Still no cancel button on menus! (Full Version)

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LarryP -> Still no cancel button on menus! (7/19/2007 9:57:22 PM)

I complained about this a year ago and it is still not in the game. When you go into the menu to replace the commander, there is no cancel button to change your mind. No matter what, it will replace the present commander with whoever is highlighted. There is a "Replace" button which should be relied upon to actually go through with the replacement. There is also an "X" to back out of the menu but that does the same as the "Replace" button. What gives?! The menus without a "Cancel" button that works are worthless to me. [:@]

One year ago next month (August 2006) I was playing this game having to save each time before I went into a menu. Then when leaving a menu, if I did not want the changes forced upon me, I would reload the saved game. I finally gave up due to this being a real pain to play. It's the same now after this new update 1.08.

I just went back into the game and the cancel button on the Recruitment menu doesn't work either. Oh it backs out of the menu OK, but it does NOT cancel what I did. Why even have the cancel buttons on your menus?! This game is unplayable to me still. I complained about these lack of features a year ago. Did anybody listen? NO! [:@][&:]



mmccot -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/20/2007 1:08:40 AM)

I just replace leader, then assign the regement I want. If I replace leader without choosing the troops, your back to the default leader. I have replaced leader, & regiment and changed my mind too. In which case I transferd troops in Manage army screen to other leader in the stack. No cost for influence unless influential leader. Tool tip will let you know. 



LarryP -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/20/2007 5:22:55 AM)

It still doesn't fix the original problem. I can't believe that a comprehensive update can be released, a sale employed at 35% off, and the menus are without a cancel button that works right.

EDIT: I originally said above that this game is garbage, and I am sorry for saying this, I was mad at the time and should have said that "this game is unplayable for me." [&o]



HussarGames -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/26/2007 2:47:18 PM)

It will NOT replace the commander if you exit with the button marked 'X'.

Recruitment is final however, you cannot cancel it. Do others see this a problem as well? We had no complaints about this, but if this is an issue for many people we will try to come up with something.

Hope this helps.



LarryP -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/26/2007 5:02:45 PM)

I complained about this a year ago when I bought this game originally. Why even call it a Cancel button if it won't cancel your previous actions?! The Windows interface and all other games I have ever owned let you cancel out of a menu after any choices you made.



mmccot -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/26/2007 5:53:21 PM)

There is a cancel last move button on menu. As far as I know after selection of leader and regement there is no cancel. You can replace with another leader but it will cost influence. Move army's to same hex to transfer regements.



Ike99 -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/26/2007 7:14:48 PM)

quote:

Larry-This game is a piece of garbage.


I like it.[:D]

I haven`t noticed what you mean exactly Larry. Your saying you want to be able to pick a new leader and assign him units and then cancel everything out?

This is what I do....



[image]local://upfiles/19240/9D189487309740FF9C6BCAC84DE1D633.jpg[/image]



Venator -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/26/2007 7:48:27 PM)

This game is most certainly not 'garbage'. There's a couple of tweaks that would be nice but if you find them game breaking then I'd suggest snap. Or perhaps draughts if you're feeling daring.

Personally I'm a bit sad that Hussar have been so thin on the ground since the move to Matrix - at Battlefront they were very active indeed. I'm also sad that the 1.80 patch took a while to come. But the game is one of the best three wargames I've bought in the past couple of years and is probably the most enjoyable.



LarryP -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/26/2007 7:55:28 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Venator

This game is most certainly not 'garbage'. There's a couple of tweaks that would be nice but if you find them game breaking then I'd suggest snap. Or perhaps draughts if you're feeling daring.

Personally I'm a bit sad that Hussar have been so thin on the ground since the move to Matrix - at Battlefront they were very active indeed. I'm also sad that the 1.80 patch took a while to come. But the game is one of the best three wargames I've bought in the past couple of years and is probably the most enjoyable.


Good, I'm glad you enjoy it. I really am. I played this game for many days last year and enjoyed it very much. I had to turn off SLI and put up with the menus not cancelling actions, but I had fun for a while. Then I got tired of having to reload saved games to change back to what the open menus changed.



