when to stop minelaying? (Full Version)

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hosho -> when to stop minelaying? (6/14/2006 1:19:15 PM)

i have an ml tf at rangoon and i`ve been minelaying an enemy base at akyab ( or what ever the name is [:)] ) for more than a month. but i`ve experienced "suicide" of 2 my mls from own mines[:@]. someone has lost the maps of minefields or ...? is there a point when i should stop laying mines? are there any hints that say this is the time to stop minelaying an enemy port? i`m a jap player.



Terminus -> RE: when to stop minelaying? (6/14/2006 1:21:49 PM)

The time to stop is when your enemy loses the base.



hosho -> RE: when to stop minelaying? (6/14/2006 1:26:57 PM)

maybe i have kamikaze minelayers? or a commander that likes sake too much [sm=00000436.gif]



tsimmonds -> RE: when to stop minelaying? (6/14/2006 3:38:55 PM)

The best way to mine a hex that is not one of your bases is to put ML carrying 1500-2000 mines together in one TF, steam to the hex under cover of some nearby distraction or other, drop your mines, and never return there for any reason.[;)]

The biggest minelaying mistake you can make is to mine an enemy base that you are planning a landing on.



Drex -> RE: when to stop minelaying? (6/14/2006 3:42:52 PM)

I'm not sure 1500-2000 mines are enough for defense. I've had success in hitting ships even when preceded by MSWs by laying 4000+ mines. And I use multiple trips with no problems.



tsimmonds -> RE: when to stop minelaying? (6/14/2006 3:48:19 PM)

**shrugs** I've had good results with that number of mines. the enemy doesn't know how many mines you laid. If he hits one, it doesn't really matter whether there's ten or 10,000. After that it's a question of where you are placing them. If it is someplace where you have air superiority, he isn't likely to want to risk a minesweeping mission there.

Offensive minefields are never going to produce great results in sinking enemy ships. The purpose of an offensive minefield is to deny use of that hex to the enemy.



Sardaukar -> RE: when to stop minelaying? (6/14/2006 3:48:35 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: irrelevant
The biggest minelaying mistake you can make is to mine an enemy base that you are planning a landing on.


Been there, done that...[:D] Same if you plan to bombard. Your own offensive minefields are way more dangerous to Bombardment TF than any defensive ones enemy has laid.



tsimmonds -> RE: when to stop minelaying? (6/14/2006 3:51:49 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Drex

I'm not sure 1500-2000 mines are enough for defense. I've had success in hitting ships even when preceded by MSWs by laying 4000+ mines. And I use multiple trips with no problems.

...now if it's defensive minefields you are talking about, I agree, you can't have too many mines. Sure, 4000, 5000, why should you ever stop laying mines there? It's not like they cost you anything more than about 4 supply points each. [;)]



BrucePowers -> RE: when to stop minelaying? (6/14/2006 4:30:14 PM)

I do not plan on laying offensive minefields. As the allies I figure they will just get in my way later. As the IJN player I figure my minelayer time is better spent laying defensive fields.



RUPD3658 -> RE: when to stop minelaying? (6/14/2006 6:40:58 PM)

In my current PBEM my Allied opponant has mined every base he can. It is March of 42 and I have lost 10APs, 5DDs, a SS (a mine laying one no less), and a few PCs to mines. Mines and costal guns have sunk more ships than air strikes thus far.

I think he has done most of this via sub and I never fail to hit a mine no matter how small the mine field. [:@]



aletoledo -> RE: when to stop minelaying? (6/14/2006 6:56:09 PM)

I've also lost quite a few ships to offensive minefields (both my own and enemy laid ones). I have tended to stop laying offensive mine fields when I start hitting my own mines. it seems to give good results for a couple of weeks and then I can start laying again.



jwilkerson -> RE: when to stop minelaying? (6/14/2006 7:15:31 PM)

I'll go with 3000 as being a minimal goal for a defensive minefield that you want to make a difference in terms of stopping an enemy landing at one of your bases.

The minefield itself will not stop the landing. The minefield is part of a "rock, paper, scissors" defence that should include significant counter-strike capability (air and/or surface) as well as a credible defense on the ground in the base hex.

I have had 3000+ minefields be a part of stopping two major invasions, so I'm a believer.

I haven't had to face anyone doing this to me yet - but if I did, I'd say the counter includes subs (to sink the minelayers) as well as countermining (with subs or DM). In my second example, I think I lost 4 minelayers to subs in the hex and it did slow down the build up of the minefield. My opponent also counter-mined though not extensively. One of my BBs hit a mine ( probably enemy but can't be sure ) when my surface force counter-attacked the landing. But I do not think my opponent made extensive use of counter-mining, so that would be something try.

I've used 7000 and even 9000 sized fields, but had the "feeling" that the 3000 size field was accomplishing the purpose (surviving in the face of dozens of MSW and sinking dozens of AP/AK which were trying to land the landing force) so 3000 still gets my vote as "optimal". But you never "stop" minelaying in a base you are trying to set up with a large field. You must continuously resow, just to sustain the field at a number like 3000. One good minelayer is probably sufficient for this purpose.





hosho -> RE: when to stop minelaying? (6/15/2006 12:54:55 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: irrelevant

The best way to mine a hex that is not one of your bases is to put ML carrying 1500-2000 mines together in one TF, steam to the hex under cover of some nearby distraction or other, drop your mines, and never return there for any reason.[;)]

The biggest minelaying mistake you can make is to mine an enemy base that you are planning a landing on.


agreed! but since i have air superiority don`t have to steam so much [:D]
well i`m not planing to land there, already have chandpur, i`m just trying to stop the replenishment and to starve them out before mopping up eventually ( that is the theory, will see what will happen )




thank you all for your comments!



dtravel -> RE: when to stop minelaying? (6/15/2006 3:52:00 AM)

You should stop laying mines when there isn't any more room for them in the harbor.



tabpub -> RE: when to stop minelaying? (6/15/2006 8:23:52 AM)

yes, I find 25,000 to be a nice round number.



rockmedic109 -> RE: when to stop minelaying? (6/15/2006 11:26:02 AM)

I thought I had read somewhere that the code doesn't give any more increased chance to hit a mine after 1000 mines.  But, it just might be early onset Dementia.



mc3744 -> RE: when to stop minelaying? (6/15/2006 6:51:29 PM)

To avoid my MLs hitting mines I always pair them with MSW. DM with DMS. It has always worked so far.



bradfordkay -> RE: when to stop minelaying? (6/15/2006 7:14:20 PM)

WHen to stop laying mines? Well, I always figured that if one of my minelayers hits a mine then it's time to stop...



Nemo121 -> RE: when to stop minelaying? (6/15/2006 8:19:09 PM)

When the enemy troops can disembark 3 miles offshore and tiptoe to shore from mine to mine then you have half the numbers of mines required ;).

I put a 9,000 mine minefield at a base where the Allies came to bombard. They came with a BB and several CAs and CLs as well as several DDs. 3 of the DDs hit mines and I think all three sank. I definitely didn't see a similar result when a similar Allied bombardment TF bombarded a base I had only defended with 3,000 mines.

Therefore I think that minefields definitely give increasing benefit up to at least 9,000 mines. I can see no reason for their benefit to be capped after a specific number.



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