First steps (Full Version)

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Arminius -> First steps (4/11/2007 12:46:07 PM)

Hi, I orderd the game in the UK, just before Easter, physical and download.
Over the holydays, I studied the manual (puh, 252 pages) and then started the game with the Standard Campaign, advanced and Sarge.

Reading a manual like this one time of course is not the way to master the game.
I see now, I donīt know how to dispatch the few generals, how to involve the new brigades, I donīt know how to use the ironglad near Cairo, or if there is any ship in the 1st or 2cd Fleet. Looks like by now I do not have any shipyards, to increase my seapower, is that right?

When I was searching the forum for some solutions to my questions, I was wondering, that nobody so far has written kind of a "First steps for the Rookie Union player"

I`m living in Kaiserslautern, Germany. We still have a lot of US installations here and itīs just about 15 miles away from Ramstein Air Base. So I have a little hope, that a gamer from our region is reading this and can offer some help in learning FoF. ( I also play TOAW III )

Please excuse my english.











christof139 -> RE: First steps (4/11/2007 1:26:46 PM)

quote:

Hi, I orderd the game in the UK, just before Easter, physical and download.
Over the holydays, I studied the manual (puh, 252 pages) and then started the game with the Standard Campaign, advanced and Sarge.

Reading a manual like this one time of course is not the way to master the game.
I see now, I donīt know how to dispatch the few generals, how to involve the new brigades, I donīt know how to use the ironglad near Cairo, or if there is any ship in the 1st or 2cd Fleet. Looks like by now I do not have any shipyards, to increase my seapower, is that right?

When I was searching the forum for some solutions to my questions, I was wondering, that nobody so far has written kind of a "First steps for the Rookie Union player"

I`m living in Kaiserslautern, Germany. We still have a lot of US installations here and itīs just about 15 miles away from Ramstein Air Base. So I have a little hope, that a gamer from our region is reading this and can offer some help in learning FoF. ( I also play TOAW III )

Please excuse my english.


Guten Morgen,

I haven't played the Union all that much so can't really help you over there in K-town.

I was in Wonderful and Scenic Baumholder for 30-months from early 1971 to late 1973 with the old 8th ID's 2nd Bde., 1/39 Inf. Gets a bit windy on the mountain top there.

Actually, the country side is very beautiful there, food is good, etc.

Nice to meet. Take care, Chris





Arminius -> RE: First steps (4/11/2007 1:49:23 PM)

Hi, thanks for the answer.  1971 - 1973 ?. You must look like Gen. Lee now. I was a soldier belonging to the Staff battery (donīt know if this is right english) of the Arty Reg. 5 at Idar-Oberstein. 1983 - 1985. (ha ha, right I must look like Grant now ) So I saw "Truppenübungsplatz" Baumholder too.

I assume my questions can be answered even so you play the CSA. You have to detach Gens too, etc.
But I can start the Standard Campaign as a Rebel too, most important to me is to learn the game.



christof139 -> RE: First steps (4/11/2007 2:04:27 PM)

quote:

Hi, thanks for the answer. 1971 - 1973 ?. You must look like Gen. Lee now. I was a soldier belonging to the Staff battery (donīt know if this is right english) of the Arty Reg. 5 at Idar-Oberstein. 1983 - 1985. (ha ha, right I must look like Grant now ) So I saw "Truppenübungsplatz" Baumholder too.

I assume my questions can be answered even so you play the CSA. You have to detach Gens too, etc.
But I can start the Standard Campaign as a Rebel too, most important to me is to learn the game.


Ha ha ha!!! Nope. Not yet. People think I am in my mid to late 30's or early 40's, but I do have a bird's or crow's nest (bald spot) on the top back of my head but I am not a 'chrome dome' yet.

Yes, Staff or HQ battery in US Army and USMC. Idar-Oberstein is a very nice, scenic and historic town. I remember somethings very well.

We satyed in old unrenovated Wehrmacht barracks with bad heat in the Winter. Baumholder was better than Korea, Alaska, Vietnam or Grafenwohr etc. but not by much.

What is the area of mountains that Baumholder is in, what is the German name?? I think the name means 'High Wild Place' or something like this in English. I saw something similar on a map once, but I cannot find this German name for the Baumholder area. The Hunsruck Mtns. as you know are just to the north. Great place for hiking and finding gem stones etc. Attila the Hun supposedly crossed through the Hunsruck or Hun's Path or Way into Roman Gaul.

There is a German Kasserne in the very north part of the Baumholder Base, and I forget the name, but that is where visiting German troops and French troops and other NATO troops would stay.

