RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (Full Version)

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Peter Stauffenberg -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/30/2007 10:49:38 AM)

 Is disorganized the same as what we called "flipped" in WIFFE? You can become flipped after ground strikes, combat results where you don't get an asterisk result (*) etc. You use an HQ during an impuse to unflip units or you use oil at the end of the turn to unflip units.  Is this the same as disorganization?  I guess the MWIF units don't flip and show a reverse counter side.



Froonp -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/30/2007 10:57:42 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Borger Borgersen

 Is disorganized the same as what we called "flipped" in WIFFE? You can become flipped after ground strikes, combat results where you don't get an asterisk result (*) etc. You use an HQ during an impuse to unflip units or you use oil at the end of the turn to unflip units.  Is this the same as disorganization?  I guess the MWIF units don't flip and show a reverse counter side.

Yes. Disorganized = Flipped = Face Down.
This is consistent with the HQ re-organizing.



Neilster -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/30/2007 12:03:53 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Borger Borgersen

Is disorganized the same as what we called "flipped" in WIFFE? You can become flipped after ground strikes, combat results where you don't get an asterisk result (*) etc. You use an HQ during an impuse to unflip units or you use oil at the end of the turn to unflip units. Is this the same as disorganization? I guess the MWIF units don't flip and show a reverse counter side.

Disorganized units will be shown using the status indicators.

Cheers, Neilster



bredsjomagnus -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/30/2007 12:53:20 PM)

In tutorail page 8 it says that the defending Italians have 4 combat factors instead of 9. Shouldnīt that be 4 combat factors instead of 8?


/Magnus



Darken -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/30/2007 1:59:13 PM)

Greetings,

perhaps You could change the seven buttons on the right top of the tutorials like this?

[image]local://upfiles/12474/95E134E65E2344078A5E8F7CF91C5CDB.jpg[/image]

Thanks for Your interest.



Peter Stauffenberg -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/30/2007 6:13:27 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darken
Greetings,

perhaps You could change the seven buttons on the right top of the tutorials like this?

[image]local://upfiles/12474/95E134E65E2344078A5E8F7CF91C5CDB.jpg[/image]

Thanks for Your interest.


Good idea. [:)] The way you show the buttons is more intuitive. But I wonder if Steve has created a lot of diffent forms with the names, symbols and shapes the same way as for the buttons used in the tutorials. That means it's a lot of work to change them.

The most important thing is to have a consistent use of dialog boxes, buttons, names etc. I have no problems getting used to almost anything as long as I can expect all the forms to look similar.

The forms were created and discussed on the forum a long time ago (more than 1 year ago). The reason for that was to agree upon a standard way of creating all the forms Steve needed to create. Now that work is finished based upon what we agreed upon that time. But it's never too late to change things if there is a very good reason to do so. Only Steve can answer whether it's feasible or not to change the buttons to be similar to your suggestion.






Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/30/2007 7:34:22 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darken
Greetings,

perhaps You could change the seven buttons on the right top of the tutorials like this?

[image]local://upfiles/12474/95E134E65E2344078A5E8F7CF91C5CDB.jpg[/image]

Thanks for Your interest.

I hadn't considered that. It wouldn't be difficult to change.

However, ...

I prefer words to symbols. That is probably inconsiderate of the non-English speakers.[:(]

Though I understand these symbols, I only just learned them in the last year, and I am still not real comfortable with them. Since I work with computers continuously (and have done so for decades), I wonder if less experienced computer users would know what they mean.

I arranged the buttons so it would be easiest to click on Next Page. I expect that button to be selected 6-8 times more often than all the others combined and by isolating it, I prevent unintended clicks on the others.

I think I'll leave this as is. But it is good for me to be exposed to other viewpoints and possiblities, so thank you for your suggestion.



composer99 -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/30/2007 7:46:22 PM)

A comment on the Supply Tutorial page with the CW set up to blow away the Italians in Sardinia:

Either on that page, or perhaps earlier in the tutorial, the abbrevation OOS should be introduced as standing for out of supply.



Froonp -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/30/2007 7:54:38 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darken
perhaps You could change the seven buttons on the right top of the tutorials like this?
[image]local://upfiles/12474/95E134E65E2344078A5E8F7CF91C5CDB.jpg[/image]

I like these.
Lots of webpages have similar buttons already, they are clear for me in their meaning.
A tooltips can also write a text that will remove any doubt if there are.



bredsjomagnus -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/30/2007 8:14:57 PM)

With the risk of being nagging...
quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

Second and last in series.

[image]local://upfiles/16701/1D5750AEF13F47FE94829DEEE696EDAB.jpg[/image]


Doesnīt the Italian 5-3 and 3-1 unit togheter become 8? Or is there a rule I donīt know of?

/Magnus



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/30/2007 10:09:49 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bredsjomagnus

With the risk of being nagging...


Doesnīt the Italian 5-3 and 3-1 unit togheter become 8? Or is there a rule I donīt know of?

/Magnus

It looked like a 6-1 to me. Patrice?



Froonp -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/30/2007 10:16:19 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

quote:

ORIGINAL: bredsjomagnus

With the risk of being nagging...


Doesnīt the Italian 5-3 and 3-1 unit togheter become 8? Or is there a rule I donīt know of?

/Magnus

It looked like a 6-1 to me. Patrice?

This is the all mighty Italian XVth GARR Corps, which is a 5-1 from 1940 from countersheet 4 [:D]



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/31/2007 5:46:49 AM)

We have been making some changes so here are the first 10 pages (some new, some old, some revised).

[image]local://upfiles/16701/25CA3BBFB3C54EB8B96FABF713ACEE57.jpg[/image]



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/31/2007 5:48:08 AM)

Obviously the new items are the abstracts.

