RE: Allied aircraft production figures

RE: Allied aircraft production figures (Full Version)

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Andy Mac -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/11/2006 7:24:13 PM)
No its a fair point new gps do get planes when they arrive but disbanded gps do draw planes when they re appear its only reinforcing gps that get free planes

DFalcon -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/11/2006 7:30:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Andy Mac No its a fair point new gps do get planes when they arrive but disbanded gps do draw planes when they re appear its only reinforcing gps that get free planes I stand corrected. My information came from way back when I was testing for double dipping on disbanded airgroups. Then disbanded groups got planes, it has been many patches since then.

panda124c -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/11/2006 7:44:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jim D Burns I took the time to tabulate total allied aircraft production for the entire game. I then separated the US figures from all the rest, so in the first line there are a total of 1656 Allied factories, of which 780 of them produce US planes. Start date.....Total factories.....US factories.....Upgradeable factories...Months in production Start............1656...................780................340.............................45 Jan42...........315....................245................150..............................44 Mar42...........50.....................0....................0..................................42 Jun42...........200....................130................100..............................39 Jul42............90.....................90..................0...................................38 Sep42..........30......................0...................0....................................36 Oct42..........100.....................100...............80...................................35 Dec42..........110...................80..................0.....................................33 Jan43..........643....................415................250.................................32 Feb43..........150...................150................0......................................31 Mar43..........20.....................20.................0......................................30 Apr43..........150....................100...............0......................................29 May43.........100....................10.................0......................................28 Jun43..........90......................90.................0......................................27 Jul43...........754....................669................0......................................26 Sep43..........395....................355...............75....................................24 Oct43...........55.....................5...................0......................................23 Nov43...........300...................250...............0......................................22 Dec43...........194...................144...............0......................................21 Jan44............155...................100...............0......................................20 Mar44...........105....................105...............75....................................18 Apr44...........180....................180...............75....................................17 May44...........90.....................0...................0......................................16 Jun44............50.....................0...................0......................................15 Jul44.............50.....................0...................0......................................14 Sep44...........150...................150................75....................................12 Dec44...........40.....................0....................0.....................................9 Jan45...........90.....................40...................0......................................8 Total production is then calculated by multiplying the number of factories times the number of months that factory is in production through Aug45. So for example starting factories are multiplied by 45 months. Edit: I should note upgradeable factories are already included in the first two columns totals so don't count them again. I simply added them as a separate stat line to show how many allied factories eventually turn obsolete. Total production: 200,069 Total US production: 126,863 Now we know Japans industry can build them about 140,000 total planes through the war given the numbers posted by Admiral Laurent in this thread: http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=1217199&mpage=7&key= quote: Now with the 'historic conquests', the points available for AC production will be 5200 per day... Production of 3500-4000 AC a month, around 45 000 per year. That is 50% more that what historical Japan did. So this proves beyond a doubt that Japan is far out producing the allies throughout the entire war given the fact that about 80% of allied factories are fixed and end up producing obsolete aircraft for most of the game. While Japans factories stay upgraded and keep producing top line aircraft for the entire game. Japan is probably out producing the allies in first line aircraft by 2-1 or better for the whole game given the facts of these numbers. So let’s take the year 1944 for example. Let’s assume all previous upgradeable factories are upgraded to front line equipment. Let’s assume that all factories producing aircraft from Jul43 are also producing front line aircraft. So we start 1944 off with 1428 regular factories from Jul-Dec 1943 and an additional 920 upgraded factories from prior to Jul 1943. This gives us a total of 2348 factories plus another 155 that go online in Jan 1944 totaling 2503 factories. Here are the production numbers for front line aircraft in 1944 given these assumptions: Jan44.....2503 factories times 12 months = 30,036 Mar44.....another 105 factories times 10 months = 1050 Apr44.....another 180 factories times 9 months = 720 May44.....another 90 factories times 8 months = 720 Jun44.....another 50 factories times 7 months = 350 Jul44.....another 50 factories times 6 months = 300 Sep44.....another 150 factories times 4 months = 600 Dec44.....another 10 factories Total 1944 allied production = 33,786 Of this about 18k or so would be US production. I also seriously doubt all of these factories are producing front line equipment. And according to Admiral Laurent’s figures quoted above, Japan will produce 45k+ aircraft in the same period. Of which 100% is front line equipment due to 100% upgradeable factories. Jim What happens if you do the same sort of analysis on pilot "production" and quality?

