RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (Full Version)

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SMK-at-work -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/19/2007 1:39:08 AM)

thanks for the info sarge



fochinell -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/19/2007 11:04:03 AM)

18th January 1944. A: 240/2006 (56aa), X: 119/1658 (4gd). 41 Bf109G-6, 23 Me410, 6 Mustang III, 7 Hurri II, 10 P-38L, 25 P-47D, 24 P-51B, 139 B-17F. A major battle but a clear Axis attritional victory [:(], with Werner at 7% losses while inflciting 9% on me by air combat alone, with a better than 1:1 attrition rate against the heavy bombers.

MTO: Tac raids to Italy, including the usual low-yield fighter strikes on the Milanese AFs, with the MAC fighter squadrons persisting with their inability to intercept RTBing LW interceptors despite arriving overhead on their AF's at the right time [:@].

ETO: The 8th AF send a single medium-sized force to hit Bussing NAG EFAC, supported by 9th AF sweeps. Werner catches me out by staging a major interception of the inbound force as it crosses the Ems, and the 50% escort force is overwhelmed after a heavy fight. Only 44 bombers get through to bomb the target [X(], and the supporting sweeps come in too late and do too little to help on the return leg. The FC sweep alone loses 17/48 P-51B's, while the main force achieves 30/312f 139/160b 162e for 30% damage to the target. Bomber losses are far too heavy, and the re-equipment of the 3rd Bomb Division from my small stock of B-17G's now commences.

BC: 6 Group to Duisburg for a good raid, with more than 90% of the bombloads in the target area. 5/356b with 0/12b for the Oboe supporters. No NJG activity. PR reveals Duisburg-Ruhrort PORT at 99%, Rothensee-Elbe OILS at 99%, while some of the last month's RR targets are relatively unscathed, Augsburg at 28% and Frankfurt/Oder at 7%.



wernerpruckner -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/19/2007 9:14:36 PM)

I think one of the important things that happened during this turn:
2 FGs turned back after a short clash over the Channel [:D]
Two of my Elite units ( bah....one only has a total exp of 55 ) followed a few escorts back to the Channel....and there I changed their targt to two fresh incoming FGs....this created a huge gap in fresh escorts [:D]



fochinell -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/19/2007 11:57:26 PM)

...this created a huge gap in fresh escorts

My main problem with the escort gap was the cancellation of the first two P-47 sweeps and at least two 8th AF FG's [:@]. Which leads to..

19th January 1944. Rest day A: 0/0, X: 5/0. Never fear, the Allied horde will be BACK SOON...



fochinell -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/22/2007 4:04:34 PM)

And here they are...

20th January 1944. A: 132/3645 (27aa), X: 140/1253. 37 Bf 109 G6/R6, 21 Zerstorer, 7 Spit Vb, 11 Spit IX, 5 Spit XIV, 6 Typhoon, 6 P-38H, 4 P-38L, 18 P-47D, 10 B-26B, 6 B-17F, 43 B-24J. A good turn for me, with some useful bombing results and overall low heavy bomber losses against a good level of LW attrition. [8D]

MTO: Major 15th AF attacks on aviation industry targets around Budapest. Two forces of 96 Liberators attack Dunai and Gyori Vagongyar AFAC's. The Gyori attack goes in successfully against a coule of skirmishes while inbound, while the Dunai force attract the conceptration LW interceptors gathering NW of Budapest. The late arrival of their target-leg escorts plus extensive flying over the Budapest city area in search of the secondary target and t/o's after the primary is socked in leaves them exposed to substantial fighter attack until the escorts catch up south of the city. [:@] Final results are 4/288f 43/188b 49e, with Gyori AFAC at 28%. Some useful LW losses, even if the allied bomber losses are heavy and the bombing results poor. The supporting 12th AF P-38H strikes against Budapest AF's come in too late and lose 6/96f, mostly from return-leg attacks approaching the Adriatic coast. Otherwise some average medium bomber and fighter attacks on Italian PORT and RR by the tactical forces see no opposition.

ETO: More activity, as the 8th send two forces of 160 B-17F with full escort plus FC and 9th AF support to my favourite aviation targets around Leipzig, Mittel Deutsche EFAC and Erla AFAC. Zero resistance on the way in, and little combat for the 8th on the return leg, mostly returning Thunderbolts from the inbound leg escort force being hunted on their return over Holland; 8/728f 6/320b 9e for Mittel-Deutsche EFAC 100% and Erla only 1%.

