TOAW Championships (Full Version)

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DeadInThrench -> TOAW Championships (11/24/2007 7:36:11 AM)

I am curious if any thought has been given to this... a yearly TOAW Championships tournament.

The idea.... each and every scenario that is short enough (less than 30 turns?) and has at least 2 players sign up for the championship tourney, shall have such a tourney, with the winner determined by the process of a single elimination tournament.

No need for any prizes or anything... just a listing of who the champions are in each scenario. Of course, can always do a thing like in the Origins, etc, tournaments, charge an entry fee and maybe have a certificate that is mailed to the winner.

The thing about computer wargames.... hard to play them out in a four day convention like with Origins. However, the advantage, you don't have to have a convention to have a championship tournament.

Hmmm... one problem... scenarios are not necessarily balanced. But, this is easily solutioned by having each player bid on a side... giving this many or that many VP, with the higher bidder getting the side, but with that loss in VP.

Would be nice if Matrix sponsored something like this, because they are the publisher, but I guess there could be other possibilities (I would prefer Matrix).

Hmmm... guess scenarios of any length could have championships, with the caveat that there would have to be enough time to finish the games and ultimately determine a champion, in that one year time period (lol). Sheesh, I guess that would prohibit the 426 turn Sino-Japanese war.

More hmmm... yeah, probably something that would be kicked off at the start of each new year.

Comments?

DiT

P.S. IMO, Matrix should offer this in ALL their games. Would keep the interest there over the long span and thus continued sales of their games over a longer time.



sPzAbt653 -> RE: TOAW Championships (11/24/2007 12:31:08 PM)

Hmmm ... to be crowned the '2008 World Champion Fite Player' .... Good Morning America, Letterman, Leno ... maybe my own reality series! ...



DeadInThrench -> RE: TOAW Championships (11/24/2007 4:05:28 PM)

LOL..... for FiTE... you guys would be going at it maybe the entire year <g>.

One thing though, I like my idea of 'bidding' for a side. I have seen posts that the scenario right now is balanced in favor of the Germans. So, with bidding, whomever bid the most for the side would get it but with that many VP subtracted from his total... and that would tend to balance things. Matrix, or whomever might be running this tournament, would then not have to concern themselves with balance.

DiT

P.S. Actually, thinking about it some, don't think you guys would be done in a year or less <g>.



Silvanski -> RE: TOAW Championships (11/24/2007 4:22:10 PM)

if you wanna have a fast tournament with a lot of participants in a balanced scenario I'd suggest Anonymous Heroics



vahauser -> RE: TOAW Championships (11/24/2007 6:00:50 PM)

Another possibility for a tournament is the Blitzkrieg scenario (the 25-turn version).

One way to conduct a match is by using a "best two out of three" format.  Using this format, each player would switch sides after each game, and use a coin flip if a third game is necessary.



Veers -> RE: TOAW Championships (11/24/2007 7:08:15 PM)

Gamesquad is in the middle fo a TOAW tournament right now. We're in the middle of round two of three, but each round is like a mini-tournament, with recognition for the best player in each round and then even more recognition for the best player in the whole tournament. Check it out at the GS TOAW Tournament Forum



SMK-at-work -> RE: TOAW Championships (11/25/2007 3:56:10 AM)

Is 1 year long enough for FITE? Sounds more like the 4-year thing like the soccer, rugby & cricket world cups.....even that might not be long enough for a couple of rounds....:)



DeadInThrench -> RE: TOAW Championships (11/25/2007 8:36:57 AM)

I hadn't ever looked at either the Blitzkrieg (I have the orignal AH boardgame buried away somwhere... got the nickname 'Sitzkrieg' because the original rules did not allow for any exploitation.... but then there was the mod from SPI) or the Anonymous Heroics scenarios, and they would make for nice tournaments, but why limit a tourney to any specific scenario? Just let everyone sign up (for $5 or maybe just $2) for whatever scenario they are interested in and, if someone signs up for 'The Invasion of Lower Slobobia', and nobody else does, well, then THEY are the champions of that scenario and get the certificate of the championship for that scenario for that year, and get listed with the other champions in the forums.

Hmmmm.... IMO would have to limit it to the released scenarios and well-done user developed scenarios available elsewhere (like, the Franco-Prussian War scenario I got from Rugged Defense).

The thing is, why try to force players to play this scenario or that? Instead, let em play whatever scenario they are interested in.

Hmmm.... yeah... might get a fair number of cases where just one player signs up. But, if nobody is willing to take em on in that scenario, well, they DESERVE to be the champion in it.