LarryP -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/26/2007 7:59:47 PM)

Ike;

I appreciate you doing so much work to explain the Cancel button. I did not quote because it would take so much space. However, the Recruitment menu for one, if I open it up and do anything, then Cancel or "X" out the changes did not discard but they applied to the game. More than one menu does this. I have played this game off and on (more off) for over a year and these menus do not abort any changes you made by choosing the "X" button.

I hope I explained it better.

I am sorry for saying this game is garbage, it is not and I am going above and removing that line I made. To me however I won't play it because of the "X" buttons. I can't open menus without whatever changed sticking.



LarryP -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/26/2007 8:38:28 PM)

OK. I went back into the game and here is what I have documented so I won't make any mistakes:

1) Options menu at start of game has "X" button and you have to keep any settings, you can't abort them.

2) Recruitment menu. If you select Recruit then you cannot abort your selections with the "X" button. You CAN view the options like Ike showed above, but once you select anything, you are stuck with it.

3) Influence menu. If you choose Select then you cannot abort your change with the "X" button.

4) Options menu inside game. Whatever changes you make you cannot abort with the "X" button.

5) Save menu from Options menu inside game. You have to eneter a filename, and cannot abort opening this menu without entering a filename. The "X" button does NOT abort opening this menu.

I personally have never seen a Windows program of any kind NOT have a Cancel button to abort any changes.



Ike99 -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/26/2007 9:34:00 PM)

quote:

Ike;

I appreciate you doing so much work to explain the Cancel button.


Well...pressing a couple keys on a computer and moving a mouse isn`t exactly like digging a ditch. [:D]

Yeah your right though. Once you do change a leader or recruit a unit you can´t undo it.

It`s a done deal.

Hmmm...well you can do it but you´ll be penalised like that guy was saying before.



LarryP -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/26/2007 9:40:56 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ike99

Well...pressing a couple keys on a computer and moving a mouse isn`t exactly like digging a ditch. [:D]

Yeah your right though. Once you do change a leader or recruit a unit you can´t undo it.

It`s a done deal.

Hmmm...well you can do it but you´ll be penalised like that guy was saying before.


You did an excellent job above of showing me just what to do, and I had that in my head when I opened For Liberty. Yoo have truly mastered posting images on here!

I suppose with what Hussar said above, unless more pople complain about this it won't get changed. Oh well, I have plenty of other games with menus that work like they should. [:D]



James Ward -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/26/2007 9:53:59 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: LarryP

Oh well, I have plenty of other games with menus that work like they should. [:D]


Perhaps the menu's work exactly like they should. If that is the way the game is designed I don't see why you would say it doesn't work. It just doesn't work they way you would like it to. Perhaps you should be asking for an 'improvement' in the way it works not posting it doesn't work at all.
I've changed leaders many times by accident. It's not like the program did it to me on a whim, I just wasn't paying attention to what I was doing.



LarryP -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/26/2007 10:04:54 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: James Ward

Perhaps the menu's work exactly like they should. If that is the way the game is designed I don't see why you would say it doesn't work. It just doesn't work they way you would like it to. Perhaps you should be asking for an 'improvement' in the way it works not posting it doesn't work at all.
I've changed leaders many times by accident. It's not like the program did it to me on a whim, I just wasn't paying attention to what I was doing.


I'm sure they work the way they should AND the way they were designed. Most mistakes are made just that way.

One thing I am learning this week more and more. That is to just go and play whatever game I like and just shut-up. I could point out a bug and someone would come along and say they like the bug. These newsgroup postings are becoming a bad habit.

I am a software programmer that works from home and I know that if I designed menus to work like they do in Liberty, I would have no customers left. However, that's just my opinion I guess and I should probably have not even answered your post.



Venator -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/26/2007 10:09:01 PM)

To be honest Larry if you had posted your complaint in a less aggressive fashion I'd have thought it fair enough. It is possible to accidently swap and it is a wee bit irritating to have no cancel option. As I said though, your initial comment was a bit over the top. The menus seem okay to me otherwise though and losing a few influence points isn't the end of the world for me - just a tad annoying.



