joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (Full Version)

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wernerpruckner -> joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/5/2008 5:52:17 PM)

VS and I will try to play through the short version of the NJ1 scenario.
VS will play the Axis - he is one of the most knowledgeable Axis gamers!
and I will play the Allied this time.

This is the first of three night scenarios and starts on the 21st of August 1941.
This scenario plays during the time of the destruction of Hamburg.

The Allied score triple for each terror target and normal for every other targets.





wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/5/2008 6:07:15 PM)

Because this will be a joint AAR, I will not discuss any future plans, but I will try to give a glimpse into the Allied side.
I will try to discuss past missions, and explain, why the Allied C in C is such an incompetent fool [X(]


In the NJ1 scenario BC is quite weak - there are still many Sterling and Wellington bombers used. There are not as many NIs as in the full campaign, because only BC is used.
Sterling bombers can carry a nice load, but lack altitude and are therefore any easy target for large AA concentrations.
The Wellington is a good and sturdy aircraft, but it is past its prime.
The Halifax II and Lancaster I will have to carry the main tasks, but I have to be careful. I do not have an unlimited stock of those.
Mosquito bombers have a nice aid -Oboe -, and can mark targets as pathfinders close to the homeland ( Oboe has a limited range from the closest Allied A/F).

There are even a few Lancaster IIIs, all of them pathfindercapable.....maybe I will use them for pinpoint attacks.

The helping force are 2 Wellington and one Mosquito RCM units as well as a few nightfighter units ( MosquitoII and Beaufighters)

here a look at the campaign information at the game start:

[image]local://upfiles/16527/098366BA36FB4F0598E446DC12256448.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/5/2008 6:10:02 PM)

The main strength of BC during this time will be the use of windows - and the Germans will have to adapt to the failure of their radar.



von Shagmeister -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/5/2008 6:35:03 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: swift

VS will play the Axis - he is one of the most knowledgeable Axis gamers!



Duh, but he still manages to send Werner the wrong file!

22Aug43 Axis

Bomber Command sends out multiple raids against area/rail targets. Since the introduction of their Duppel (Window) during the Hamburg raid last month most of the Nachtjäger force has been rendered impotent. All together we only manage to bring down 15 British bombers and of these only 7 are claimed by fighters. FuG 202 equipped a/c fail to get any sensor detections due to interference caused by window. FuG 212 a/c get two contacts but neither leads to an interception. It appears our a/c must rely on search lights and the fires of our burning cities to pick out enemy a/c. We can only hope that sensors in development allow us to overcome the severe restrictions imposed by window. Himmelbett is obsolete, we must chase the bombers to their targets and rely on our eyes!



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/5/2008 6:48:04 PM)


for turn 1 I used all A/C for a maximum effort turn.
I attack several different targets and used many NIs in streams and as patrols.

here is the raid list ( sorted for bomb raids)

[image]local://upfiles/16527/5B6365371EC54E689149E195AE758328.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/5/2008 6:50:28 PM)

here are the fly paths of Northern Germany

[image]local://upfiles/16527/0DE50046F8BE458F9A797060BD136C7F.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/5/2008 6:51:27 PM)

and central Germany

[image]local://upfiles/16527/CC63370E31C04D4E8E95D3A6C7E5ABCF.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/5/2008 6:52:47 PM)

the campaign information after turn 1

[image]local://upfiles/16527/C82BDABE31084D0E8DC6A125F862EFB8.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/5/2008 6:53:47 PM)

and the AAR of the raids:

[image]local://upfiles/16527/75ABB610D1D74B4D8BFC4F7DA9398A90.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/5/2008 6:55:49 PM)

you can see that my losses were in the raids against coastal towns ( Cuxhaven and Bremerhaven), which are not only protected by the typical Luftwaffe Flak units, but also by German Navy AA guns.



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/5/2008 6:56:56 PM)

and here my A/C losses:

[image]local://upfiles/16527/33DC45E8C01E46F79C4641F6DA4A5182.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/5/2008 6:58:25 PM)

for turn 2 there will be less action,
I forgot to move some units before the first turn.
Also several units are low on morale and others are tired.



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/5/2008 8:03:34 PM)

turn 2 only sees one weak raid to Lingen, and a few NIs to known NF bases

[image]local://upfiles/16527/2D1E624F1EA24AE2B43BA085C2EFDAEA.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/5/2008 8:05:49 PM)

here the flypaths.
you can see that the additional waypoints can help creating a better path through enemy territory, or to confuse the opponent

[image]local://upfiles/16527/EA8BABE8E40F42D6989091BFE4E08484.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/5/2008 8:07:44 PM)

VS keeps his forces still grounded [8D]
he is probably waiting for an deep inland strike.

[image]local://upfiles/16527/983B2AE9F5F94574B329ED6FE332353E.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/5/2008 8:09:09 PM)

it looks like the raid against the small town of Lingen did some damage

[image]local://upfiles/16527/B2EEAEDC162E45FC9DEEAA17167E9BD0.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/5/2008 8:11:38 PM)

planning for turn 3.

NO MISSIONS, all A/C are grounded because of the amount of low clouds.



I would attack the enemy, as long only Germany is clouded, but I am not risking a bunch of landing accidents in this foggy weather.


