RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (Full Version)

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bo -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/21/2011 6:59:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Extraneous

Polish setup was discussed in Prefered style of playing Poland

Thank you Extraneous for that information, went there saw the setup and just now tried it out in my CWIF game. Actually it was a disaster for Poland [and I am no Erwin Rommel[:-]] I received in Pulse 1,3, and 5 perfect weather [just might be a CWIF thing] I was able to get a 7 to 1, an 8 to 1 on the first impulse and a 7 to 1 on the second impulse, I forget what the odds were on the third impulse but they were not good for the Polish army, even though that setup put a greater amount of points to overcome in each hex the German units still had overwhelming power, I actually had more trouble when I had put one Polish unit in each hex on the border because I could not get the best odds even though those odds were quite good. Look if I knew what the heck I was doing I would be dangerous [&:] also I have a great advantage over people here who have not played for awhile because I am able to with the help of CWIF to try many different attacks over and over again until I get it right.[;)] and because I think I got it right does not mean its RIGHT!

Bo




Joseignacio -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/21/2011 7:16:27 PM)

The first impulse is always good weather, the others are just very probable good time.

If the three of them were good weather and there is no super bad dice throw, the polish don't stand a chance.




Extraneous -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/21/2011 8:26:23 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: bo


quote:

ORIGINAL: Extraneous

Polish setup was discussed in Prefered style of playing Poland

Thank you Extraneous for that information, went there saw the setup and just now tried it out in my CWIF game. Actually it was a disaster for Poland [and I am no Erwin Rommel[:-]] I received in Pulse 1,3, and 5 perfect weather [just might be a CWIF thing] I was able to get a 7 to 1, an 8 to 1 on the first impulse and a 7 to 1 on the second impulse, I forget what the odds were on the third impulse but they were not good for the Polish army, even though that setup put a greater amount of points to overcome in each hex the German units still had overwhelming power, I actually had more trouble when I had put one Polish unit in each hex on the border because I could not get the best odds even though those odds were quite good. Look if I knew what the heck I was doing I would be dangerous [&:] also I have a great advantage over people here who have not played for awhile because I am able to with the help of CWIF to try many different attacks over and over again until I get it right.[;)] and because I think I got it right does not mean its RIGHT!

Bo



The danger with guarding the border is that it leaves Warsaw open to attacks from East Prussia on the 1st impulse.

If you take Warsaw on the 1st impulse you don’t have to bother with the units on the border.




bo -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/21/2011 8:43:31 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Extraneous


quote:

ORIGINAL: bo


quote:

ORIGINAL: Extraneous

Polish setup was discussed in Prefered style of playing Poland

Thank you Extraneous for that information, went there saw the setup and just now tried it out in my CWIF game. Actually it was a disaster for Poland [and I am no Erwin Rommel[:-]] I received in Pulse 1,3, and 5 perfect weather [just might be a CWIF thing] I was able to get a 7 to 1, an 8 to 1 on the first impulse and a 7 to 1 on the second impulse, I forget what the odds were on the third impulse but they were not good for the Polish army, even though that setup put a greater amount of points to overcome in each hex the German units still had overwhelming power, I actually had more trouble when I had put one Polish unit in each hex on the border because I could not get the best odds even though those odds were quite good. Look if I knew what the heck I was doing I would be dangerous [&:] also I have a great advantage over people here who have not played for awhile because I am able to with the help of CWIF to try many different attacks over and over again until I get it right.[;)] and because I think I got it right does not mean its RIGHT!

Bo



The danger with guarding the border is that it leaves Warsaw open to attacks from East Prussia on the 1st impulse.

If you take Warsaw on the 1st impulse you don’t have to bother with the units on the border.


Agreed, but I guess that the Polish player will see the German setup and act accordingly in his setup even though IMHO it does
not matter what the Polish player does.

Bo




Centuur -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/21/2011 9:16:14 PM)

It depends. A Polish set up should be such that it might give him the opportunity to survive the first turn (however unlikely this event is going to be). This means putting screening units against the main German thrust at the border (look for forest hexes or cities there) and have two unit stacks at Warsaw and Lodz.
The airforce should be somewhere in the woods behind the front (but beware of soviet intervention...).
However, even then it is only a matter of time before they are killed. Only really bad weather and a lot of luck might see the Polish still living in ND 1939.




