YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (Full Version)

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82ndtrooper -> YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/7/2010 7:21:07 PM)

This is a game I started a few weeks back with some new players and we have mostly just been talking back and forth in emails. But for me playing as the west something new and different has happened in this game and I wanted to start a thread about it to show you guys whats going on.

Both sides can post here if they wish I wont be revealing anything that the Axis doesn't already know.

For those that don't know me let me explain a little bit about how i approach strategy games.
I am as competitive as anyone but I don't mind losing,there are other aspects of these games I enjoy as much as winning. Like I really enjoy trying out new strategies and solving strategic problems and every game I play I do something new and different, this causes me to lose more than I would sometimes but if I don't then I get in a rut and get bored with any strategy game I play. (this is also why I make a good test game partner for Explorer2 I find a lot of bugs and since I do things different every time, I have been directly responsible for many of the changes in his scenario, even if he has absolutely destroyed me the last two games we have played)

This is one of the reasons I enjoy playing against new players, not because they are easy to beat but because they approach the game differently then veteran players in that they haven't yet found out what tactics and strategies work best for them so they are full of new ideas and different approaches to the game. I always learn something new every time I play with them. I also play against them differently because of this, I still try to win and I play my absolute best but rather than try and force the game in a direction I want it to go I sit back and let them take it in any direction they want, to see what ideas they come up with. Then I try my best to counter it.
I really enjoy this type of game play and it allows new players a chance to flex their minds and try out their ideas, so its a win, win situation. Especially when you realize that i am a better defensive player than I am offensive and in "AT" I am better with naval forces than I am with land forces. I really enjoy the naval aspect of this game and because of that I like playing the West and Japan the most and I feel like I am pretty good at it.

Which brings us to this game.

I am the west and its now just Nov 22,1940.
Players:

Axis: DRommel
Western Allies: 82ndtrooper
Soviet Union / China: ehzorg
Japan: Von Dudert

I started the game expecting to try something new as usual and I was going to play the action cards that allow me to defend France (which I have never tried) so I had been saving up all my PP. When it came time to play them I realized that if I did that it would delay the others from being able to get started in the game so I decided not to do it since they are all new players and I knew they would be eager to get going and playing their regimes.
Boy talk about a stroke of luck on my part. In any other game I would have already spent that PP on FT II and INF II etc... I would not have had that much PP saved up, this literally saved me.

you see Drommel as the axis player came at the War in the Atlantic with a little bit different strategy and the desire to win it. From the second turn of the game I was fighting the most intense battle in the Atlantic I have ever fought. It was so intense that I had moved my med fleets out of the med and to the Atlantic before Italy had even came into the game. I have never had to do that before I have always been able to defend the Atlantic and leave my Med fleets in the Med.

I wish I had been taking screen shots from the start but we had decided not to bother with a AAR. I went back and opened some old turns though and discovered that he was on average easily destroying over 2000 supply a turn and on one turn he destroyed over 4000.
If you have ever played the west you will understand that's a huge part of England's supply so early in the game.

I found myself feeling exactly like England must have felt in WWII during the winter of 39-40. I was very low on supply I could barely keep my fleets in fuel and I wasn't able to produce anything but supply and there where U-Boats everywhere. I was literally starving in England.

By around April of 1940 I was down to only 4 active destroyers in the Atlantic and they where new, I also had my starting fleets but by this time in the game I would normally have a dozen or more destroyers working the Atlantic. It was so bad I couldn't even keep the channel open to salvage units from France, I had to move what I could from Marseilles to North Africa instead. I only got one unit moved to England.

For the first time, I was losing the war for the Atlantic.

