New BoA Patch!

New BoA Patch! (Full Version)

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Gibbon -> New BoA Patch! (5/7/2007 1:43:19 PM)
Hurra! BoA is still alive and kicking!! Patch 1.12 is ready quote: Dear players, After some waiting, here is the new patch. It has been beta tested this week-end and no errors have been reported. It fixes some annoying bugs and provides some tweaks in gameplay and user interface. http://ageoddl.telechargement.fr/latest/BOA_Patch.zip ================================================== ============================ Birth of America Update 1.12 Readme Saturday, May 05, 2007 ================================================== ============================ This patch contains all changes since the start. You can continue a saved game created before the patch. All entries will apply dynamically to your previous game (except the location of Skinner if already on map) ================================================== ============================ Bugs Fixes ================================================== ============================ fixed: Training ability did not work in 1.11 (reminder: you must be in full supply, non moving and not in offensive posture to train units) fixed: Supply was resplesnished too fast in friendly territory. ================================================== ============================ User Interface ================================================== ============================ You have a new option to have the map focus on an enemy move during hosting (Options/Media window). Activated by default, you can disable it. Units prevented from merging with others stacks will keep the option from turn to turn. (CTRL-L or right cliking on the army tab) The "Save Under a new name" procedure (ctrl-click on the save button) has been rewritten to prevent file locking. New System Option, 'Max Texture Size', which will allows the game to run in a safer mode. See the technical forum thread for more details. ================================================== ============================ Game Play, Rules Additions and Changes ================================================== ============================ Disloyal cities don't prevent entirely weather damages, to counter the exploit of city-hopping in winter. Force march percentage has been slightly revised (higher base chance) Siege damages revised, more emphasize on artillery, less on others units. Taking hits during siege unfix the units. Reminder: if an inactive leader is caught in a battle, he will suffers heavy penalty if not in a region friendly controled (up to 50% penalty). Ambush % and mechanic improved. ================================================== ============================ Scenarios Additions and Changes ================================================== ============================ fixed: The latter French reinforcements were not arriving properly (thus rendering the game too hard on the American's side). Leader Skinner was not in the right place at the right moment. ================================================== ============================ AI ================================================== ============================ More cautious raiders/cavalry on recon. More cautious AI against entrenchments and forts.

Jagger2002 -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/8/2007 5:33:34 PM)
Heads up on the new patch. Supply is unforgiving...so remember, supply depots are your friends. Also recuperation from losses seems slower than the previous version.

Joe D. -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/10/2007 1:21:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jagger2002 Heads up on the new patch. Supply is unforgiving...so remember, supply depots are your friends ... Under 1.12, supply is not only unforgiving, its rules are applied in Draconian fashion; I have lost entire armies immediately after just losing my wagons, and some my troops have been out-of-supply in forts in areas that I actually control! The Brit AI seems to be declawed and is no longer a challenge; it looks like the play balance is very uneven w/this new patch, which was supposedly tested before its release. Anyone else experience this, or is everyone playing ACW?

Will_L_OLD -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/15/2007 6:20:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Joe D. quote: ORIGINAL: Jagger2002 Heads up on the new patch. Supply is unforgiving...so remember, supply depots are your friends ... Under 1.12, supply is not only unforgiving, its rules are applied in Draconian fashion; I have lost entire armies immediately after just losing my wagons, and some my troops have been out-of-supply in forts in areas that I actually control! The Brit AI seems to be declawed and is no longer a challenge; it looks like the play balance is very uneven w/this new patch, which was supposedly tested before its release. Anyone else experience this, or is everyone playing ACW? I just finished a 1775-1783 campaign with an American victory in September 1779. Normal settings for aggressiveness and detection and more time for AI. It seemed that the Brits could never really get rolling after they lost the first battle outside Boston in '75 (I was shocked and Ward actually improved to a 2 attack and 3 defense afterwards). In '76 after their initial spread out in New England I was able to return from Albany and New York and wrest the New England region from them. They contented themselves with taking Ft. Ticonderoga and occasionally trying to take Ft. Stanwick. Had I realized their supply situation at Ticonderoga was so critical I would have beseiged it sooner, they surrendered after one turn of seige in August '79. Was able to keep control of South Central and the Philadelphia/New York/Albany corridor the entire game and while they made a strong effort in the Deep South I was eventually able to overwhelm them there as well. Built depots everywhere with supply which must have helped me out, wasn't able to build a depot with the two bateaux as previously. Regaining strength points, supply or ammunition was a slow proposition. The logistics nightmare was actually kind of enjoyable. Also there was never a withdrawal of any on map militia or continental army unit. Now to try the British side and hopefully not suffer the same fate.

