RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (Full Version)

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ASHBERY76 -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/20/2008 6:20:35 PM)

This and Fable2 will keep me busy on the 360 for a while.



Arctic Blast -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/20/2008 10:28:41 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: ASHBERY76

This and Fable2 will keep me busy on the 360 for a while.


I'm hoping Fable 2 lives up to the possibilities after the first was a bit of a disappointment. If only Peter Molyneux didn't seem unable to keep from running his mouth before releasing a game, expectations wouldn't get so high to begin with.



doomtrader -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/22/2008 11:56:02 AM)

It looks like it is not so great.

Just readed about two reviews for 9/10



Perturabo -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/22/2008 1:08:22 PM)

Only 9/10? It must certainly be crap. A really good game should have 14/10[:'(].



NefariousKoel -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/22/2008 10:36:00 PM)

11  These guys are 11.

[:D]



Hertston -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/23/2008 1:10:41 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: doomtrader

It looks like it is not so great.

Just readed about two reviews for 9/10



'Spore' at Metacritic;

Average of 66 'critic' reviews; 84%. Average of 1,018 reader reviews, 45%. That's all you need to know about 'reviews', folks [;)]



mc82 -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/23/2008 4:19:24 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hertston

quote:

ORIGINAL: doomtrader

It looks like it is not so great.

Just readed about two reviews for 9/10



'Spore' at Metacritic;

Average of 66 'critic' reviews; 84%. Average of 1,018 reader reviews, 45%. That's all you need to know about 'reviews', folks [;)]


The PC Gamer Spore review was a real classic in relation to the "paid off magazine/review site" phenomenon. It was 3 or 4 pages about how the game failed to live up to expectations, and was nothing but a dumbed down series of rudimentary mini-games in each stage (a "basic RTS game", "Civilization for dummies" or something like that, and etc)...

Then suddenly turned into: "But it's totally awesome! The graphics are great and it's charming and fun! Don't think of it as a game you're trying to win, think of it as a toy!"

That's right folks, challenge sucks! Well, maybe not, but that sounds like the general trend in PC games today.

On the Fallout 3 topic, I fully expect the game to be a huge, mainstream hit just like Oblivion, and draw in hordes of FPS fans now declaring themselves to be "totally hardcore RPGers doodz", all the while also being a giant blasphemy to the memory of the classic Fallout games. I'd like to hope myself to be wrong, but nearly all of the previews of F3 have given me exactly this impression- and this time, it doesn't even feature soil erosion.



doomtrader -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/28/2008 4:57:44 PM)

Released in USA,
Anybody played?



Fallschirmjager -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/29/2008 3:28:23 AM)

Let me preface this with I played both the orginal Fallout games
I played Fallout 6 months after it's release and Fallout 2 the day of it's release. So I know all about the legacy of the games.

I very much wanted a sequel and each year that passed without one was heart wrenching. Fallout 2 was one of my top 5 favourite games of all time afterall.
When Vam Buren died along with Black Isle/Inerplay it was the end of the Golden Age of CRPGs.
Baldurs Gate, Icewind Dale, Planescape Torment (another of my top 10 games) and of course Fallout
The late 90s/early 2000s were RPG heaven

When I read that Bethesda had acquired the Fallout liscence I had my share of trepidations. They immediadtly made it be known that the series would be changing.
I really did not like Morrowind all that much. In fact, I hated it.

Oblivion came along after that and after all the good reviews I got it for my X-Box.
I must admit I really did enjoy it. But I still worried about Fallout. I did not like the enemies leveling up along with your character. I did not like the lifeless world or the combat which I found lacked any punch.

Then around early spring I decided to count my blessings that a sequel was in fact being made. I mean, much better a bad sequel be made then no sequel at all.
So I guess I realized that the prospect of a 2-D isometric Fallout 2 much like Fallout 3 died with Van Buren.

