Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (Full Version)

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Terminus -> Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 7:25:32 PM)

Okay, boys and... well, let's not kid ourselves, boys...[:D] This thread will be used for discussing the AE editor. For those modders familiar with WitP Editor X, you'll see much stuff that looks familiar, but for those used to the stock editors, it'll be full of new shiny bits.

I'll be going through all of it with screenshots and such. Ask questions as you will, and I'll do my best to answer them, within the usual restrictions.



witpqs -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 7:36:07 PM)

So when is it being released along with the rest of AE? [:'(]



Terminus -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 7:36:37 PM)

First off, aircraft. In the attached screenshot, we have the B5N2 Kate. Most of it is pretty self-explanatory, but there are a couple of things I want to explain.

First off, you see that the aircraft appears to come pre-installed with MAD and radar when it becomes available in April 1942. However, this is not the case. Instead, those devices do not appear until the devices themselves become available in 1944. In-Game, they will be greyed out until they become active.

Secondly, in the bottom right corner, you see that we have added the ability to enter specific ranges for any aircraft, with or without drop tanks. Very useful, and less difficult to find than you'd think.

[image]local://upfiles/16369/0CD1A7DAD4F44A37B03CA8320FD19FD4.jpg[/image]



GaryChildress -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 7:38:57 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Okay, boys and... well, let's not kid ourselves, boys...[:D] This thread will be used for discussing the AE editor. For those modders familiar with WitP Editor X, you'll see much stuff that looks familiar, but for those used to the stock editors, it'll be full of new shiny bits.

I'll be going through all of it with screenshots and such. Ask questions as you will, and I'll do my best to answer them, within the usual restrictions.


Many thanks Terminus! [&o][&o][&o] IMO this will be a most important thread for modders! I've already been working out details for a new mod at the Warship Project Forums and am looking forward to doing some preliminary research based upon what data AE will require. A good look at the editor will really help get things in motion early! Then when AE comes out it will merely be a matter of entering the already collected data! [8D]



Terminus -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 7:45:52 PM)

Segue'ing from aircraft to air groups, here's how that tab in the editor looks. Notice the following (from top to bottom):

- You can rename air groups at given dates. The Japs were fond of this.

- Any air group can be defined as the parent of a detachment of itself, which can be pre-defined. This functionality is similar to the land unit system, which I'll look at later.

- Any air groups can be withdrawn and returned later, like ships and land units.

- Air groups can be set to be resized at a given date (3 or 4 times, IIRC).



[image]local://upfiles/16369/4093100977FF4E449FBCFE8218ED32C7.jpg[/image]



GaryChildress -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 7:52:04 PM)

Most everything does appear to be straightforward. What is the difference between "amphibian" and "float capable"? Also what is the significance of the "Heavy bomber", "medium bomber", etc. toggle boxes as opposed to having the drop down box which has the aircraft "type" "Torpedo Bomber"? In other words why are there seemingly two places to denote whether the plane is a bomber or not?

[image]local://upfiles/17421/B07EE8ACBB5B46B3BAE4D33D34707A86.jpg[/image]



Terminus -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 7:55:01 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Gary Childress

Most everything does appear to be straightforward. What is the difference between "amphibian" and "float capable"? Also what is the significance of the "Heavy bomber", "medium bomber", etc. toggle boxes as opposed to having the drop down box which has the aircraft "type" "Torpedo Bomber"? In other words why are there seemingly two places to denote whether the plane is a bomber or not?

[image]local://upfiles/17421/B07EE8ACBB5B46B3BAE4D33D34707A86.jpg[/image]


The difference between amphibian and float capable is whether or not they can be flown from land-locked bases or not. The difference between the different types of bomber has to do with basing requirements.



Terminus -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 7:59:03 PM)

Taking a random hop over to the task forces tab, which is now separate from the locations tab (more on that later). The main new stuff here is in the top right corner, where you can switch on or off the first turn movement bonus (individually for each task force), and the different routing options, i.e. pre-setting waypoints or patrol zones for the task force to follow.

[image]local://upfiles/16369/61490C3EEDD941869E90035CF8F32BCA.jpg[/image]



Terminus -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 8:07:42 PM)

Here from there, this next tab fulfills the function it took a whole stock editor to do, i.e. scenario data. It's mainly self-explanatory, except the little check-box at the bottom marked "Use Respawn". You're welcome, Ron...[:D]

[image]local://upfiles/16369/3168A068525541D2B28982D46B637C25.jpg[/image]



Terminus -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 8:14:24 PM)

Moving on to pilots, here's Pappy Boyington. Note that he's also a leader:


[image]local://upfiles/16369/B080CBB5B0784AF58DBD25E350A8FC38.jpg[/image]



Terminus -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 8:14:53 PM)

And here he is with his leader hat on...