Jim D Burns -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/11/2006 9:25:34 PM)
All the Japanese fanboys seem to be missing my point entirely. I am not advocating the reduction of Japanese industry. I am simply pointing out the glaring fact that Japan out produces the US for the entire game due to fixed factories that cannot upgrade for the most part. The US (forget the other allies, the US alone out produced Japan by at leas 3-1 in the Pacific) NEVER got out produced by Japan and thus needs a major revamping of their production. How about we make all Allied factories upgradeable? That still won’t fix the total numbers problem since we know they’ll still only produce 200,000+ planes total (126,000+ of them US), but at least 80% of them won’t be obsolete planes when they get produced. Right now the allies are screwed with these fixed factories. They will never come close to competing with Japanese production numbers of first line equipment. Jim

Jim D Burns -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/11/2006 9:39:36 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: pbear What happens if you do the same sort of analysis on pilot "production" and quality? Going by this statement: quote: In 1942 USN pilot training programs started to ramp up; 10,869 aviators received their wings of gold, almost twice as many as had completed the program in the previous 8 years. In 1943 there were 20,842 graduates; 1944, 21,067; and, with then end of the war in sight, 1945 ended with 8,880 graduates. Thus in the period 1942 to 1945, the USN produced more than 2.5 times the number of pilots as the IJN. And each of those USN pilots went through a program of primary, intermediate, advanced, and, for the carrier pilots combat preparation in RAGs before heading west. New pilots were arriving for action in USN carrier squadrons with as many as 600 hours flying under their belts and as much as 200 hours of that in type. Which I found here: http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/aviation/wwii-naval-pilot-training-426.html It's pretty obvious USN pilot training is way too few. Here's his numbers for the Japanese: quote: As near as I can put together, during the course of the war the IJN trained some 24,000 pilots of all stripes. Roughly 18,900 of them, and their pre-war compatriots, were killed, either in action, training, or operationally. Over 2500 of these were killed in suicide attacks. Here's a little more history of flight training in WWII: http://www.centennialofflight.gov/essay/GENERAL_AVIATION/civilian_pilot_training/GA20.htm quote: The CPTP/WTS program was phased out in the summer of 1944 but not before 435,165 people, including hundreds of women and African-Americans, had been taught to fly. The CPTP admirably achieved its primary mission, best expressed by the title of aviation historian Dominick Pisano's book—“To fill the skies with pilots.” All aspects of US production were staggering, the game completely fails to recreate that. Jim

Ron Saueracker -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/11/2006 9:48:02 PM)
Why can't all the factories be placed on map? I'm pretty sure Andrew Brown has experimented with this already. Have the factories automatically upgrade like the Wirraway does...it upgrades to the Boomerang. I still can't fathom a design which won't stop producing obsolete planes. I'm beginning to think fixed production was added to the game simply because the production system was untested and floats like a cinder block.

VSWG -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/11/2006 10:07:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DFalcon I may be missing it in this information but I see no accounting of replacement airgroups. There are a lot of planes entering the game through replacement groups and they should be counted. Replacement groups for the allies do not take planes from the pool so should be added to the number of planes produced. I can provide the numbers for CHS: the totals of all Allied AC entering the game through airgroups are: 9299 ready + 2792 damaged land based AC = 12091 4851 ready + 6 damaged ship based AC = 4857 (including all float planes) Total: 16 948 Not sure how much CHS differs from stock in this area, but I guess it can be used as a first estimate.

DFalcon -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/11/2006 10:21:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jim D Burns "Now with the 'historic conquests', the points available for AC production will be 5200 per day... Production of 3500-4000 AC a month, around 45 000 per year. That is 50% more that what historical Japan did. " And according to Admiral Laurent’s figures quoted above, Japan will produce 45k+ aircraft in the same period. Of which 100% is front line equipment due to 100% upgradeable factories. Jim These numbers are too high. The most extreme example of Japanese production I could find was a little over 3000. Japanese production of 2000-2500 in 44 seems more typical.