The major German unit in the area when I was there was the 9th Panzer Division I do believe, and we trained with them, as well as the French etc.

Chris in Detroit, MI




Erik Rutins -> RE: First steps (4/11/2007 3:42:58 PM)

Hi Arminius,

Your English is great, no need to apologize! Please have a look at the Flash Tutorial included with the game (from the Game Menu) and also read through the pinned PBEM threads in the main forum. Most players have said that reading through those PBEM reports from the developer vs. tester game gave them a great deal of additional insight on how to start and how to play a turn.

This game is not actually very complex, but it is quite deep!

Regards,

- Erik



Arminius -> RE: First steps (4/11/2007 3:56:01 PM)

I donīt really know if this region is belonging to that area too, but the name should be "Nordpfälzer Bergland".
( North Palatinate mountainland ) I donīt know why they named it Bergland. Thereīs only hills.
I donīt know the name of the "Kaserne(n) in Baumholder. I remember there is a nice museum inside the installation with WWII vehicels outside, like the german "Hetzer" Jagdpanzer, or a Priest etc.
My Art. Reg. was part of the 5th Panzer Division, I canīt remember seeing elements of the 9th at Baumholder.

Well Christof (sounds like a german name ) itīs really nice talking to you `bout your biography.[;)]  But since that I did not make any progress in learning the game.



Walloc -> RE: First steps (4/11/2007 3:57:59 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arminius

Reading a manual like this one time of course is not the way to master the game.
I see now, I donīt know how to dispatch the few generals, how to involve the new brigades, I donīt know how to use the ironglad near Cairo, or if there is any ship in the 1st or 2cd Fleet. Looks like by now I do not have any shipyards, to increase my seapower, is that right?

When I was searching the forum for some solutions to my questions, I was wondering, that nobody so far has written kind of a "First steps for the Rookie Union player"



I've played union alot and ill see if i can answer some of ur question.
Btw im some what closer as in 500km to the north of u in Jutland. Not sure if count that as in ur region. [:)]

First u played without the beta patch? the mention of few generals leads me to think so.
Its a great upgrade and all u have to do is registre ur purchase then u can download it.
I would start by doing that.

I donīt know how to dispatch the few generals, how to involve the new brigades

Im making an assumtion here and please correct me if im wrong. I know when i started playing the predecessor to FoF, Crown of Glory that it toke me a few to get the hang of the container system the game uses. I get the feeling u havent done that yet. Again if im wrong let me know.

Basicly generals and all other units need to go into containers. A container is a fleet, at sea or a Division, corps and army at land. So what u need to do to generals and new brigaes is when u have them selected you need to left click them into the containers.
U can open and review containers by right clicking on them.
You can build new container as u need too. Be aware here u can build division in cites with 1 barrack. Corps and cities with 2 and Armies with cities with 3 barracks in them. You start with no cities with 3 barracks so its a prioverty to build a barracks. Possibly in Harrisburg that starts with 2 barracks. That way is the fastest to make Army containers.

Some of ur generals should go out West. Again i asssume u playing unpatched. U start with very few generals and its sorta random which u start with. With out knowing which generals u have its hard to advice specificly. Also whether u play with historic generels or random plays in. That said generals are a nice forcemultopiler so i'd say move some generals u think would be good and rail them out west. Over time many more generals will appeare.


I donīt know how to use the ironglad near Cairo

This one is easy. Dont do any thing until u already have units besieging forts or cities. Then move it in by clicking on the river province in question. If u move it into an enemy province alone it will die in seconds.
One thing about riverine ironclads. They arent put in containers unlike just about any thing else in the game.

or if there is any ship in the 1st or 2cd Fleet

Have you tried to right click the fleet containers? I see 4 ships and 1 and 5 in the other.

Looks like by now I do not have any shipyards, to increase my seapower, is that right?

No. If u click on the city list in the buttom menu and then click the ship prod selection bar at the buttom on that page. There should be filtered in the 3 cities that start with shipyards. Boston, Brooklyn and Philly.


Hope it helps, if not please PM me or ask more questions here.

Kind regards,

Rasmus



Walloc -> RE: First steps (4/11/2007 4:18:37 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arminius

I donīt know the name of the "Kaserne(n) in Baumholder. I remember there is a nice museum inside the installation with WWII vehicels outside, like the german "Hetzer" Jagdpanzer, or a Priest etc.



Ever been to the Panzer museum in Munster?
Its great, the uniform of 1st Leibhussars(Totenkorpf hussar's) is worth it alone if u a Prussian Napoleonic fan [:D]
Yes, lots of panzers too. Dang, the proposed Marder 2, that never made it into production is HUGE. Think they read to many stories about the Maus when designing that. No way to hide that one. Very nice selection of WWII panzers too. Tigers, Panthers among others.