[image]local://upfiles/16527/39B2617523EE418D8A5C5F58AD275E2A.jpg[/image]



Hard Sarge -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/6/2008 12:32:23 PM)

Bite em Shaggy, Bite em



Terminus -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/6/2008 1:31:01 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: swift

The main strength of BC during this time will be the use of windows - and the Germans will have to adapt to the failure of their radar.


[:D][:D] I know you mean Window, obviously, but still... That BC should have an advantage by using Windows...[:D][:D]



Hard Sarge -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/6/2008 1:34:22 PM)

Term, you not seen Swift play, he means Windows, even Vista[sm=comp16.gif]

I would like to see the house rules he came up with, I feel sorry for Shaggy (except, I know Shaggy is pretty swift himself :)





von Shagmeister -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/6/2008 1:43:33 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hard Sarge

Bite em Shaggy, Bite em


I'd love to, but I appear to have had my dentures stolen. I'm having to use my gums whilst I grown new teeth.



Hard Sarge -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/6/2008 1:48:57 PM)

ahhhhh, keep forgetting I not the only old one here :P

okay

Kick em Shaggy, Kick em



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/6/2008 8:39:07 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hard Sarge

Term, you not seen Swift play, he means Windows, even Vista[sm=comp16.gif]

I would like to see the house rules he came up with, I feel sorry for Shaggy (except, I know Shaggy is pretty swift himself :)





I somewhat like Vista [:D]
but the computer I am playing at the moment is with Linux [X(]



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/6/2008 8:40:00 PM)

turn 4 sent to Shaggy.

This time more action [8D]



von Shagmeister -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/7/2008 3:57:36 PM)

25Aug43

Extensive radio activity detected by Y-Dienst. Large scale raid predicted.

Large stream approaches the northern Ruhr, controllers begin assembling fighters in the area using the new Wilde Sau and Zahme Sau techniques. Atmospheric conditions are good, searchlights illuminate the clouds and allow for numerous interceptions. To the surprise of the controllers the stream passes the Ruhr onwards deeper into the Reich. Target is in the Leipzig area, fighters directed accordingly and more interceptions are made in the vacinity of the target.

A second large stream is detected over the North Sea heading across the Jutland peninsular, suspect one of the Baltic ports will be targetted. Fighters start to be assembled, looks like it isn't Kiel. Target is Stettin, fighters to assemble in area. Searchlights and flak barrage illuminate many RAF bombers, Pauke, Pauke heard many times (helped now by the moon).

Many Allied a/c are bought down (133 (90 by fighters, 43 by flak)) but still many targets are left as blackened ruins. The enemy has had to pay for his success with the blood of his bomber crews. Most of the a/c bought down are Lancasters and Halifaxs but examination of wreckage also reveals three Wellington Elint a/c (codes identified as 192 Sqn) which Stab XII.Fl.Kps. is particularly pleased about.

Analysis: The RAF planners made serious errors by having two diverse streams allowing us to fight two seperate battles using units from different areas. The first stream in particular (Leipzig raid) was poorly routed over a heavy flak concentration (northern Ruhr) allowing a large number of interceptions to be made (resulting in an estimated 50-60% of the losses on this one raid). Whether this was intentional to throw off controllers as to the real target (which succeeded until stream passed the Ruhr) or if it was poor planning (doubtful) is not known but RAF losses were undoubtedly higher because of this.

Our crews have been quick to adapt to the threat of window and our new control techniques. FuG 212 offers a degree of immunity from interference (13 detections leading to 8 interceptions) whilst FuG 202 is rendered practically useless (1 detection, 1 interception) except in the hands of the most experienced crews. Enemy losses were extremely heavy but even so we couldn't stop the destruction of the targets.



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/7/2008 4:07:50 PM)

It was indeed bloody.
I thought I was well away from the Flak concentration with my raid.....but the units thought of shortening their way ( they did not use all waypoints....duuuh [X(][:(] )

and my major mistake.....I forgot to check the moon rising and setting times and I paid dearly for it

here the planed raids for turn 4

The Leipzig raids targeted the big ALUM site with the hope of creepback bombing over the city

[image]local://upfiles/16527/0B6556F5DED14B34B1EAF751207E7EA1.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/7/2008 4:09:35 PM)

just to show how I use the waypoints ( at least sometimes):
here is the Soest raid

[image]local://upfiles/16527/162178C698784EB5B7EC14E3107E2F95.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/7/2008 4:11:17 PM)

and here is the campaign info after the bloody turn 4:

[image]local://upfiles/16527/EB67D9ABB64C4F9C8B88A89AB816CFE2.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/7/2008 4:12:13 PM)

here is the after mission report:


[image]local://upfiles/16527/37616C5F222D490089F78BAD462F15F6.jpg[/image]



wernerpruckner -> RE: joint AAR Nachtjagd 1 - VonShagmeister vs swift (11/7/2008 4:14:14 PM)


and now one of the little positive things of that turn.....
creepback did work at Leipzig
and something is still burning ( red dot.......black dots are totally destroyed areas )

[image]local://upfiles/16527/1DC46B5F0E974DEBA14D05637C270A76.jpg[/image]



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