RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks

RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (Full Version)

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Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/9/2013 11:17:53 PM)
June 15, 1942 A Gift A lot to feel lousy about today, but at the end, a gift. 1) I've been casually building up Canton and Baker in anticipation of SNAGGLEPUSS and he's left me alone. But the needed recon of the various islands seems to have stuck a sharp stick up Japan's kiester and now they're out hunting. As always, I have nowhere near the air cover I need and he has big Mid-PAC bases and carriers that aren't in upgrade. Before my bombardment TF got clocked, with the loss of New Mexico and the 60+ system damage dealt out to one CA, I had set Canton up as a regional ops base. Now it's something else, but the AKE is still there. I-168 flings fish and misses, but gets a solid deck gun round into AKE Wind Rush. 2) Recon from Wake also spots several TFs unloading at Marcus, which had been empty. Two LCUs seen. USS Grayback has her zone altered to bring her into Marcus I. harbor. Through three phases today she fires nine torpedo salvoes at three different merchants. The last one hits with one fish, and the CO adds two deckgun hits in exchange for taking two himself. Fair chance xAK Toho Maru will sink. Grayback certainly needs to head for the barn. 3) Many Allied subs are coming and going on transport missions out of Soerbaja for the PI; I have been assigning them short patrols on the homeward leg. In the Strait USS Sturgeon attacks the first tanker seen departing Balikpapan in, well, I think ever. One hit into escorted TK Yamazuru Maru leaves her with heavy fires and heavy damage. She sinks. 4) The withdrawl of the CAP at Pt. Blair and several days of empty-sky sweeps causes Japan to shift to the port and today they do find Royal Sovereign. Morning Air attack on Port Blair , at 46,58 Weather in hex: Overcast Raid spotted at 35 NM, estimated altitude 14,000 feet. Estimated time to target is 13 minutes Japanese aircraft A6M2 Zero x 12 G3M3 Nell x 29 G4M1 Betty x 6 Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 12 Japanese aircraft losses G3M3 Nell: 2 damaged Allied Ships BB Royal Sovereign, Bomb hits 6, heavy damage AKE West Planter, Bomb hits 2, on fire ACM Chimo, Bomb hits 1, on fire Port hits 4 Port fuel hits 4 I expect to find her on fire again and a few flooding points from total. Most likely I will form her and scuttle. The support ships are not viable without CAP. If all this means he's coming for Pt. Blair it will be a fight. The Aussie 6th Division is there, fully filled out and well-led, plus several other offensive LCUs. 45,000 supply and forts 4+. 5) Troops near Rahaeng are bombed for light casualties. They continue to move toward Moulmein. Allies paste Benkoelen again with everything at PBang and Oosthaven. They re-take the dot base at Lahat, on the rail line to Benkoelen. An African unit is in strat mode at Oosthaven, partly prepped for Benkoelen. It will move to Lahat and march. 32nd ID's squads come out of the wormhole and make for DG to pick up extensive escort to run into Sumatra. 6) At Oosthaven itself, where a small group of xAKs has been shuttling fuel to Cocos for several months, Magic Mavis comes to call with more fish. A single Cobra meets them, but they come on and blast the harbor. When the 32nd comes near I will have to CAP Oosthaven better than this. Morning Air attack on TF, near Oosthaven at 48,96 Weather in hex: Clear sky Raid spotted at 12 NM, estimated altitude 7,000 feet. Estimated time to target is 5 minutes Japanese aircraft H6K4 Mavis x 9 Allied aircraft P-400 Airacobra x 1 Japanese aircraft losses H6K4 Mavis: 1 damaged No Allied losses Allied Ships AMC Cornwallis, Torpedo hits 3, and is sunk DD Express ------------------------------ Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Oosthaven at 48,96 Weather in hex: Light rain Raid spotted at 19 NM, estimated altitude 8,000 feet. Estimated time to target is 9 minutes Japanese aircraft H6K4 Mavis x 13 Allied aircraft P-400 Airacobra x 1 No Japanese losses No Allied losses Allied Ships xAP Mount Vernon xAK West Isleta, Torpedo hits 5, and is sunk xAK Elmdale, Torpedo hits 3, and is sunk Aircraft Attacking: 13 x H6K4 Mavis launching torpedoes at 200 feet Naval Attack: 2 x 18in Type 91 Torpedo [image]local://upfiles/31387/C899B87D145C4461937C2D34C6A3E658.jpg[/image] 7) Palembang AF goes to 5. 8) And, the gift. Last air raid of the day. Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Palembang at 48,91 Weather in hex: Clear sky Raid spotted at 34 NM, estimated altitude 18,000 feet. Estimated time to target is 12 minutes Japanese aircraft A6M2 Zero x 5 D3A1 Val x 18 No Japanese losses Allied Ships HDML 1062, Bomb hits 1, and is sunk Sourced from a red TF icon near Billiton. And attatched to one squadron, the text message: "Akagi-2". Gotcha. Roll SNAGGLEPUSS.

