RE: No Beer & Pretzels ? (Full Version)

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Gizuria -> RE: No Beer & Pretzels ? (9/2/2012 10:19:38 AM)

quote:

I am a seasoned war gamer with 40 years experience going all the way back to Avalon Hill and all that. DCCB is the best overall east front computer war game experience I have had to-date, bar none.


Really? That's quite a testimonial. You're making me think about getting into this as well as WW2 East Front is my real wargame love.



Redmarkus5 -> RE: No Beer & Pretzels ? (9/2/2012 10:30:23 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fascist Dog

quote:

I am a seasoned war gamer with 40 years experience going all the way back to Avalon Hill and all that. DCCB is the best overall east front computer war game experience I have had to-date, bar none.


Really? That's quite a testimonial. You're making me think about getting into this as well as WW2 East Front is my real wargame love.


The thing to remember is that there's not yet a 100% perfect PC 'board' game out there. For those who didn't like AT, DCCB really is a different game - much less generic and a much better representation of WW2 operations.

I am the first to admit that WitE is without any doubt superior to DCCB in several ways:

1. Better map, though hard to mod.
2. More accurate OOB at start.
3. Reinforcement schedules to Grognard standards.
4. Covers the whole war, etc.

However, once the game kicks off, I see DCCB as being way ahead of anything else for a convincing operational 'feel' and the modelling of decision-making and leadership blunders, as well as having a better AI. I didn't like the stock DCCB map at all, so I modded it to create a board game feel.

Of course, after you've played any AI a few times you will start to see it's limitations, so I have now moved on to PBEM and I'm having a great time with that. (Don't knock the AI too hard though - a new DCCB player will make plenty of errors that the AI doesn't until the human player learns the ropes).

DCCB models almost everything you could ask for in an operational game, but most importantly it is probably the most 'mod-able' game of its type ever produced. I can see huge long term potential here and I will be quite surprised if I am not playing modded scenarios and campaigns in this and other theatres for years to come. DCCB is the TOAW of the current decade, IMHO.



rominet -> RE: No Beer & Pretzels ? (9/2/2012 11:40:38 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: redmarkus4


The thing to remember is that there's not yet a 100% perfect PC 'board' game out there. For those who didn't like AT, DCCB really is a different game - much less generic and a much better representation of WW2 operations.

I am the first to admit that WitE is without any doubt superior to DCCB in several ways:

1. Better map, though hard to mod.
2. More accurate OOB at start.
3. Reinforcement schedules to Grognard standards.
4. Covers the whole war, etc.

However, once the game kicks off, I see DCCB as being way ahead of anything else for a convincing operational 'feel' and the modelling of decision-making and leadership blunders, as well as having a better AI. I didn't like the stock DCCB map at all, so I modded it to create a board game feel.

Of course, after you've played any AI a few times you will start to see it's limitations, so I have now moved on to PBEM and I'm having a great time with that. (Don't knock the AI too hard though - a new DCCB player will make plenty of errors that the AI doesn't until the human player learns the ropes).

DCCB models almost everything you could ask for in an operational game, but most importantly it is probably the most 'mod-able' game of its type ever produced. I can see huge long term potential here and I will be quite surprised if I am not playing modded scenarios and campaigns in this and other theatres for years to come. DCCB is the TOAW of the current decade, IMHO.


I really hope DC3 will cover all the east front.
But we have time with DC2 and the editor.



Gizuria -> RE: No Beer & Pretzels ? (9/2/2012 1:07:58 PM)

Sounds very good to me. I don't get hung up on the groggy stuff as long as the game-play is a winner. While I like WiTE, it somehow fails to hit the spot for me. I'm particularly interested in the linked campaign concept. Is it possible to create these with the editor?



Redmarkus5 -> RE: No Beer & Pretzels ? (9/2/2012 3:31:17 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fascist Dog

Sounds very good to me. I don't get hung up on the groggy stuff as long as the game-play is a winner. While I like WiTE, it somehow fails to hit the spot for me. I'm particularly interested in the linked campaign concept. Is it possible to create these with the editor?


Yes, linked campaigns of various levels of complexity can be created. Be warned that while editing existing campaigns is (relatively) straight forward, creating a new scenario is a more challenging process. A new linked campaign will take a while to appear, I expect.



Redmarkus5 -> RE: No Beer & Pretzels ? (9/2/2012 3:33:13 PM)

I hope so too, although the DC2 editor is sufficient for a serious modder to cover the whole East Front or, indeed, any other front of their choosing. You can basically edit and mod all of the main features of the game such as map, unit types, OOBs, graphics, combat values etc.



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