Now this is where that stroke of luck came into play. Remember all that PP I had been saving ? Well in the spring or early summer of 1940 sometime I had enough to buy Carrier III and I began producing carrier air III as fast as I could and getting them on too my carriers, this and the arrival of my Med fleets at exactly the right time is all that saved me.
Around the end of summer or early fall of 40, we had a big naval battle at the southern end of the Channel just as my med fleets arrived and that coupled with the carrier air III allowed me to pull off a victory that without both I most likely would have lost. To understand how big it was I sank 11 subs in that fight. Sheer luck on my part that I had saved up that PP and then decided not to spend it.
After this battle which was only 3 or 4 turns ago the pressure in the Atlantic eased up and I wondered where his subs had went. More about that in a few minutes.

So here it is Nov of 1940 and I have carrier III !!! not because I wanted to have it but because I was forced to get it or starve. This has absolutely changed everything for me strategic wise in this game. My normal Tech tree is a shambles and it will take me months to tech up units that I need too, and everything that I would have normally planned to do is thrown out the window,My production of units is also so far behind in England that its impossible for me to even consider any type of invasion at this point. so my standard way of playing the basics of the game is gone for this game.
BUT....
Having carrier III this early has opened up unlimited new possibilities that I am eagerly looking forward to exploring. Out with the old and in with the new [:D]

for example this is my new Sub Killer fleet that I have come up with. I can show you this because that sneaky DRommel just found my fleets I had waiting to pounce on him this last turn so he has already discovered them.
Expect to see these little fleets all over like fleas on a dog.


[image]local://upfiles/30814/A730BAEFE4CD4605AAF6BB111C150708.jpg[/image]

I think it looks pretty good on paper so to speak and I can make a lot of them which trust me I am doing as fast as I can. We will have to see how they work out in combat.
Compared to a regular CV-II which holds 7 planes I can make three of these which will hold 6 planes and will cost me 2000 more production, but I don't have to wait for the Hulls to pop.



82ndtrooper -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/7/2010 7:53:19 PM)

ok remember me wondering where all his subs had gone in the Atlantic ?

Well he obviously realized that I had moved my Med fleets to the Atlantic so he seems to have shifted to the Med where I was forced to leave myself undefended.

This turn Greece came online and he has pulled off a brilliant attack on Greece with minimal forces that has all but taken it out of the game the very first turn.
I forgot to take a screen shot so the following is from the history screen.

This is what I opened my turn to in Greece

[image]local://upfiles/30814/CCE7616768C14C43BA9600E00D0D91D1.jpg[/image]

This shows a excellent understanding of the game and ability to plan ahead and is the kind of move I would expect to see from a veteran player like Explorer2, Tweber, Grumpy or Bart etc....

He may be a new player but he is playing like an expert.



82ndtrooper -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/7/2010 8:02:22 PM)

this is where I ended up at in greece. I dont see how I can possibly save greece my fleets are in the Atlantic, he has Athens blockaded and the Italian Air Force is bombing Athens to dust.
very well played on his part.

[image]local://upfiles/30814/8291C51266A34420A6EACE4AEAFADD1C.jpg[/image]



82ndtrooper -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/7/2010 8:07:09 PM)

Remember how I had to pull my fleets out of the med asap ? Well in doing so I forgot to destroy the Italian East Africa Korp and now he is using them to be a thorn in my side. He doesn't miss a beat.
Actually it wasn't that I forgot to destroy the E.Afrika Korp it was that I had to move my fleets out of the Med before Italy even came online so I had no chance to eliminate this unit.

[image]local://upfiles/30814/108B6C483F344F4C89B5BDAAF23F1F83.jpg[/image]



82ndtrooper -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/7/2010 8:11:35 PM)

Well that's the current situation I hope you all enjoy watching how this plays out. I find myself in one of the most interesting games I have ever played as the West and I am eagerly looking forward to seeing how things go. I cant wait to see what the other players come up with in this game. I have a feeling its going to be a blast.



Josh -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/7/2010 9:39:48 PM)

"I hope you all enjoy watching how this plays out"

Well I sure do [&o] Masterfully executed move in Greece by your opponent.... a new player you say? [:)]
Still, those Fallschirmjäger will be in a lot of trouble if the cavalry don't show up soon, I mean soon.