The main fight is against the tactical raids. An early 2TAF Typhoon strike against SASIC RUBBER in Belgium attracts most of the LW fighters in northern France, and the first Spit XIVs from 401 RCAF Sqn go down to the usual series of near-defenceless bounces, 16/52f 6/72b 7e - the Spit Vb's get 5 for 7 lost this turn, the XIV's 2-5 lost [&:] Nasty Werner [:(]. The main fight is against the 9th AF Marauders going to Nordhafen RUBBER to cover the 8th's return leg. The target takes nil damage, but the combat results are excellent, 12/288f 10/64b 91e. The following 2TAF Mitchells make a small contribution, 7/407f 0/72b 7e for Hamm OILS 72%, while the 2 Group Mossie FB's hit Superphosphat CHEM near Bremen for a disappointing 28% although they only lose 3/24b, mostly cripples to flak near Emden.

BC: 1 Group do some damage to Halle, with about 75% of the bombloads in the city area, with the rest overshooting for once. 205 Group may have actually produced a good raid against Budpest this time, with over 80% of their bombloads hitting the city area. The NJGs are up in small numbers over Germany, with the NI's claiming 1 for 1 Mossie lost. PR reveals Dresden RR at 99%. Excelleurnt.



fochinell -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/22/2007 11:43:47 PM)

21st January 1944. A: 63/2219 (7aa), X: 44/754. 22 Spit Vb, 14 Spit IX, 1 Spit XIV, 11 P-47D, 4 B-17G.

MTO: Rest day.

ETO: 3 forces of 100 B-17G to aviation targets around Stuttgart. No resistance, apart from the usual escort hunting as the inbound escorts head home which sees some bad bounces with 2, 3 and even 4 Thunderbolts going down to single bounces. Bombing results are disappointing due to heavy cloud, with only one primary hit - DB Sindelfingen EFAC 15%, otherwise Heilbronn RR 57%, and some blind bombing of Unterturkheim RR. 12/680f 4/300b 9e.

For once the main fight is not against the 9th AF supporting raid, and the Marauders do 100% damage to Morhange OILS for 1/257f 1/64b 1e. Most of the combat centers on the following 2TAF Mitchells aiming for Hesperange STEEL, and the Spits take heavy losses - 37/321f 4/71b 41e. The Typhoons hit GM ARM for 49% at long last without opposition.

BC: 3 Group raid Ebano OILR outside Hamburg for a basic failure - only 72 bombloads in the target area for 1/240b lost. Oboe Mossie B.IVs attack Krupp STEEL but only 9 bombloads are reported in the target area, 0/24b. Little NJG activity, although one is destroyed by the NI's.



SMK-at-work -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/23/2007 1:23:39 AM)

quote:

1/257f 1/64b 1e


What does that mean??



wernerpruckner -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/23/2007 8:16:11 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: SMK-at-work

quote:

1/257f 1/64b 1e


What does that mean??


f.....fighter

1 fighter lost out of 257

b...bomber

e...destroyed enemy A/C claimed



fochinell -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/23/2007 8:44:01 PM)

22nd January 1944. A: 31/1203 (25aa), X: 0/8 (0gd). 13 A-20C, 5 B-24J.

MTO: The Norden bombsights are frozen up today. The 15th send a single force of 96b to hit OILS in the Trieste area, and miss, losing 5 bombers to Flak. The 12th AF A-20C's try to hit SIAP Vado Ligure OILS and miss, before a horde of flak cripples crash into the sea off Corsica much to the amusement of the MAC Mitchell crews who have seen it all before. Otherwise some fighter strikes on RR, with only the Stab units in southern Italy doing anything in response.

ETO: A Tiffie raid to SA Redeventza OIL for 58%, no resistance. Otherwise quiet due to weather.

BC: 4 Group raid Bottrop, getting 70% of their bombs in the target area with the rest landing in Essen. No resistance.



wernerpruckner -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/23/2007 9:11:35 PM)

you forgot something !!!!



wernerpruckner -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/23/2007 9:12:57 PM)

Operation Shingle has started



fochinell -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/24/2007 5:26:26 PM)

you forgot something !!!!

Hey, you get the notifications. Yeah, the whale is flopping it's tail around Nettuno beach [>:] Some tactical strikes should follow in due course as a token gesture towards historical realism.

Meanwhile, back at the ranch -

23rd January 1944. A: 103/2424 (8aa), X 65/805 (0gd). 36 Fw190A, 2 Bf 110 G4/U8, 12 Mossie FBVI, 10 Spit IX, 67 B-17G. Heavy B-17 losses, but for once not directly due to me.

MTO: Rest day due to heavy cloud.

ETO: The 8th return wth three forces of 100 B-17G with full escort going to the engine factories around Stuttgart, and reach they target area without resistance. Cloud diverts two of the forces to secondaries, and the bombing is mediocre. The main fighting breaks out on the return, when some of the bomber groups appear to fall behind at an air speed of about 50 mph and take the brunt of repeated fighter attack approaching the Pas de Calais, after the return leg tactical supporting raids are completed and their escorts return with the bombers at normal cruising speed. Results are 5/693f 67/300b 65e, for DB Sindelfingen EFAC 41%, Mannheim-Rhine PORT 54%, and Ludwigshafen Oppau CHEM 20%.