BBfanboy -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/9/2013 11:50:26 PM)
You really must find out where your opponent got the anti-AA cloaking device for the Mavis! At this rate the Nell and Betty drivers will be demanding an upgrade to the big boat!

Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/10/2013 12:03:48 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BBfanboy You really must find out where your opponent got the anti-AA cloaking device for the Mavis! At this rate the Nell and Betty drivers will be demanding an upgrade to the big boat! Tell me about it. I said something to Mike after New Mexico's loss. He said since they each carry two torpedoes he thought they had underperformed! Gonna be fun peeling Japan like an onion. [8D]

Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/11/2013 4:11:09 AM)
June 16, 1942 Whoop A!** From doldrums to rampage in a week. Will try to summarize. 1) More heavy strikes on Pt. Blair. Royal Sovereign, on Day 1 of three coming off the pier to be scuttled, takes half a dozen more bombs and sinks for full VPs. The last casualty of FUDD. ACM Chimo takes two herself and also sinks. The AKE is ordered to flee for Madras and so far is not seen. The port takes heavy damage, but in the near term it won't matter. Come and get me! 2) Sixty mines are cleared at Sabang. Twenty more are inbound on USS Shark, but fleet DMSes will make short work of them. The RN carriers were moved, for the second time, to within one hex west of Sabang but did not launch again. Probably an air superiority issue. They'll go elsewhere. 3) Off PBang in a suddenly very high traffic area, ACM Obstructor transiting to PBang runs across a TF of three PBs. Anti-sub? Probably, because two IJN BBs are sighed today as well just NE of here. Where there is Mutsu there is more surface power. A transit of the Sunda or a bombardment on Oosthaven? I think the latter, but time will tell. 4) PBang is just smeared today. Given the sighting of Akagi yesterday I pulled everything off land attacks on Benkoelen and onto Naval. A motley crew, but enough 4Es to maybe fight through CAP. Not to be. Not one naval mission launches from PBang, which has virtually no fighters. Instead a huge Zero sweep comes in, then five separate attacks on the air field which destroy 9 planes and damage 44. The base is essentially OOC air-wise. The Allied air OOB was never intended to be defending PBang, Batavia, and Soerbaja in June 1942. And right now it isn't. But like Pt. Blair PBang has to be taken on the ground. And there it has teeth. So far Japan has shown no willingness to kick in doors and eat up troops. If it wants PBang it needs a beachhead and it needs a lot of men. 5) The TF containing Akagi, which so far has only read as a CS, moves east across Java. A dozen Beests from Soerbaja sortie without escort; 2 are lost and no hits. Only Akagi-1 CAP is seen. Next 5 Banshees venture out to attack BB Kirishima and two are shot down for no hits. Bettys come from up north and launch torpedoes at the only Allied surface forces in the theater, at Soerbaja. CLs Marblehead, just repaired, and Perh dodge and are safe. The CAP, which includes about 75 fighters (20 get into the furball), shoots down a reported 4 Bettys and damages 5 more, but the animation says the loss figure should be more like 10. Akagi runs right across xAKL Siberoet hauling the last seven squads of Naval Support from the last Allied base in southern Borneo. She is sunk by Vals. And in a final bit of Allied good luck at Soerbaja, 25 torpedo Kates come in, ignore the two fat cruisers sitting there, and instead attack AMc Cheribon, which is blown into matchsticks. All of this activity suggests Japan is making a move on southern Sumatra, and perhaps NW Java concurrently. There isn't enough LBA left to need a lot of carriers, and the first upgrade cycle calls the IJN. No landing TFs are seen yet, but the LCU stack at Singers has had time since its fall to heal and prep to middle numbers at least. I have intel of at least one large ID at Singers yesterday. To oppose I have the small naval force at Soerbaja, and a lot of subs. Some naval force is available at Colombo, but a lot is still in upgrade or repair, and one good RN carrier withdraws in 35 days or so. Wasp and North Carolina are a month-and-a-half away. The only good news is that I know where at least one CV is. I'll do a post on SNAGGLEPUSS soon, but knowing where the KB, or most of it, is located was a go-no go consideration. 6) The Allies stage attacks on Dili as well as troops in the open in China. The 23rd Division is hit west of Chungking for 27 casualties. Chungking has started to slowly build supplies again, passing 13,000 this week. Sian LI is hit for 1 hit. I see Mike has restarted his AAR in the past two days. This might be meaningful. [:)]

Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/11/2013 4:45:18 AM)
I have received electronic communications from the Fox. His labors in Istanbul complete, he has returned to the Den and reassumed his nom de guerre, RockyRoo. That is all.

Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/12/2013 5:34:39 AM)
Scooby sez, "Ruh roh!" [image]local://upfiles/31387/30829D6039DB43B399F0F380C62B2192.jpg[/image]

zuluhour -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/12/2013 2:05:07 PM)
Hey you almost have an equal number of smoke stacks [:D]

Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/12/2013 4:34:35 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: zuluhour Hey you almost have an equal number of smoke stacks [:D] Ha ha. [:)] That might have been true when I took the screenshot, but not any more.

Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/12/2013 6:42:41 PM)
June 17, 1942 Trouble At Both Ends The interim Japanese strategy became clearer today--attack Java at both ends and work toward the middle. It's also possible a landing at Oosthaven is in the cards; not sure yet. To accomplish this Japan has invested much of its heavy surface forces (screenshot posted above as well as more near Batavia), but has also taken the somewhat odd tack of including only Akagi in the mix. No idea where the other heavy CVs are; maybe in upgrade or pre-upgrade? Wherever they are they aren't here today. And for Soerbaja a good thing. 1) The first battle doesn't go the Allies' way. From screenshot up-thread. The surface TF from Soerbaja was sortied knowing it was probably dead meat, but with heavy port attacks on Soerbaja a near certainty with a known CV in the straits to the north I figured it was better to go out and hunt for something rather than die for nothing. When I gave that order I didn't believe Akagi was alone. Now I'm pretty sure that's the case. Regardless, the battle did result in Akagi taking 8 hits to hull and flight deck (smoke showing a 10-15 system-damage-type result), as well as Yamato using perhaps 1/3 of its main battery ammo, and most of the TF's Long Lances being used up for no hits. Perth did make it back to Soerbaja by later in the turn. Day Time Surface Combat, near Kangean at 59,103, Range 23,000 Yards Japanese Ships CV Akagi, Shell hits 8 CS Nisshin BB Kirishima, Shell hits 2 BB Yamato, Shell hits 1 CA Maya, Shell hits 1 CA Ashigara, Shell hits 2 DD Kazegumo, Shell hits 2, heavy fires DD Oshio DD Inazuma DD Shirakumo DD Isonami DD Shirayuki Allied Ships CA Canberra, Shell hits 13, heavy fires, heavy damage CL Perth, Shell hits 4, on fire CL Marblehead, Shell hits 3 APD Barker DD Parrott, Shell hits 5, heavy fires, heavy damage DD Tenedos, Shell hits 1, on fire 2) This small action shows the composition of the largest TF near Batavia. No landing force is seen, however. Something red went through the Sunda Strait today and kept going. I think this is a relief force for Benkoelen. The African LCU is marching that way, and right now the squads of the 32nd ID are aimed to come ashore here as Oosthaven is "hot." That might need to change. The 32nd TF has heavy surface escort including Oklahoma, and the RN carriers are moving to rendezvous west of the landing hex. All fluid. Day Time Surface Combat, near Merak at 48,97, Range 22,000 Yards Japanese Ships BB Nagato BB Mutsu CA Furutaka CL Kitakami CL Oi DD Ayanami DD Sagiri DD Yugiri DD Amagiri DD Oboro DD Akebono Allied Ships AMc MMS D, Shell hits 1, and is sunk AMc Digoel, Shell hits 1, and is sunk 3) The East Java landing TF is seen, with Banjo as the target. Day Time Surface Combat, near Banjoewangi at 57,107, Range 18,000 Yards Japanese Ships DD Asanagi DD Yunagi DD Hasu DD Tsuga TB Kari xAP Terukuni Maru xAP Hakone Maru xAP Kashima Maru xAP Husimi Maru xAP Miike Maru Allied Ships AMc Djember 4) The AF carnage at PBang yesterday still left a remarkable number of planes operable. Japan hits the AF hard again. Morning Air attack on Palembang , at 48,91 Weather in hex: Partial cloud Raid spotted at 19 NM, estimated altitude 15,000 feet. Estimated time to target is 6 minutes Japanese aircraft A6M2 Zero x 39 A6M2-N Rufe x 9 G4M1 Betty x 38 Allied aircraft no flights Japanese aircraft losses G4M1 Betty: 3 damaged Allied aircraft losses 139WH-3: 3 damaged B-17E Fortress: 8 damaged B-17E Fortress: 1 destroyed on ground P-38E Lightning: 2 damaged P-38E Lightning: 1 destroyed on ground SBC-4 Helldiver: 3 damaged Airbase hits 7 Airbase supply hits 2 Runway hits 29 Morning Air attack on Palembang , at 48,91 Weather in hex: Partial cloud Raid spotted at 12 NM, estimated altitude 14,000 feet. Estimated time to target is 3 minutes Japanese aircraft G4M1 Betty x 15 Allied aircraft no flights Japanese aircraft losses G4M1 Betty: 2 damaged Allied aircraft losses B-17E Fortress: 5 damaged 139WH-3: 2 damaged LB-30 Liberator: 2 damaged Runway hits 10 Morning Air attack on Palembang , at 48,91 Weather in hex: Partial cloud Raid spotted at 18 NM, estimated altitude 14,000 feet. Estimated time to target is 6 minutes Japanese aircraft A6M2 Zero x 12 G4M1 Betty x 25 Allied aircraft no flights Japanese aircraft losses G4M1 Betty: 3 damaged Allied aircraft losses A-24 Banshee: 7 damaged A-24 Banshee: 1 destroyed on ground LB-30 Liberator: 2 damaged 139WH-3: 8 damaged P-38E Lightning: 2 damaged B-17E Fortress: 7 damaged B-17E Fortress: 1 destroyed on ground Morning Air attack on Palembang , at 48,91 Weather in hex: Partial cloud Raid spotted at 16 NM, estimated altitude 11,000 feet. Estimated time to target is 4 minutes Japanese aircraft Ki-21-IIa Sally x 36 Allied aircraft no flights Japanese aircraft losses