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RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 4:22:54 PM   
CaptBeefheart


Posts: 2301
Joined: 7/4/2003
From: Seoul, Korea
Status: offline 		BTW, "Patriot" was highly fictional. Gibson seems to have a thing against Limeys (witness "Braveheart").

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Beer, because barley makes lousy bread.

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Post #: 31
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 4:29:33 PM   
vonmoltke


Posts: 182
Joined: 10/27/2003
From: Bloomfield, NJ
Status: offline 		U-571
Pearl Harbor
Battle of the Bulge

And what's with calling The Enemy Below one of the worst TexasLt?

(in reply to CaptBeefheart)
Post #: 32
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 5:33:56 PM   
The Gnome


Posts: 1233
Joined: 5/17/2002
From: Philadelphia, PA
Status: offline 		Thin Red Line - Great book, horribly cliched movie.
Pearl Harbor
Patriot - I love how they portray the British troops as the SS, masterful hyperbole (that should be read dripping with sarcasm).

(in reply to vonmoltke)
Post #: 33
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 5:42:57 PM   
Toro


Posts: 578
Joined: 4/9/2002
From: 16 miles southeast of Hell (Michigan, i.e.), US
Status: offline 		Ah, bad war films... seems like there's more of them than good.

My worst:
Gods and Generals (as opposed to Gettysburg, which I loved)
U-571 (excuse me, have to go to the toilet now)
Pearl Harbor (excuse me, barfing now)
Windtalkers (a movie about Windtalkers that wasn't about Windtalkers)
The War Lover (Steve McQueen, what did you do???)

Opposition to another suggestion:
Thin Red Line -- didn't like this the first time I watched, love it now. It's like Raising Arizona; takes some getting used to...

< Message edited by Toro -- 7/1/2004 10:43:25 AM >

(in reply to The Gnome)
Post #: 34
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 5:55:35 PM   
JohnK

 

Posts: 285
Joined: 2/8/2001
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rlc27

IMHO Thin Red Line was a close to a masterpiece. Not as a conventional war flick, but as a psychological tour de force. Didn't like how they only had 1 transport available though. My main problem was that it was overly interpretive from the book; all that Buddhist stuff was added in, while the book plays it pretty straight. And it's a lot funnier.



The Thin Red Line was an abomination, largely because it did have some beautiful cinematography and a couple great moments absolutely ruined.

Actually, it was pretty funny when I began laughing at the 1,542,423,454th shot of a colorful bird in a tree (As Malick repeatedly beat his viewers over the head with his "man violating nature" message, which incidentally is found NOWHERE in the book.)

The endless voiceovers of inner thoughts (a sign of a bad script) were horrible, particularly those of Witt, who I was hoping would get ventilated by a Japanese machine gun the whole movie.

I actually read the book AFTER seeing the movie. Obviously, adapted screenplays are going to differ a LOT from books; many characters will be removed, scenes cut...the problem with TRL is in no way, shape, or form did it capture the SPIRIT of the book; and the characters were changed beyond recognition; in the book, Witt is a brawling racist, not a gentle backwoods philosopher.

(in reply to rlc27)
Post #: 35
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 6:15:01 PM   
tiredoftryingnames


Posts: 1919
Joined: 12/10/2001
From: Chesapeake, Virginia
Status: offline 		Thin Red Line (The editing and dialog was so bad it was a joke. Sorry but I was in the infantry, most GIs don't talk like poets 24/7)
Pearl Harbor (The script as a whole was so bad it was a joke)

Enemy at the Gates has a special category. I liked (not loved) most of the movie and could deal with it's shortcummings until the end. The final sniper duel from 5 ft apart just blew the whole thing. That and the love story. Even my wife who loves love stories said it was a bad love story in the middle of a movie that didn't need a love story.

(in reply to CaptBeefheart)
Post #: 36
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 6:19:29 PM   
Mr.Frag


Posts: 13410
Joined: 12/18/2002
From: Purgatory
Status: offline
quote:

Thin Red Line (The editing and dialog was so bad it was a joke. Sorry but I was in the infantry, most GIs don't talk like poets 24/7)


Agreed, one of the very few war movies ever that I actually got up and found something else to do in the middle of it.

(in reply to tiredoftryingnames)
Post #: 37
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 6:20:35 PM   
Feinder


Posts: 6589
Joined: 9/4/2002
From: Land o' Lakes, FL
Status: offline 		Anybody ever seen "Wake Island" (1942).

Yes, it's an old propoganda film. It's horrible, but you have to consider the time.

I think you guys take some these films way too seriously. Are you looking for a TRUE historical account of the battle? or something you can enjoy.



