RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (Full Version)

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SGT Rice -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/24/2008 7:59:23 AM)

Allied Spring 44 - Eastern Front

In the dark days of 1942 Marshal Koniev hatched a scheme for an eventual counteroffensive against the Nazi invaders. One of the Ukrainian factory complexes was diverted from the Urals to the Caucasus, where a population point and a major port gave it the ability to produce naval units. In Winter 44 the Russians finish 3 transports to join the survivor of the original Black Sea Fleet; unnoticed by German intelligence in Spring '44, they sortie into the Western Black Sea allowing the rapid invasion and conquest of (lightly defended) Rumania and (undefended) Bulgaria. Kiev remains in German hands for the time being, but the Germans will have to shift rapidly to cover their exposed Balkan flank.

Soviets hit 8 LA for their infantry this turn; notice the cool 'running man' unit symbol. Nice touch Jesse.

Neutral screen view at start of Axis Summer 44 turn.



[image]local://upfiles/16741/0CC05491D5EE4B4DB56F719D705C83C7.jpg[/image]



SGT Rice -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/24/2008 8:06:02 AM)

Allied Spring 44 - Western Front

The Germans spring a major strategic surprise; building nine fighters in West Germany, reinforcing them with eight more fighters, 2 HBs and 5 LBs. Now they're applying the principle of big stacks that's been used successfully against them. The Wallies scramble to withdraw a detachment of 10 fighters that had been sent to Norway last turn. Allied bombers score 6 hits on resources in Eastern France.

Screen shot is neutral view at star of Axis Summer 44 turn.



[image]local://upfiles/16741/0645F2FF45294A11B07DC565D921755E.jpg[/image]



SGT Rice -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/24/2008 8:12:18 AM)

Allied Spring 44 - Pacific Theatre.

The blockade of the Japanese Home Islands was successful; costing the US 2 CAGs, 1 CV destroyed, 1 CAG, 1 CV damaged by the Japanese counterattack in Axis Spring 44. But Japanese air power is on its last legs; P-51s from Okinawa lead missions over Honshu that clear Japan's airfields of FTRs and CAGs during Allied Spring 44. An hasty invasion of Hokkaido is launched to take Japanese homeland production down to 1.

Screen shot is neutral view at start of Axis Summer 44 turn, with combat results from Axis & Allied Spring 44 turns.

Turn sent to Sandeman.


[image]local://upfiles/16741/E503F33A25AE4D399B88750FFDC6AAAD.jpg[/image]



Sandeman -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/25/2008 2:11:26 AM)

Axis Sum'44

Things heating up in Europe. The russians pulled their own version of Anzio secretely building transports in the caucasus to land behind German lines in the balkans resulting in 5 axis resources lost.[:@] However, their 11 unit beachhead in Bulgaria is now surrounded by 34+ units. Kiev and Belorussia should hold another turn... so what will Stalin do? W.Germany is now holds our entire force of 20 FTRs and our INF also makes LA 8 but no new graphics [:(]

Japan smashes some more irregular soviet units in siberia

Turn sent to SGT Rice

[image]local://upfiles/24703/6C9F3CBBD00E4CBA919F58DAC5E11D41.jpg[/image]



SGT Rice -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/25/2008 7:51:42 AM)

Allied Summer 44 - European Theatre

The Soviet expeditionary force in Bulgaria turns around and punishes Turkey for its Axis leanings; followed up by a Wallied tag team that takes the eastern half of the country. Sturmovik strikes score 5 rail hits in eastern Europe.

In the West the Second Front is reopened; back to The Low Countries. 8 HBs, 5 LBs (lost one to an autohit) and 4 BBs combine to damage the 3 artillery, then 5 WA infantry sweep in to clear out the militia defenders. Hopefully the beachhead is secure; 2 ARM, 10 INF and 4 ART defend against a potential German counterattack of 4 INF, 2 ART, 6 AA and 9 MIL.

Insets focus on the opposing air forces in the West. Allied bombers (8 HBs and 4 LBs) are on patrol over the Atlantic. WA hit 9 evasion this turn, earning the nice F-80 icons.


[image]local://upfiles/16741/A7F0FCED03EC4B9F92B24EAFF67DDC3F.jpg[/image]



SGT Rice -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/25/2008 7:59:46 AM)

Allied Summer 44 - Pacific Theatre.