The 9th AF Marauder supporting raid hits Hadonange STEEL for 99% with zero contact - 0/284f 0/63b 0e. The 2TAF Mitchells see more of a fight, coinciding with the returning B-17's for a while - 13/363f 1/72b 18e and Haine St.Pierre RR 69%. The Tiffies hit Brussels/Midi RR for 66% without a fight, while a low-level mossie FB raid on the OILS outside Paris and lose 12/24b to fighters on the return.

BC: 5 Group raid Magdeburg for 4/360b and all their bombloads in the target area. The NJG make an appearance, losing the first two Bf 110 G4/U8's to the intruders.



fochinell -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/29/2007 12:13:00 PM)

24th January 1944. A: 21/785 (8aa), 22/307 (0gd). 10 Fw190A, 8 P-38L, 8 B-24J.

MTO: 15th AF send two forces of 96 bombers each to aviation targets around Munich. Some combat after the targets are reached. 8/288f 9/192b 34e for BMW Munchen EFAC missed but Oberpfaffenhoffen AFAC 100%. Some tactical raids in Italy, most cancelled by weather.

ETO: Rest day.

BC: Raid cancelled. PR reveals Duisburg RR 40% damage.

25th January 1944. A: 129/1897 (14aa), 90/1353 (0gd). 34 Bf109G6, 15 Halifax II, 13 Mustang III, 53 P-47D, 33 B-26B, 8 B-17F. Heavy P-47 losses, but that's what they're there for and they do some good work in return.

MTO: Rest day.

ETO: The 8th send a single force to Bussing NAG in the hope of doing some useful damage for once. No dice - 30% damage this time. Most losses are escort jumping of the P-47's returning home and some B-17F flak cripple hunting. 17/426f 8/160b 11e. The big fight is, yet again, around the 9th AF supporting raid, which sees massive combat covering the 8th's return, exaggerated by a late take-off pushing them out well behind the returning 8th AF fighters. I'm happy enough for OKL to occupy themselves with the tactical fighters, even though losses are high. 49/284f 33/64b 110e, Krupp-Hannover STEEL 68%.

BC: 6 Group to Oberhausen, 15/336b with 0/12b Mossie B.IV Oboe support. A rare example of a BC raid with no NI support attracts the NJG, and Halifax losses are higher as a result. No new NJG AF's active, though. Half the bombloads hit the target, with most of the rest hitting Gelsenberg Benzin FUEL. Oh well, fair enough.

26th January 1944. A 3/322 (1aa), X: 0/0.

MTO & ETO: Rest day due to weather.

BC: 1 Group to Cologne/Nippes, 2/292b with most of the bombloads in the target area. No NJG activity.



fochinell -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/29/2007 5:44:14 PM)

27th January 1944. A: 48/1210 (14aa), X: 6/467. Not a good day for me.

MTO: Rest due to weather.

ETO: The 8th send a single force to Leverkusen RUBBER, doing 32% damage. The only combat is the usual flak-cripple hunting on the return leg. 0/288f 18/160b 0e. Still, the bomber losses weren't too bad even for such **** bombing results.

Constant AI upgrading of the B-26B units to B-26G when I don't want it to means there are no available 9th AF Marauder units with more than 50% morale this turn, hence a pathetic group of P-47 bombing attacks on RR targets in an attempt to cover the return leg. Needless to say, they do negligable bombing damage, catch no Axis fighters, and one group get hammered doing the usual repetitive strafe-RR-repeatedly-while-being-bounced routine. I wish this would have a Darwinian effect, but I doubt it.

BC: 3 Group to Hitzacker OILS with their H2S-equipped Lanc III's. 168 bombloads in the target area for 8/240b lost. Some NJG activity, but only one claimed for one NI lost. 0/24b Mossie B.IVs to Krupp STEEL, and they manage to get 3 bombloads in the target area. That should make Speer sweat with terror. So much for Oboe. 205 Group raid Sofia for 0/168b, while PR reveals Cologne/Nippes RR at 7% (curses) with Oberhausen at 45% (hmmph).

28th January 1944. A: 179/2847 (40aa), X: 87/1646 (1gd). Losses include 36 Fw190A, 17 Me410, 13 Spit Vb, 13 Spit IX, 16 P-39, 7 P-40, 11 P-38L, 12 P-51B, 12 A-20C, 21 B-26B, 15 B-17F, 36 B-25J. A narrow Axis success, with only one out of three strategic attacks doing anything worthwhile in terms of bombing damage for fifty HB's lost.