Joe D. -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/15/2007 2:56:31 PM)
Check Pocus' post under the "Brits easier" thread; Pocus said he would look into the new supply situation, but he probably has a full plate now that ACW is out. As the Colonials, under 1.12 I watched an entire Brit AI army self-destruct while it was billeted at Ticonderoga. The new supply rules are too severe, esp. in "civilization"; after all, colonists were required to billet Brit soldiers in their own homes, so how serious could resupply be for the Brits in territory they control?

Will_L_OLD -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/15/2007 5:52:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Joe D. Check Pocus' post under the "Brits easier" thread; Pocus said he would look into the new supply situation, but he probably has a full plate now that ACW is out. As the Colonials, under 1.12 I watched an entire Brit AI army self-destruct while it was billeted at Ticonderoga. The new supply rules are too severe, esp. in "civilization"; after all, colonists were required to billet Brit soldiers in their own homes, so how serious could resupply be for the Brits in territory they control? It makes sense that the supply rules would force the Brits to spread out. There are enough towns to billet them in, just need to match the supply level the region can produce with the forces you send there. I'll see how I manage with them later today when I start a new 75-83 campaign against the American AI.

Joe D. -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/15/2007 6:58:42 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Will_L It makes sense that the supply rules would force the Brits to spread out. There are enough towns to billet them in, just need to match the supply level the region can produce with the forces you send there. I'll see how I manage with them later today when I start a new 75-83 campaign against the American AI. Matching Brit armies to areas that can support them may prove easier said than done; it's ironic that the player advice at the end of the BoA manual (v 1.09) said not to disperse your Brit armies, but the new supply penalties under v. 1.12 may not give you much of a choice. Anyway, let us know how you make out as Pocus often monitors these threads.

Roads -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/15/2007 7:24:36 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Joe D. The new supply rules are too severe, esp. in "civilization"; after all, colonists were required to billet Brit soldiers in their own homes, so how serious could resupply be for the Brits in territory they control? In real life it was very hard. The British were never able to feed the army in New York off local supply, even though they held all of Long Island for the duration of the conflict. The reason Trenton happened was because the British had dispersed across the entire state/colony of New Jersey to ensure adequate supply. Basically they always had supply problems away from the ports (whcih I guess are depots for game purposes).

Joe D. -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/16/2007 1:26:09 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Roads quote: ORIGINAL: Joe D. The new supply rules are too severe, esp. in "civilization"; after all, colonists were required to billet Brit soldiers in their own homes, so how serious could resupply be for the Brits in territory they control? In real life it was very hard. The British were never able to feed the army in New York off local supply, even though they held all of Long Island for the duration of the conflict. The reason Trenton happened was because the British had dispersed across the entire state/colony of New Jersey to ensure adequate supply. Basically they always had supply problems away from the ports (whcih I guess are depots for game purposes). I assume the troops in Trenton were "living off the land," otherwise dispersing troops just makes it harder to get supplies to them (from port). Well, BoA now has to make a decision between a historical supply system w/severe penalties that prohibits the Brits from forming large armies for any appreciable amount of time, or compromising the new supply restrictions to get back the challenging "cat and mouse" play between hit-and-run Colonials and large(r) Brit formations. Wonder what Pocus will decide to do? What do BoA players want?

Pocus -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/16/2007 10:22:49 AM)
AI must not be screwed. If players have too much trouble in sustaining their troops, imagine how hard it is for poor Athena. So the rule will be softened. Any reports on the American AI? Are the US troops dissolving too?

Joe D. -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/16/2007 5:41:25 PM)
I found it almost impossible to sustain any Colonial troop strength in Canada in the winter, even w/a train load of wagons. After the wagons go quickly red, armies can dissolve within one turn/month. I was, however, able to use Spanish troops to take Florida, then Vincennes, from where it was a short jump to Fort Detroit. I was able to succcessfully seige it during the summer and maintain troops there through the winter. In the US proper, Colonial troops usually don't disolve in most areas; they simply don't replenish their numbers, i.e., red units stay red. However, my Colonial armies tend to be smaller than their Brit counterparts. I will have to play as the Brits and try to see how the Colonial AI does w/supply.