The Soviets launch a spoiling attack into Manchuria, eliminating 2 Japanese INF. Odds are a little more even, but the Japanese might as well continue their banzai charges to attrite the Russian. CAG/BB strikes take out a lone artillery on Kyushu, clearing the way for Operation Olympic. Honshu should fall next turn.

The Chinese army emerges from the hinterland in time to join the ticker tape parade.

[image]local://upfiles/16741/BF6CD79B22B8418CA4F484945810CEF0.jpg[/image]



SGT Rice -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/25/2008 8:05:03 AM)

Allied Summer 44 (final)

Screenie showing overall force totals.
Sum key unit ratings:


Infantry (LA/EV)
Germany (8/7)
Japan (7/6)
Russia (8/7)
WA (8/7)
China (6/4)

Armor (LA/EV)
Germany (9/8)
Russia (9/8)
WA (8/8)

Artillery (LA)
Germany (8)
Japan (6)
Russia (8)
WA (8)

Anti Aircraft (AA)
Germany (9)
Japan (6)
Russia (7)
China (6)
WA (7)

Fighters (Spd/AA/EV)
Germany (3/8/8)
Japan (3/7/7)
Russia (3/7/7)
WA (3/8/9)

CAG (Spd/AA/EV)
Japan (3/5/6)
WA (4/7/7)

Strategic bombers (Spd/LA)
Germany (5/5)
Japan (4/4)
Russia (4/4)
WA (5/6)

Tactical bombers (Spd/LA)
Germany (3/5)
Japan (2/5)
Russia (3/7)
WA (4/7)

Turn sent to Sandeman.


[image]local://upfiles/16741/E10E4BC3237849149E368DD7B6A745A0.jpg[/image]



GKar -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/25/2008 11:50:57 AM)

I just wanted to drop in and say that I really like your AAR images with the unit details and arrows, SGT Rice (I'll assume that it was your idea [:'(]). A great idea to show both the overall situation and several interesting force concentrations at the same time.

Keep up the good work, both of you! I think it is the first 'Japan first' AAR I've read, at least for a while. Great stuff!



SGT Rice -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/25/2008 12:05:01 PM)

My pleasure ... glad to hear someone finds it useful.



Sandeman -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/27/2008 12:48:13 AM)

Axis Fall '44

Germany adjusts to the new reality that our empire is shrinking... but the army is restless as it has never suffered any major defeat. W.France, now being indefensible, is abandoned in favor of the old Maginot line forts. It's a shame that the allies conspired against the good natured Turks, but still I won't complain if armies are moving away from Germany...[:-]

Japan just waits for the inevitable

SS shows major european deployments

[image]local://upfiles/24703/3EEF2770E9354D10B80D1D88CC54A7A6.jpg[/image]



SGT Rice -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/27/2008 10:15:48 AM)

Allied Fall 44 - Eastern Front

Stalin recalls his expeditionary force from Turkey; the rest of the Red Army moves forward to engage the outer defenses of the Reich.

[image]local://upfiles/16741/B62F89BBBF75490CA323374462C75125.jpg[/image]



SGT Rice -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/27/2008 10:19:43 AM)

Allied Fall 44 - Western Front

Germany is defended by 20 FTRs, 5 LBs. The WA sends a force of 23 FTRs, 4 CAGs, 8 HBs, 4 LBs from England. Casualties run ~ 2:1 in favor of the WA. B-17s from the Med damage 2 German HBs in Austria. The WA completes the conquest of France.

Japan's small Honshu garrison is overrun, completing the conquest of Japan.

Turn sent to Sandeman.

[image]local://upfiles/16741/99E679912D654F5FAE92DF9311B48C39.jpg[/image]



Sandeman -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/28/2008 12:50:42 AM)

Germany Win'45

The German army masses to defend W.Germany and E.Poland. Hopefully the winter will help prevent any major allied success. Notice E.Poland has 56 land units with 11 of them armor which will deny the Russians combined arms (they only have 10 total) should they attack this turn.

Turn sent to SGT Rice

SS shows our E.Poland army.