Kind regards,

Rasmus



Arminius -> RE: First steps (4/11/2007 4:29:06 PM)

@Eric Rutins: Hi, txs for your answer. I did the Flash Tut. So Ihink I do it again. But as a suggestion the old phrase "learning by doing" is always right. So the Tut should be in a way like many other games, where you have kind of an AI Teacher who is telling you lesson by lesson, what to do. ( Now we wanna move our unit by rail, therefore you have to select your brigade, klick the railroad button and then move the unit to Frankfort. Very good. Now we need to build a shipyard, therefore....) You know what I mean.

Hm PbEM. You not talking about the AAR, do you?



Arminius -> RE: First steps (4/11/2007 5:11:02 PM)

@Walloc: Hi, txs for your answer. Well Jütland is northern Danmark. Don`t know, but itīs already about 800 km`s (500 miles) from my town to the german-danish border, when you go by car.  We`re located just about 50 km`s or 30 miles north to the french border. Never knew that there is a military museum in Munster. I`ve been to others like the British war museum, London.

Beta patch: Are you talking about the FoF update v123, or is there a patch I missed ?

Yes I do not really know how to use the containers, or build new ones. But I think I understand now, how to produce them. So far I can produce Divisions.  But what do I have to do, if I want to unite the 3 parts of the Army of the Potomac? Is it not possible?

The CSA Army at Fredericksbourg right now has about 150 000 men. I can not attack with 45k. Another problem is, when I put the curser over that CSA Army (must be Army of North Virginia) sometimes it says 851,236 for example. I donīt think this is manpower. Is it a bug, or what can it be?

In detailed battle, I`m very poor in the offensive, but I managed to win the battles when I`m in defence.
I donīt know what to do, to drive the rebels out of their trench. On the other hand, I can not build trenches. Why?  Another thing. I opened advanced menu and ordered my brigades to fortify. Since that I had no more control over them until the end of the battle. Why?




Erik Rutins -> RE: First steps (4/11/2007 5:30:28 PM)

Arminius,

He's talking about the 1.9.4 beta update, which is quite stable and at this point I'd recommend for everyone to try. You can find instructions for getting it in the Public Beta sub-forum.

Regards,

- Erik



Walloc -> RE: First steps (4/11/2007 5:54:53 PM)

Hi Arminius,

The museum is certainly worth a visit loacted about half way between Hannover annd Hamburg. Well im not that much above the bordeline. 800km it is then.

Beta patch: Are you talking about the FoF update v123, or is there a patch I missed ?

There is a public beta patch. It requires u have first registred ur game on the matrix site then go into members download u can find it there. 1.9.4 IIRC.

Yes I do not really know how to use the containers, or build new ones. But I think I understand now, how to produce them. So far I can produce Divisions. But what do I have to do, if I want to unite the 3 parts of the Army of the Potomac? Is it not possible?


Containers are alfa and omega to the game, but u will get the hang of it soon.

Basicly. If u have a brigade outside a container, You after selecting them then left click on the contaither to add it into the container. Notice here there is a limit to how much can be in each container.
Same applies or container them self. Left click a division(full of brigades or not) on a army or a corps container to add them. U can add a division to a corps or an army and a corps to an army.
So brigade into division, division into corps or directly into armies. Corps into arimes

So u optimum wana add brigades to division container and then add division containers to army or corps containers. I ofc assume u have any avaible and u dont start with any corps so u will have to attach divisions directly to the army.

When u start. U if u right click the army container in potomac river province, Washington DC, it will open. Then u can in turn open division containers inside the army container by rigth clicking on them too. That should give u an idea of a simple build of containers.

Yes as u have noticed u start with the Army of the Potomac split up in 3.
All 3 are army containers so u cant combine those. Army being the highest container.

My advice is. Chose 1 of the 3 army containers to be ur main AOTP for the moment. Transfering divisions from the other armies into that. after opening all the armies containers and then selecting the division and left click on the 1 of the 3 armies u want to be ur main. Notice here there can be a max of 35 units or 8 containers in an army so prolly all the division cant fit into 1 but most can. You should have 1 army free u can rail it out west and assemple it there with some of the free divisions.

Same with generals. U add once my after selecting left click on the container.
this is a bit mroe tricky advice wise. Generals have abilities and they have rank
1 star cant command more than a single unit inside a container.
2 star command divisions.
3 star corps
4 star Armies.
5 star can command several sepereate armies in same province but that is for later in
the game.