[image]local://upfiles/16369/38695F3248CF48A6B82713335ACD2A74.jpg[/image]



Terminus -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 8:22:23 PM)

Moving over to the Locations tab, it still covers both bases and land units, including HQ's and TOEs. There's much new stuff here:

- Notice that there are now "garrison" fields for both Jap and Allied garrison requirements for a given base.

- There's a "prime unit" field, which works similar to pre-split air units as discussed above.

- We have a bunch of checkboxes just around the middle of the screen, allowing you to make a unit static, making Command HQ's temporarily or permanently restricted and marking something a "convoy unit", which we use to represent off-map supply convoys, coming in to be immediately disbanded, transferring all the devices assigned to it to the pool.



[image]local://upfiles/16369/63F6558D4D4A42D494B145EBD00D1D8C.jpg[/image]



Terminus -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 8:43:46 PM)

The "devices" tab is still a bit in progress, as you'll see in the top right corner. The bunch of text boxes up there enters the "exchange rate" between raw materials and industrial output. When we go gold, it might not be in this tab anymore. Otherwise, the tab is relatively self-explanatory.

[image]local://upfiles/16369/A7FCFD07F1CD483CB5C21DFE1F9EC49B.jpg[/image]



Terminus -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 8:46:01 PM)

The AI data tab is a child of the totally rewritten AI processor, and I haven't quite gotten used to it myself yet (although I had to write scripts for my own scenarios). I'll just put up the screenshot, and let you ask questions.

[image]local://upfiles/16369/B45EBDCA64864CD88B743B14A41061DC.jpg[/image]



Terminus -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 8:49:19 PM)

Almost there now...[:D] Here's the "ship" tab, showing how you can pre-define damage, including major damage and repair mode this ship starts in. Additionally, there's the "temp AK convert" box, which allows you to pre-set Jap xAK's to be xAP's, i.e. temporary troop transports.

[image]local://upfiles/16369/8DE91B071CC84FBFBFB734B9458937FB.jpg[/image]



Terminus -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 8:56:32 PM)

And finally, the "ship class" tab, showing the Clemson-class DD. I chose this to demonstrate our "convert from/convert to" functionality.

Each group of class that you can convert from and to are grouped together in what we call a "bind". The list just below the ship shil graphics show the bind for the Clemsons, letting you convert to long-range escorts, fast transports, fast minelayers, fast minesweepers and seaplane tenders.

On the right, you can see the "Convert From Class" box, which signifies that class #2430 is a baseline for all the "Convert To" classes to be built from. The next one, #2431, is also a "Convert From" class, letting you still do the conversions even after the basic destroyer has been upgraded.

In the main bunch of data fields, the "Upgrade dmg", "Upgrade delay", "Conversion delay" and "Upgrade Shipyard size" fields lay down the specifics for upgrades and conversions. Since #2430 is a baseline class, it has no data in these fields.

Other than that, not much in it, really.

[image]local://upfiles/16369/1A8EA0E33EB543C5A28F929C94CB286B.jpg[/image]



GaryChildress -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 9:00:09 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

quote:

ORIGINAL: Gary Childress

Most everything does appear to be straightforward. What is the difference between "amphibian" and "float capable"? Also what is the significance of the "Heavy bomber", "medium bomber", etc. toggle boxes as opposed to having the drop down box which has the aircraft "type" "Torpedo Bomber"? In other words why are there seemingly two places to denote whether the plane is a bomber or not?

[image]local://upfiles/17421/B07EE8ACBB5B46B3BAE4D33D34707A86.jpg[/image]


The difference between amphibian and float capable is whether or not they can be flown from land-locked bases or not. The difference between the different types of bomber has to do with basing requirements.


I think I understand the different bomber check boxes in that case.

However, I still don't understand the difference between "amphibian" and "float capable". If a plane is checked "amphibian" what capabilities/limitations will it have. If it is checked "float capable" what capabilities/limitations will it have?

Many thanks!



Terminus -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 9:01:19 PM)

"Amphibians" can fly from water, like float planes, and land bases, like wheeled planes. You can fly an amphibian from Chungking, but not a float plane.



Historiker -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 9:02:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus
[image]local://upfiles/16369/0CD1A7DAD4F44A37B03CA8320FD19FD4.jpg[/image]

Can a plane have more than one designition? e.g. Carrier, medium and amphibian?
Do this options differ with other plane types?



Terminus -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 9:05:00 PM)

The options are the same for all plane types, and you can most certainly make a carrier-capable medium bomber (or a heavy one, for that matter). You can make it an amphibian, as well, but it won't have any effect.



Historiker -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 9:08:26 PM)

Does makeing a fighter "light bomber" mean it won't attack via dive?
What means DT Ordnance?
What makes an attack bomber special? Dive Bombing?

thx



Terminus -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 9:15:42 PM)

Some of those boxes might not be there any more when we go gold.

"Light Bomber Capable" is again for basing requirements, usually combined with "level bomber" in the type field. "DT ordnance" doesn't seem to be used any more (the latter used to be for drop tanks, which is handled differently now. Like I said previously, some of this is still work-in-progress.