DFalcon -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/11/2006 10:27:45 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: VSWG I can provide the numbers for CHS: the totals of all Allied AC entering the game through airgroups are: Total: 16 948 Under 400 a month, not a huge number but significant.

bradfordkay -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/12/2006 7:11:42 AM)
" Why can't all the factories be placed on map?" Well, as a historical fanboy, I would then demand that the map include the US east coast, especially Long Island.

RETIRED -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/12/2006 7:18:34 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jim D Burns All aspects of US production were staggering, the game completely fails to recreate that. Jim AMEN! Between January of 1941 and August of 1945, the US produced 306,090 Aircraft. Japan produced 69,882. Engine production was even more impressive with the US producing 786,648 to Japan's 116,597. The ratio in "airframe weight" was over 8:1 in favor of the US. The US not only produced a lot more A/C, but larger, stronger, better protected, and more heavily armed A/C. The same staggering one-sidedness applies to pilots, aircrew, and ground support personnel. By 1944 the US was cutting back drastically on training, and increasing the "acceptance" qualifications. At the same time, the Japanese were massively lowering standards as well as the length and quality of training.

treespider -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/12/2006 7:33:11 AM)
This thread started by showing total US Production in the game as something like c. 120,000 aircraft. How many AC IRL were shipped to the Pacific theater? I am not concerned with the hypothetical Japanese production ...just the difference beteween IRL US production sent to the Pacific vs. what the game provides....Has this been analyized?

RETIRED -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/12/2006 7:43:13 AM)
By number it seems to have been about 35%, but by value and construction costs is was less as most of the expensive 4-engined bombers went to Europe (except for the B-29's), while the great majority of Naval A/C went to the Pacific. Approximately 30% overall of the US Production Effort went to the Pacific cost-wise, though it varied from year to year.

Jim D Burns -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/13/2006 1:31:21 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RETIRED By number it seems to have been about 35%, but by value and construction costs is was less as most of the expensive 4-engined bombers went to Europe (except for the B-29's), while the great majority of Naval A/C went to the Pacific. Approximately 30% overall of the US Production Effort went to the Pacific cost-wise, though it varied from year to year. It was a lot more dynamic than that for air assets since by mid 1944 we had complete air superiority in Europe. Losses fell off dramatically there so more like 50%-60% of our aircraft production was going to the Pacific by then. Early on the figure was probably about 30%-35%, but by mid to late 43 it was probably as high as 40%-45% of total air production since it was much more of an air war theatre than Europe. Jim

Jim D Burns -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/13/2006 1:35:55 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: treespider This thread started by showing total US Production in the game as something like c. 120,000 aircraft. Remember about 80% of those "produced" aircraft are going to be obsolete when they are made. I guess a better example would be to just give a multiple of 6-8 months for fixed non-upgradeable factories. That would be a lot more realistic than multiplying them by the total months in the game I guess. Jim

VSWG -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/13/2006 1:57:35 AM)
Would it be possible to scratch Allied aircraft production / replacement rate alltogether and instead create massive amounts of large replenishment squadrons? They could provide replacements with pinpoint accuracy: at the correct time the correct model in the correct quantity. It would also prohibit the tactic of drawing planes from the pool at obscure places (especially the "downgrade an airgroup in San Francisco - immediately draw their planes from pool in India" tactic). Are enough slots available? Can replenishment squadrons refill LBA, too? Just an idea...