So u wana assign 2 star to ur division and 4 start to command ur armies.
U do it same way. select them and left on the containter u want it in. Helps to open that container first.

The CSA Army at Fredericksbourg right now has about 150 000 men. I can not attack with 45k. Another problem is, when I put the curser over that CSA Army (must be Army of North Virginia) sometimes it says 851,236 for example. I donīt think this is manpower. Is it a bug, or what can it be?

No its Fog of War. Ur reports on enemies will vary alot.
My suggestion isnt to attack Army of North Virginia (ANV) just yet less u wana just try and see what happens.
Ur gona get ur ass kicked. You would be attacking a similar sized force but u inferior quality and attacking.

In detailed battle, I`m very poor in the offensive, but I managed to win the battles when I`m in defence.
I donīt know what to do, to drive the rebels out of their trench. On the other hand, I can not build trenches. Why? Another thing. I opened advanced menu and ordered my brigades to fortify. Since that I had no more control over them until the end of the battle. Why?

Yes, dont be alarmed by this. When u defend ur troops get a +2 quality boost. Thats alot early in the war when the quality isnt great. Hench my advice on not attacking Fredericksburg.
The defending auto AI trenches are removed in the beta patch, one of many reason to use it.

Its very hard to attack early on cuz of the trenches. So get the patch they are removed in that.
In case u dont.
The way to overcome it very early is. Bring ovewhelming troops. Buy long range weapons. Use them to out shot the rebels at ranges longer than their weapons.
Use artillery. U start with Non. So have to build.

You, you self cant build trenches until. Either u get the hasty entrenchment tech upgrade or u happen to have a unit with the special ability digger and then only that unit can. So dont order them to fortify. Nothing will happen


Hope it help and ask away.

Kind regards,

Rasmus



Walloc -> RE: First steps (4/11/2007 5:58:09 PM)

Not fair Erik,

U know how long it toke me to write all that and in the mean time u answer [:'(]

Kind regards,

Rasmus



christof139 -> RE: First steps (4/11/2007 6:39:05 PM)

quote:

I donīt really know if this region is belonging to that area too, but the name should be "Nordpfälzer Bergland".
( North Palatinate mountainland ) I donīt know why they named it Bergland. Thereīs only hills.
I donīt know the name of the "Kaserne(n) in Baumholder. I remember there is a nice museum inside the installation with WWII vehicels outside, like the german "Hetzer" Jagdpanzer, or a Priest etc.
My Art. Reg. was part of the 5th Panzer Division, I canīt remember seeing elements of the 9th at Baumholder.

Well Christof (sounds like a german name ) itīs really nice talking to you `bout your biography. But since that I did not make any progress in learning the game.


Wie gehts Arminius,

Yes, "Nordpfälzer Bergland", that is the name that encompasses the entire Baumholder area and the Hunsruck etc. of the Rhine Pfalz, but there is another local German name for the mountains that Baumholder is in, and I actaully saw this name on a map and it is similar to 'High Wild Land", something like that.

I can look at a NATO map from that time and see if it was the 9th Pz. Dv. in the area, and I think it was, since my Battalion was part of the 39th Inf. Regt. of the 9th ID in WWII, and my uncle was in the 9th Armored Division and fought elements of the 9th SS Pz. Div. in the Bulge, I tend to remember 3's and 9's. Famous Regiment from Detroit is the 399th Inf. Rgt. that foughtthe Bolsheviks up around Murmansk after WWI. 3's and 9's always show up. Had a friend in the 9th ID in Vietnam in the Delta, he was an Engineer and was attached to one or more of the 3 Battalions of the 39th IR that were in Vietnam, well, after his 2-tours in Vietnam he was transferred to Germany into the 39th ADA (Air Defence Artillery). So, you can see what I mean about 3's and 9's. [8|]

Just recently I knew of the name of the Kasserne in Baumholder, but have also just recently forgotten it again. [8|][:)]

I use Christof for Kryztof or Kryzstof etc., a Polish version of Christopher that is also about the same as the German version. Then when added together with the 1/39 Inf. Bn. = Christof139. See, I am a genius. [8|]

I also have a Divine/Latin/Roman/Sicilian connection in my family, in that Silvanus was the Roman diety of forest and field and the surname Silva dates to ancient Rome, with several Silva's being of military prominence such as Cornelius Flavius Silva that was Legate of Legion X Fretensis in the Holy Land at the Siege of Masada etc.

You must update the game to version 1.94. It takes time getting familiar with the interfaces, and I just usally scroll from city to city on the screen rather than use the interface. Just keep playing and experimenting with the game in bits and pieces, that is only play so much and not a full game by using the small setup, and also you can practice with the tutorial game.