Pocus -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/16/2007 6:58:24 PM)
for Canada, you need to take a town and establish a depot or even two, because you need to resplenish your wagons routinely, if you want to operate in winter (which is somehow ahistorical). In winter, wagons can protect you from damages, but will eat supply very fast.

Jagger2002 -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/16/2007 10:10:06 PM)
I have played a couple of years now as the Brits against the American AI. I can function properly with the Brits as I build plenty of depots. The American AI seems to play well. After a year and a half as the Americans against the Brit AI, the Brits are having major problems. They are so scattered that they are easy pickings with my concentrated American armies. Also the Brit armies have weak strength either through lack of supply and/or lack of refit/replacements. The big Brit/Hessian reinforcements of 76 haven't yet arrived but I suspect I will take them out as well and finish the game off. IMO, the American AI doesn't seem to have a problem with the new supply rules but the Brit AI is having major problems. For a human, the supply and rest/refit rules are working great. The supply rules are probably fine for human vs human but not so much for the Brit AI.

Roads -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/17/2007 5:25:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Joe D. quote: ORIGINAL: Roads In real life it was very hard. The British were never able to feed the army in New York off local supply, even though they held all of Long Island for the duration of the conflict. The reason Trenton happened was because the British had dispersed across the entire state/colony of New Jersey to ensure adequate supply. Basically they always had supply problems away from the ports (whcih I guess are depots for game purposes). I assume the troops in Trenton were "living off the land," otherwise dispersing troops just makes it harder to get supplies to them (from port). That was my point. The only time that the British really tried to live off the land led to their forces being so dispersed that they were beaten handily. Howe needed almost all of New Jersey, in addition to Long Island, New York and Westchester to draw enough supplies for his amry (admittedly the biggest British army in the war). Supply problems led to his dispersing his troops and their being beaten at Trenton. Supply problems stopped Cornwallis cold in North Carolina. Supply problems led to Burgoyne sending his light troops to where they could be beaten in Bennington. I haven't played the new patch enough to have an opinion on the new rule. But IMHO supply wasn't enough of a factor in 1.11, especially for the British. The continentals certainly had plenty of supply problems, but these didn't constrain their operations the same way that comparable problems constrained the British. Ultimately this was because the rebels were almost always able to assert political control where the British weren't present.

Joe D. -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/17/2007 2:54:10 PM)
Under 1.12, BoA is almost a new game; I now have to use the supply filter on every turn to see where I can/can't stay or go. In fact, playing as the Brits, an area in supply could suddenly go bad with the advent of winter or a nearby Colonial army! Historically, the Brits sometimes caused their own supply problems by pointlessly chasing Colonial militia into the wilderness (Cornwallis) or trying to get an entire baggage train of personal comforts -- including a mistress -- through the wilderness, as did Burgoyne. But you're right; BoA supply restrictions weren't sufficient in 1.11, but in 1.12, these retrictions may have gone too far re play balance is concerned; so there may still have to be a compromise.

Joe D. -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/17/2007 3:03:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Pocus AI must not be screwed. If players have too much trouble in sustaining their troops, imagine how hard it is for poor Athena. So the rule will be softened. Any reports on the American AI? Are the US troops dissolving too? Playing as the Brits, I watched an entire AI army under H. Gates quickly change to red after a short seige -- by land and sea -- in NYC! Otherwise, the AI seems to handle supply better as the Colonials than when playing as the Brits. It also seems more feisty, foolishly engaging Brit armies early in the '75 scenario, but that was probably because I didn't give "Athena" a FOW break; I kept the same parameters for this game as when I played the Colonials: normal AI w/extended time w/o any FOG advantages.

Joe D. -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/18/2007 3:35:46 PM)
Playing as the Brits in the 1775 scenario vs. the Colonial AI set at normal w/extended time: it's 1780 and my lead of 1610 to 1500 plus is slowly vanishing because I can't get my troops and officers into a town where they could be resupplied/replenished. Even w/only a few regiments to billet for the winter, areas that are clear for supply just go dark when my troops finally get there; all that way for nothing because the town doesn't have enough supply to support a handful of troops! All the stars earned by my regiments -- one had 3 -- have been for naught since the last of my veteran units has dissolved; I then lose town after town because I have no troops left to defend them. Perhaps BoA has become too realistic for gaming purposes; I have certainly gained an appreciation for supply problems in the 1700's, but what was an exciting -- if not frustrating -- game of "cat and mouse" is now more like being slowly squeezed to death by an Anaconda of supply restrictions that is sucking the life right out of this game. Well, at least was a good history lesson while my attention span lasted.