Ki-21-IIa Sally: 4 damaged Allied aircraft losses B-17E Fortress: 14 damaged B-17E Fortress: 1 destroyed on ground B-25C Mitchell: 4 damaged SBC-4 Helldiver: 6 damaged SBC-4 Helldiver: 1 destroyed on ground 139WH-3: 7 damaged 139WH-3: 2 destroyed on ground A-24 Banshee: 2 damaged Allied ground losses: 7 casualties reported Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled Airbase hits 1 Airbase supply hits 2 Runway hits 9 Morning Air attack on Palembang , at 48,91 Weather in hex: Partial cloud Raid spotted at 16 NM, estimated altitude 13,000 feet. Estimated time to target is 4 minutes Japanese aircraft Ki-21-IIa Sally x 17 Allied aircraft no flights Japanese aircraft losses Ki-21-IIa Sally: 1 damaged Ki-21-IIa Sally: 1 destroyed by flak Allied aircraft losses B-17E Fortress: 3 damaged LB-30 Liberator: 1 damaged 5) Back at Soerbaja, 7 Beests get up and attack Akagi; no hits. Twelve B-17s, all the way from PBang, attack the BBs for no damage at 7000 feet (House Rule advocates please note). One B-17 is downed and five are damaged. Two Banshees escorted by P-38s attack as well, taking down a Zero for a Banshee and no hits. 6) PBang gets more bombing in late morning. Over 30 Nicks bomb from 14,000 and take a Mitchell and 2 Helldivers. 20 more Sallys destroy a Helldiver and damage 13 more planes of various stripes. PBang is really suffering, but this is the Japanese maximum effort and clearly PBang is a worry to them. The Allies will hang at least another day. 7) Akagi shoots its wad by Val-striking Soerbaja. This base has the only decent CAP in the region, and it's fairly isolated from big enemy AFs still. The Akagi air wing suffers greatly. Despite the combat report's figures, the animation showed all Vals soundly destroyed. Morning Air attack on TF, near Soerabaja at 56,104 Weather in hex: Partial cloud Raid detected at 80 NM, estimated altitude 16,000 feet. Estimated time to target is 30 minutes Japanese aircraft A6M2 Zero x 5 D3A1 Val x 18 Allied aircraft Hurricane IIb Trop x 3 B-339-23 x 8 P-39D Airacobra x 21 P-40E Warhawk x 21 Japanese aircraft losses A6M2 Zero: 1 destroyed D3A1 Val: 12 destroyed Allied aircraft losses P-39D Airacobra: 1 destroyed Allied Ships CL Perth, on fire Aircraft Attacking: 3 x D3A1 Val releasing from 3000' Naval Attack: 1 x 250 kg SAP Bomb [image]local://upfiles/31387/FBF6F34531AC44479C2CC78ED484FF1C.jpg[/image] 8) The Kates go the other way, attacking the surface TF limping back to Soerbaja. It is clocked. Morning Air attack on TF, near Kangean at 59,103 Weather in hex: Clear sky Raid spotted at 19 NM, estimated altitude 10,000 feet. Estimated time to target is 7 minutes Japanese aircraft B5N2 Kate x 20 No Japanese losses Allied Ships DD Tenedos, on fire DD Parrott, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk CA Canberra, Torpedo hits 2, heavy fires, heavy damage (sinks) I have been bleeding cruisers. This valuable CA today. Another has 30+ flooding at Soerbaja and is trapped for now. She may have to fight. And, worse, USS Salt Lake City, which took 62 system damage, 13 flooding, and 4 Fires near Baker I. three days ago, has been heading for Johnson to do emergency DC. Fires spread over three days and overwhelm systems today. She also sinks. 9) In other regions: --Mine clearing continues at Sabang. Submarine heading there (not Shark as I said yesterday) is re-routed down western Sumatra to lay at Oosthaven. --RO-65 shows up at Wake where many ships are unloading and staging. It puts a shell into xAKL Kanlaon II. --Light AVG CAP gets up over the Big Stack and shoots down two heavy bombers and damage another. The BS is about 10 miles from the yellow road and freedom to the west. The huge IJA stack sits waiting on the eastern side, I assume to see if the BS leaves Tsuyung alone. Once the BS departs I expect the Japanese to head for Chungking. --red icons are at Baker I. Four Vindicators from Canton attack BB Hyuga there and are met by Zeros. I assume this is the CVL/CVE(s) that hit the cruisers three days ago. With this nearly all BBs are located. I have three good upgraded CVs at Pearl. --Pt. Blair is pounded on for supply denial. The armored force out of Prome reaches the intersection to the north and turns south toward Bassein. 7th Aussie Div. is right behind them. Several Chinese heavy corps are moving forward from the Mandalay group for Toungoo. --at Balikpapan USS Shark does lay mines, then torpedoes and sinks APD Tsuta --at Marcus I. unloading TF is again attacked. USS Herring sinks xAK Tyoyo Maru 10) IJA 5th ID begins landing at Banjoewangi. (aka Banjo) 281 casualties in first wave. Bad prep? Interesting day. I've been reading another AAR where the Allied plane pools are being discussed and I have to say I'm hip. It's a known Allied thing, but in this game it's bugging me. It shouldn't be, but it does get old day after day trying to scrape up 3-4 fighters to meet the hordes. Part of it for me is perception. We've been playing almost a year real time but are still in Allied dark times. I've never spent more than 2-3 real-time months getting to mid-1942. I constantly have to do internal mental health adjustments, keep telling myself this will pass. Today I went through actions most Allied players see in January, not June, so that's better. But man, I want some assets to move! I have the turn already, as Mike's work schedule has him playing vampire this week. So I'm away. Subs to move.