[image]local://upfiles/24703/45E57470AAC84A03984D6008C63F710B.jpg[/image]



SGT Rice -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/28/2008 4:12:09 AM)

Allied Winter 45

The Russians mass several army groups facing the German concentration in Eastern Poland. The Luftwaffe is momentarily cleared from the skies by and the WA bomber force rebases to Eastern France. Follow on B-17 strikes score 7 resource hits. The Italian fleet is driven from the Med and WA landings seize Greece and Southern Italy. The WA takes Vichy; the Germans are down to 11 1/2 resources.

Turn sent to Sandeman.

[image]local://upfiles/16741/7F058A2FA99E44E5A9AC306C5663817A.jpg[/image]



Sandeman -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/29/2008 2:41:06 AM)

Axis Spr'45

Germany moves around some troops, but mostly does nothing. 63 units in E.Poland now stand in the way of the red army juggernaut. Maybe they can hold one more turn?

The only combat this turn was me trying to get a cheap kill in the baltic states with an armor unit. Clearly the game does not grant luck to the axis in 1945...

Turn sent to SGT Rice

[image]local://upfiles/24703/B50123FE3D78414F9D13E31AD07BFDAA.jpg[/image]



SGT Rice -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/29/2008 4:59:10 AM)

Allied Spring 45

The Allies are once again able to use their strategic mobility to good effect. In the Russian turn a Soviet paradrop into unoccupied Hungary allows rapid reconstruction of the rail network through Rumania and establishment of a strong cordon around the huge Wehrmacht army in Eastern Poland. Only Western Poland provides a retreat route for these forces. The Red Air Force sends in Sturmoviks to blast the rail lines in Western Poland, losing 1 TAC in the process, but 2 rail hits are achieved.

During the WA turn, massed TAC air and BB strikes on Denmark damage the 4 ART guarding the straits. WA trannies, BBs and DDs pour through, supporting an invasion by the 4 INF left in Scandinavia. This landing wipes out the 2 MIL, 2 AA defending Western Poland, isolating Germany's armies in the East.

The WA collapse their convoy pipelines in the Pacific, providing sufficient sealift to surge the majority of the troops from Japan (previously staged to India), SE Asia, the Middle East and the United States into Western France. B-17 strikes torch the rails in W. Germany, N. Italy and Yugoslavia. Spoiling attacks on Northern Italy and Yugoslavia fail to take the areas but destroy many Italian militia units.

[image]local://upfiles/16741/05E0AF9B906C4CB6A00B8AB93C6F8FDC.jpg[/image]



Sandeman -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/29/2008 5:14:28 PM)

Axis Sum'45

Bad move #1 Not leaving a couple units in Hungary to keep the para from taking it
Bad move #2 Not leaving any supplies in E.Poland

So now the bulk of my army is stranded... W.Germany still has a decent garrison. Can the allies take it this turn?

Turn sent to SGT Rice



SGT Rice -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/29/2008 11:20:51 PM)

Allied Summer 45

The Russians don't have much to do ... they march in to Czechoslovakia and Austria for VC purposes.

The WA set up the final offensive with an air attack on the German artillery. This provides a nice example of the new suppression rules at work in a late war setting.

The Germans have invested heavily in AA; they have 8 AA units in W. Germany with anti-air ratings of 9. The target of the WA attack are 8 ART units. The attackers are 8 LBs (7 EV, 8 LA) and 8 HBs (6 EV, 6 LA). The WA lose one LB damaged; suppression results to all involved units are shown in the screen shot. I had considered an invasion to support the main attack to allow lots of BB fire support, but the German ART remains to strong sheltered beneath this powerful AA umbrella.

[image]local://upfiles/16741/CA2372F8488B448285D6BA14C33BDE68.jpg[/image]



SGT Rice -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/29/2008 11:24:12 PM)

Allied Summer 45

The final assault; half the WA armor is just off the boat from the US. Germany falls.

[image]local://upfiles/16741/B30A6541D6594A71B91B27CDD7FCE064.jpg[/image]



SGT Rice -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/30/2008 12:11:30 AM)

This was a highly competitive and very enjoyable match. Many thanks to Lebatron for providing the scenario, MrQ for providing the tourney, and Sandeman for his excellent play.