DiT



DeadInThrench -> RE: TOAW Championships (11/25/2007 9:00:35 AM)

I am not denying the significance of tournaments along the lines you mention. However, I remember playing in a Star Fleet Battles tournament at the east coast wargame convention one year, and I believe there were like 32 players (the guy that ran it only expected 16... yeah, I managed to win that one <g>), but then the next year I showed up at Origins and the Star Fleet Battles tournament was being run by the publisher, Task Force Games (I believe) and there were 256 players (!). Actually, I believe there was actually a bit more than that and they made ends meet one way or another.

The point here, is there is significance to an 'official' tournament that is beyond what any independant tournament can give.

Also, IMO an official tournament would not be something in lieu of independant tournaments and in fact, they would prosper probably even more than they would otherwise, if for no other reason players practicing for the official tournament.

I really don't know why Matrix and other publishers don't learn from the Origins, etc, tournaments, and take what is there and put it online and thus allow it to go on over months of time.

Hmmmm.... lastly, as far as the GameSquad tourney, do they have one on the Franco-Prussian War scenario? What about the Seven Weeks War or Russio-Japanese War scenarios? Serbia-Galicia? Operation Torch? Smolensk 41?

I don't think so, and THOSE are the scenarios I am interested in right now and, I am sure everyone else has certain scenarios that they are particularly interested in as well.

Whatever,

DiT



vahauser -> RE: TOAW Championships (11/25/2007 11:46:12 AM)

DiT,

What a tournament must be is as fair and balanced as possible.  And that means that all of the exisitng pre-designed TOAW scenarios are unacceptable for a tournament. Why?  Because some players are more experienced with some scenarios than others, and using those scenarios in a tournament will give some players an automatic advantage.

If you truly want a fair and balanced tournament, then the tournament should have a special tournament scenario that is custom designed for that tournament only.  The special tournament scenario should be along the lines of the Blitzkrieg scenario and only released to participants at the start of the tournament so that nobody has an advantage (other than inherent talent and skill with TOAW in general).

The tournament should also have a team (three is a good number) of highly qualified and impartial referees/judges to serve as moderators and rules arbitrators.



Trick37_MatrixForum -> RE: TOAW Championships (11/25/2007 1:44:07 PM)

I would support a championship, although I haven't challenged anyone yet (my schedule doesn't allow me too m uch free time right now).

I scanned through the "Fite" rules, and it seems a bit restrictive to me.  I prefer minimal, if any, restrictions.....




DeadInThrench -> RE: TOAW Championships (11/25/2007 6:02:10 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: vahauser

What a tournament must be is as fair and balanced as possible.  And that means that all of the exisitng pre-designed TOAW scenarios are unacceptable for a tournament. Why?  Because some players are more experienced with some scenarios than others, and using those scenarios in a tournament will give some players an automatic advantage.


Sorry but that argument is absurd. That's like saying, well, you can't have a TOAW tournament at all because, some players are more experienced with the game.

Uh, in case it was not obvious, I was not suggesting that anyone be expected to play any scenario they are not interested in. Essentially there would be a separate championship for each scenario that ANYONE was interested in. So, there isn't any problem in using the existing scenarios, and in fact you would WANT to do this because that is what the players are playing.

As far as scenarios not necessarily being balanced, the idea of 'bidding' for a side takes care of that.

DiT



vahauser -> RE: TOAW Championships (11/25/2007 6:14:29 PM)

DiT,

If you are crowning individual scenario champions, then that is not the same as a TOAW champion.  The only way to crown a true TOAW champion is to have a scenario that is played by all tournament participants. 



DeadInThrench -> RE: TOAW Championships (11/25/2007 7:40:16 PM)

vahauser...

That is correct... and I entitled this thread championshipS, and the basic idea is to treat each scenario that has at least one player is interested in it as a separate game with a separate championship. With over 200 released scenarios and at least 100 good user developed scenarios, this might seem difficult but, along the lines of my suggestion, it would really be quite easy.

If you wanted an overal TOAW championship, then yeah, your points are valid, though something like the Blitzkrieg or Annonymous Heroics scenarios would probably work.

Hmmm... yeah... I guess you could do both.

Of course, whether my suggestion would work or not, would all depend on how many players are out there playing the scenarios and how many would be interested in a tournament on the scenario(s) they are playing. I think there would be a fair amount that would be interested but, I don't really know.

DiT



SMK-at-work -> RE: TOAW Championships (11/25/2007 10:47:41 PM)

Come to think of it waht yuo need for a tournament is the tutorial scenario - it 'small enough to be able to play a few rounds in a year, & of course perfectly balanced! :)



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