BBfanboy -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/12/2013 7:10:49 PM)
quote: Bullwinkle58 ... I constantly have to do internal mental health adjustments, keep telling myself this will pass. ... I'm pretty sure some of the hot sauces discussed in Canoerebel's AAR of late will take your mind off the aircraft pools ... [sm=00000003.gif][;)]

zuluhour -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/12/2013 7:39:04 PM)
Geographically your position is enviable, IMHO. [8D]

JocMeister -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/12/2013 8:57:01 PM)
Hehe, don�t worry about the pools. Or rather get used to worrying about it. They are still giving me heartaches in my game. I�m hoping 11/44 will change that. [:D] IMO, Until you get Corsairs in 1/43 and probably until 4/43 when the Hellcat arrives its Tojo time. And Tojo rules the sky. So hunker down, stay on CAP and train, train, train. Besides the P40 in the game sucks for anything but training anyway! Have I mentioned how I hate the P40? [:D]

Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/12/2013 9:20:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BBfanboy quote: Bullwinkle58 ... I constantly have to do internal mental health adjustments, keep telling myself this will pass. ... I'm pretty sure some of the hot sauces discussed in Canoerebel's AAR of late will take your mind off the aircraft pools ... [sm=00000003.gif][;)] For a Minnesotan I can take some spice. By Texas standards I'm a wimp. [:)]

Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/12/2013 9:23:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: zuluhour Geographically your position is enviable, IMHO. [8D] It is, plus I have some things going on I haven't talked about here. I have, to be truthful, gotten very used to having places like Soerbaja for yards and subs. It looks like he's going for that base for fuel and because it's closer to his good bases in the PI and Babeldebob, but he really, really needs to address PBang if he wants to survive HI-wise. If I can get an intact 32nd ID in there with what's already in residence, plus Forts 6, I think he's on borrowed time. The current level of naval ops, with Yamato and Akagi tearing around, is eating fuel. Ops down as far as Baker/Canton do too. SNAGGLEPUSS, when I can get it underway, is partly designed to force him to burn fuel.

Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/12/2013 9:27:32 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: JocMeister Hehe, don�t worry about the pools. Or rather get used to worrying about it. They are still giving me heartaches in my game. I�m hoping 11/44 will change that. [:D] IMO, Until you get Corsairs in 1/43 and probably until 4/43 when the Hellcat arrives its Tojo time. And Tojo rules the sky. So hunker down, stay on CAP and train, train, train. Besides the P40 in the game sucks for anything but training anyway! Have I mentioned how I hate the P40? [:D] The P-40E is my go-to fighter right now. I love the little bastids! With drop tanks they can cross wide expanses of ocean; Wildcats can't right now. I just followed some of Nemo's advice and moved several from safe CAP locations behind the lines up to where the fun is. Makes me a little nervous but I did have 60 or so on easy duty. We'll see if it helps. I haven't seen Tojos, thank goodness. We're playing with non-historic R&D, so I expect wonder planes any day. So far so good though.

zuluhour -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/13/2013 1:14:15 AM)
I have had success with the Warhawks myself. I normally employ them at 17-20m feet as top cover with Aerocobras getting most of the kills circling below at 14-16m feet. When I have the luxury of the three tier CAP there is often penetration into the bombers.

BBfanboy -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/13/2013 1:36:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: zuluhour I have had success with the Warhawks myself. I normally employ them at 17-20m feet as top cover with Aerocobras getting most of the kills circling below at 14-16m feet. When I have the luxury of the three tier CAP there is often penetration into the bombers. +1 The P40E is capable if kept within its best maneuver band [up to 15K] and not outnumbered by the enemy fighters. Pilots MUST have 65+ Defensive skill.

Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/13/2013 2:17:59 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BBfanboy quote: Bullwinkle58 ... I constantly have to do internal mental health adjustments, keep telling myself this will pass. ... I'm pretty sure some of the hot sauces discussed in Canoerebel's AAR of late will take your mind off the aircraft pools ... [sm=00000003.gif][;)] I reflected on this some more after a 5-mile hike with GOTP. (Really! No foolin'!) I titled my last daily post as I did to reflect something I've heard young mothers say about their babies when they're sick. (". . . both ends") I would be impressed if said infant had the trouble in question due to excessive pepper consumption. But I would not put that past a Texas Baby. [:'(]

Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/13/2013 2:20:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: zuluhour I have had success with the Warhawks myself. I normally employ them at 17-20m feet as top cover with Aerocobras getting most of the kills circling below at 14-16m feet. When I have the luxury of the three tier CAP there is often penetration into the bombers. The penalty to go above 15,000 is pretty steep. I do it, but I've never been sure where the break-even is on bounce versus band. I do love Cobras at either 5000 or 10,000. They eat TBs for lunch if they can get past the Zeros.

JocMeister -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/13/2013 8:29:18 AM)
I actually prefer the Cobras over the P40. Felt like they did somewhat better. But they never went up against the Tojo as frequent as the P40 did. The P40 did good up until the Tojo arrived. At the point they just became free kills for the Jap. I had times when I lost 50 or more P40s for just 2-3 Tojos. My opponent wisely used high alt massed Tojo sweeps getting the dive on my P40s and just wrecking them. Losing a month worth of replacement in one set of sweeps was not uncommon. Eventually I just had to withdraw outside sweep range and stay there unless it was vital to put a CAP up. Needless to say I�m not too sympathetic right now towards Erik when he moans about the P47! [:D] I think a monumental shift in the air war happened once I managed to get Corsairs in decent numbers. I could then for the first time not only face up against the Tojo but also start doing offensive missions (sweeps). When the Hellcat arrived I was really helped to have some LBA based squadrons to help with sheer numbers as the Corsairs were just too few.