82ndtrooper -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/8/2010 12:16:38 AM)

I agree that most likely that para unit will be destroyed next turn but it has already done its job. My two units north of it will be out of supply next turn and I doubt they will survive. I had some readiness left in my HQ unit and meant to attack that para unit that turn but forgot to do it when I started taking screen shots. not that it would have made any real difference



DRommel -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/8/2010 1:30:29 AM)

I must say, I'm not a rooky and had some experiance in the game.
And I play currently against Tom, so I laern from one off the best.
Also I read or try to read most of the AAR reports here one the forum, from witch I also learn alot.

I try to post some comments here, if there is anything to report and if I can gif some whitout giving to much hints away.

In this game I tryed, just like trooped mentioned, to be a big player in the Atlantic
If not to win then to try and by time for my forces in France to prepare for the big and little insurgens from the WA.
What I can tell, Trooper will soon see it, all the Coastalcities off France, have now Coastalbatteries.
and the first fortifications for defends are inplace. This is much harder to do if the WA start to herras my troops.
In Greece: I had to do this right because the Balkan countries are still frozen. and the only way into Greece in from Albania. But historicly I belief i'm doing just right, Para's did partisipate in the battle for Greece.



82ndtrooper -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/8/2010 9:13:10 PM)

Ahah ! you have been playing with Tom. haha that certainly explains somethings.

But to be honest if I had known I wouldn't have changed the way I played at all. You where forcing me to react to you from the second turn of the game and I couldn't have done much, if anything different. After your expert attack on Greece I Knew I was up against a veteran player and that I would have to play as hard as I can to compete.
I am excited about where I am in the game right now. In the three or four years I have been playing this game I cant remember ever seeing anyone that had carrier III in 1940 as the West or any regime. So its a brand new situation and I have been thinking a lot about it the last couple weeks. Originally I was concerned that I HAD to spend 300+ PP in 1940 on carrier III just to survive because I have always used that PP to get Infantry II and Fighter II etc... so I am way behind teching up those units. This is a concern for me in all theaters of operation. How can I survive with Infantry I and fighters I in North Africa, India, Burma and the Pacific ?
But after thinking about it carefully I realized I can turn this to my advantage and that I have a rare opportunity here to develop a brand new strategy for playing the West that others can use in the future. I am excited about the challenge.

So this is the question.
How do I take carrier III and use it effectively enough to compensate for my lack of low tech in other areas ? What new strategy and new tactics can I come up with ?

I don't know yet but I am working on it. [:)]



Josh -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/9/2010 10:14:38 AM)

Well he learned it from the master that's for sure [:)] You might have gotten more than you asked for LOL. It's gonna be a challenging game that's for sure.
Inf II and Fighter II is the conventional choice, defensive battles, outnumbering and flanking seems to be your choice then... I don't know, it will be tough. Carrier III... well we'll see how it plays out.



ehzorg -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/9/2010 7:02:42 PM)

Hello there, China/SU player here.

This is my first game as China/SU against a human opponent, although I have played other WaW revised games as Axis / Western Allies previously. It remains to be seen if this knowledge allows me to put up a good fight...

Not much to report as China thus far. I can report that bridges over the Yangtze have been blown at Shanghai and Nanking. Hopefully we can get our engineers down south to blow the last bridge before the coming storm.

I won't reveal what the Chinese industries have been working on yet, but as you know it's always a toss-up between more meat for the grinder (infantry/conscripts) and more dicey tactics that require PP and research.

More reports to come when interesting things start happening...



82ndtrooper -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/9/2010 7:29:55 PM)

hey glad you posted on the thread Ehzorg. Now we just need japan to post and everyone will be represented.

Not a lot to report from the west this turn except that greece has held on but I expect for it to fall next turn.

