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Newbie Unit Counter Graphics Questions: TOAW 3 conversion and differential counters

 
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Newbie Unit Counter Graphics Questions: TOAW 3 conversi... - 9/5/2020 3:59:49 AM   
apresby

 

Posts: 12
Joined: 6/7/2007
Status: offline 		BLUF:
1. Is it possible to import TOAW 3 scenarios with custom graphics to TOAW 4 without manually converting those files to the new TOAW 4 graphical system? Essentially redrawing them.
2. Can one make a scenario in which the two Forces have different shapes on their counters? I see many scenarios where both sides have different colors but I'm not seeing ones with different shapes.

BACKGROUND: I am a new-to-TOAW player looking to convert several old TOAW 3 scenarios that used custom unit counter shapes. These scenarios are either fantastical or outside the timeframe for which the game is designed so I don't really expect the capability to do this to be innate. I did expect to be able to figure out how to do it. Though I am a sailor in an Army game so maybe that's why I can't seem to find my backside with both hands and SONAR.

DISCUSSION: I used the forum search for likely titles, read Bob Cross' article on unit icon coloration, searched the manual and read every instance of the word "graphic" in it, reviewed the "Manuals" folder in the game's root directory, and looked at the titles of every single page of the 15 pages of Scenarios and Mods thread here reading likely entries. Sadly my efforts revealed no certain answers to the above questions. Oh...and I ran old TOAW 3 scenario with custom graphics in TOAW 4. Scenario ran like a champ but no graphics changes were evident. I can find how to create my own custom counter shape-sheet but not how to import the old TOAW 3 counter by counter graphic format into TOAW 4 nor how to make a scenario where the two sides have different icons on their counters.

I am certain that I'm missing something obvious but please file me under "noob-who-wants-to-learn" and not "lazy-little-sh!t-that-never-lifted-a-finger-to-answer-own-question".

Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.

< Message edited by apresby -- 9/5/2020 4:08:51 AM >
Post #: 1
RE: Newbie Unit Counter Graphics Questions: TOAW 3 conv... - 9/5/2020 4:34:28 AM   
Hellen_slith


Posts: 1990
Joined: 10/10/2005
Status: offline 		About the III / IV graphics: seems like there was pretty extensive discussion about this w/re/to the Vietnam Combat Operations scenes (and I'm pretty sure the answer to your question is a solid NO, but I'm no expert.) I will try to find that discussion and post the link.

(in reply to apresby)
Post #: 2
RE: Newbie Unit Counter Graphics Questions: TOAW 3 conv... - 9/5/2020 4:44:21 AM   
Hellen_slith


Posts: 1990
Joined: 10/10/2005
Status: offline 		This is the post / link I mentioned

https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4382199

(in reply to Hellen_slith)
Post #: 3
RE: Newbie Unit Counter Graphics Questions: TOAW 3 conv... - 9/5/2020 4:52:51 AM   
Hellen_slith


Posts: 1990
Joined: 10/10/2005
Status: offline 		Also, the user Sylvanski has done some conversions of popular scenes, he would definitely be someone who you might sound out for tips. You might looks at his work, they are in mods / scenarios and I will look at my index and see which scenes I can identify that he converted to IV

(in reply to Hellen_slith)
Post #: 4
RE: Newbie Unit Counter Graphics Questions: TOAW 3 conv... - 9/5/2020 4:57:07 AM   
Hellen_slith


Posts: 1990
Joined: 10/10/2005
Status: offline 		Sylvanski's conversions I see listed in WWI section, look at post #1 of link below, in the table / list of scenes, at bottom are several that were " converted" by sylvanski, you can download those frm the mods/ scenarios section of these forums,

https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4805229

(in reply to Hellen_slith)
Post #: 5
RE: Newbie Unit Counter Graphics Questions: TOAW 3 conv... - 9/5/2020 6:53:49 AM   
sPzAbt653


Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline 		1. It depends on what Graphics you want to import, some can, some can't.
2. No, both sides use the same sheet. You could make side specific counters within that one sheet with some effort, however there is the shading to contend with. I haven't tried it myself.

The pre-IV Graphics systems were mostly bashed on the rocks by the developers with no respect for all earlier versions. Now you have to try to shoehorn and crowbar your way thru the 'CounterUnits' files:




Attachment (1)

(in reply to apresby)
Post #: 6
RE: Newbie Unit Counter Graphics Questions: TOAW 3 conv... - 9/5/2020 6:58:52 AM   
sPzAbt653


Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline 		You've got this counter grid to contend with, and after this there is a shading file somewhere.




Attachment (1)

(in reply to sPzAbt653)
Post #: 7
RE: Newbie Unit Counter Graphics Questions: TOAW 3 conv... - 9/5/2020 4:00:46 PM   
apresby

 

Posts: 12
Joined: 6/7/2007
Status: offline 		phew. Ok. Thank you all for those references! I'll see what I can kludge together. For what I have in mind representing both sides using unique elements on the same counter sheet should actually work...EXCEPT...

1. From my forum reading I think that each individual counter on the sheet has hard coded in-game behaviors, yes? Or did I misunderstand that part?

2. The counters are just shapes which can be assigned to units, right? The actual statistics are built from the underlying .eqp and .nqp files if I am understanding things correctly. So I just need all the SHAPES I need in the counter files.

Please don't be offended but in addition to using this excellent wargame to learn about ground combat (a topic which, as an ex-naval officer, I perhaps know less than I should) I am also toying with using TOAW IV to represent fictional space and ground warfare. So, for instance, the countersheets in Task Force Games' Federation and Empire (shown below) are something I'm thinking about replicating in TOAW 4.

If people are interested in seeing what I'm trying to do I can post an image seven days after my tenth post...so not quite there yet.

Thanks again for your patience!
v/r
feld

< Message edited by apresby -- 9/5/2020 4:14:24 PM >

(in reply to sPzAbt653)
Post #: 8
RE: Newbie Unit Counter Graphics Questions: TOAW 3 conv... - 9/6/2020 2:57:05 AM   
sPzAbt653


Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline 		We have been given this chart as a reference. Those in Red have specific coded abilities, therefore those not Red can be used for other purposes.




Attachment (1)

(in reply to apresby)
Post #: 9
RE: Newbie Unit Counter Graphics Questions: TOAW 3 conv... - 9/6/2020 3:02:47 AM   
sPzAbt653


Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline
quote:

2. The counters are just shapes which can be assigned to units, right? The actual statistics are built from the underlying .eqp and .nqp files if I am understanding things correctly. So I just need all the SHAPES I need in the counter files.

Getting advanced with this one, and that's ok it's just maybe a little more difficult to grasp at first. While mixing/making icons you can create something that can't hold the equipment that you want. But since that doesn't happen often we can skip it for now. So yes, the unit stats come from the equipment, not the icon/counter. We used to have 108 counter sheets and could do pretty much whatever we creatively wanted. Now we have this one sheet to limit our creativity, but some stuff can still be done.

(in reply to apresby)
Post #: 10
RE: Newbie Unit Counter Graphics Questions: TOAW 3 conv... - 9/7/2020 1:04:43 AM   
apresby

 

Posts: 12
Joined: 6/7/2007
Status: offline 		OK. Thanks. Bollux. I may have to do what I want in TOAW 3. Hmmm...but the naval hardware simulation in TOAW 3 was no where near as robust I think.

(in reply to sPzAbt653)
Post #: 11
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