Chris




Gil R. -> RE: First steps (4/11/2007 7:15:56 PM)

I agree that the business of assigning generals or units, etc., can sometimes be difficult for those who haven't used this system before, but always like to point out that it becomes second nature quickly. And as proof that it's not too complex I like to cite two family members who are in elementary school and have no trouble doing so -- so the system is different, but not difficult to master.



christof139 -> RE: First steps (4/11/2007 10:49:22 PM)

quote:

I donīt really know if this region is belonging to that area too, but the name should be "Nordpfälzer Bergland".
( North Palatinate mountainland ) I donīt know why they named it Bergland. Thereīs only hills.
I donīt know the name of the "Kaserne(n) in Baumholder. I remember there is a nice museum inside the installation with WWII vehicels outside, like the german "Hetzer" Jagdpanzer, or a Priest etc.
My Art. Reg. was part of the 5th Panzer Division, I canīt remember seeing elements of the 9th at Baumholder.

Well Christof (sounds like a german name ) itīs really nice talking to you `bout your biography. But since that I did not make any progress in learning the game.


Technically, I do believe any point over 1,000 feet may be considered a mountain, not 100% positive but I think so. I have a degree in Geology.

Highest point at baumholder was Wilson's Hill, over 900 meters, so over 2,700 feet above sea level. There is local relief in the area 300-feet and more in spots, with cliffs. Those mountains around Baumholder and the Hunsruck to the north are the Hercenian Mountains from that same named age long ago, fairly old, several hundred million years old.

The Kasserne at Baumholder is Kasserne Aulenbach.

I do see the 5th Pz. Dv. was in the area to the east, part of US V Corps now, but not when I was there. I do believe the 9th Pz. Dv. was in the area, almost positive as someone in 8th ID HQ told me that some months ago, but I could be confusing it with the 5th Pz. Dv. I have not been able to refind the map of troops dispositions I was looking for, but no big deal. Map was from about 1981, but that is almost 10-years after I left. I remember the Leopard I's and Jagd Kannone 90's, and Fiat 91(???) ground support aircraft and F-104's flying at treetop level. We and the pilots used to wave at each other and sometimes 'flip the bird' at each other. Pilots were allways laughing. I met some US Air Force F-4 pilots in town and got a ride once. Crazy people Jet Jockeys are, and chopper pilots are just as crazy. And hilarious at times.

My biggest problems with the game are the interface and errors it can help cause in inadvertent movement due to inadvertent clicking and the accuracy of the Guns.txt or Weapons file, plus I had an older compooter that caused the game to run slow, but now I have upgraded that old compooter and have a new one too, so no problems there. I was displeased with the weapons files in the old TS battleground ACW games so I and other people modded them, also in some other games.

Have fun, Chris






Drex -> RE: First steps (4/11/2007 11:31:11 PM)

OT, there was a movie about an actual event in a town in Wales who had the honor of having the highest mountain in their region until the British Geological Department demoted it to a hill because it was under 1000'. the movie was about the town's inhabitants raising the hill bit by bit until it reached 1000' and was a mountain once more.



christof139 -> RE: First steps (4/11/2007 11:40:17 PM)

quote:

OT, there was a movie about an actual event in a town in Wales who had the honor of having the highest mountain in their region until the British Geological Department demoted it to a hill because it was under 1000'. the movie was about the town's inhabitants raising the hill bit by bit until it reached 1000' and was a mountain once more.


Thanx for that info. I don't have my Geology Diktionary anymore, and only a few science books as I lost them all when our home was incinerated in 1989 and I never replaced them. obviously I do not work in the Geology field even thiugh that is what my degree is in. However, I still like the subjects within the Geo field.

Thanx again, Chris




Houtje -> RE: First steps (4/12/2007 1:13:18 PM)

the movie, btw, is called "The Englishman Who Went Up a Hill But Came Down a Mountain".




Arminius -> RE: First steps (4/12/2007 1:54:27 PM)

Txs for all the help so far, especially to Ramuss.

One more question. When I open an Corps Container for example and I detach a 2star General, is he automatic  detached to a division? And is a 3star General automatic the Corps Commander? Is a 1star General always just leading a brigade, even so there is no 2star General in the Division?



christof139 -> RE: First steps (4/12/2007 3:47:08 PM)

quote:

Txs for all the help so far, especially to Ramuss.

One more question. When I open an Corps Container for example and I detach a 2star General, is he automatic detached to a division? And is a 3star General automatic the Corps Commander? Is a 1star General always just leading a brigade, even so there is no 2star General in the Division?