So flash forward to now. I pre ordered a copy of Fallout 3 for my X-Box and picked it up last night at a midnight launch (which was a lot of fun, someone brought a laptop with them to show the 'kids' what Fallout 2 looked like [:D] )

It is now 10:17 PM EST and according to the ingame statistics I have logged 9 hours of game time today.

The game is fantastic on it's own merits.
Yes it is a action RPG and not turned based. Yes it feels mu.ch like a slow paced RPG.
Yes it has some of the shortcomings of Oblivion.
But I enjoy it nonetheless

So in short, once I stopped whining about what I wanted the game to be and started accepting the game for what it is I realized there is much to enjoy.
It is one of the best games I have played this year and with some time for prospective I might rank it among the best I have ever played.

So again I know I am wasting alot of typing by putting this in a wargaming forum. But if some gamers would get over themselves and look beyond decade old game design they will find gems where they did not think they would exsist.
So I challenge Fallout fans like myself to do what I did. Start accepting Fallout 3 for what it is and give it a clean slate and judge it without bias and go into it knowing it is a completly different creature.
I think you will find that it belongs right beside the first two games in the series.



Perturabo -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/29/2008 10:24:19 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager

I think you will find that it belongs right beside the first two games in the series.

Look, I found a secret sequel of WitP!
Try it, it's really fun. I think you will find that it belongs right beside the first two games in the series.



mjk428 -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/29/2008 11:00:28 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager

So I challenge Fallout fans like myself to do what I did. Start accepting Fallout 3 for what it is and give it a clean slate and judge it without bias and go into it knowing it is a completly different creature.
I think you will find that it belongs right beside the first two games in the series.


I agree it seems like it will earn its place at the table with the Black Isle games.

It's deep, fun and superior to Oblivion. Put lots of points into Agility and combat becomes virtually turn-based with the VATS system (except quicker and with slow motion impacts). I played Oblivion but didn't love it. So far, 5 hours in, I love F3.



Erik Rutins -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/29/2008 11:36:13 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager
Yes it is a action RPG and not turned based. Yes it feels mu.ch like a slow paced RPG.


Can you elaborate on this? How can it not be turn based and yet feel like a slow paced RPG?



killroyishere -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/29/2008 12:32:19 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

Last time I checked, this one looked like a FPS with a few bolted on turn-based RPG elements. Have they changed it back to a true turn-based, party-based RPG? I loved Wasteland, Fallout, Fallout 2 and Fallout: Tactics, but what I saw of Fallout 3 made me more concerned than excited. While I enjoy a good FPS from time to time, that's not what this series is about for me.


Say Erik why don't you reverse the trend in some of your wargames like Close Combat and turn that rts game into a turn based game instead? It seems the mainstream keeps ruining great turn based games and turning them into rts games so it'd be nice for a change to see some rts games turn in to turn based games.



Raindog101 -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/29/2008 3:27:06 PM)

This is a great game. Will probably win everybody's "Game of the year" competition.

This game is "Fallout" all the way. Even though you spend most of your time in the 1st person, there is not a single doubt you are in the "Fallout" universe.

All I can say is if you're a fan of the "Fallout" games and you pass this up, it's your loss. This game has a "Fallout" pedigree of the highest order.



jamus34 -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/29/2008 7:21:39 PM)

Giving my objective (but still opinionated) view of the game after spending 2 hours with it last night I can say I like it better than almost any other A(merican)RPG (like Mass Effect, KOTOR, Arena series) I have played.

Yes they did remove some of what the original Fallout was but in all honesty there was never a chance Fallout 3 was going to be an isometric turn based game.

Overall though in my mind it works going to a first person view since Fallout was always about you the former Vault dweller. While other people may join your group they were never controllable and for the most part ended up being bullet shields (at least in 1...never got the chance to play 2 but may have to pick it up on Steam someday soon).

I think it also helps get you into the role a lot better than the first Fallout based on how the new game begins.

One detrimate I have heard is that the end game requires combat which means you can't completely ignore your combat skills like you could in the first. That said, in the first there were certian quests you would have to ignore completly if you did not have combat skills.