Red Prince -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/22/2011 12:22:43 AM)

This may be unpopular, but if playing with Pilots and Internment, I try to rebase the Polish aircraft into Hungary at the first opportunity. Two 'free' pilots for the CW. (Don't know if this is in CWiF)




lomyrin -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/22/2011 1:01:58 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Prince

This may be unpopular, but if playing with Pilots and Internment, I try to rebase the Polish aircraft into Hungary at the first opportunity. Two 'free' pilots for the CW. (Don't know if this is in CWiF)


When playing the CW I usually do that but choose Lithuania




Joseignacio -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/22/2011 6:26:59 AM)

I select Lithuania too. Of course, if in the second impulse I don't see that it can be the 5% of the times that Poland has an opportunity, be it because of bad weather, bad german dice, or insufficient german units because of ineptitude of german player...




oscar72se -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/22/2011 11:34:26 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: lomyrin


quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Prince

This may be unpopular, but if playing with Pilots and Internment, I try to rebase the Polish aircraft into Hungary at the first opportunity. Two 'free' pilots for the CW. (Don't know if this is in CWiF)


When playing the CW I usually do that but choose Lithuania

Assuming that it hasn't become a part of the Russian motherland I presume? [;)]

Regards,
Oscar




oscar72se -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/22/2011 11:47:48 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: bo


quote:

ORIGINAL: oscar72se

Here's what I usually do when I play GE:
In order to have more corps available for the second GE impulse of S/O 39 I usually setup Rundstedt on the western front. I use this HQ to flip the RES... This way I minimize the risk of being over committed on the western front. But be careful, Rundstedt is a nice bomb target for the allies so let him relax in a nice forested area [:)] I also make sure to seize control over Denmark, just make sure that you take ALL coastal hexes. If not, the CW player can just land an HQ in Denmark and make your life miserable for a couple of turns. To take control over Denmark (and "take" the Baltic Sea), you need three units of which one has to have 6 MP.

Regards
Oscar

See Oscar that is where I sense trouble for me in this game until I get some real experience either playing an AI good or bad and playing a good or great human player I would forget about putting a HQ in the woods to help offset an air attack, I have along way to go.

Bo

Everyone makes these mistakes from time to time (myself included of course) [:)]. But that's what makes for a good, exciting game isn't it? Seeing your opponent exposing his jugular... or discovering that you made an awful misstake [:)]

Regards,
Oscar




Joseignacio -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/22/2011 1:32:27 PM)

Yep, after your first or second game you start to learn the value of woods to protect from ground strikes, out of your own mistakes...




Centuur -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/24/2011 5:52:11 PM)

It isn't possible to avoid mistakes in WiF. There's simply to many things to remember to do.

I lost Sevastopol once, simply by forgetting to put a corps there during a reinforcement phase...




paulderynck -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/24/2011 5:56:42 PM)

I had a game one time when my opponent forgot to add the 1941 CW force pool additions.




warspite1 -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/24/2011 7:13:08 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: paulderynck

I had a game one time when my opponent forgot to add the 1941 CW force pool additions.
Warspite1

Been there, done that......[&:][:(]

My gracious opponent allowed a re-start [&o]




micheljq -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/25/2011 6:29:05 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

It isn't possible to avoid mistakes in WiF. There's simply to many things to remember to do.

I lost Sevastopol once, simply by forgetting to put a corps there during a reinforcement phase...



My opponent in the last game I played USSR was able to attack and cross the souther Dnepr river on the first impulse of Barbarossa because I forgot that a division does not have a ZOC on adjacent hexes.




Extraneous -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/25/2011 8:05:35 PM)

[&:] Do I have the weather right for the first turn [&:]

quote:

ORIGINAL: RAW7scenario.pdf 24.4.7 The Global war: Sep/Oct 1939 ~ Jul/Aug 1945
Last weather modifier: Nil. The die-roll for the first impulse of the game is a ‘4’.



First impulse weather is 4
ARCTIC weather is Fair
N. TEMPERATE weather is Fair
MEDITERRANEAN weather is Fair
N. MONSOON weather is Fair
S. MONSOON weather is Fair
S. TEMPERATE weather is Fair
if USSR passes it cannot claim Eastern Poland
There is a 40% chance turn ends.
If every major power on your side chose a pass action, except one, there is a 50% chance turn ends
If every major power on your side (neutral and active) chose a pass action there is a 60% chance turn ends.
Sep/Oct Impulse marker advances 1

Second impulse weather is 5
ARCTIC weather is Rain
N. TEMPERATE weather is Fair
MEDITERRANEAN weather is Fair
N. MONSOON weather is Rain
S. MONSOON weather is Fair
S. TEMPERATE weather is Fair
if USSR hasn’t claimed Eastern Poland and passes it cannot claim Eastern Poland
There is a 50% chance turn ends.
If every major power on your side chose a pass action, except one, there is a 60% chance turn ends
If every major power on your side (neutral and active) chose a pass action there is a 70% chance turn ends.
Sep/Oct Impulse marker advances 1