MTO: The 15th send two forces of 96b to aviation targets in Bavaria. Bombing accuracy is pants, with Messerschmitt AFAC 0% and BMW Munchen EFAC 16%. OKL send some fighters up before the targets are reached, but most of the combat is on the return leg, with flak cripples and some bingo-fuel opportunism accounting for most of the bombers lost. The 100th FS get their first kill over the Adriatic on the return leg. 10/288f 36/192b 35e.

Various tactical raids go in, with only one Hurri strike on Italian RR and a Baltimore raid on OILS proving useful. Otherwise fighter strikes to the Milanese AF's get slaughtered (yes, those Airacobras again - well, it beats losing more useful aircraft on such ineffective missions) and the 12th AF Bostons get massacred by Flak attacking OILS near Trieste for predictably zero bombing results.

ETO: The 8th send a single force to Waldau-Fieseler AFAC which does 99% damage. No substantive combat against the main force again, with OKL contenting itself with flak-cripple hunting and jumping returning escorts yet again. This does cause some annoying P-51B losses from the FC squadrons for the penetration leg which becomes even more annoying when they don't fight back. 14/327f 15/160b 6e.

The usual story unfolds as the LW take on the tactical strikes covering the return leg. The 9th AF Maruaders are back, but the battle only really starts on their return from another ineffective attack on Nordhafen RUBBER. 7 B-26's go down to one bounce over Holland, but most of the losses are one by one, with the Marauder gunners doing most of the defensive work. 6/333f 21/64b 46e. Plenty of Thunderbolts and Marauders in the stockpile to soak this up. The 2TAF Mitchells are back for the first time in a couple of days, and hit Ludwig BBFAC for 12% and 21/336f 1/72b 26e. Tiffies hit Lesquin CHEM without resistance.

BC: 4 Group to Stettin-Oder PORT for what looks like an outstanding raid, 4/240b lost and 238 bombloads reported in the target area. Some minor NJG activity from a northern Danish AF as the NJG go back to cowering in their bunkers. Hitzacker OILS PR'd at only 22% damage. Bugger [:@]



fochinell -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/31/2007 4:09:14 PM)

29th January 1944. A: 15/570 (5aa), X: 5/142 (2gd).

MTO: Some fighter strikes on AF's in bad weather.

ETO: Bad weather again. A low-level mossie FB raid on Ford ARM at Antwerp gets jumped on the return leg, losing 7/12b.

30th January 1944. 174/3533 (34aa), X: 63/1272 (0gd). A day of mixed fortunes for the allies. Losses include 17 109G6, 19 Me410, 11 Lanc I, 22 Spit Vb, 20 Spit IX, 2 Spit XIV, 24 P-51B, 9 A-20C, 56 B-17G, 18 B-24J. High losses and a poor attrition rate for me redeemed by a couple of destructive bombing attacks.

MTO: The 15th AF send two forces of 128 bombers to aviation targets in Bavaria again. No opposition inbound, and Messerschmitt AFAC hit for 65% damage. The second force misses the primary of BMW Munchen yet again but hits the secondary, Freiham OILS for 100%. LW resistance takes the form of the usual flak-cripple hunt, with no combat against the escorts. 1/304f 18/256b 3e.

Various tactical strikes in Italy, with about half cancelled by the weather, and the Bostons taking heavy losses to Flak again.

ETO: The 8th send three forces of 100 B-17G's to aviation tagets south of Brunswick and Madgeburg. Combat follows the usual format of jumping returning escorts, cripple-hunting and some combat over Holland on the exit leg. Junkers EFAC 99%, Magdeburg Junkers EFAC 32% and AGO Oschersleben AFAC 50%. 26/665f 56/300b 43e.

The 9th AF Marauders come in to cover the withdrawl route, but see nil combat although they manage to cause 79% damage to Nordhafen RUBBER for once. 0/324f 2/64b 1e. The big fight is against the 2TAF Mitchells, who miss Welheim FUEL and take 39/327f 1/72b 25e - a bad day for the Spits [:(]. Tiffies hit Interescaut POWER 99% while some FB strikes on the VSITES do nothing against no resistance.

BC: 5 Group to Halle, taking a substantial number of damaged on the way in due to the difficulty of dodging flak nests in the route planning phase(roll on those new waypoints and some sane slant ranges for the Flak guns). 305 bombloads in the target area for 11/360b lost. As the Lanc losses suggest, the NJG are active for once, and the NI's only get 1 kill in return (plus a couple of crashes).

31st January 1944. A: 16/304 (7aa), X: 7/74 (0gd).

MTO: Some tac strikes in Italy, with the MC.202's coming off second best in a minor skirmish against some 15th AF P-38L's over the Adriatic.

ETO: Bad weather. Even BC get cancelled.




fochinell -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/31/2007 4:13:50 PM)

Now for the top-scoring Minions of Doom in January 1944.