[image]local://upfiles/30814/B89001DC45BA4453B1C309366D876560.jpg[/image]



82ndtrooper -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/9/2010 7:33:12 PM)

this is the current totals for the west.


[image]local://upfiles/30814/E2C11AE69ED842C3B2521E8CF3854C61.jpg[/image]



82ndtrooper -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/9/2010 7:55:56 PM)

I wanted to post that to show the results so far, it seems there was some confusion about my earlier post describing how DRommel had done such a great job in the War for the Atlantic and it was thought that he had sank most of my fleet. I didn't lose but 1 cruiser from my capital fleets.

To understand what he did you have to realize that as the west you start out with very limited production and with the historical supply option selected you get a lot of your supply from Canada.

Now when I play the west I always take the first few turns in England and produce infantry and some armor units to set up my defense. This way no German player will have a easy go at trying Sea Lion. So for the first few turns with me producing that in england I can only produce one or two destroyers per turn.

Now what DRommel did so well was destroy that supply I was getting from canada and sink any destroyers he could. So by January or February of 1940 I found that he had sank 10 of the 14 destroyers I had built and I had sank 20 of his subs. BUT more importantly he had destroyed 40,000 to 50,000 supply. That was around 40% to 50% of my total supply production. I found my land units in England below 30% readiness and I had all my production on supply so I was unable to build any more destroyers and still my supply wasn't keeping up during the winter. At this point I had to turn off supply to some of my land units so I could resupply my capital fleets to keep fighting. By spring North and South Coastal commands where around 20 readiness and if he had done operation Sea Lion he could have taken England with a few harsh words.
That was why I bought carrier III and as you can see since then I was able to turn things around in the Atlantic for now.  So the lesson is you don't have to sink the Royal Navy to win the war in the Atlantic.



82ndtrooper -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/9/2010 8:03:23 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Josh

Well he learned it from the master that's for sure [:)] You might have gotten more than you asked for LOL. It's gonna be a challenging game that's for sure.
Inf II and Fighter II is the conventional choice, defensive battles, outnumbering and flanking seems to be your choice then... I don't know, it will be tough. Carrier III... well we'll see how it plays out.


Aye Josh its going to be tough but I have come up with a couple different battle plans. All I can say is that this is going to be a different game for the west if I can pull a couple things off.



82ndtrooper -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/15/2010 8:47:19 PM)

Not a lot to report, Athens has fallen as expected. So Greece is lost. I have some plans going into effect but cant report on them yet.

I have named that little unit I have been making the Sea Flea and expect to see it everywhere this game I really like it and I think its going to be a lot of fun to play around with.



ehzorg -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/16/2010 5:09:18 PM)

Soviet Union now awake (Jan '41).

Stalin has replaced that pesky critic Zhukov as chief of his General Staff - we've got a much more reliable man there now. Things are looking up-n-up now that we've shot all of the other dissenting commanders. Of course we'll have to keep an eye on that rogue Adolf, but he's got to respect the vast armies we've got securing the border. Perhaps we should annex Finland or Northern China... oh what to do, what to do.



Von Dudert -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/16/2010 10:31:10 PM)

Greetings,
Japan player here.

This is my first time posting on the forums, as well as my first serious effort playing as the Japanese. My previous experience has been getting crushed by ehzorg several times playing as the WA. Not an encouraging resume. Fortunately David has shared some thoughts on basic Japanese strategy. Hopefully I can put his advise to use.

As far as the current state of the Japanese war effort, I would summarize it as trying to build a strong enough army to capture and hold the needed Chinese objectives and at the same time try to keep my gas-guzzeling fleet supplied. The little extra I'm using for needed additions to my fleet and PPs. I'm not posting any screen shots for now since there's not much to show.

I did build some engineers early and have added a factory location on the coast near Port Arthur. That should free up some supply production from the other Japanese cities. At least I'll have the engineers on hand to rebuild the blown bridges when the time comes to attack China.