Pocus -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/18/2007 4:22:44 PM)
I agree with you, I tried to play also the Brits and they have one hell of a time with supply. My testing was done as the Americans so the problem was much amended by the fact many regions are friendly to you. I will try to update BOA next week, thanks for your feedback all !

Joe D. -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/18/2007 8:01:59 PM)
Thanks for taking the time to listen to our feedback; this doesn't always happen with all the games on Matrix forums.

anarchyintheuk -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/18/2007 11:02:50 PM)
IMHO after playing as Brits in the 1775 and 1775 alt campaigns with the new patch, supply "feels" about right. It forces you to advance slowly, garrison the areas you take rather well and disperse your forces in winter. Although not historical, you can park and rotate regiments in Halifax and the West Indies for r&r (terming service in the West Indies as r&r would not have amused the soldiers of that age). Whether or not that reflects a valid game construct only the designers can answer. May sound odd but I'd like to play those campaigns with the old supply wagon availability rates. Having to fill supply wagons would approximate the extensive preparations that large Brit armies of the time would have had to make prior to a campaign. Guarding supply wagons to and from your depot/main base would recreate on a strategic level the logistical tail historic for the period.

Jagger2002 -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/19/2007 4:10:23 AM)
IMO, it is tough as the Brits but certainly not impossible against a human or AI. If I adjusted anything, a few additional supply wagons to allow for depot construction would help without making it too easy for the Brits. (Although I think the Americans could use a few more supply wagons for depots as well.) The Brits are very strong on the ground. IMO, the supply restrictions balance out some of the Brit advantage of very powerful ground troops. It keeps the Brits from rampaging across the map which they could do without the supply restrictions. It spreads the Brit forces out, giving the Americans some targets of opportunity for their weaker troops. Between humans, the game is very finely balanced. I think the Americans now have a slight but not overwhelming advantage with the current supply rules. I also suspect that the new supply rules are not well understood yet by players. After they get use to the rules, they will adjust their playing styles which will give us a better idea of the true balance.

Joe D. -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/19/2007 5:23:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jagger2002 ... I also suspect that the new supply rules are not well understood yet by players. After they get use to the rules, they will adjust their playing styles which will give us a better idea of the true balance. AGEOD will have to rewrite the BoA manual -- notably the "Hints & Tips" toward the end of v 1.09 -- if they decide to keep the latest supply restrictions Besides, Pocus said he would "soften," not scrap, the 1.12 supply version.

Will_L_OLD -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/21/2007 12:18:53 AM)
As the Brits, I haven't found the 1.12 supply rules overly frustrating. Its required some adjustments but I consider that a good thing. Ran into some supply problems with Cornwallis in the Deep South but they were of my own making and resolved by transporting two captured supply wagons down to build a depot. Washington surprised me by attempting a 1777 invasion of Canada, at St. John. I'd just transported Burgoyne's reinforcements to Montreal and engaged, then chased the withdrawing troops to Ft. Ticonderoga where they were destroyed. AI keeps trying to take Ft. Niagara but hasn't been able to seige it long enough before they have to leave because of supply shortage.

Jagger2002 -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/21/2007 1:01:18 AM)
In my PBEM, I am the Americans and we have reached March of 78. I had a rough winter supplying troops in the south. I actually started losing troops to starvation. I don't have any depots in the south and am currently moving two supply wagons from the north to build a depot. My total number of supply wagons within the game are currently 5 supply wagons. So devoting two of them to a supply depot down south demonstrates how desparate my need for supply was over the last winter. Over the course of the game, I have created 4 depots in the north and lost one of those. One probably bug in this PBEM game which impacts my supply situation. I have not received any notifications of disbanded troops in January. I also haven't noticed troops disappearing. Either I am very lucky or I should have less troops than I actually have. Which means my supply needs are probably much higher than it would be normally. Anybody else not having American troops disbanding at the end of the year?

Joe D. -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/21/2007 2:48:30 PM)
How far along are you in your game as the Brits under 1.12? I was doing OK as the Brits until the French arrived, then the 1.12 supply constraints really became a problem in the face of mounting Colonial opposition as i was unable to replenish my own veterans. It should be difficult -- but not impossible -- for Colonial troops to operate in Canada. After all, we nearly took Quebec in a snow storm! Under the 1.12 supply restrictions, it's almost impossible for the Colonials to successfully seige anything north of Ticonderoga. As for the Brits, they can't hold on to anything south of Ticonderoga for very long; it gets harder and harded to replenish your depleted units w/so few wagons/depots to be had, esp. in the winter.