As for "attack bombers", those are primarily strafers. Think gunship B-25's and A-26s. They're usually combined with medium bomber.



GaryChildress -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 9:18:33 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

"Amphibians" can fly from water, like float planes, and land bases, like wheeled planes. You can fly an amphibian from Chungking, but not a float plane.


So an "amphibian" can fly from both land locked bases and bases near water (including undeveloped "dot" bases). A float plane can be flown from only bases near water (including undeveloped "dot" bases)?

One more question, the fields for Range Max, Range Extended, Range Normal...can they be entered independently of the endurance/cruise speed fields? In other words in Vanilla WITP range was calculated by endurance x speed. With the new fields in the editor, will we be required to enter range seperately?

Thanks.

[image]local://upfiles/17421/803A45A08B714DB99B9F80482DCD666C.jpg[/image]



Terminus -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 9:19:47 PM)

Yes, you will need to fill the whole thing, as far as I know...



Historiker -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 9:20:26 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Some of those boxes might not be there any more when we go gold.

"Light Bomber Capable" is again for basing requirements, usually combined with "level bomber" in the type field. "DT ordnance" doesn't seem to be used any more (the latter used to be for drop tanks, which is handled differently now. Like I said previously, some of this is still work-in-progress.

As for "attack bombers", those are primarily strafers. Think gunship B-25's and A-26s. They're usually combined with medium bomber.

Thank you! :)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Yes, you will need to fill the whole thing, as far as I know...

amazing! [&o]



GaryChildress -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 9:37:43 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Yes, you will need to fill the whole thing, as far as I know...


Thanks Terminus! [&o] If range is entered independently then doesn't that make the endurance field somewhat irrelevant? Is there a practical reason for keeping the endurance field maybe I'm just not perceiving? Why is there a need to have it or is it one of the things that might disappear when AE goes gold? [&:]



51st Highland Div -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 9:54:13 PM)

Im speechless..the editor is a mods dream come true on top of AE being developed and released...[:D][:D]



Terminus -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 9:59:14 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Gary Childress

quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Yes, you will need to fill the whole thing, as far as I know...


Thanks Terminus! [&o] If range is entered independently then doesn't that make the endurance field somewhat irrelevant? Is there a practical reason for keeping the endurance field maybe I'm just not perceiving? Why is there a need to have it or is it one of the things that might disappear when AE goes gold? [&:]


It might. Things are still in a bit of a flux.



Historiker -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 10:12:40 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: 51st Highland Div

Im speechless..the editor is a mods dream come true on top of AE being developed and released...[:D][:D]

I still miss a "different weapon options for one plane" possibility [sm=sad-1361.gif]



GaryChildress -> RE: Admiral's Edition Editor Thread (3/19/2009 10:16:28 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

And finally, the "ship class" tab, showing the Clemson-class DD. I chose this to demonstrate our "convert from/convert to" functionality.

Each group of class that you can convert from and to are grouped together in what we call a "bind". The list just below the ship shil graphics show the bind for the Clemsons, letting you convert to long-range escorts, fast transports, fast minelayers, fast minesweepers and seaplane tenders.

On the right, you can see the "Convert From Class" box, which signifies that class #2430 is a baseline for all the "Convert To" classes to be built from. The next one, #2431, is also a "Convert From" class, letting you still do the conversions even after the basic destroyer has been upgraded.



IMO the convert to/from boxes will be essential for any Alt_Naval based mod considering it's use of "shadow" ships which convert to combat types so I have a couple questions here as well.

1. How is a "bind" defined or how does it work in other words? Do I just pick whatever (previously unused) number I want and put it into the "Bind classes" value box then assign all ship classes which are part of that bind to that number? So let's say I want the Atlanta class cruisers to be part of a series of conversions. Let's say the number 123 isn't being used by any other binds. Can I therefore pick 123 and enter it into the "bind classes" box in the Atlanta cruiser screen to create a new bind?

2. How does convert to/from work? Let's say I want Atlanta type cruisers to convert into minelayers? I'm guessing that I check "convert from" for the base class. For the minelayer conversion I would check "convert to"? I assume simply checking the "convert to" box will make it a permanent conversion? So if I want to be able to convert the Atlanta class minelayer back into a cruiser I would have to check BOTH the "convert to" AND "convert from" boxes under the minelayer class screen? PLUS I would have to have BOTH "convert to" and "convert from" checked in the cruiser tab so that I can convert back to a cruiser. I hope that is clear.

3. What sets the conversion time for the "binds" or is there a setting? Obviously if the ship is only making a mild conversion, say a tanker into a cargo ship, I want a short conversion time but if the ship is going to be a radical conversion say from a tanker into a carrier, then I want a longer conversion time. Can this be set in the editor for the different binds? So for instance if I convert a tanker into a cargo ship maybe it only takes 60 days or something for the bind to occur. If I want it to convert into a carrier then it might take 180 days or something.

Thanks.



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