Third impulse weather is 6
ARCTIC weather is Rain
N. TEMPERATE weather is Fair
MEDITERRANEAN weather is Fair
N. MONSOON weather is Rain
S. MONSOON weather is Fair
S. TEMPERATE weather is Fair
if USSR hasn’t claimed Eastern Poland and passes it cannot claim Eastern Poland
There is a 60% chance turn ends.
If every major power on your side chose a pass action, except one, there is a 70% chance turn ends
If every major power on your side (neutral and active) chose a pass action there is a 80% chance turn ends.
Sep/Oct Impulse marker advances 2

Fourth impulse weather is 8 Add 1 to the next impulse's weather roll
ARCTIC weather is Rain
N. TEMPERATE weather is Rain
MEDITERRANEAN weather is Fair
N. MONSOON weather is Storm
S. MONSOON weather is Fair
S. TEMPERATE weather is Fair
if USSR hasn’t claimed Eastern Poland and passes it cannot claim Eastern Poland
There is a 80% chance turn ends.
If every major power on your side chose a pass action, except one, there is a 90% chance turn ends
If every major power on your side (neutral and active) chose a pass action the turn ends.
Sep/Oct Impulse marker advances 2

Fifth impulse weather is 10 Add 2 to the next impulse's weather roll
ARCTIC weather is Storm
N. TEMPERATE weather is Storm
MEDITERRANEAN weather is Rain
N. MONSOON weather is Storm
S. MONSOON weather is Rain
S. TEMPERATE weather is Fair
Turn ends at the end of the Axis impulse
USSR cannot claim Eastern Poland unless Poland hasn’t fallen





composer99 -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/25/2011 9:21:54 PM)

Extraneous: Was this a weather/impulse sequence that came up during a game you tried out on CWiF or tabletop WiF?

The only impulse in September/October 1939 with fixed weather is the very first impulse, which as noted has a weather roll (so to speak) of '4', resulting in fine weather across the board.

After the first Axis and Allied impulses, the second Axis impulse comes up and the Axis rolls (or a random number is generated) for weather, with all results from 1-10 available.

On subsequent Axis impulses, the Axis rolls for weather, usually restricted to the 1-10 range of results unless a modifier applies.




38special -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/25/2011 11:13:35 PM)

When I play the Germans I attack Poland less and France more. Take Polish resources and let the Polish units pollute the UK Force Pool while you wade into France on Turn 1. Yes, I attack both Poland and France pulse one and aim at grabbing resources only on pulse one from Poland. With alternate set up rules the French can build a better selection of "at start" units, but so can the Germans. Have fun. My last game had France fall in SO 39, long turn, and the Brits surrendered Poland because of the force pool fiasco.




Froonp -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/25/2011 11:40:27 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: 38special

When I play the Germans I attack Poland less and France more. Take Polish resources and let the Polish units pollute the UK Force Pool while you wade into France on Turn 1. Yes, I attack both Poland and France pulse one and aim at grabbing resources only on pulse one from Poland. With alternate set up rules the French can build a better selection of "at start" units, but so can the Germans. Have fun. My last game had France fall in SO 39, long turn, and the Brits surrendered Poland because of the force pool fiasco.

I don't believe that it is mandatory for the CW to add the Polish Force Pool to his. The default is that he don't.
Poland is aligned to the CW, but the Polish force pool is not added to the CWs.




Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/25/2011 11:41:53 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: 38special

When I play the Germans I attack Poland less and France more. Take Polish resources and let the Polish units pollute the UK Force Pool while you wade into France on Turn 1. Yes, I attack both Poland and France pulse one and aim at grabbing resources only on pulse one from Poland. With alternate set up rules the French can build a better selection of "at start" units, but so can the Germans. Have fun. My last game had France fall in SO 39, long turn, and the Brits surrendered Poland because of the force pool fiasco.

Germany is not allowed to attack France until the 3rd impulse. France has to first DOW Germany on the 2nd impulse.




Froonp -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/25/2011 11:42:20 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Extraneous

[&:] Do I have the weather right for the first turn [&:]

Except for impulse 1 & 2, the weather is random in WiF FE Global War.
You're confusing the weather and the impulse track's marker advance.




Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/25/2011 11:50:24 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Froonp

quote:

ORIGINAL: Extraneous

[&:] Do I have the weather right for the first turn [&:]

Except for impulse 1 & 2, the weather is random in WiF FE Global War.
You're confusing the weather and the impulse track's marker advance.