I will study my opponent's Barbarossa opening as the model for how to do it right. A massed phalanx of armor with abundant air support; right into the center of the Russian defenses, perfectly positioned to threaten everything ... Leningrad, Moscow, Gorki, Stalingrad, Kharkov. I had no choice but to run for my life. My Russian defense used the old 'rope-a-dope' technique (anybody remember Ali-Frazier?); just take the punches and sag all the way back to the Urals. This type of defense looks a little risky under the Global Glory rules; if I'm reading them correctly a Russian surrender could have occured a couple of times in this game (I'll have to do the math to verify).

My initial take on the new suppression rules was that AA units were no longer worth investing in since they rarely shoot down bombers anymore. I'm a little less certain now; when the Germans pushed their AA rating to 8-9 it made things pretty difficult to do heavy damage when the AA defenses were in place. Sandeman probably has a good sense of how worthwhile the AA investment is.

It might be desirable to seed AA research or even raise at start AA values by 1 across the board. The Chinese in particular are in bad shape; it seems like a no-brainer for the Japanese to build HBs, tech them to 4-5 LA and bomb the Chinese to zero production. There's virtually nothing the Chinese can do about it and no risk to the Japanese.

Of course it would seem artificial to give China advanced air defense capabilities. A more elegant solution might be to raise the evasion rating of Chinese factories and resources to 5 or 6; the design rationale being that China employed low-tech, labor-intensive production methods that were more geographically dispersed and harder to target from the air. That would be my only concrete suggestion based on a first playing of UV 2.1.

One last note; the game reported a result of Axis Marginal Victory. My reading of the game manual indicates this is off one level. Is this a bug or did something change?



Marshall Art -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/30/2008 1:42:24 AM)

Congrats SGT Rice, well played Sandeman, IMO the biggest pocket I ever have seen in E. Poland caused a quicker downfall of Germany. [&o]

As far as surrender probabilities go - they should be displayed in the diplomacy screen so you do not need to calculate - Or is this just a GG 3.0 functionality? It would be very interesting to see how close Russia was to surrender.





Sandeman -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/30/2008 5:08:00 AM)

Definitely one of the best games I've played so far, and the first with the new scenario. Hats off to my opponent for keeping the Russians in the war and taking out Japan as rapidly as he did. Not only that but finding a way to trap my huge army at the end was well executed. [&o]

Now I haven't had a chance to play as the Wallies yet, but it seems like the new rules hinder axis play the most... Japan suffers the worst of it with the transport rules forcing them to build more in order to get around the islands (every little ungarrisoned enemy island reduces transport significantly) Also Japan's offensive air power is curtailed in higher production costs for bothfighters and HBs and in the fact that I always seemed to be at max range for my bomber targets. Not that I have a problem with the rules, in fact I enjoyed playing with them, but they just seem to work more against Japan's efforts than anyone else.

As for SGT Rice's comments on AA I agree that raising starting values by 1 (but not the WS) would be a good idea. Tech'ing them up sure helped against TBs and HBs under 6 LA, but once the Wallies hit 6 LA they weren't very effective at all. Even with 3 AA units in E.France at 9 air attack SGT Rice was getting many hits and rarely with any bombers damaged. Maybe it's possible to increase the autohit possibility of only AA fire (from AA units and ships) from 5% to 10%? I mean now its almost a no-risk endeavor to send out bombing runs.

Being a new scenario, I tried a rather different approach than my usual. I figured I'd use the new WR rules to keep the U.S. out as long as possible...but I think I procrastinated too long and ended up giving them too much buildup time both to counter-attack and defend India. I have never seen anyone tech up their CAGs to 4/7/7 before so I was taken by surprise when he attacked me and I couldn't counterstrike. Japan is pretty well defenseless without a good force of CVs and CAGs to keep the U.S. at bay.

With Germany though, my little venture into africa turned out to be a waste of time and supplies. I was a bit surprised that my opponent didn't contest control of the C.Med after I withdrew the afrika corp. I guess he was content to conserve his forces until strong enough to confront me elsewhere. Barbarossa went well, although I must admit his complete withdrawal to the ural/caucasus mountains was frustrating [:@] Russia's strategy was a mixed blessing as allowed me to reach the 77VP watermark as well as keep his armies pinned down, but on the other hand he had a huge force bearing down on me at the end.