[image]local://upfiles/18818/434A63FA038C4BBA8FAF4EF7CBD3F4CF.jpg[/image]



fochinell -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/31/2007 4:14:32 PM)

And here's the overall losses:



[image]local://upfiles/18818/8AA0A7E6555348799AB9C03D4A017E87.jpg[/image]



fochinell -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/31/2007 4:35:03 PM)

And did I hear you crying out for the stats? Calm yourselves, lads - here they are:

On the Allied side - strat bombing score down 700 pts to 4,863 (down to my concentration on EFAC/AFAC this month) and terror up to 152,973.

Overall: Allied sorties and losses were down to 2,081/46,734, or about 10% down on last month in both cases (2,238/50,300). The loss rate is static at 4.5% vs 4.4% last month. AA losses rose slightly to 597 vs 549 (29% vs 25%).

Within that, night bomber losses have risen (108 vs 69) and intruder losses are also up (34 vs 19). I blame these on increased NJG activity and higher Flak losses, respectively. Most importantly for me, the heavy bomber losses are down to 587 from 906, which is a relief as it has allowed me to re-equip the B-17F force with B-17G's in response to heavy losses. F losses are down to 291 from 416, but they're still taking the brunt of the attrition compared to the G's, who have dropped to 147 from 383. The increase in B-24J losses (149 vs 99) is down to the increase in 15th AF activity, but I still have plenty of them in hand for new 15th AF BG's and the 2nd Bomb Division in the 8th AF if necessary. Medium bomber losses are up slightly (270 vs 235) mostly down to an increase in B-25D losses (72 vs 43) while the other types have been reasonably stable.

On the fighter front, losses have increased, mostly down to some savage losses on AF strikes and sweeps coupled with OKL concentrating on returning escorts and tactical fighter raids. P-39 losses are up to 59 from 14 purely down to a couple of terrible AF sweeps. Spit Vb losses are relatively high considering their gradual removal from the battle (98 vs 115), while Spit IX losses have increased (144 vs 99). P-38 losses have actually decreased, with the H down to 39 from 88, and the L down to 94 from 186. Mostly this reflects the infrequency of heavy combat for the 15th AF units and the fact that the 8th AF P-38L's are used for deep-penetration target leg and return leg escorts which OKL has generally avoided contact with this month. The P-47D losses are up (320 vs 208), which is unsuprising as they've been the major combatants this month, although overall Thunderbolt losses are static giving the paltry loss of 1 P-47C by 80 Sqn in MAC against 96 in December when they were still heavily in use by the 12th AF. More concerning is the increase in P-51B losses (100 vs 35), most of which have not been down to combat with the 4 8th AF FG's equipped with them but concentrated on the 4 FC sqns which re-equipped with them this month. Mustang III losses have risen in tandem (38 vs 19) due to their use by the 9th AF RAF squadrons.

On the Axis side -

Overall: Axis losses and sorties declined to 1,127/19,452 from 1,503/20,790. The LW loss rate has declined to 5.8% from 7.2%. Ground losses dropped further to 24 from 47. So Werner's loss rate has declined more than his sortie rate, a growth in efficiency even when the decline in Allied losses is taken into account. KIA & MIA drop to 763 from 983, which is bad news to me, although this level of pilot attrition should still be enough to give him a problem.

Losses by type reveal the details of the decline in combat losses. Of the main fighter types, 109 G6 losses decline to 324 from 612, and 190A losses rise slightly to 257 from 205. The Zerstorers are also down to 228 from 318, while the Wilde Sau drop to 2 from 34 and the twin-engined NJG types to 22 from 86. Almost all of this can be accounted for by OKL's decision not to use the NJG types to defend against daylight attacks. Coupled with the decision to avoid the main escorts and cripple-hunt, this probably accounts for the improvement in OKL's efficiency this month.



wernerpruckner -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/31/2007 8:15:00 PM)

)and now the focus on the Luftwaffe:

Score still favors the LW [8D]

The major A/Cs of the LW are Bf109G6 ( + G6/R6 ) and the FW190A ( + A8/R8)....all JGs are using this variants at the moment. German school units sometimes use different A/C / even one that is still using Gavins favorite A/C - the D.520 [:'(] )

The Zerstörer forces are using a mix of Me410 and Bf110 ( one unit is using a Ju88 destroyer variant ) - some of them only use their guns and some others also are using additional rockets ( propelled granates... no real rockets yet ....but the Orkan R4/M will come [:)] )
The few active Schlacht units are using their own variants of the Fw190 - F and G....sometimes also equipped with additional rockets. But those units haven´t seen lots of air action latley.