There is not any automatic attachment for the gens. You have to manually attach them down to Divisional level, then the AI assigns them randomly to brigades within the Division, but the AI does not assign any Gens. to Containers.

If you want to move a Gen. out of a Container, click on the Gen.s name and then click on the Province and the Gen will pop-out of the Container.

Chris




Walloc -> RE: First steps (4/12/2007 3:57:44 PM)

Hi Arminius,


When I open an Corps Container for example and I detach a 2star General, is he automatic detached to a division

Not necesarrily. Be sure u place the 2 star general inside the division container u want him to command. If he is placed inside the corps container, but not inside one of the division u dont get his bonuses.
The 3 star u wana place inside the corps container but NOT inside 1 of the division containers inside the corps. If u do he only leads that division not the corps. This a huge difference from placements of 2 star's. Same apply to 4 / 5 star's btw.

Is a 1star General always just leading a brigade, even so there is no 2star General in the Division?

Yes. If u want him as a division commander u have to promote him. There is a limit on how many generals of a particular star u can have, so i only promote ppl i do want to command at that level i want, in general ;-).
How many depence on if u play with or without the beta patch. The way it works in the 2 are pretty different, so i wont explain until im sure u play with the beta patch.

Kind regards, and ask away if u have more questions

Rasmus



Arminius -> RE: First steps (4/12/2007 9:42:25 PM)

Yes I`m playing the beta patch. I wanna play "Southern steel" as Union. (Hey Iīm a beginner)

There`s always poping up a window, asking me whom I wanna promote to 4 star General. Is there a possibility just to promote a 1 star to a 2 star and so on? I think in real life there would be a riot started by all the other Generals if you would promote Grant from Brigade to Army Commander.



Walloc -> RE: First steps (4/12/2007 11:32:07 PM)

There`s always poping up a window, asking me whom I wanna promote to 4 star General. Is there a possibility just to promote a 1 star to a 2 star and so on? I think in real life there would be a riot started by all the other Generals if you would promote Grant from Brigade to Army Commander.

Well. Yes, u can promote 1 star directly to 4 star. I understand what u mean but the issue is IMO not as simple. Wasnt Grant first commanding AoTP in 64 and not 61 yes, but already early in 62 he does command an army out West. So he should in that sense be an army commander early on. Its a bit of an balance act to get all of this right and the beta patch is some what different then the 1.2.3 patch on this issue.



christof139 -> RE: First steps (4/12/2007 11:37:51 PM)

quote:

There`s always poping up a window, asking me whom I wanna promote to 4 star General. Is there a possibility just to promote a 1 star to a 2 star and so on? I think in real life there would be a riot started by all the other Generals if you would promote Grant from Brigade to Army Commander.

Well. Yes, u can promote 1 star directly to 4 star. I understand what u mean but the issue is IMO not as simple. Wasnt Grant first commanding AoTP in 64 and not 61 yes, but already early in 62 he does command an army out West. So he should in that sense be an army commander early on. Its a bit of an balance act to get all of this right and the beta patch is some what different then the 1.2.3 patch on this issue.


When I played the USA I played historically, that is I put McCellan as the 4-star and then hoped and looked the other way.

Actually, he wasn't that bad but ...

Chris



Arminius -> RE: First steps (4/19/2007 12:19:18 AM)

Hi, after playing the game for some rounds (May 62) I decided to quit to start again with more knowledge. I want to start again with better planing. So right now I want to build 88 Brigades of any kind. 17 more Divisions and 12 Corps. Then I will see how I go on.
Questions:
I`m interested in all the names, the Union gave to their Armys. Following I know.

Army of the Potomac
Army of Kentucky
Army of Illinois
Army of Cumberland (where was it`s area of operations?)
Army of the Tennessee
Any more? Is this 4th Army in the game a historic one? Don`t think so.

Detailed battle: Canīt find it in the manual. What does that white blinking star beside a brigade really mean?
Loss of morale?

What does that golden, big, shiny star mean? Must be something good.

How many fleets do I need for a complete blockade of the CSA? I know there have to be 3 ships (x 10) inside a fleet. Is it important to build extra fleets to hunt down blockade runners? Is it important to build frigades?
Is it important to build ironglads?

Another question that I have to explain.  In early 62 the AoP is laying siege on the Forts of the Fredericksburg province. After destroying two of them, Zollicofer is moving into the province to seek battle.