What is especially difficult in regard to impulses is that "impulse number" has two meanings.[:@]

First there what I think of as the Impulse Count, which starts at 1 and goes up by 1 every time the phasing side switches.
Second there is the Impulse Number, which starts at 1 and increases by whatever the Impulse Increment is for the current weather roll.

The players roll for the weather every time the impulse count changes to an odd value. When the impulse count changes to an even value, the weather does not change - it stays the same as for the previous impulse.

Now the impulse number can jump all over the place. Some sequences are:
1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 8, 9, 10
1, 4, 7, 9, 11
1, 4, 7, 8, 9, 11, 13
1, 3, 5, 7, 9, 10, 11, 14, 17

The only thing you can rely on is that the impulse number increment by the same amount two impulses in a row (since the weather roll always applies to two impulses).




Extraneous -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/26/2011 1:23:07 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: composer99

Extraneous: Was this a weather/impulse sequence that came up during a game you tried out on CWiF or tabletop WiF?

The only impulse in September/October 1939 with fixed weather is the very first impulse, which as noted has a weather roll (so to speak) of '4', resulting in fine weather across the board.

After the first Axis and Allied impulses, the second Axis impulse comes up and the Axis rolls (or a random number is generated) for weather, with all results from 1-10 available.

On subsequent Axis impulses, the Axis rolls for weather, usually restricted to the 1-10 range of results unless a modifier applies.


quote:


3.1 Sequence of play
The sequence of play in a turn is:
A. REINFORCEMENT STAGE
B. LENDING RESOURCES STAGE
C. INITIATIVE STAGE
D. ACTION STAGE
Repeat D1 through D3 until the action stage ends.
D1 Determine weather

quote:


8. Weather
If you are taking the 1st impulse in each pair of impulses, roll a die to determine the weather for that pair. If the result from the last roll (even if it was from the previous turn) was asterisked, add 1, 2 or 3 to the roll, depending on the number of asterisks.

Cross-reference the modified roll with the turn on the weather chart. This gives you the weather in each weather zone.

Ten sided die + number of Asterisks (0 or 1 or 2 or 3) = modified roll



D2 First side’s impulse
Every major power on the first side performs these steps:
D2.1 Declare war
D2.2 Choose action
Choose either: a pass, a naval, an air, a land or a combined action.
D2.3 Perform actions
The major powers that didn’t pass perform these steps in this order (their action choice will limit what they can do ~ see action limits table):
(a) Port attacks
(b) Naval air missions
(c) Naval movement
(d) Your naval combat
(e) Opponent’s naval combat
(f) Strategic bombardment
(g) Carpet bombing (option 32)
(h) Ground strike missions
(i) Rail movement
(j) Land movement
(k) Air transport
(l) Debark land units at sea
(m) Invasions
(n) Paradrops
(o) Land combat
(p) Air rebases
(q) Reorganisation
D2.4 End of action
Roll to end the action stage. If it doesn’t end, advance the impulse marker the number of spaces shown on the weather chart for the current weather roll. If it ends, move on to stage E—the end of turn.

quote:


12. Last impulse test
After you have finished your impulse, roll a die. If every major power on your side (neutral and active) chose a pass action, subtract 2 from your die roll. You only subtract 1 if you are playing a 1 or 2 map game.

If every major power on your side chose a pass action, except one, subtract 1 from your die roll to end impulses. This does not apply to 1 or 2-map games.

If the modified die roll is less than or equal to the current impulse end number on the impulse track, impulses are over and you go on to the end-of-turn stage.

If not, advance the impulse marker the number of spaces determined by current weather ~ see 8.2.8 Turn length (unless the impulse marker is already in the last box).

quote:


8.2.8 Turn length
The result on the weather chart will also give you a circled number. If your last impulse test die roll (see 12. Last impulse test) doesn’t end the turn’s impulses, advance the impulse marker that number of boxes on the impulse track.



Your opponents now have their impulse. If they are the second side, they repeat stage D2.2 Choose action of the sequence of play (see 3.1 Sequence of play ), If they are the first side, they repeat stages D1 Determine weather & D2.2 Choose action of the sequence of play.

If impulses end and your side had both the first and last impulse in the turn, move the initiative marker 1 space towards your opponent’s end of the initiative track.

Example: The initiative marker is in the Axis ‘+1’ space. The Axis went first in the turn. After their 3rd impulse, they have to roll a 3 or less to end the action stage. They roll a ‘2’. You move the impulse marker to the ‘0’ space because the Axis has taken the first and last impulses in the turn.



