred

The thread is about consumption.
Alfred