I've moved the fleet units to warm weather ports to minimize the winter penalty to their supplies.

I find the news that the WA has invested in Carrier IIIs disconcerting but there's little I can do about that. At least the Japanese receive new naval technology once the Pacific blitz card is played.

I have made some recon sorties to the south and they have revealed that the Aust/NZ cities have been producing a lot of SMG infantry. They have transported some to garrisoned Port Moresby as well. Additionally there is a line of fortifications that has been constructed along the Burmese border.

The Chinese seem to be forward deployed so I appears I'll have a fight on my hands to drive them back from the Wuhan sector.

I'll have to be patient and wait to see how things play out between Germany and the Russians. In the meantime I'll keep building up my strength.

Von Dudert









explorer2 -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/16/2010 11:07:20 PM)

Von Dudert-
Sounds like all your opponents have been reading recent AAR's carefully and are very well prepared for you.
Good luck. Sounds like you're going to need it!



82ndtrooper -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/16/2010 11:31:20 PM)

Hey Von Dudert and welcome !
good to see you posting.

yes the carrier III thing is most likely going to effect the pacific war more than anything else. I had a special plan developed, But it fell through because I cant move through the panama canal until the pacific blitz card is played. So its back to the drawing board for me because its too far to get forces in place going through the med.

We will see how this plays out I will most likely take some risks I wouldn't normally do and I could get creamed.
good luck and have fun
I will be happy to answer any questions also if needed.



82ndtrooper -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/18/2010 8:54:33 AM)

Not much to report this turn,my main fleet is taking a med cruise to show the flag.



DRommel -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/20/2010 12:43:58 AM)

WA fleet bombs Tripoly. El Duce damands counter actions. he's asked Germ for assistens.
Wavel begins his offensive from out Egypt. Rommel is leaving for the front.

(how do you get pic in here)



82ndtrooper -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/20/2010 3:53:02 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DRommel

WA fleet bombs Tripoly. El Duce damands counter actions. he's asked Germ for assistens.
Wavel begins his offensive from out Egypt. Rommel is leaving for the front.

(how do you get pic in here)



you have to use reply not fast reply. then at the bottom check the box that says "embed picture in post" then click on "click here to upload"

file has to be 500kb or less.



DRommel -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/20/2010 11:55:01 AM)

See That hugh fleet of the coast off Tripoly.


[image]local://upfiles/19219/BFCA47AACCF6483191056482E9D3B324.jpg[/image]



82ndtrooper -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/23/2010 10:11:20 PM)

not much to report here. still building my SEA Fleas and cruising the med.



Von Dudert -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/25/2010 12:23:42 AM)

I thought I'd make another posting as the Japanese.
It's currently March of 1941 and the Empire is continuing to slowly
increase it's strength. I don't want to show any specifics at this time but
I'll list a general outline of my force increases.
1. Infantry.
Japan is required to invade China this coming summer.
Garrison units and reserves are needed to ensure a reduced partisan level.
In addition, Japan will need extra troops to garrison victory points in the Pacific
and in the Dutch East Indies. I'll need to be cautious and keep an eye on my manpower levels, but that shouldn't become a problem till next year.
2. Artillery.
I've decided to invest in guns II. Since the Chinese will be infantry heavy I'm hoping to create a respectable artillery corp to help clear the way for my advances this summer. Guns II also allow me to build immobile flak units which will help counter Allied long range bomber threats as well as give some protection to my fleet units when in port.
3. Naval.
Since we are an island empire and currently have more battleships then we need,
I'm slowly adding to my destroyer and submarine fleets. The destroyers will help
counter Allied submarine threats to my island supply lines, and the submarine
units will act as reconnaissance elements for my fleet as well as giving me the option to try and interdict enemy supply lines.