Jim D Burns -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/13/2006 2:07:15 AM)
Ok I did it, here is the breakdown for the number of fixed factories and upgradable factories: Start date.....Total factories.....Fixed factories.....Upgradeable factories...Months in production Start............1656...................1316...................340.............................45 Jan42...........315....................165.....................150..............................44 Mar42...........50.....................50.......................0..................................42 Jun42...........200....................100.....................100..............................39 Jul42............90.....................90.......................0...................................38 Sep42..........30......................30......................0....................................36 Oct42..........100.....................20......................80...................................35 Dec42..........110...................110.....................0.....................................33 Jan43..........643....................393.....................250.................................32 Feb43..........150...................150......................0......................................31 Mar43..........20.....................20.......................0......................................30 Apr43..........150....................150.....................0......................................29 May43.........100....................100.....................0......................................28 Jun43..........90......................90......................0......................................27 Jul43...........754....................754....................0......................................26 Sep43..........395....................320...................75....................................24 Oct43...........55.....................55.....................0......................................23 Nov43...........300...................300...................0......................................22 Dec43...........194...................194...................0......................................21 Jan44............155...................155..................0......................................20 Mar44...........105....................30...................75....................................18 Apr44...........180....................105.................75....................................17 May44...........90.....................90...................0......................................16 Jun44............50.....................50...................0......................................15 Jul44.............50.....................50...................0......................................14 Sep44...........150...................75...................75....................................12 Dec44...........40.....................40...................0.....................................9 Jan45...........90.....................50....................0......................................8 So if we multiply fixed factories by 8 months we get 40,416 air frames. We then get another 41,925 air frames by multiplying non-fixed factories by the total number of months they are in production for a total of 82,341 allied air frames that can be considered competitive air frames at the time of their production. Don't like the figure of 8 months? Just add or subtract 5,052 air frames by the number of months you want to change that figure by. Of these about 60% would be US planes for a total US production of about 49,405 competative air frames for the entire game. Edit: oops caught a mistake numbers have been slightly revised. Jim

mc3744 -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/13/2006 11:35:19 AM)
A quick and uninformed comment. I just finished "The reluctant Admiral", a (very good) Yamamoto biography. According to this book Yamamoto has always been convinced that Japan could stand the Allied power for 6 months for sure and probably (at most) for 12-18 months. The reason for his belief was exactly the production capacity. He kept questioning the establishment about Japan production capacity to try and dissuade them from entering into the conflict. He even talked himself with Japanese business men to induce them to increase airframes and engines production. Hence the game should definitely reduce the Japanese production capacity and/or increase the US one. That is if we want a more precise simulation. But this wouldn't necessarily make for a better game. I keep loosing Jap opponents, I'm not sure that making the Allies more powerful would end up in a beter gaming experience. Just my two cents

treespider -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/13/2006 10:01:04 PM)
Since this hasn't seem to have been posted yet....here are the IRL Total US production figures: Fighters - 1942-1945 - 94372 Bombers - 1942-1945 - 93072 Recon - 1942-1945 - 3918 Transport - 1942-1945 - 23233 Trainers - 1942-1945 - 46456 US Military Aircraft production 1942- 1945 279813 Total 1939-1945 - 324750 These figures are for the TOTAL US production. The source is: World War II: A Statistical Survey by John Ellis. Jim's analysis suggested a total of 49405 competitive airframes for the entire war. Is this just fighters or fighters and bombers? In a separate post Jim suggested that A/C allocation to the Pacific would have been on the order of 35% in 1942 up to 50-60% by 1945. If we allocate 50% of IRL US aircraft production to the Pacific we arrive at 47186 fighters and 46536 bombers. This is a total of 93722 fighters and bombers being allocated to the Pacific assuming a 50% allocation rate. So if Jim's competitive airframes are just fighters then the production figures for the US seem pretty accurate.

Jim D Burns -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/13/2006 10:35:35 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: treespider Jim's analysis suggested a total of 49405 competitive airframes for the entire war. Is this just fighters or fighters and bombers? This figure is for everything, fighters, bombers, patrol, recon, transport. You name it it's in there. Jim