To my surprise I`m the attacker, even so the CSA enters the province.  Well, careful in a good order I move my divisions and after my right wing has contact with Rebel Cavalary I start to bring the whole Army in Line Formation. More and more CSA troops arrive in the area and because they all appear at my right wing, I move my center and the left wing from heading south with new direction west. Therefore I change most formations back to column. But I do not order forced march, to keep them fresh.  After a while, the frontline is heading north to south. I have about 145k troops, the CSA about 95k. My troops can hold the line and inflict at least as many damage to the CSA, as they take. Because the battle started after 5 pm it is going on into the nighttime. Even so nothing dramatic happend to my troops, suddenly at about 4 am, my troops start to leave their positions and route. I have no idea what`s the reason. Maybe the overall morale was down to zero. Can someone tell what is the reason for this. The battle report told me, that I inflicted 15k casualities to CSA and took 12k. Later I saw a very long list of brigades surrenderd to the CSA. Frustrating.






Walloc -> RE: First steps (4/19/2007 1:44:18 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arminius

Detailed battle: Canīt find it in the manual. What does that white blinking star beside a brigade really mean?
Loss of morale?



Its means that unit is out of command. Use the cmd buttom in the menu and press that unit to regain control over it. Else it will move by it self. Usually not a good thing. Especially if multiple units start to move on their own, making u lose control of the battle.

quote:

What does that golden, big, shiny star mean? Must be something good.


It means that a routed/ disorganized unit has been rallyed by a commander.

quote:

How many fleets do I need for a complete blockade of the CSA? I know there have to be 3 ships (x 10) inside a fleet. Is it important to build extra fleets to hunt down blockade runners? Is it important to build frigades?
Is it important to build ironglads?


I see people having different styles of play. So it will vary. Its a question of resources. the more u ports u blocade the less the CSA will recieve in gifts from european countries.
But it means spending ur resources on additional ship. I dont think there is a "right" answer. Several factors play into this. How high is the CSA status with the different european powers. Leading to the question much are the CSA recieving in gifts. How u play the diplomacy game plays into this. Spending those resources on ships, is that taking away resources from ur army, it needs to advance and beat the CSA?
All those answers arent easily answered. There are pro's and con's so the "right" answer depence heavily on yours and your opponents style of play.

quote:

Another question that I have to explain.  In early 62 the AoP is laying siege on the Forts of the Fredericksburg province. After destroying two of them, Zollicofer is moving into the province to seek battle.

To my surprise I`m the attacker, even so the CSA enters the province.  Well, careful in a good order I move my divisions and after my right wing has contact with Rebel Cavalary I start to bring the whole Army in Line Formation. More and more CSA troops arrive in the area and because they all appear at my right wing, I move my center and the left wing from heading south with new direction west. Therefore I change most formations back to column. But I do not order forced march, to keep them fresh.  After a while, the frontline is heading north to south. I have about 145k troops, the CSA about 95k. My troops can hold the line and inflict at least as many damage to the CSA, as they take. Because the battle started after 5 pm it is going on into the nighttime. Even so nothing dramatic happend to my troops, suddenly at about 4 am, my troops start to leave their positions and route. I have no idea what`s the reason. Maybe the overall morale was down to zero. Can someone tell what is the reason for this. The battle report told me, that I inflicted 15k casualities to CSA and took 12k. Later I saw a very long list of brigades surrenderd to the CSA. Frustrating.




the rules are that the one owning a province is by default the defender. Yes in some situasion i agree it seems counter intuiative. A defender automaticly gain a +2 combat moral boost. Quoting an example of same situasion from another post i made else where.

AotP moves into Fredericksburg to attack the ANV. Even if ANV isnt there the forts prevents the US from gaining the province right out. Leaving time for a ANV counter attack and still have moral bonus. Final average moral for the battle is 2.4 vs 5.25 giving the ANV a nice advantage. No I havent counted in dispostion which indeed do play in, but lets keep it simple.

This is an example what happens in a early 62 attack. Following that math a AotP that attack u can see the CSA will have quiet a moral advantage over you. Meaning ur units will route alot faster than the CSA. Once half ur units are routing ur army starts panicking and the will to fight will drop fast. U overall moral called will to fight u can check at the top of the screen as well as the enemies if it falls to 0 ur entire army routes. Its shown as 2 numbers next to each other at top fo screen 1 for each side. The average moral of urs and the opponents units as well as how many are routing/disorganized u can check pressing V.
In general i would advice against attacks which will lead to a situasion where the ANV gets defender bonus early in the war, if u an inexperinced player. U can attack just to gain combat experience but as u saw u have to be very carefull u dont get ur troops captured or the price will be higher than the gains. Guard ur retreat routes carefully. In time ur troops will be trained if u have generals in the army and u can buy abilities for ur units making it all a bit easier.
Those attacks can ofc be a good way to learn HW but expect losses before u get the hang of it. Which for some can be frustrating.