Battle of the Bulge (true historical account) - SNOW. Lots of it. Visability of 20m. "BOOM! Where the fack did that come from?!"

Pearl Harbor (true historical account) - SMOKE! Lots of it. BOOM! "Where the fack did that come from?!"

This Red Line (ture historical account) - HUNGER! "Where the fack is our gawd-d_mned Navy with more food! We're starving! (artillery fire) BOOM! ****! Where the fack did that come from?!

Desert Rats (true historical account) - HOT! "Holy shat if facking hot out here! Forward line-abreast at 40m. Enemy Panzers on the south ridge! BLAM! Where the fack did that come from?!"

I know the "facts" (of the historical accounts), but I also don't mind a bit of "poetic license" as long as it's entertaining. If I want to see a historical account, I'll watch a documentary.

But while I might find "Wake Island" entertaining, in the spirit of this thread, it gets my vote as the "worst" movie.

-S-

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Post #: 38
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 8:37:42 PM   
dr. smith

 

Posts: 221
Joined: 6/30/2004
From: lost in space
Status: offline 		MIDWAY - no other movie comes close. Instead of seeing how bravely the TBDs lined up one after another to ALL meet a fiery end, what do we see? Chuckles Heston sitting at a desk chewing his fingernails. Instead of seeing the SBDs arrive over the carriers with nary a Zero in the sky, lining up one after another, turning over to make their fateful dives to drop 1k pounder after 1k pounder on Jap flight deck, what do we see? We see Chucky Heston chewing on his fingernails.

IT SUCKED!!!

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 39
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 8:42:50 PM   
freeboy

 

Posts: 9088
Joined: 5/16/2004
From: Colorado
Status: offline 		sounds like you don't like ch? I thought that it was far hollywild ww2 action, the origonal out of print had great coral sea action.. but it alas is lost

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Post #: 40
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 8:44:48 PM   
Onime No Kyo


Posts: 16842
Joined: 4/28/2004
Status: offline 		IMHO even the worst war movies have had their moments. Enough to justify the movie ticket at any rate. The worst films, I would have to say were...

Pearl Harbor (although the digi-Battleship Row was amazing).
Patton (I just did not like that movie. Say what you will, but to me it seemed very superficial, despite the fact that George C. Scott is a wonderful actor).

and last and most odious was Thin Red Line. My apologies to the fans of the movie but if someone hadn't told me before hand that it was a big-budget war flick I would have confused it with a student film shot on a budget of $15 over a 3-day weekend.

Enemy at the Gates wasnt that bad. I admit that I went int there with such low expectations that they had nowhere else to go but up. On the whole, I think they did a better job of capturing the mentality and spirit of the time than I ever expected from a Hollywood war movie.

On the whole, however, I think that my ability to speak Russian has spoiled me. Being able to speak another language opens up a whole new vista of cinematography, as I'm sure our German friends would agree. I think that Russian war movies are hundreds of times better, more accurate and thrilling on a smaller budget.

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Post #: 41
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 8:47:49 PM   
McNaughton

 

Posts: 113
Joined: 4/13/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Feinder

Anybody ever seen "Wake Island" (1942).

Yes, it's an old propoganda film. It's horrible, but you have to consider the time.

I think you guys take some these films way too seriously. Are you looking for a TRUE historical account of the battle? or something you can enjoy.


Yeah, this was horrid, everyone dies at their post.

I think that all movies which used big-budget actors are horrible war movies. In the end it turns problematic as the actor themselves cannot portray anything but (at least by the end) an absolute hero (take Saving Private Ryan for example). War movies built around actors are pathetic (Battle of the Bluge, Pearl Harbour, Patriot, U-571, etc.) while those that have the story more important than the actors tend to be better (The Longest Day, A Bridge Too Far, Bridge over the River Kwai, All Quiet on the Western Front, etc.) may have big actors, but no single one dominates (i.e., it isn't THEIR story).

< Message edited by McNaughton -- 7/1/2004 6:52:54 PM >

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Post #: 42
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 8:55:48 PM   
kev_uk

 

Posts: 288
Joined: 6/5/2004
From: South Wales, UK
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Onime No Kyo

and last and most odious was Thin Red Line. My apologies to the fans of the movie but if someone hadn't told me before hand that it was a big-budget war flick I would have confused it with a student film shot on a budget of $15 over a 3-day weekend.


Hardly agree with that. I think its probably one of the best war films I have seen, at least it had some semblance of trying to analyse what war is about/the futility of war. It depends what you look for in films though I guess.

(in reply to Onime No Kyo)
Post #: 43
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 9:02:08 PM   
joey


Posts: 1408
Joined: 5/8/2004
From: Johnstown, PA
Status: offline 		by far the Thin Red Line!!!!