treespider -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/14/2006 3:09:16 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jim D Burns Ok I did it, here is the breakdown for the number of fixed factories and upgradable factories: Start date.....Total factories.....Fixed factories.....Upgradeable factories...Months in production Start............1656...................1316...................340.............................45 Jan42...........315....................165.....................150..............................44 Mar42...........50.....................50.......................0..................................42 Jun42...........200....................100.....................100..............................39 Jul42............90.....................90.......................0...................................38 Sep42..........30......................30......................0....................................36 Oct42..........100.....................20......................80...................................35 Dec42..........110...................110.....................0.....................................33 Jan43..........643....................393.....................250.................................32 Feb43..........150...................150......................0......................................31 Mar43..........20.....................20.......................0......................................30 Apr43..........150....................150.....................0......................................29 May43.........100....................100.....................0......................................28 Jun43..........90......................90......................0......................................27 Jul43...........754....................754....................0......................................26 Sep43..........395....................320...................75....................................24 Oct43...........55.....................55.....................0......................................23 Nov43...........300...................300...................0......................................22 Dec43...........194...................194...................0......................................21 Jan44............155...................155..................0......................................20 Mar44...........105....................30...................75....................................18 Apr44...........180....................105.................75....................................17 May44...........90.....................90...................0......................................16 Jun44............50.....................50...................0......................................15 Jul44.............50.....................50...................0......................................14 Sep44...........150...................75...................75....................................12 Dec44...........40.....................40...................0.....................................9 Jan45...........90.....................50....................0......................................8 So if we multiply fixed factories by 8 months we get 40,416 air frames. We then get another 41,925 air frames by multiplying non-fixed factories by the total number of months they are in production for a total of 82,341 allied air frames that can be considered competitive air frames at the time of their production. Don't like the figure of 8 months? Just add or subtract 5,052 air frames by the number of months you want to change that figure by. Of these about 60% would be US planes for a total US production of about 49,405 competative air frames for the entire game. Edit: oops caught a mistake numbers have been slightly revised. Jim In revisiting your analysis there is a flaw... you make the assumption of using 8 months. The problem with this is you have planes like the TBM Avenger. It will not upgrade to anything else, nor will the units using it. It enters the game 7/43 with a rate of 200...at your 8 month calculation we would get 1600. However it will remain in production until the end (or 26 months) providing us with an additional 3600 aircraft or a total build out of 5200. Or take the F4U-1D which enter the game 1/44 with a rate of 100. Your 8 month calculation provides 800 however it will reamin in production until the end (or 20 months) providing us with an additional 1200 aircraft. For a total build out of 2000 aircraft. Likewise the F4U-1 enters the game on 2/43 however it will not be able to upgrade for at least 11-12 months and will likely remain in service for longer. I feel you need to revisit your analysis...I'm not suggesting that US production accurate but it is probably closer to IRL than you think.

Jim D Burns -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/14/2006 7:03:06 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: treespider but it is probably closer to IRL than you think. Oh Jesus, I give up. All the friggin Japanese fanboys will question ANYTHING that threatens their fun till the damn cows come home. This is an estimate, there are planes that went longer or shorter than the damn 8 months. I even told you how many air frames to add if you don’t like my 8 month estimate. It is OBVIOUS the US is neutered, you don’t want to admit it fine I can’t force you to see reality. If you want to do a plane by plane comparison YOU DO IT. I’m fed up with the whining Japanese. Jim

ctangus -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/14/2006 7:47:51 AM)
Chill, Jim. Tree's never struck me as a JFB - seems to me he's a get-it-accurate fanboi. quote: ORIGINAL: Jim D Burns If you want to do a plane by plane comparison YOU DO IT. You did start this thread. If you want to assert or prove allied aircraft production is too low, it's not unreasonable to ask you to do further analysis on it. I don't myself consider the issue a handicap or game-breaking (or I'd do the number-crunching myself), but I'd be interested. (If you do more analysis, please factor in the +/- 400 planes a month via airgroups.) My impression is the allies are slightly under-represented, and largely so in at least one key type (F6Fs). BTW, before you send JFB accusations my way, I only play allies.

Mike Scholl -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/14/2006 8:19:50 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jim D Burns quote: ORIGINAL: treespider This thread started by showing total US Production in the game as something like c. 120,000 aircraft. Remember about 80% of those "produced" aircraft are going to be obsolete when they are made. I guess a better example would be to just give a multiple of 6-8 months for fixed non-upgradeable factories. That would be a lot more realistic than multiplying them by the total months in the game I guess. Jim This seems to be the key "point of contention" in the discussion. Because of the game's idiotic production system, the Allies will get lots of A/C...., and a big pile of them will be useless garbage. What good is having a lot of Brewster Buffalos in the pool in 1944? Some means of deciding just when, and which A/C should be considered "superflous junk" in the totals needs to be arrived at if this matter is to be discussed intelligently. Jim's suggestion of 8 months might or might not be accurate, but it seems to be in the vacinity of the "ballpark". And given that only the Japanese were given much in the way of ability to change and improve their A/C output, 2x3 might have at least gotten the allied production closer to the correct numbers and types arriving at any one time. Calling one another "fanboys" won't solve the basic problem of getting the numbers right.