If anyone is interested I'll post up again in a day or two once I log another 4-6 hours or so.

However, if I had to choose between F3 not being made or being made in it's current iteration I'll take the game any day of the week.



Perturabo -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/29/2008 7:59:16 PM)

Does it have good writing? Good descriptions of terrain and objects?



Fallschirmjager -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/29/2008 9:46:51 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager
Yes it is a action RPG and not turned based. Yes it feels mu.ch like a slow paced RPG.


Can you elaborate on this? How can it not be turn based and yet feel like a slow paced RPG?




If you play the game like Halo or any other FPS you will die. Many many times. Or at the very least you will waste ammo and stim packs needlessly.
You must approach combat with a careful tactical approach. It is always best to use the terrian and cover to your advantage and proceed slowly and try and get the drop on enemies.

Then there is the VATS system. You hit the right bumper on your controller and the VATS system comes up and the game pauses. Each area of a enemies body is displayed along with your % chance of hitting that body part. You input attacks on these body parts and this uses action points. You queue up your attacks until your action points are gone. The the game switces to a cinematic camara angle and in slow motion your attacks are carried out. You can see your misses and your hits in this fashion. The hits when critical rip off body parts and heads or for explosive attacks turn your enemies into a misty spray [sm=00000106.gif]

It feels sort of like Fallout Tactics (which I liked a lot) you get to run around and explore and interect with the world in real time and when it comes time for combat you can either choose real time or with the press of a button resolve it by turn phases.

About 65% of the time I use the Vats system
I only use real time when I face very weak enemies that I know I can slaughter easily or I get such a good drop on them from short range than I can lay into them with a high chance of hitting them for good damage.

It is a very good combo of real time mode keeping things moving at a nice pace and when you need it turn based kicking in for some very fun tactical combat



Fallschirmjager -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/29/2008 9:50:27 PM)

The writing I do not think is quite up to Mass Effect quality (which has the best story and writing of any RPG I have yet played besides Planscape Torment) but is still very good.
This is more than made up for by the combat and graphics and sound and quality and design of the world.

As far as I am concerned the American RPG industry is on a roll right now while Japanese RPG makers continue to churn out the same form factor games that I played on the SNES and PS1.



jamus34 -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/30/2008 12:24:24 AM)

One thing I have noticed is that the VATS systems seems majorly overpowered compared to the original game.

Starting out in 1 I'd be lucky to get a 70% headshot chance at close range...here it seems like medium range regularly gives you 70-80% chances.



Erik Rutins -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/30/2008 12:39:19 AM)

Thanks for the additional info, I also liked Fallout Tactics. So far these reports are much more encouraging than I could have hoped. I'll have to add F3 to my wish list.



killroyishere -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/30/2008 1:00:44 AM)

What about adding turn based Close Combat to your list?



Fallschirmjager -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/30/2008 1:01:00 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: jamus34

One thing I have noticed is that the VATS systems seems majorly overpowered compared to the original game.

Starting out in 1 I'd be lucky to get a 70% headshot chance at close range...here it seems like medium range regularly gives you 70-80% chances.




Maybe I suck but so far I have found the game diffucult going. I wandered into downtown Washington and was quickly dispatched by Super Mutants. I tried it three more times and even though I could kill a few the mini guns and rocket launchers eventualy did me in.
I will have to come back with more ammo for my good weapons and improved armor.



105mm Howitzer -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/30/2008 3:58:26 AM)

Nah Fallschirm, that wasn't your fault. You probably encountered former politicians-turned-mutants directly emerged from the nuke shelters.[:D]



Perturabo -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/30/2008 2:45:02 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: jamus34

One thing I have noticed is that the VATS systems seems majorly overpowered compared to the original game.

Starting out in 1 I'd be lucky to get a 70% headshot chance at close range...here it seems like medium range regularly gives you 70-80% chances.

Even in the original game the accuracy seemed to be too big - I could get 75% on medium range with 25% Small Guns skill and Hunting Rifle. Now 70% headshots...

quote:

ORIGINAL: killroyishere

What about adding turn based Close Combat to your list?