D3 Second side’s impulse
If the action stage didn’t end, repeat the steps in D2.2 Choose action for the second side. If the action stage doesn’t end after the second side’s impulse, go back to D1 Determine weather.
E. END OF TURN STAGE





The rule should read...

D2.4 End of action
Roll to end the action stage. If it ends, move on to "E. END OF TURN STAGE"

If it doesn’t end, use the circled number shown on the weather charts for the current weather roll to advance the impulse marker that number of spaces.







Joseignacio -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/26/2011 7:35:04 AM)

Boys, should we go back to topic?

I would like to see inputs on what you think are the goals of the japanese in the Pacific, how to prepare for the american and wether it compensates to attack the chinese (instead of simply holding the borders) or to atack the USSR...

All the same, what would be your goals in Russia as a german player? Adevance in the North, South, divide USSR forces? And as a USSR player? Defend only in woods and behind rivers? Create a line (including clear spaces) or only zocs? Defend hero cities?




Joseignacio -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/26/2011 7:38:54 AM)

Repeated.




Red Prince -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/26/2011 9:16:53 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Joseignacio

Boys, should we go back to topic?

I would like to see inputs on what you think are the goals of the japanese in the Pacific, how to prepare for the american and wether it compensates to attack the chinese (instead of simply holding the borders) or to atack the USSR...

All the same, what would be your goals in Russia as a german player? Adevance in the North, South, divide USSR forces? And as a USSR player? Defend only in woods and behind rivers? Create a line (including clear spaces) or only zocs? Defend hero cities?

I think that Japan can benefit by a small offensive in China. There are 2 or 3 resources to be gained by it. If playing with Chinese attack weakness, then the Chinese (Nationalist) can't afford to counter-attack until the US is in the war and really threatening Japan, so you can try some lower odds attacks to make your way into southern China with little fear of reprisal.

Personally, I like the idea of trying to control the Southern Soviet front (as Germany). It's a better economic choice, and can gain a lot of resources and oil if successful. An army marches on its stomach. A tank rolls on its gas tank.




Joseignacio -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/26/2011 11:56:30 AM)

Thanks for that input. i am thinking it seems to be a wise approach the one you suggest in Southern USSR, there uses to be a milder climate and absence of forest, which benefits both armored units and luftwaffe. I was worried about North, but the fact is that you can win most of this war just by capturing the oil resources and aligning Turkey. Besides, intense losses in the south can direct reinforcements an even part of the northern line derivate south, allowing isolated concentrated attacks on the ones left.

As for China, I don't know all the deployments. I was very surprised using CWIF when I saw the Guadalcanal scenario, where Japan had not occupied Korea or Manchuria and had no presence in China. [X(]

But in the deployment of the 39 campaign, Japan starts with part of China and the mentioned minor and territory, as well as some resources... The usual thing is to keep a petty war against thw chinese, just not to die of boredom while you are at peace with everyone, however, this can distract some resources (to replace losses, small as they will be) and maybe make Japan have to take more land movements that they want to, although usually in a turn there is time for everything. Also, every city you need to take is a 30% probability of an American Chit, which is the last thing you want to have, so I try to take as few cities as possible, but some you just need to take them...






Red Prince -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/26/2011 2:24:53 PM)

Something else to keep in mind about the Northern front vs. the USSR, is that the Soviets can't deploy reinforcements directly into the Baltic States. That means when, as you mentioned above, some troops move south into the steppes, you're right about making some concentrated attacks up north, particularly late in a turn. Even if you end up disorganized, you probably will have an impulse or two at the beginning of the next turn to reform your screening units into an adequate protection. Hopefully you can gain a few hexes on the secondary front this way.

In China, because there are now more cities, the US Entry roll has been adjusted a little. I think it is 2 for a city, and a 3 for a city with a factory. So, 20% & 30%.




composer99 -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/26/2011 4:29:40 PM)

Some notes here:

(1) Guadalcanal scenario uses only the Pacific map in the tabletop, and ignores continental Asia (Korea, Manchuria, China). So I don't see a big problem with them not being in play in CWiF/MWiF.
(2) The additional Chinese cities are an optional rule in MWiF, which implies that any modification to US entry applies only if they are in play.




Red Prince -> RE: How do you handle Barbarossa? And the Pacific War? (7/26/2011 4:38:37 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: composer99

(2) The additional Chinese cities are an optional rule in MWiF, which implies that any modification to US entry applies only if they are in play.

Good point, and also correct. If you don't use the additional cities, the Entry Action roll is just like WiF FE.




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