dtravel -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/14/2006 9:42:46 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ctangus (If you do more analysis, please factor in the +/- 400 planes a month via airgroups.) [image]http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/8290/1picture6ky3.gif[/image] I just looked at the Allied Air Unit Reinforcement Schedule. I see only two months in which the Allies get more than around 200 planes. Most months its less than 100. Quite frankly the numbers of planes the Allies get in their Reinforcement units are a drop in the bucket. They are not a significant factor.

aztez -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/14/2006 10:51:28 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Mike Scholl quote: ORIGINAL: Jim D Burns quote: ORIGINAL: treespider This thread started by showing total US Production in the game as something like c. 120,000 aircraft. Remember about 80% of those "produced" aircraft are going to be obsolete when they are made. I guess a better example would be to just give a multiple of 6-8 months for fixed non-upgradeable factories. That would be a lot more realistic than multiplying them by the total months in the game I guess. Jim This seems to be the key "point of contention" in the discussion. Because of the game's idiotic production system, the Allies will get lots of A/C...., and a big pile of them will be useless garbage. What good is having a lot of Brewster Buffalos in the pool in 1944? Some means of deciding just when, and which A/C should be considered "superflous junk" in the totals needs to be arrived at if this matter is to be discussed intelligently. Jim's suggestion of 8 months might or might not be accurate, but it seems to be in the vacinity of the "ballpark". And given that only the Japanese were given much in the way of ability to change and improve their A/C output, 2x3 might have at least gotten the allied production closer to the correct numbers and types arriving at any one time. Calling one another "fanboys" won't solve the basic problem of getting the numbers right. Amen. Well said Mike.

FeurerKrieg -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/14/2006 10:52:05 AM)
Has anyone done a plane by plane analysis to find out how many of each plane model was produced, and going a step farther, how many were ship to the PTO? Maybe that is a project someone could organize and people could pick a plane they will research and then the organizer can compile the info. Or did CHS or RHS already do this? Even if a given model stopped production, it is really no big deal if that model is continued to be produced in game since if it is obsolete, it is unlikely it will get used (and if they do get used, then chalk it up to the Allies cranking up production since time are desparate).

Jim D Burns -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/14/2006 12:46:10 PM)
Sorry Treespider I was venting and the jist of my post wasn't really aimed at you personally. Just seems like I'm talking to a brick wall sometimes. To me it's obvious the US is way underrepresented, so doing a plane by plane analysis seemed like an utter waste of time. Here's an interesting read: http://www.history.navy.mil/download/ww2-7.pdf Of note is the numbers for naval aviation roles at the time of Okinawa: quote: Naval Aviation now numbered 41,000 aircraft, 60,000 pilots, 33,000 nonpilot officers, and almost 338,000 enlisted personnel. 41,000 aircraft. Even if only half were in the Pacific, that's over 20,000 naval aircraft in operation in the Pacific after years of heavy losses had already taken their toll and air losses had begun to diminish dramatically. But I bet a lot more than half were in the Pacific by the time Okinawa rolled around. Note the number of extra pilots, I doubt the US even gets half of 60,000 pilots for all services for the entire game combined. Jim

tabpub -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/14/2006 12:56:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: dtravel quote: ORIGINAL: ctangus (If you do more analysis, please factor in the +/- 400 planes a month via airgroups.) [image]http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/8290/1picture6ky3.gif[/image] I just looked at the Allied Air Unit Reinforcement Schedule. I see only two months in which the Allies get more than around 200 planes. Most months its less than 100. Quite frankly the numbers of planes the Allies get in their Reinforcement units are a drop in the bucket. They are not a significant factor. Ok, the next time you play allied, then just send back all the carriers that you get as "reinforcements" and their associated air groups as they are insignificant. And regarding the LBA reinforcement schedule, I think that you need to check again; you must have had a filter or two toggled. 2 months over 200? Most under 100? I will agree on eyeballing it that most months in 43 are between 100 and 200, but there are some that are positively silly, especially in late 43/early 44. [image]local://upfiles/9730/C5C173BAA30E4811A0A2AD14E6E62B87.jpg[/image]

Jim D Burns -> RE: Allied aircraft production figures (8/14/2006 1:03:09 PM)
Not well organized but full of statistics: http://www.history.navy.mil/download/nasc.pdf The sites main page: http://www.history.navy.mil/index.html Jim

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