2 day/1 day turns (Full Version)

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ird -> 2 day/1 day turns (6/7/2008 5:27:49 PM)

I've had the game for a few weeks now and am planning to start a full game against the AI in the next week or so. One thing I've noticed in the forums is that a few people play 2 day turns. What is the general preference for people - 1 day or 2 days. - and how does it affect gameplay (aside from the obvious before I get 10 sarcastic comments as soon as I post this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)



patrickl -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/7/2008 5:51:28 PM)

Most of us die hards play 1 day turn but some say 2 day turn will slow things down and make it historical. [:)]



Terminus -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/7/2008 6:09:32 PM)

I used to be religiously on the side of the 1-day turn cycle, because I thought I absolutely HAD to micro-manage everything on a day-to-day basis. Then I tried just once to do a 2-day cycle and was instantly hooked.

Things move much smoother and much faster, and it's maybe a teeny bit more realistic to not be able to send new orders every day and have them be instantly obeyed.

I'm never going back to a 1-day cycle again.



ird -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/7/2008 6:15:31 PM)

Thanks for those comments - it was actually a couple of things that you'd put on the forums, Terminus, that made me look at 2 day turns



bradfordkay -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/7/2008 7:09:03 PM)

I prefer the one day turns because it makes me feel more like Adm. Nimitz sitting at his HQ receiving daily reports on what is happening... [8D]



ny59giants -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/7/2008 8:52:46 PM)

If your playing against the AI, I would go with 2 day turns to help give the AI a small advantage and prevent you from doing too much micro-management (KB shows up someplace unexpected and your able to get away). The AI needs all the help it can get. [:D]



ird -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/7/2008 10:49:40 PM)

Slight change of topic but how can I tell if a ground unit is fixed or not?? Sometimes I seem able to transport ground units and at other times none appear in the list and I'm not sure why



Feinder -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/7/2008 11:58:29 PM)

Fixed (restricted) commands are"

Canadian
West Coast
New Zealand
ANZAC
USAAF
ABDA
(Australia Command is NOT by the way)
India
China
(not sure if Far East is)

Kwangtung
China Exped
Home

Any units assigned to them may not be loaded onto ships or airlifted without paying political points to convert them to a non-restriced command (like CentPac, SoPac, SWPac, SEAC, Burma Area, Southern etc).

I'll say for 2-day turns I'm 60-40 for them.  I like the clip of the game.  The 2nd day's lack of control is neither here nor there for me (altho you do need to get used to guessing what you *and your enemy* can do in two days).  Ground combat is problematci tho.  Your troops will attack on day 1 successfully.  But supplies are NOT delivered every day, so often on the 2nd day, your troops will continue to attack with inadagquate supplies, killing your AV, and if it's a close battle, you can (likely) drop to 0:1.  Whereas with one day turns, you'd be able to evaluate the supply situation and NOT launch the attack (with 2 day turns, your army continus to attack if you get at least 1:1 on the first day, but doesn't botherh to check supplies).

Also, as I understand nukes, if you play 2 day turns, you end up dropping nukes two days in a row (if they're available).  Not necessarily what you want to do.  And 3 day turns, means dropping 3 nukes (if they're availale), which affects victory conditions (but noboy really cares at that point anyway).

-F-



Gem35 -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/8/2008 5:59:09 AM)

I tried 2 day turns and didn't like it, though I play against the AI.
I like micro-management to the nth degree so I may be biased.[:)]



jwilkerson -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/8/2008 7:02:33 AM)

For years I was a 1-day turn guy - but then Nik got me to try 2-day turns - I didn't like it for about the first 400 turns - but then finally saw the light - am I'm now a "reformed "2-day" turn guy!

The ability to do carrier raids (hit and run) is nice in the 2-day turns.

The ability to launch an attack, like an invasion, etc. and not get instance reaction has a more historical feel.

Also, you really need to plan all your attacks better, less like to try "suicide probes" on land or with air.

But for me at least, it did take a lot of getting used to. But haven't gotten there I'd say I'm pretty much a die-hard 2-day guy, with possible exception of the tiny "battle" scenario format.

