US Mine Laying (Full Version)

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fleetwood -> US Mine Laying (4/10/2007 5:56:27 PM)

I have started a scenario 15 game against the computer in which I have sent both US subs and minesweepers to lay mines at choke points in the Phillipine area. I have not seen any mine symbols appear on the map as if they are not laying mines. Is there some issue why they are not laying mines and/or the symbols do not appear?



Terminus -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/10/2007 5:59:49 PM)

If you're playing at the newest version of the game, check the TF information screen immediately underneath the picture. Look for a line of text that says "Do Not Lay Mines", click on it to change it to lay mines, and the TF will lay its mines at its destination.

But that's in general. If they're based in Manilla, they can't load mines in the first place (port's not big enough). Oh, and minesweepers don't lay mines...



6971grunt -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/10/2007 6:50:39 PM)

Terminus is correct - if your coming out of Manila you won't load with mine (unless already loaded at the start of the game). You need a 9 or 10 size port to load up mines.[X(]



rtrapasso -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/10/2007 6:53:02 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: grunt6971

Terminus is correct - if your coming out of Manila you won't load with mine (unless already loaded at the start of the game). You need a 9 or 10 size port to load up mines.[X(]



or an MLE at a port with sufficient supply...



bradfordkay -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/10/2007 6:54:02 PM)

Also, I have noticed that if the hex does not have a port of at least size 1 then the mine symbol will not appear.



rtrapasso -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/10/2007 6:59:06 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

Also, I have noticed that if the hex does not have a port of at least size 1 then the mine symbol will not appear.



Odd - it appears on my maps... but the number of mines will not show at the base unless it has a port. Also, beware... i think this is considered an offensive mine field, and you might be more prone to run into your own mines... [X(] [8|]



MineSweeper -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/10/2007 8:22:38 PM)

I use to place some offensive minefields between Borneo and Celebes on the first Japanese turn to catch the Boise or Houston....but it is more of a hinderence to the IJN and is not worth it.....[;)]



bradfordkay -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/11/2007 9:17:05 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rtrapasso


quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

Also, I have noticed that if the hex does not have a port of at least size 1 then the mine symbol will not appear.



Odd - it appears on my maps... but the number of mines will not show at the base unless it has a port. Also, beware... i think this is considered an offensive mine field, and you might be more prone to run into your own mines... [X(] [8|]


That's it... I misremembered(tm) the situation!



fleetwood -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/11/2007 5:53:45 PM)

Thanks for the help!  So, your own side needs to be careful as they do not know where the minefields are within a hex. 



Terminus -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/11/2007 5:55:11 PM)

Depends on what hex it is. If it's your own port, it's a defensive minefield, and you can be assumed to have charts for it. If it's one of his, it's an offensive field, and the risk goes up...



rtrapasso -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/11/2007 5:55:24 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: fleetwood

Thanks for the help!  So, your own side needs to be careful as they do not know where the minefields are within a hex. 


Yes - more than one player has been chagrinned to lose a ship in an offensive mine field that they sewed. [X(]



Mike Solli -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/11/2007 5:55:28 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: fleetwood

Thanks for the help!  So, your own side needs to be careful as they do not know where the minefields are within a hex. 


Yup. If you drop mines in a base that you own, that's a defensive minefield and only enemy ships can hit the mines. If you drop mines anywhere else, they are offensive mines. Anyone can hit them.



KPAX -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/12/2007 3:50:15 AM)

Once Hong Kong falls, how long will the IJN take, using a minesweeper with like 10 MSWs, to clear those mines ?

And, can a minesweeper TF at Hong Kong just be parked there, and there still be a minesweep, or do you have to move in and out of that hex to get a sweep ?



Yamato hugger -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/12/2007 9:55:58 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: KPAX

Once Hong Kong falls, how long will the IJN take, using a minesweeper with like 10 MSWs, to clear those mines ?

And, can a minesweeper TF at Hong Kong just be parked there, and there still be a minesweep, or do you have to move in and out of that hex to get a sweep ?


2 - 3 days will clear them. The TF can be parked there, or in an adjacent hex.



rtrapasso -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/12/2007 1:37:58 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli


quote:

ORIGINAL: fleetwood

Thanks for the help!  So, your own side needs to be careful as they do not know where the minefields are within a hex. 