Hope it helps,

Rasmus



Erik Rutins -> RE: First steps (4/19/2007 1:48:22 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Arminius
Hi, after playing the game for some rounds (May 62) I decided to quit to start again with more knowledge. I want to start again with better planing. So right now I want to build 88 Brigades of any kind. 17 more Divisions and 12 Corps. Then I will see how I go on.


Sure, make sure you're on 1.9.4 and try either Coming Fury or Southern Steel for the scenario.

quote:

Army of the Potomac
Army of Kentucky
Army of Illinois
Army of Cumberland (where was it`s area of operations?)
Army of the Tennessee
Any more? Is this 4th Army in the game a historic one? Don`t think so.


Hm, Army of the Ohio is another, I think there was also an Army of the West, there were some that were the same army but went through several name changes. I think that 4th Army name is probably a scenario issue. Which one is that in?

quote:

Detailed battle: Canīt find it in the manual. What does that white blinking star beside a brigade really mean?
Loss of morale?


I know it's in the manual somewhere - it means the brigade is Out of Command. You can restore it by clicking on the button to get it back into command, then clicking on the brigade you want to restore. I suggest restoring brigades that are not yet "pinned in combat" before those that are.

quote:

What does that golden, big, shiny star mean? Must be something good.


If you are describing what I think, it means that a general has just rallied that unit.

quote:

How many fleets do I need for a complete blockade of the CSA? I know there have to be 3 ships (x 10) inside a fleet. Is it important to build extra fleets to hunt down blockade runners? Is it important to build frigades?
Is it important to build ironglads?


You need 30 "ships" in a fleet, but ships can be Ships, Frigates or Ironclads. Each unit has 10, so three units per fleet will do it. There are, IIRC 8 or 9 major CSA ports to blockade. I recommend building fleets and frigates in Boston, Philadeplhia and Brooklyn until you have the blockade in place as cheaply as possible, then a few more fleets to hunt blockade runners. Ironclads are more important if the CSA starts building a fleet or if you want to bombart a port.

quote:

Another question that I have to explain.  In early 62 the AoP is laying siege on the Forts of the Fredericksburg province. After destroying two of them, Zollicofer is moving into the province to seek battle.
To my surprise I`m the attacker, even so the CSA enters the province.


Whoever controls the province is the "defender", so until you take those forts and take the province they have the advantage in any fight in that province.

quote:

Well, careful in a good order I move my divisions and after my right wing has contact with Rebel Cavalary I start to bring the whole Army in Line Formation. More and more CSA troops arrive in the area and because they all appear at my right wing, I move my center and the left wing from heading south with new direction west. Therefore I change most formations back to column. But I do not order forced march, to keep them fresh.  After a while, the frontline is heading north to south. I have about 145k troops, the CSA about 95k. My troops can hold the line and inflict at least as many damage to the CSA, as they take. Because the battle started after 5 pm it is going on into the nighttime. Even so nothing dramatic happend to my troops, suddenly at about 4 am, my troops start to leave their positions and route. I have no idea what`s the reason. Maybe the overall morale was down to zero. Can someone tell what is the reason for this. The battle report told me, that I inflicted 15k casualities to CSA and took 12k. Later I saw a very long list of brigades surrenderd to the CSA. Frustrating.


My first guess is that the CSA succeeded in outflanking you, which can generate yellow and red morale reduction zones that affect your army's morale. This won't normally rout good troops, but if your troops were of low quality and/or low disposition, they would be fragile and could rout in that instance. Did you notice any of your movement areas turning red or yellow when you had a brigade selected? How was your Will to Fight doing? It gets reduced by 2 each day, did it reach 0 before your army started to rout? How was your Supply and Disposition in your army going into the battle?

Definitely keep a close eye on Will to Fight and brigade morale (you can use TAB to check this visually) each turn.

The AI loves to outflank - less so in the next version where we mixed things up a bit, but in 1.9.4 it LOVES to outflank. You have to make sure to keep your army from being outflanked or the penalties can be fairly severe.

Hope that helps.

Regards,

- Erik



Arminius -> RE: First steps (4/19/2007 10:03:17 AM)

@Rasmus: Thx

@ Eric: Yes I`m on 1.9.4 and Southern steel.
          I had 147k troops in that battle. So they could not outflank me. They tried, but I send two Reserve Divisions to my right wing to face that. I think Rasmus gave the right explanation. Not my province, troops of low quality.  (I have to get rid of those improvised weapons too )



 



Walloc -> RE: First steps (4/19/2007 2:12:07 PM)

U found out where to buy stuff i assume? i didnt have time to answer this morning.

Rasmus



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