Oh and 2-day turns also has the advantage for the Allied PBEMers, of getting them into the mid-game with half has many back and forths with their opponents. Having only played the Japanese in PBEM I can't speak much about this advantage. But I would think it would be attractive.





Hornblower -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/8/2008 7:21:57 AM)

I'm a one turn guy..



Gem35 -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/8/2008 7:22:26 AM)

I'm a one woman guy....[;)]



Hornblower -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/8/2008 7:42:27 AM)

lol



Oldguard1970 -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/8/2008 4:44:57 PM)

This is the list of Restricted HQs in the manual:

restricted HQ. These HQ’s are:
Japan
�� Home Defense Force
�� Kwangtung Area Army
�� China Expeditionary Army
Allies
�� Australia Command
�� West Coast
�� USAFFE
�� ABDA
�� Canada Command
�� New Zealand Command



Terminus -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/8/2008 5:24:14 PM)

In AE, restricted HQ's will have a (R) after their names in the game.



Feinder -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/8/2008 6:48:41 PM)

quote:

This is the list of Restricted HQs in the manual:

restricted HQ. These HQ’s are:
Japan
�� Home Defense Force
�� Kwangtung Area Army
�� China Expeditionary Army
Allies
�� Australia Command
�� West Coast
�� USAFFE
�� ABDA
�� Canada Command
�� New Zealand Command


Yes. The list above is for Stock (which is probably what the poster was talking about).

My bad. My list is for CHS. Be advised the different commands in Stock vs. CHS. A major difference is that in CHS there is the "India Commmand" (new) that is restriceted; and the "Australia Command" in CHS is -NOT- restricted in CHS (but it is in Stock). In CHS, the "ANZAC Command" is new and -is- restricted.

-F-



ird -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/8/2008 7:11:02 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: OldGuard1970

This is the list of Restricted HQs in the manual:

restricted HQ. These HQ’s are:
Japan
�� Home Defense Force
�� Kwangtung Area Army
�� China Expeditionary Army
Allies
�� Australia Command
�� West Coast
�� USAFFE
�� ABDA
�� Canada Command
�� New Zealand Command



Thanks for that - it's cleared it up. I was starteing to think it was me trying to do something wrong. And it is stock I'm playing at the moment. Couldn't find it in the manual, I'll have another look



ird -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/8/2008 10:38:23 PM)

I've just scoured the manual - the list above is in the manual as aircraft units which are unable to be transported. It doesn't mention ground units. So am I right in thinking that it does actually apply to all air and land units??



USSAmerica -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/8/2008 10:40:47 PM)

Yes, you are correct.  The restriction does apply to all air and land units assigned to that HQ.



bradfordkay -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/9/2008 5:16:38 AM)

There will also be other ground units assigned to unrestricted HQs that will not be able to be moved. These ground units will have large, immobile guns (or in CHS, fortifications) that have an asterisk next to the item name in the TOE. This means that particular item is too large to move, and so the whole unit is immovable (unless you can get your enemy to destroy the large guns!).



romanovich -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/19/2008 7:51:57 AM)

Are there any new features in AE that were already disclosed that would make one regret to choose the 2 day turn option?



JoePirulo -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/20/2008 12:40:03 AM)

You can switch between 1, 2, 3 days turns or continuos play against the AI. It´s an option I use, when nothing happens: 2 or 3 days. When action is calling 1 day/turn.
Max.



romanovich -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/20/2008 2:22:50 AM)

I knew about that for AI games. But I played the big historical scenario a few years back and the AI at some point late in '42/early '43 got so predictable it wasn't any fun anymore. A game this scale needs human unpredictatbility. I recruited a worthy opponent who'd be new to WITP (but capable of handling this sort of complexity) to play the grand scenario in AE as PBEM. Obviously you have to plan for playing it for at least a year, but if you do 1 day turns, if you start in late in 2008 (god, I am still optimistic, aren't I?) you wouldn't even have gotten halfway thru 1942 at a realistic playing rate (one turn every other day) after that year. So it seems imperative to plan for a 2 day turn set-up in PBEM, but then you're locked in with that choice, obviously. So I am really, really wondering if we would come to regret choosing the 2 day turn option for the new AE (I've only played 1 day turns in WITP against AI because you could do several in a day and micromanaging is fun).