My NF forces... the Wilde Sau is using the FW190 variant...the others ( Bf109) have been transfered to day fighter duty.
The main planes are the Bf110 and the Ju88, only a few Stab and Staffel sized units are using the He219. There is also a new variant of the NF Bf110 online - two Gruppen are using those...all older Bf110s will be replaced by the newer version in the next few months

Now my active pilots:


[image]local://upfiles/16527/81DE976171F0403EA09BBE49080ABA37.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/31/2007 8:16:33 PM)

and my wounded pilots - too many are wounded due to landing accidents [:(]

[image]local://upfiles/16527/E32B032FE866487798F243D5F6A18DB0.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/31/2007 8:19:05 PM)

overall industry:

[X(] just to tease Gavin [:'(]

Gavin is concentrating on my EFACs at the moment - but soon many replacement FACs will go online

[image]local://upfiles/16527/3C52AAFDEFE24F759ED8CAC915423981.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/31/2007 8:20:57 PM)

here the overview for the A/Cs used in my units at the moment:

[image]local://upfiles/16527/F0BE0A7B73EA48FD9CF404CE530CF564.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (10/31/2007 8:23:08 PM)

and as another teaser for Gavin a part of my production overview.

are the numbers so bad because of bombing - or did Swift turn the production onto newer A/Cs [sm=00000619.gif][sm=00000622.gif]

[image]local://upfiles/16527/394A7E6F17914C169794A731608FAF2D.jpg[/image]



fochinell -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (11/1/2007 12:01:46 PM)

And now the units:

8th AF: 20 BG plus 9 PFF dets B-17G, 9 BG B-17F. 4 FG's P-47D, 5 FG's P-38L, 4 P-51B, 3 sqns Mustang III. Leading units 56th FG P-47D - 179 kills, 55th FG P-39L - 157, 355th FG - 149. Leading P-51B unit 4th FG - 104, leading RAF sqn 19 Sqn - 77.

9th AF: 2 BG plus 3 PFF dets B-26G, 4 BG B-26B. 7 FG's P-47D, 3 sqns Mustang III. Leading units 358th FG and 354th FG - 83, 362nd FG - 64. Leading RAF unit 66 Sqn - 14.

2TAF: 11 sqn Typhoon, 3 sqn Hurri II, 6 sqn Mossie FB.VI, 3 sqn B-25D, 3 sqn B-25J, 3 sqn Spit VB, 14 sqn Spit IX, 3 sqn Spit XIV, 3 sqn P-51B (converting). Lead units 402 RCAF Sqn - 43, 421 RCAF and 132 Sqn - 35 (all Spit IX), 302 Polish Sqn Spit VB - 31, 610 Sqn Spit XIV - 31.

FC: 1 sqn Typhoon, 4 sqn P-51B. Lead units 350 and 501 Sqns - 5.

BC: 11 sqn Halifax II, 13 sqn Halifax III, 22 sqn Lanc I, 15 sqn + 1 det Lanc III (please absorb the ABC Lancs into 101 Sqn, HS!), 3 sqn Mossie B.IV, 3 sqn Mossie B.XVI.

The UK-based NF's: 4 sqn Mossie NF.XII, lead unit 141 Sqn - 21. 8 sqn + 5 det Mossie NF.II, lead units 68 Sqn - 35 and 605 Sqn - 25.

15th AF: 14 BG B-24J, 22 sqn P-38L. Lead units 95th FS - 62, 308th FS - 59, 307th FS - 49.

12th AF: 2 BG A-20G, 6 BG A-20C, 4 FG P-38H. Lead units 33rd FG - 35, 81st FG - 20. 4 FG P-47D lead unit 57th FG - 21.

MAC: 4 sqn B-25D, 4 sqn Baltimore, 1 sqn Mossie FB.VI, 2 sqn Hurri II. 1 sqn P-47C, 3 sqn P-39, 8 sqn P-40, 20 sqn Spit IX. Lead units all Spit IX; 145 Sqn - 21, 601 Sqn - 16, 111 Sqn - 15.

205 Group: 7 sqn + 1 det Halifax II.

more to follow...



wernerpruckner -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (11/2/2007 3:03:56 PM)

German and Italian top units:
[ all Gruppen with 100+ kills, all Staffeln with 40+ kills and all Stab units with 30+ kills ]

Fw190A:
Stab/JG 53 53 kills
Stab/JG 27 44 kills
Stab/JG 26 35 kills
Stab/JG 2 36 kills
8/JG 26 60 kills
10/JG 11 68 kills
I/JG 1 185 kills
II/JG 1  222
I/JG 2  237
III/JG 2  184
IV/JG 3  122
I/JG 4  202
I/JG 26  272
II/JG 26  166

Bf109G-6:
JGr 50  40
11/JG 26  46
III/JG 1  138
II/JG 2  105
I/JG 3  100
II/JG 3  132
III/JG 3  126
III/JG 26  147
I/JG 301  100
18 Gruppo CT  132

Bf109G-6/R6
3 Gruppo CT  140

G55I
8Gruppo CT  70

Bf110G-2
11/ZG 26  75
I/ZG 76  100

Me410A-2/R2
Stab ZG 76  32
III/ZG 26  142
I/ZG 76  126


and my best NF unit:
II/NJG 6 using Bf110G-4 with 40 kills



fochinell -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (11/5/2007 3:43:18 PM)

And the ass-kicking continues...