(in reply to TexasLt)
Post #: 44
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 9:04:27 PM   
JohnK

 

Posts: 285
Joined: 2/8/2001
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kev_uk

Hardly agree with that. I think its probably one of the best war films I have seen, at least it had some semblance of trying to analyse what war is about/the futility of war. It depends what you look for in films though I guess


That's not it at all. It was a miserably failed, clumsy attempt to make a thoughtful anti-war "war" movie.

The problem with TRL isn't that it wasn't a rip-roaring patriotic explosion-fest, it was that it was cliched and ham-handed.

< Message edited by JohnK -- 7/1/2004 7:04:53 PM >

(in reply to kev_uk)
Post #: 45
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 9:07:43 PM   
JohnK

 

Posts: 285
Joined: 2/8/2001
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Onime No Kyo
Enemy at the Gates wasnt that bad. I admit that I went int there with such low expectations that they had nowhere else to go but up. On the whole, I think they did a better job of capturing the mentality and spirit of the time than I ever expected from a Hollywood war movie.


Enemy at the Gates had the best sets I've ever seen in a war movie. Really made me believe it was Stalingrad.

Ending, as others have noted, was horrible.

If you're at all interested in the subject matter, read the novel "War of the Rats." Has the same characters as Enemy at the Gates (since both were based on real characters) but has nothing to do with the movie, and pre-dated the movie. The ending sniper duel in War of the Rats is one of the best things I've ever read.

(in reply to Onime No Kyo)
Post #: 46
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 9:47:26 PM   
dr. smith

 

Posts: 221
Joined: 6/30/2004
From: lost in space
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: freeboy

sounds like you don't like ch?


Chucky Heston was not quite vile, what was vile about Midway was after paying UpChuck, they did not even have enought money to do those "model ships in the bathtub blowing up" sequences to show the action, ala In Harm's Way.

Hell, as mere teenager (with good intentions mind you ), I filled my USS Missouri full of gunpowder with a fuse and floated her down the creek . . . KABOOOOMM! Thus providing better special effects than Midway!

< Message edited by dr. smith -- 7/1/2004 2:52:14 PM >

(in reply to freeboy)
Post #: 47
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 10:35:18 PM   
Onime No Kyo


Posts: 16842
Joined: 4/28/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JohnK
If you're at all interested in the subject matter, read the novel "War of the Rats." Has the same characters as Enemy at the Gates (since both were based on real characters) but has nothing to do with the movie, and pre-dated the movie. The ending sniper duel in War of the Rats is one of the best things I've ever read.


Yes, I read that before I saw the movie. In fact, I make it a point to read books that movies are based on before I see the film. It was a good read although the book vs movie thing suffers from the same ailment as "Devils and Angels"/Gettysburg, namely, its historical fiction. Having said that, I enjoyed both EatG and Gettysburg very much.

As long as I'm on the subject, the one book I had not read before seeing the movie was "Starship Troopers", that I read after watching the film. And as long as we're talking about "war" movies, ST has to be one of the best blockbuster shoot-em-ups ever. Not quite sure if you guys will accept it into the war-movie discussion here, but still worth a mention.

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Post #: 48
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 10:55:01 PM   
Blackhorse


Posts: 1983
Joined: 8/20/2000
From: Eastern US
Status: offline 		Worst Movie:

Breakthrough! the horrid sequel (with Richard Burton as Sgt. Steiner) to the superb Cross of Iron.

. . . I enjoy almost any war movie with any redeeming value -- even Battle of the Bulge, because of the great Panzer recruits singing scene -- and even (or especially) well-done movies with an anti-war message . . . Deer Hunter, All Quiet on the Western Front.

That said, I am among those who really, really, disliked Thin Red Line. It was a great National Geographic Nature Documentary. It was a horribly long and turgid war movie. I remember the 'false ending', then finding out there was another 20 minutes of voiced-over "O, My soul . . ." thought-dialogue, and hoping that the landing craft carrying our heroes away from the 'Canal would hit a mine and put everyone out of our misery.

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Oddball: Why don't you knock it off with them negative waves? Why don't you dig how beautiful it is out here? Why don't you say something righteous and hopeful for a change?
Moriarty: Crap!

(in reply to Onime No Kyo)
Post #: 49
RE: THE WORST WAR FILMS - 7/1/2004 11:25:14 PM   
stinger5050

 

Posts: 8
Joined: 6/30/2003
From: Rochester NY
Status: offline 		I have to say Pear Harbor is the worst, they had how much money and talent available, and this is the best they could produce?

(in reply to Blackhorse)
Post #: 50
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