Will_L_OLD -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/21/2007 5:59:49 PM)
My game as Brits is in September of 77. In New England I control Boston, Newport and Norwich and will take Hartford and Springfield in the October turn. Middle States: New York, Albany, Ft. Ticonderoga, Ft. Stanwix and Philadelphia. South Central: Norfolk only. Deep South: Charleston, Savannah, Augusta, Ninety Six, Camden and Wilmington. Have all the objective towns needed except Pittsburgh and 14/23 strategic towns I believe. Built forts at Boston, Newport, New York, Albany, Philadelphia, Savannah and Wilmington, captured forts at Charleston, Ticonderoga and Stanwix. Built or captured depots at New York, Albany, Ft. Ticonderoga, Philadelphia, Wilmington and Charleston and will be building one at Springfield. Americans have been fighting hard in New England and Deep South. In middle states their supply source is at Oswego (which I had abandoned to reinforce Ft. Niagara) and have noticed their forces moving towards Oswego and avoiding combat enroute. They've constantly been marching small forces across frozen Lake Erie in the spring to little effect on Ft. Niagara.

Joe D. -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/21/2007 8:51:29 PM)
When the French arrive circa 1780, your fortunes will change and your forces will probably get caught/squeezed between the French in the north and Colonials in the south. Using the supply filter, you will soon discover how little clear area you have to replenish your hard-pressed troops; playing as the Brits -- normal Ai with extended processor time -- I just gave-up in Jan. 1781.

Lightsfantastic -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/22/2007 5:01:02 AM)
As the British in this PBEM I did not fully understand the supply rules when we started, resulting in a horrible supply situation for His Majesties Forces during the winter of 1775/1776. It has taken me two years and three Depots built just to be able to rebuild and retake the offensive in New England for New York. Also my opponent has been using his armies in hit and run attacks (very historical) of my dispersed garrisons during the early winter months, and sending raiding parties to pillage areas in the late fall, reducing the supply available for the winter. [:-] I can live with the rules as they are, but concur that maybe more supply wagons are needed. quote: ORIGINAL: Jagger2002 In my PBEM, I am the Americans and we have reached March of 78. I had a rough winter supplying troops in the south. I actually started losing troops to starvation. I don't have any depots in the south and am currently moving two supply wagons from the north to build a depot. My total number of supply wagons within the game are currently 5 supply wagons. So devoting two of them to a supply depot down south demonstrates how desparate my need for supply was over the last winter. Over the course of the game, I have created 4 depots in the north and lost one of those. One probably bug in this PBEM game which impacts my supply situation. I have not received any notifications of disbanded troops in January. I also haven't noticed troops disappearing. Either I am very lucky or I should have less troops than I actually have. Which means my supply needs are probably much higher than it would be normally. Anybody else not having American troops disbanding at the end of the year?

Will_L_OLD -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/22/2007 5:54:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Joe D. When the French arrive circa 1780, your fortunes will change and your forces will probably get caught/squeezed between the French in the north and Colonials in the south. Using the supply filter, you will soon discover how little clear area you have to replenish your hard-pressed troops; playing as the Brits -- normal Ai with extended processor time -- I just gave-up in Jan. 1781. At the end of '78 was able to get control of all strategic towns in New England, Middle States and Deep South. Controlled Norfolk and Alexandria in the South Central. The French and Spanish declared war in February of 1779. Now in November '79 after spending much of the year chasing Rochambeau around New England I've picked up two more strategic cities in the South Central and been able to hold or take back all the rest (Camden & Hillsboro fell to the Americans but are now under British control again) The supply filter does show just how little we control beyond the reach of my forts and depots. I tend to stick close too them for the most part and strike out for more turf in the late spring and summer. The Americans keep trying to take a decent size city and have a good number of supply wagons they are dragging around and frustatingly keep just an area ahead of my strike forces trying to catch up to them. Except for Rochambeau, who I caught with Brandt and a bunch of Indians at Brattleboro and captured an artillery and supply. Thanks for the new fort to be built at (to be determined) Rochambeau! Wondered why the AI had split him off like that. One thing I've noticed playing as both sides with 1.12, there has not been a single militia unit removed during the winter. I don't think the Brits need more supply wagons with their reinforcements, they get enough and just need to be careful with them.

Joe D. -> RE: New BoA Patch! (5/22/2007 1:44:23 PM)
You're chasing the French? What are your game settings, i.e., AI, processor time?

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