1st February 1944. A: 98/2339 (30aa), X: 77/846 (0gd). 33 Bf109G6, 7 Me410, 25 P-47D, 37 B-17F.

MTO: Some tac strikes vs RR.

ETO: The 8th do zero damage to BMW Eisenach EFAC. No combat inbound, with seperated BG's taking punishment on the return. Some kills for the escorts to balance the usual returning escort-jumping, though. 21/406f 37/160b 30e.

The tactical medium bomber supporting raids are split into two forces of 32 and 24 bombers each, which seems to spread the incoming escorts coverage out and improve their effectiveness. Zero bombing damage, though. The 9th AF manage 9/325f 8/64b 35e and 2TAF 4/275f 2/48b 25e. Tiffies miss Tilburg RR and hit Ablassadam OILR for 68%.

BC: 6 Group to Mulheim, 3/336b and 0/12b Mossie supporters. About two-thirds of the bombloads on target, with no NJG activity.

2nd February 1944. A: 74/1702 (24aa), X: 29/543 (2gd).

MTO: 15th AF sent two forces to aviation sites in Bavaria again. Munich Dornier AFAC 14% and the second force misses primary and secondary, dumping bombs on Insterburg AF on the way home. Some fighting for the first force sees 19/288f 26/190b 32e. Various tac raids in Italy do little.

ETO: Weather.

BC: 1 Group to Dortmund get all their bombloads in the target area, for 0/292b and 0/8b for the Oboe Mossie support. The NJG are active, but get zero for 5 NI claims. Oh yeah [:)].

3rd February 1944. A: 44/2733 (15aa), X: 12/170 (1gd).

MTO: Some tac F strikes.

ETO: 3 forces of 100 B-17G to aviation industry targets around Stuttgart. Daimler-Benz EFAC 14%, Junker Juno Jet EFAC 45% and Klemm AFAC 99%. Resistance is confined to a cripple-hunt on the return leg. 0/691f 15/300b 1e. The 9th AF Marauders hit Bitburg RR 40%, Thionville RR 11% against no resistance. 0/288f 0/64b 0e. The 2TAF Mitchells hit John Cockerill STEEL 38% and Michelin RUBBER 15% while the French-based LW fighters take a belated interest. 7/302f 1/48b 9e. Tiffies to Tavaux AF, Courcelles STEEL 29%, and Sottevast VSITE 99%.

BC: 3 Group go to Mannheim for a good raid, 6/216b, but no NI claims. PR shows Dortmund RR 89% but Halle 29%. 205 Group bomb the fields outside Campia in Roumania, 0/172b.

4th February 1944. A: 46/1488 (28aa), X: 19/146 (0gd).

MTO: 15th AF vs Bavarian targets again. Some skirmishes but poor bombing. Zeppelin EFAC 0%, Manzell Jet EFAC 20%. 2/284f 5/192b 6e. The usual tactical stuff, with the MAC escorts to Baltimores doing better than usual hitting the port outside Trieste, 2/122f 2/36b 6e. The 12th AF Bostons do their usual job of absorbing 88mm Flak shells for no return, losing 11 A-20C today.

ETO: Even BC grounded by weather.

5th February 1944. Rest day.

6th February 1944. A: 139/1915 (13aa), X: 62/1344 (1gd). 26 Bf109G6, 22 Zerstorer, 14 Spit IX, 34 P-47D, 9 B-26G and 73 B-17G.

MTO: Tac F strikes creeping around between the clouds. The only interest is the 15th AF P-38L's attacking Venice RR, and getting into combat with some Adriatic MC.202's on the return, 2/48f 2e.

ETO: A disasterous raid by a small force of 8th AF B-17F's to BMW Spandau EFAC. The usual escort jumping with the P-47's refusing to defend themselves - check today's Thunderbolt losses to see what I mean [:@] . Zero damage to the target, and the force splits on the return, exposing most of the force to attack between Berlin and Bremen while lead group takes the planned route home north of Hamburg with all of the escort. I'd be upset but these idiots really do deserve to die for being so stupid. [sm=00000018.gif] 32/429f 73/96b 57e.

The tac mediums attack around Liege as the planned return leg for the 8th was too far north. The 9th hit Liege RR 31% with a single force in the first B-26G operation for 2/214f 9/67b 2e. So much for the PFF lead units. 2TAF do slightly better, with the Mitchells getting Michelin RUBBER 60% and Brussels RR 22% for 8/183f 1/48b 13e. I think this was the first op for the B-25J as well. The Tiffie strikes actually see the Spit escorts get involved for once, to my suprise, and get a total of 6/139f 0/48b 17e, for Ford ARM 60% and Ghent RR 37%.