Big decision! A year of your life!

So, glad to get guidance from anyone who monitored the boards and saw anyone drop hints as to the benefits/drawbacks of 1 day/2 day turns in AE.

(might need to/should post in AE forum, but what the heck...)



jwilkerson -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/20/2008 4:02:42 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: romanovich

Are there any new features in AE that were already disclosed that would make one regret to choose the 2 day turn option?


Not at all - I've done the bulk of my AE testing with 20day turns. As far as I'm concerned, AE is just as confortable with 2-days turns as stock.




Feinder -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/20/2008 4:12:47 AM)

If your army attacks 1:1 on day 1, it attacks again on day 2, usually with much depleted supplies, more often than not, ending in 0:1, and doing a fine job of blunting your offensive army.

Any chance some sort of check has been added to AE, to *not* automatically trigger that 0:1 suicide attack on day 2?

I do believe that is my single biggest frustration with 2 day turns - that you can't stop an attack that would obviously fail (all it would take is a supply check, and the player could decide to halt the attack : will the auto-attack be able to make this check?).

-F-



jwilkerson -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/20/2008 5:12:11 AM)

I think whata I like about 2-day turns is that the tactics are different. What works in one may not work in the other. And 2-day turns require more planning. So if you really don't like 2-day turns don't play them. For me ... it took at 400 turns of 2-day turns before I finally got "converted" .. before that I was thinking I hated it and was just doing it because Nik was making me .. but then there was a turn where I plotted a high speed run for the Eastern Solomons down to just East of the Louisades (with KB) .... and re-home-ported myself to Shortlands, where I had built up the port and stock piled a bunch of gas. We started the turn ... my carriers ran down to the Louisades launched an attack on Nik's carriers and ended the turn at Shortlands. When I looked at the map at the start of the next turn, KB was fully fueled!!! And boy that one sold me. I could make a carrier strike and back away from the battle space and gas up ready for ops the next turn. The perfect "hit and run".

But the planning requirements are different and it is best not to launch attacks by air, sea or land unless you believe both days worth of attacks will be in your interest. If this type of planning is not for you then stick with 2-day turns, but I love it!
[:)]



Feinder -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/20/2008 4:10:08 PM)

quote:

Feinder - I do believe that is my single biggest frustration with 2 day turns - that you can't stop an attack that would obviously fail (all it would take is a supply check, and the player could decide to halt the attack : will the auto-attack be able to make this check?).


quote:

Jwilkerson - But the planning requirements are different and it is best not to launch attacks by air, sea or land unless you believe both days worth of attacks will be in your interest. If this type of planning is not for you then stick with 2-day turns, but I love it!


I'll take that as a "no" then. That's truely unfortunate.

[:(]

-F-



Nikademus -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/20/2008 5:09:00 PM)

2 day turns are great for players who on average only do 1-2 turns per day PBEM. Otherwise your looking at a game time play equiv. to real time. i.e. 2 years of game play = 2 years of RT. Thats daunting.

Not being able to micromanage and plan/execute attacks also forces more careful (i.e. more realistic) planning which forces you to rely on local commander's decisions. If one thinks an attack might fail...then the best plan may be not to do it. Slows down pace considerably. It also eliminates to a degree the ability to "teleport" airforces, attack then teleport back out next turn.



jwilkerson -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/20/2008 5:09:04 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Feinder

That's truely unfortunate.



Ah, but we did leave the 1-day turn option still available - so you won't have to suffer playing 2-day turns!
[:)]



Feinder -> RE: 2 day/1 day turns (6/20/2008 5:26:02 PM)

The conundrum is that I prefer 2 day turns for the clip of the game - I'm one of those folks who only has time to manage a turn a day.



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