Not sure on the victory results, I did hit second watermark but maybe the UV scenario has a different victory time scale...one less than Axis marginal would put the game as a draw. I could live with that [8D]
















SGT Rice -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (1/30/2008 5:59:10 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sandeman

Not sure on the victory results, I did hit second watermark but maybe the UV scenario has a different victory time scale...one less than Axis marginal would put the game as a draw. I could live with that [8D]



Mmmm ... actually I thought the level was off one in the other direction[:(] From section 14.3 of the game manual: Decisive Allied Victory - Axis surrender by the end of the Summer 1945 turn. This would then be shifted one level in favor of the Axis (Substantive Allied Victory) due to their hitting the second watermark. I seem to recall seeing this kind of one level shift in a v1.011 game with Marshall Art as well; perhaps the Victory Conditions have been changed at some point but the change wasn't documented in the Read Me file?



MrQuiet -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (2/4/2008 5:45:13 AM)

quote:

One last note; the game reported a result of Axis Marginal Victory. My reading of the game manual indicates this is off one level. Is this a bug or did something change?


That does not sound right.
I believe victory(for scoreing purposes) is actually checked on the start of the German Turn but I am not sure on that.
That would make it Fall45 + Axis second high water mark which acording to this:

quote:

For All Campaigns and Scenarios I, II and II:
Decisive Allied Victory – Axis surrender by the end of the Summer 1945 turn.
Substantive Allied Victory - Axis surrender by the end of the Fall 1945 turn.
Marginal Allied Victory – Axis surrender by the end of the Winter 1946 turn.


Would be a Marginal Allied Victory not Axis.
Did you mean Allied?
Could you post a screenshot of the victory screen?


Scores:

Allied Marginal Victory
Sandeman +5
SGT Rice +25

Sandeman
21 turns with in 24hrs for 10.5pts
22 turns with Screen Shots for 11pts


SGT Rice
25 turns with in 24hrs for 12.5pts
25 turns with Screen Shots for 12.5pts

Totals
Sandeman----26.5
SGT Rice-----50




SGT Rice -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (2/4/2008 5:53:56 AM)

My mistake. You're correct; I meant to say that the game reported an Allied Marginal Victory, but I believe it should have reported Allied Substantive.

[image]local://upfiles/16741/A43BD20E7C9F470EAE032133DE8A51DC.jpg[/image]



MrQuiet -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (2/4/2008 5:58:07 AM)

Thanks for the fast response and like I posted I think the victory check is made at the start of a round which means the next season.
I have seen this a few times and that is the conclusion I come to.



MrQuiet -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (2/5/2008 12:21:04 AM)

SGT Rice could you load that victiory file again and then take a look at the map and see what season it is showing.
I have a feeling it might say fall45.



SGT Rice -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (2/5/2008 12:49:09 AM)

Indeed it does say Fall 1945. This makes sense; I ended my Summer 1945 turn before sending it to my opponent. I'm not concerned about the tourney points; I'll be on the other side of the equation when I play the Axis[X(]. Its simply a mismatch between the game manual and the way the game actually functions[>:]. That's why I moved my comments over to the patch thread. Thanks.



MrQuiet -> RE: Lightning Tourney Rd1 Sandeman vs SGT Rice (3/30/2008 4:58:29 PM)

Now going back to the following post by WH: He says that a bug was introduced in 1.02 that causes Victory Level to be determined one season late

quote:

quote:

ORIGINAL: WanderingHead

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrQuiet
I just figured the person who wrote the manual was not the person who coded the game and they somehow got comunications crossed on when victory level is decided.


No, this is definitely not the case. Having looked at the code, I can say that I unintentionally changed it when I fixed the "continue game" option. My oopsie. First time, I think, that I've had the displeasure of identifying a bug I myself put in a released version :(.

If that is the only problem then that should be easy enough to fix it back. It would still progress to the next season, but I can subtract 1 season in computing the victory level.



quote:

I am going to adjust victory scoreing accordingly for all games using 1.02 in this tournament and the others.
So far it only effects this game and Sandeman vs Sgt Rice, but it will no doubt effect the 2 vs 2 games that have started in 1.02

The Scores have been changed so that Allies Receive SV



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