BC: 4 Group to Dortmund-Herne PORT get 80% of their bombloads in the target area despite a delayed start which saw their Mossie Oboe support attack too far ahead of them. 1/240b and 0/12b for the mossies. PR reveals Magdeburg RR 41% (hit by 5 Group ages ago) and Mannheim RR 95% from the recent 3 Group raid.

7th February 1944. A: 48/1137 (14aa), X: 18/170 (1gd).

MTO: The 15th AF attack oil targets around Ploesti for the crappiest bombing results of all time. Five groups of 64 bombers each manage to do the grand total of 4% damage to one of the targets. Yes, that's all. Time to shoot some 15th AF bombardiers or send them to 205 Group where they'll fit in without any trouble. I'm assuming it was weather, as morale, fatigue and opposition don't seem to be significant. The 12th AF use their new A-20G's but can't manage to do anything with them, losing 12/64b attacking SIAP OILS near Trieste. MAC do well with escorted Mitchells attacking AF's north of Milan, probably because the jinxed fighter strikes to those targets which were designed to support them get cancelled. 2/129f 1/48b 9e.

ETO: Weather.

BC: 5 Group get cancelled, while the LNSF ignore the weather to get 0/36b on their Berlin supporting raid.



fochinell -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (11/5/2007 9:21:50 PM)

8th February 1944. A: 27/2336 (11aa), X: 9/241 (0gd). Action confined to the night this turn, with 16 Lanc I lost for 5 Wilde Sau and 3 Tame Sau.

MTO: 15th AF send a single force to Milan RR 81% for 1/96f 1/96b 0e. The 12th AF A-20's hit Brescia RR 78%, which is the most substantial damage the Bostons have done in aeons. The usual tac F raids in Italy otherwise.

ETO: The 8th send a single force to Duren AFAC 99%, no resistance. 0/168f 0/96b 0e. 9th AF Marauders hit Englebert Cie RUBBER 99% and Fabrique d'Armes ARM 35%, 0/288f 0/64b 0e. 2TAF Mitchells hit Prouvy AF and Lambrsart STEEL 73%, 0/247f 0/48b 0e. Tiffies hit SASIC RUBBER 70% and Brussels RR 33%, no combat.

BC: 5 Group go to Halle, with the bombing split between Halle and Merseberg as a result of an approach from the south made in the hope of doing some RR damage in contrast to the last few raids from the north. NJG suprisingly active, and the Lancs lose 16/360b, the highest losses for a while, but the NI's get 8 kills in response. The LNSF mossies get 0/12b over Berlin. Dortmund PR'd at 87%.



Alfred -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (11/7/2007 6:10:34 AM)

Swift,

Am I correct in assuming that 3, 8 and 18 Gruppi CT remained with you after the Italian surrender.  Were there any other Italian units who continue the fight (you seem to have at least 4 indigenous Italian plane models still flying).

Alfred



fochinell -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (11/7/2007 12:38:09 PM)

9th February 1944. A: 23/926 (16aa), X: 0/67 (0gd). The LW are in hiding.

MTO: The 15th attack Dunai AFAC for no result, 0/192f 4/96b 0e. The usual tactical raids on Italian RR.

ETO: Bad weather.

BC: 6 Group to Essen, 6/336b, with the LNSF support cancelled. No NI claims.

10th February 1944. A: 7/544 (2aa), X: 0/46 (0gd). [>:]

MTO: A typical bad weather day (low, thick cloud with more threatening to move down from the north-west during the day). Tac F strikes on the usual targets (Italian RR), nothing exciting.

ETO: Weather.

BC: 205 Group raid Vienna, getting most of their bombs in the city area or the Josefstadt suburb. All I needed was a target big enough for them to hit. [:)] Some NJG activity, but no losses. 0/172b.



Charest -> RE: AAR swift vs fochinell (11/7/2007 1:33:14 PM)

It's been basically 6 months of action now. Could you try some comparison with other AARs to see who is holding the upper hand, which points are good or bad at this time for axis and allies? I would really like to have a little analysis of what's going on on the big picture.

The idea I get is that it was pretty even in the first 4 or 5 months but right now, Fochinell seems to have difficulties to keep up. The LW seems to be still able to inflict huge losses to the air groups without paying too much blood and the industry is far from crippled. The terror score is rising though.

For Swift, I do not think he did any significant research, but some new aircraft should be almost arriving by now. And I really don't understand the NJG tactic. Why invest so much in HE 219 or JU 88, if the NJG activity is NIL? You will finally retaliate with good planes, or you wanted to stick to "reality" but without bothering about NJG, because the ratio effort/losses/time is not worth it?




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