James Ward -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/26/2007 10:32:57 PM)

"I'm sure they work the way they should AND the way they were designed. Most mistakes are made just that way."

Then it's not a mistake. It may not be the best way to do it but ....

"I could point out a bug and someone would come along and say they like the bug."

Do you really consider it a bug?

"I am a software programmer that works from home and I know that if I designed menus to work like they do in Liberty, I would have no customers left."

Perhaps Hussar is happy to take the customers who don't particularly like the way you do things [;)]



James Ward -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/26/2007 10:35:16 PM)

"The menus seem okay to me otherwise though and losing a few influence points isn't the end of the world for me - just a tad annoying."

Considering he knows how they work it does seem odd that he would keep hammering at it.
They put the steering wheel on the wrong side of the car in the UK but I wouldn't go saying it is a 'bug'. It's just the way they do it.



Ike99 -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/27/2007 12:12:58 AM)

quote:

Or perhaps draughts if you're feeling daring.


What is ¨draughts¨??

What does that mean?? [&:]



LarryP -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/27/2007 12:21:46 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: James Ward

"I could point out a bug and someone would come along and say they like the bug."

Do you really consider it a bug?


I didn't say that. I was pointing out that what one person considers a problem, another person may like it. That's what has seemed to go on for over a year with this menu situation. That's the way newsgroups are.

I consider it a bad design. Would you like it if Windows menus were all like that? Users of computer programs ALL make choices in menus they don't want to keep. You however have found a way to make it sound like having a choice to change your mind in a menu is a bad thing.



LarryP -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/27/2007 12:25:23 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Venator

To be honest Larry if you had posted your complaint in a less aggressive fashion I'd have thought it fair enough. It is possible to accidently swap and it is a wee bit irritating to have no cancel option. As I said though, your initial comment was a bit over the top. The menus seem okay to me otherwise though and losing a few influence points isn't the end of the world for me - just a tad annoying.


Less aggressive?! You must be new to newsgroups if you think my first post above is aggressive. [X(] I admit that it was not as passive as my first ones a year ago but aggressive? No.



Venator -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/27/2007 12:29:33 AM)



Well I don't think that calling a game 'garbage' because there is one mildly irritating feature in an otherwise decent game is exactly mild mannered. But that's just me. And you did recant. So no hard feelings on my part.



LarryP -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/27/2007 12:45:09 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Venator

Well I don't think that calling a game 'garbage' because there is one mildly irritating feature in an otherwise decent game is exactly mild mannered. But that's just me. And you did recant. So no hard feelings on my part.


Why would there be any hard feelings on your part anyway? I did not offend you. Some people act like their mother was trash talked when someone finds fault with a game they play. I couldn't care less how bad you find fault with games I play. It won't offend me.

How is calling a computer game "garbage" make a person NOT mild mannered?!

To me when menus won't let you back out of any decisions you made inside of them, the game is a pain. I really regret ever mentioning this because it has gone from the menu situation to a personal one.



Ike99 -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/27/2007 1:18:57 AM)

quote:

EDIT: I originally said above that this game is garbage, and I am sorry for saying this, I was mad at the time and should have said that "this game is unplayable for me."


[:D][:D][:D]

Are you serious Larry?

I mean can´t you just be careful when you recruit your Regiments and make sure they are the ones you want before you click the button?

I remember as a kid pushing 600 little cardboard counters around stacked 8 high on a paper map hoping the cat wouldn`t knock them over before we finished the game.

[:D]Now THAT was ¨unplayable¨[:D]

This is a dream compared to that.



LarryP -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/27/2007 1:26:11 AM)

Ike;

I've had it with posting here. I am sorry for ever saying a single word about any of this. It has turned into a personal issue now. I don't care if SLI doesn't work. I don't care about the menus anymore either.

I said that "this game is unplayable for me." "Me." You can compare it to your unplayable things in life, but I said it was "unplayable for me." This has really gotten out of context. I am not posting anymore here so have at it.