Yup. If you drop mines in a base that you own, that's a defensive minefield and only enemy ships can hit the mines. If you drop mines anywhere else, they are offensive mines. Anyone can hit them.



i think i might modify that to say if you have a PORT in the hex, they are defensive... i am not sure about a non-port base (i.e. airbase only or just a dot hex)... i base this on once running into my own mines at a dot hex. Could have been a fluke, but i am not willing to make the experiment in my PBEM games... [X(] [:D]



Mike Solli -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/12/2007 2:58:23 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: rtrapasso


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli


quote:

ORIGINAL: fleetwood

Thanks for the help!  So, your own side needs to be careful as they do not know where the minefields are within a hex. 


Yup. If you drop mines in a base that you own, that's a defensive minefield and only enemy ships can hit the mines. If you drop mines anywhere else, they are offensive mines. Anyone can hit them.



i think i might modify that to say if you have a PORT in the hex, they are defensive... i am not sure about a non-port base (i.e. airbase only or just a dot hex)... i base this on once running into my own mines at a dot hex. Could have been a fluke, but i am not willing to make the experiment in my PBEM games... [X(] [:D]


Yup, you're right Robert. In order for the minefield to be defensive, there must be a friendly port in the hex.



6971grunt -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/12/2007 7:01:49 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yamato hugger


quote:

ORIGINAL: KPAX

Once Hong Kong falls, how long will the IJN take, using a minesweeper with like 10 MSWs, to clear those mines ?

And, can a minesweeper TF at Hong Kong just be parked there, and there still be a minesweep, or do you have to move in and out of that hex to get a sweep ?


2 - 3 days will clear them. The TF can be parked there, or in an adjacent hex.


I believe the rules indicate that even in your own port there is natural attrition of the mines 5 to 10% per day (i.e., they float away into the great blue abyss). In the open ocean I believe the rate is as high as 50% per day.[sm=character0085.gif]



KPAX -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/12/2007 11:36:44 PM)

What does the IJN fanboys think about converting a few AKs to MLEs ?

And the Allied fanboys, what do you think ?



Yamato hugger -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/13/2007 8:44:13 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: KPAX

What does the IJN fanboys think about converting a few AKs to MLEs ?

And the Allied fanboys, what do you think ?


I make 3 on turn 1. Both sides.



rockmedic109 -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/13/2007 4:40:45 PM)

In CHS, the Brits get a few MLEs early {first six months}. I still make three or four within the first month of the game. Only need about two, but it is always advisable to have a spare or two.



AmiralLaurent -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/13/2007 7:12:33 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: grunt6971

I believe the rules indicate that even in your own port there is natural attrition of the mines 5 to 10% per day (i.e., they float away into the great blue abyss). In the open ocean I believe the rate is as high as 50% per day.[sm=character0085.gif]



The attrition is 1% off a base or dot (friendly or not), 5% off a land mass without a base and 50% in open sea.

As for building MLE building 3 seem too much for me for both sides at start. I only convert one at start (available in spring) and then 1 or 2 in spring-summer 42 (available in fall). Two AR are far more useful IMOO than two MLE.



Yamato hugger -> RE: US Mine Laying (4/14/2007 2:20:31 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: AmiralLaurent


quote:

ORIGINAL: grunt6971

I believe the rules indicate that even in your own port there is natural attrition of the mines 5 to 10% per day (i.e., they float away into the great blue abyss). In the open ocean I believe the rate is as high as 50% per day.[sm=character0085.gif]



The attrition is 1% off a base or dot (friendly or not), 5% off a land mass without a base and 50% in open sea.

As for building MLE building 3 seem too much for me for both sides at start. I only convert one at start (available in spring) and then 1 or 2 in spring-summer 42 (available in fall). Two AR are far more useful IMOO than two MLE.



That depends on your mine philosophy I guess. I lay a lot of mines with my subs, and I use the MLEs to reload them. The Jap short range subs cant stay on station very long, so I use them for mine boats. US subs arent terribly effective until late '43, so I use them as mine boats as well. I score more damage with mines from US subs in 42 than I ever did with torps, and Im not risking the boat doing it.

Edit: And I think (not going to dig out the rules and look it up right now) that the 1% decay is only at friendly bases, and 5% at other (including enemy bases) coastal hexes. This would account for the mines actually being tended to (which they were) at a friendly base, and not being tended to in other locals.



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