Speaking of reconnaissance, here's a screen shot of Allied units in the Australian and New Zealand area from last September. The Allies have already built a respectable
SMG infantry force down there!. Some of these units have now been deployed to Port Moresby in south east New Guinea. Additionally fortifications have recently begun to appear south west of Sydney. I suspect that many of the VP locations will soon have garrison units which will make them harder to pick off next winter when the Pacific blitz card is played.

For now I am waiting to see how events play out in Europe. I hope the Germans can cause great grief for the Allies and the Russians. I will plan to be in position to attack China in early summer, before I suffer any penalties from delaying the offensive too long. The Chinese will be strong enough as is without any bonus help from the Americans.

Von Dudert.

[image]local://upfiles/31708/0CB4A418FA56406684995E1E07896A5E.jpg[/image]



DRommel -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/25/2010 9:30:06 AM)

after some recon, I found the WA fleet again.
She's hidding!!!!, off the coast off Creata.
Treadning my Afrikakorps ????

Yougoslavia fell pretty fast, now all of southern Europe is axis.
After installing a garnizon I can turn my full atention to the east.

[image]local://upfiles/19219/F9031814A8DE49D2B91FB31918824202.jpg[/image]



82ndtrooper -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/27/2010 4:59:14 PM)

I said I was going to try and develop some new strategies with having carrier III so early and this action we see in the Med sea now is the result of one of them.
I felt I had built enough SEA FLEA units in the Atlantic to handle things there so I moved all my main carriers and my full battle line to the MED to try and find the Italin navy and engage and hopefully sink it while assisting in the North Africa Campaign.

My main carriers where carrier II and I had 5 cruiser I so I moved straight to port said and upgraded them too carrier III and cruiser II. I then decided too move west along the coast with my fleet to strike at the Italian units in North Africa while my army moved west also. I did this thinking I might as well do that since I would have to scout around for the Italian navy some to find it.

Imagine my surprise when I reached tobruk and there it was in port with fighter cover and coastal defense guns. DRommel continues to surprise me ,he never seems to do what I expect him too.

[image]local://upfiles/30814/1E53B499B23B42A18738212EA1366C31.jpg[/image]



82ndtrooper -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/27/2010 5:09:49 PM)

I had subs scattered around the med on anti supply duty and thats what you see with all the blue dots. I pulled them all in to assist with the attack on Tobruk and unfortunately lost all three of them. I hit with my carrier air first since my planes are expendable and lost 10 of them but I did kill 4 of the 5 fighters he had there defending which was my main goal. I had plenty of planes in reserve and was able to replace my loses with veteran units. I also lost 2 CA-II and some destroyers and subs.
see the results below.



[image]local://upfiles/30814/5DD292312889439F8BBFE9FF422592FC.jpg[/image]



82ndtrooper -> RE: YAWAWRG (yet another waw revised game) (8/27/2010 5:29:54 PM)

I lost more than he did but I destroyed the key units I wanted to and I was able to replace my air loses which I hope he wont be able to do.
I am somewhat disappointed in my naval attack since the force ratio was huge in my favor with me attacking with 15 BB-I around 10 CA-II and destroyers and subs. Thankfully I only lost 2 CA-II 4 DD-I and 3 Sub-II. all loses I can replace quickly.

Still I feel like I have caught a tiger by the tail and I expect this to result in heavy loses on both sides.
I hope he is starting to feel the loss of supply now and that it will help me in my attacks.

I am also starting to move my land army west to apply pressure as you can just see in the above screen shot.

Realizing that he has caught a Tiger the Admiral in charge sent out a urgent request to the admiralty asking for the SEA FLEAS to come help. Soon all across the free world the message was passed "all available SEA FLEAS to the Med ASAP !!! every SEA FLEA unit nearby immediately changed course and went full speed ahead to lend assistance to their brothers in the MED.

The SEA FLEAS are on the way !!!!

[image]local://upfiles/30814/FA341259DB7F43A499DBB4FB7E28A152.jpg[/image]



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