Yeah. An innovative turn-based Close Combat on hexagonal map with icons instead of individual soldiers would be a lot more immersive than that ancient real-time mode.



Hertston -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/30/2008 9:20:04 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Old Eagle101

This is a great game. Will probably win everybody's "Game of the year" competition.



Agreed... I'm very pleasantly surprised, particularly that they DID manage to keep it 'Fallout'. That said, having spent my thirty quid and endured Far Cry 2 just long enough to realise it's a pile of overhyped cr*p, just about anything would look good!



Perturabo -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/30/2008 9:36:32 PM)

Fallout died when they lost the GURPS licence. SPECIAL is crap when compared to GURPS (though it's still the best thing I saw in cRPGs - but the combat is much worse than in Jagged Alliance 2 which is the closest thing to GURPS I saw on PC).
And Fallout 3 combat is completely irrelevant to the original concept of recreating the tabletop game on computer.



Lützow -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (10/31/2008 5:21:45 PM)

My conclusion after 2h of playing:

Shooter/RPG-Hybrid with stability issues, mediocre graphics and high gore level for the mainstream crowd. Tomorrow I'm going to bring it back to my local video-store, happy that I only payed for rent and didn't purchase the game.



Hertston -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (11/1/2008 8:09:52 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lützow

My conclusion after 2h of playing:

Shooter/RPG-Hybrid with stability issues, mediocre graphics and high gore level for the mainstream crowd.


I am tempted to ask how many games you have encountered that a) have better graphics than FO3 and b) weren't targeted at that awful 'mainstream crowd' ? [;)]

It is buggy; I've had more crashes with this in a couple of days than with the release version of Clear Sky, which is saying something.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Perturabo
Fallout died when they lost the GURPS licence.


Huh? '1' and '2' are a couple of the best PC RPG's ever. I'm not saying a GURPS game would have been worse, and it might even have been better, but to say the franchise 'died' is ludicrous.




Raindog101 -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (11/1/2008 8:26:17 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lützow

My conclusion after 2h of playing:

Shooter/RPG-Hybrid with stability issues, mediocre graphics and high gore level for the mainstream crowd. Tomorrow I'm going to bring it back to my local video-store, happy that I only payed for rent and didn't purchase the game.


Are you positive you rented Fallout 3? Because Fallout 3 is in no way a shooter. Like Fallschirmjager says if try and play it as a shooter you're dead meat. This game is no hybrid. It is a total RPG. I got the strategy guide today, it's almost 500 pages. You can play this game for years and still not see everything.

The game is almost exactly like 1 and 2 except instead of a 2D sprite you have a 3D char in a 3D world. It's Fallout all the way.

Bad graphics?? Are you sure you rented Fallout3?



Lützow -> RE: Only 12 days until Fallout3 (11/1/2008 10:18:22 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Old Eagle101
Are you positive you rented Fallout 3? Because Fallout 3 is in no way a shooter. Like Fallschirmjager says if try and play it as a shooter you're dead meat. This game is no hybrid. It is a total RPG. I got the strategy guide today, it's almost 500 pages. You can play this game for years and still not see everything.

The game is almost exactly like 1 and 2 except instead of a 2D sprite you have a 3D char in a 3D world. It's Fallout all the way.

Bad graphics?? Are you sure you rented Fallout3?



The V.A.T.S (pseudo turnbased combat system) only applies to the player toon, while enemies always attack in real time and close foes or small mobs (i.e. dogs, rats, etc.) are hard to target if you don't switch to 1st-person. I wouldn't complain if I could play from a zoomed out perspective and make it turnbased all the way but that's impossible here. F3 indeed took over a lot elements from it's predeccessor but the gameplay is rather about action than tactic.

About graphics: I play with max settings and high screen resolution but grass textures already blur within 10 m distances. Altogether it doesn't look better to me than a 3-years-old STALKER and in addition I get occassional crashes for which I blame the copy protection since I got a freshly installed Vista system here.



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