Ike99 -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/27/2007 7:55:24 AM)

quote:

Ike;

I've had it with posting here. I am sorry for ever saying a single word about any of this. It has turned into a personal issue now. I don't care if SLI doesn't work. I don't care about the menus anymore either.

I said that "this game is unplayable for me." "Me." You can compare it to your unplayable things in life, but I said it was "unplayable for me." This has really gotten out of context. I am not posting anymore here so have at it.


Hi Larry how are you?

Well from other things you have said on here about ¨For Liberty¨ it seems you like the game though yes?

You just don´t like it not having a cancel button yes? Myself...I haven´t noticed it but Venator said...
quote:

Well I don't think that calling a game 'garbage' because there is one mildly irritating feature

so someone else shares your opinion about not have a ¨undo¨...¨cancel¨ button, whatever you want to call it.

Anyways my point is, if I liked a game yet it didn`t have a cancel button that could cancel my changes after I made them I would just be careful about making my changes before I did them.

But your right, this is just me. The games unplayable without this for you so that's the way it is with ¨For Liberty¨

But I wouldn´t stop posting here because of this. Hussar is still making games it seems. Maybe it's too late to get a cancel button for Liberty the way you want but probably not for their next game. Maybe it's not too late for Liberty actually. Hussar did just post here....

quote:

...but if this is an issue for many people we will try to come up with something.


....so maybe if you explain yourself very well and put sugar on top you might get what your wanting. [:D]

Anyways...if I felt so strongly about this as you seem I would try to explain myself as a current and future potential customer so I could get what I want in a game.

About that SLI thing...I don´t have this but my understanding is this links video cards together to get really fast frame rates for detailed 3D games. Flight simulators, shoot up games, games like this.

I think it`s pretty safe to assume this is not needed with ¨Liberty¨[:D]and I understand you can turn it off and the game works...so who cares if it works with SLI anyways? [&:]

I don`t, if people can turn their SLI off and the game works what`s the problem? [&:]









James Ward -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/27/2007 2:59:57 PM)

"I consider it a bad design."

I can understand that but it doesn't seem to be a really big problem. It does work.

"You however have found a way to make it sound like having a choice to change your mind in a menu is a bad thing."

It's not a bad thing but hey wrong choices can be considered part of the game too.
It's not like you are stuck with a leader you didn't want forever. And you can always get rid of excess troops over the course of the 200+ turns [:)]



LarryP -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/27/2007 5:19:44 PM)

Ike;

Thank you for posting a NICE reply. I never want to disgruntle anybody in these forums, except sometimes a developer who I feel is not giving a good enough product.

I don't want Liberty to work in SLI mode for any other reason than this: If you do not remember each time when you load the game, to turn OFF SLI, then you get the blue screen of death. I mean your PC locks up so tight that you have to turn it off. I got so tired of this happening. They tried for a while to fix it.

My original postings at Battlefront I believe it was (a year ago) I was very kind with the cancel button issue. I guess the 30% sale, the 1.08 update that was messed up, and several days of nobody supporting the game irritated me. Others were irritated too but I seem to be the one that is getting hammered on.

From now on I am not going to ever post anything in the support sections no matter how bad a game is. My nerves have had it. I really am not a bad person...[;)]

Thanks Ike, you were very kind.

EDIT: Yes, I like the game. It is a great game for that period of time and they worked hard on it.



LarryP -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/27/2007 5:22:04 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: James Ward

"I consider it a bad design."

I can understand that but it doesn't seem to be a really big problem. It does work.

"You however have found a way to make it sound like having a choice to change your mind in a menu is a bad thing."

It's not a bad thing but hey wrong choices can be considered part of the game too.
It's not like you are stuck with a leader you didn't want forever. And you can always get rid of excess troops over the course of the 200+ turns [:)]


Okay okay okay. Gosh, can you let it go??? [&:]



HussarGames -> RE: Still no cancel button on menus! (7/27/2007 9:04:52 PM)

The button marked 'X' is NOT cancel. It is not cancel in Windows either. It simply closes the window - as the hint clearly states as well. Whatever action you do is performed by another button. This is consistent in the game.



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