[image]local://upfiles/16701/BD463B76ACB549FDBB3167C087BCFDB9.jpg[/image]



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/31/2007 5:49:54 AM)

Nothing new here. it's included for completeness.

[image]local://upfiles/16701/9936AF52747747F093E9D92E075AE1AC.jpg[/image]



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/31/2007 5:51:13 AM)

I defined OOS in the text.

[image]local://upfiles/16701/D7D1A496F10D41788E239147FCCEE8A0.jpg[/image]



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/31/2007 5:52:34 AM)

The abstract does good work here.

[image]local://upfiles/16701/36117885913C4111BC66DD85434D7449.jpg[/image]



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/31/2007 5:54:43 AM)

Patrice took all the screen shots, including the abstract graphics. [&o][&o][&o][&o]
(Perhaps he'll rotate the text for us[;)]).

[image]local://upfiles/16701/3437AA4CEB514BF8ACF31A1B8249CD27.jpg[/image]



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/31/2007 5:56:20 AM)

I believe this is unchanged from previously.

[image]local://upfiles/16701/072F588D743746F6A4196089A1F59ACE.jpg[/image]



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/31/2007 5:57:47 AM)

Here the abstract helps too.


[image]local://upfiles/16701/F87E919E82384E1085536BA95880E44F.jpg[/image]



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/31/2007 5:59:56 AM)

This one is brand new. Patrice is asleep now (4:50 AM in Marseilles) or I would wait for him to add the isolated status indicators for th e2 USA units.

[image]local://upfiles/16701/A6B816B6B24442FF8A0095FC4DE65616.jpg[/image]



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/31/2007 6:02:18 AM)

10 and last in the series. There are 2 more pages to go. Actually the 12th is already done and its a doozy. But I want to wait for the 11th and show them in order.

[image]local://upfiles/16701/AD454E1A75E84302A3B2B61D326970D8.jpg[/image]



wosung -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/31/2007 10:20:28 AM)

Very good, the abstract graphics incorporated in the tutorials!

This is much better than just highlightening the key concepts in the text.

Regards



Peter Stauffenberg -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/31/2007 4:10:30 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

Nothing new here. it's included for completeness.

[image]local://upfiles/16701/9936AF52747747F093E9D92E075AE1AC.jpg[/image]


I'm looking at the example from Libya and wonder if all the Italian units are out of supply because Italy doesn't have any convoys, TRS's, amphs etc. in the Sea Zone bordering Tobruk. Is that the reason why they are out of supply? If so then it might be a good idea to mention that Italy has no sea supply.

Instinctively I would think that units at the coast and close to a port would be in supply so it necessary to explain why this is not the case here.

But again it's possible I'm rusty in understanding the supply rules I've overlooked something. [:D]



Toed -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/31/2007 4:38:35 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

This one is brand new. Patrice is asleep now (4:50 AM in Marseilles) or I would wait for him to add the isolated status indicators for th e2 USA units.

[image]local://upfiles/16701/A6B816B6B24442FF8A0095FC4DE65616.jpg[/image]

Looks good. Just spotted a spelling error in the 2nd paragraph (suplpy instead of supply).



composer99 -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/31/2007 7:17:57 PM)

The new pages & abstracts look real nice.



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/31/2007 7:46:13 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Toed


quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

This one is brand new. Patrice is asleep now (4:50 AM in Marseilles) or I would wait for him to add the isolated status indicators for th e2 USA units.

[image]local://upfiles/16701/A6B816B6B24442FF8A0095FC4DE65616.jpg[/image]

Looks good. Just spotted a spelling error in the 2nd paragraph (suplpy instead of supply).

I typed that wrong so many times I now think of it as supplemental supply.



Jimm -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/31/2007 8:47:39 PM)

These look excellent.

Supply is one of the most difficult bits of the game to get your head around (still does my head in!). I think these do a pretty good job of explaining them.

I particularly like the overlay of the symbolic overseas supply on the various pages.

The indicator system seems to work well, howevr I wonder if in-game, there may be a benefit in having some kind of toggled filter on the map which would show which map hexes are in supply- say shading those OOS hexes?

On the text, totally nitpicking, but suggest avoid "Sardinia's" (page 8- ie "Sardinia is") the odd apostrophy to keep the flow of the text readable is fine ("it's", "doesn't" etc) but this one niggles me!










Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/31/2007 9:56:24 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jimm
These look excellent.

Supply is one of the most difficult bits of the game to get your head around (still does my head in!). I think these do a pretty good job of explaining them.

I particularly like the overlay of the symbolic overseas supply on the various pages.

The indicator system seems to work well, howevr I wonder if in-game, there may be a benefit in having some kind of toggled filter on the map which would show which map hexes are in supply- say shading those OOS hexes?

On the text, totally nitpicking, but suggest avoid "Sardinia's" (page 8- ie "Sardinia is") the odd apostrophy to keep the flow of the text readable is fine ("it's", "doesn't" etc) but this one niggles me!

Ok.

You have to realize that I have about twice as much to say about most pages. I start with way too much text and then, like Hemingway [:D], I pare the text down by going over and over it, removing everything I possibly can. Once I have it stripped to what I consider the naked core, I add some of the 'touches' back in. Still, there is so much more that could be added.[:(]

In the beginning of creating the tutorials, I decided that all the comments had to fit within the text column on the right. The space allocated for the text and the screen shots would be absolutely unchangeable. That has been a tough decision to live with - though I still feel it was the correct decision.



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Supply Tutorial - #9 (8/31/2007 9:59:15 PM)

Two more new pages. You might note that we are now up to 13 pages for the supply tutorial. Want to guess what the 13th is?

[image]local://upfiles/16701/E370C96F91FE47959CF238643B06210D.jpg[/image]



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