LoBaron -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/13/2013 9:40:28 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58 quote: ORIGINAL: BBfanboy quote: ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58 quote: ORIGINAL: Justus2 quote: ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58 June 5, 1942 Batavia Bashing 3) Japan seems to have realized that strat bombing in this game is going to be a thing and it's not going to stop, so Batavia, home of some of it, is heavily targeted for a second day. A couple of P-38s are on 39,000 ft. max range, drop-tanked CAP, and they worry at the attackers in every way they can. The AF is damaged, but no planes on the ground. (They're off flying.) Four Bettys are damaged, one lost, plus a downed Zero. The P-38s are damaged and probably one is lost to ops. I thought drop tanks hinder planes on CAP, why are you using drop tanks on the P-38s? or are they flying LRCAP from another base? I did a forum search on this as I am nobody's expert on CAP. Many threads going back to 2009. For what I can best tell drop-tanks add fatigue to CAP pilots at a faster rate, but do not hinder dogfighting. They give more range (what I was after) at the cost of the supplies. Dropping the tanks is presumed I think. What I've never been totally clear on is how the CAP range influences combat passes, range needed for the attack to "burn through." In a turn-based game I don't think the RL loiter time advantage comes into it, but I could be wrong. But it's an excellent question. It seems to me that loiter time depends on how many hexes short of "extended range" the CAP is working. If the drop tank adds two hexes to that range and the CAP only goes one hex further, it will have more loiter time. If the CAP goes all the way to maximum extended range with drop tanks, it will have the same meagre loiter time as CAP without drop tanks operating to their max extended range. When you reach "bingo fuel", you gotta head back, even if you just got there! I agree with that in theory, but inside the turn there's no "time." There's only 12-hour phases, plus asset interactions which consume ops points. There's no way to know if the incoming bombers are in hour-one of the phase or hour-seven. I "think" all drop tanks get you is the range, and it's range for the whole phase until ops point consumption makes the CAP head home. I think. If Lobaron is reading I'd appreciate a weigh-in. Sorry, bit late to the discussion. At first, please note that CAP IS (one of) the most diffuse game aspects, because it is severely abstracted. To understand the air engine, we have to detach a bit from the RL concept of a plane taking off, flying to a destination, shooting at stuff, RTB, and landing. This does not happen in WitP. What I believe CAP to be is someting funnily similar to a certain aspect of quantum physics. [;)] As long as you do not perform a measurment (e.g. the strike) the particle (e.g. the CAP) has no location or quantity. What I want to say with this is, you cannot view CAP as planes taking of for the morning patrol, while other fighters get into readiness status, when no strike arrives during the loiter time of an element it lands, gets replaced by the readiness unit and another element gets into readiness, and so on. The game abstracts this. In fact, as long as no combat takes place, nothing is there except a default formula that calculates op points loss, plane op losses, fatigue gain,...over target based on a number of variables including your settings. When combat takes place, everything pops into existence. The air engine calculatesthe number of planes able to reach intercept based on a large ammount of variables. Already spent op points, detection range, cruise speeds, altitude, weather, airframe readiness, plane element situation and availability, range from base of origin,....everything that is required to initiate combat calculations and animations. When combat is initiated, this leads to continuousely updated (abstracted) status information on airframe and pilots. A CAP that intercepts a strike on a target 2 hexes away from base of origin loses planes and pilots (to op points, combat, op losses, fatigue,...). If another strike arrives over base of origin (the CAP homebase) this leads to those losses resulting in planes and pilots being unavailable for interception (i imagine a temp DB assigning values to airframes, but in trith I really have no idea on how this information is processed). In game engine terms, before the "first" strike nothing happened, at all. And the "second" strike (on the homebase) holds no information about the reason for planes and pilots being unavailable (we know that, abstracted, it was the fault of the "first" strike) and the whereabouts of those planes in a RL sense, just that the aren�t here. The Elf once said a somthing very important when thinking about all that stuff: "There is no air in the game." I might add, as you already discussed, there is also no time. I pretty much agree on what both you and BBfanboy suspect with regards to how time is treated. The concept of time between phases is not existing in a conventional sense. But the game uses certain variables and dice rolls to still introduce time as a factor, but not with the RL "flow" of time. There is a percieved "before" and "after" in a relational sense. Take as an example a sweep of several squadrons arriving over enemy base. The initial sweep usually meets the stiffest resistance, and the first, and hen each following wave weaken the CAP as planes get damaged and begin to use up what you define as "op points". So you could see this developement over a combat phase as an abstraction of the flow of time. There also is a time to target (detection range / strike cruise speed), and this time to target value is used in intercept calculations. Directly related to this there is the time to intercept calculations. I am not referring to those in the combat report (they can be misleading as they tell you nothing about averages, but only about the single last plane of a squad), but to the time to intercept for every plane element on CAP misison. On those calculations climb rate, cruise speed, current situation (e.g. scrambling or airborne), come into play. Now, if the target hex is different from the base of origin, range comes into play. Two things are replicable from my experience: Airframe range increase availability over target, drop tanks increase availability over target. (As a sidenote, drop tanks do not negatively influence combat performance or pilot fatigue as long as range to target is the same as without DT.) Could write more but I feel for the sake of personal security I now have to log and do the stuff I have promised to do... [8D] Interesting discussion and good AAR. [:)]

LoBaron -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/13/2013 9:40:56 AM)
edit: doublepost

Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/13/2013 5:07:36 PM)
LoBaron, thanks for the visit and long input/explanation. Combined with Alfred's inputs I now have a 180-degree different understanding of CAP. Woe betide the newbie if, after ten years, I was so wrong-headed. The key for me was Alfred's initial point that there is no CAP mission in the game (paraphrased.) CAP is what's left after the escorts do their business. Since I have been nearly a year real-time with short-legged fighters and 4Es that can mostly defend themselves, I have done almost no escorting. I had come to think of the escort button AS the CAP button and comingled range and drop tank mechanisms in incorrect ways. Thanks again. And hang around. [:)]

Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/13/2013 5:44:10 PM)
June 18, 1942 Whackiness What happens when a ground-pounder runs a navy? [:)] A lot happened all over the place today, but a lot of it was minor. Just going to hit the highlights so my DSL can get back to downloading Steam games. 1) Main focus today was on eastern Java. The BB-led TF near Batavia yesterday was last seen heading east. The Sunda area was calm. I think that effort was done to ease the passing of the TF that went through the strait and has not been reseen. The Air TF containing Akagi and Yamato was last seen heading east. This made sense to me. Akagi's air wing was knocked around pretty badly. She took some hits. Yamato used some ammo, and reloads are not available locally. The Long Lance cupboard was pretty bare. So it made sense to leave. The landing TF had a lot of good DDs and were right there at an undefended Banjo. At Soerbaja I had only the two CLs (Perth and Marblehead), a slow APD, and a CA with 33 flooding and 12 system that could only make 21 knots. What to do? Figuring the DDs would be rough and wanting to drown at least some of 5th ID I bit the bullet and included the CA. More and bigger guns might matter. Good plan. Except the Akagi/Yamato DIDN'T leave! Who does that?! Day Time Surface Combat, near Banjoewangi at 57,107, Range 25,000 Yards Japanese Ships CV Akagi, Shell hits 3 CS Nisshin BB Kirishima, Shell hits 1 BB Yamato, Shell hits 1 CA Ashigara, Shell hits 1 DD Kazegumo DD Oshio DD Inazuma Allied Ships CA Australia, Shell hits 19, heavy fires CL Perth CL Marblehead, Shell hits 1 APD Barker, Shell hits 4, heavy fires, heavy damage One of the hits on Akagi was a penetrating tower hit. Should be some fires from that one. In total I got off light. Australia was a gonner no matter what though, but including her let the CLs off lighter. And then, later on the way home, the #$!%* Magic Mavis Corps came calling. One P-40e leaked over from Soerbaja, but these lumbering beasts seem to be immune to AA. When I get in range of the HI that factory is at the top of the burn-down list. Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Banjoewangi at 57,107 Weather in hex: Light cloud Raid spotted at 38 NM, estimated altitude 9,000 feet. Estimated time to target is 18 minutes Japanese aircraft H6K4 Mavis x 11 Allied aircraft P-40E Warhawk x 1 Japanese aircraft losses H6K4 Mavis: 1 destroyed, 1 damaged No Allied losses Allied Ships CA Australia, Torpedo hits 3, and is sunk APD Barker, Torpedo hits 3, and is sunk 2) There is some other kind of carrier TF SE of here. It's flying Zeros, Jakes, and Kates. Near Flores I. It made several raids, one on CA Australia which missed, and a Kate strike on xAKL Lepus which hit. 3) Strato Oscars from Borneo work over Soerbaja CAP pretty badly, downing 7 for 1. Not much I can do there. 4) PBang is blasted as badly as yesterday. At least eight major attacks. In one the combat report listed 50 damaged B-17s when there are about 12 total at the base, and half were out attacking a DD in the Malacca Strait. (4000 feet, no hits, 2 damaged oh HR mavens.) Couple of dozen Japanese planes destroyed or damaged. I shouldn't be so lackadaisical about PBang, but I am I guess. Can't move them, can't defend them. Whenever this stops I can fix the AF in three days or so. A lot of what's being lost are very obsolete models, but some aren't. I have Merak, Oosthaven, and Batavia for CAP when and if I get the 32nd ID close. In the meantime it's just a beat-down. It happens. 5) About 2000 men of the 5th ID get ashore at Banjo and take the base. A (-) on disruption and a lot of the division is still afloat. Will the Akagi TF hang around again? Will I be crazy enough to send in my last two CLs? Stay tuned. 6) Baker I. is bombarded by the BB Hyuga TF; 88 casualties. He can see two Marine Raider Battalions in the report, but there are three there plus a civilian engineering unit that withdraws in two weeks. If he wants Baker it will take a lot more than an SNLF or a Naval Guard. 7) S-39 sinks a PB in the Malacca Strait. The sub/ASW population is very high in here, and so far the subs are winning. 8) Japan attacks Chengtu again, wearing it down. Ground combat at Chengtu (75,41) Japanese Deliberate attack Attacking force 101202 troops, 824 guns, 861 vehicles, Assault Value = 3634 Defending force 34942 troops, 181 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 1097 Japanese engineers reduce fortifications to 2 Japanese adjusted assault: 2452 Allied adjusted defense: 1327 Japanese assault odds: 1 to 1 (fort level 2) Japanese Assault reduces fortifications to 2 Combat modifiers Defender: terrain(+), leaders(+), experience(-) Attacker: Japanese ground losses: 6804 casualties reported Squads: 98 destroyed, 487 disabled Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 44 disabled Engineers: 1 destroyed, 61 disabled Vehicles lost 28 (4 destroyed, 24 disabled) Allied ground losses: 3084 casualties reported Squads: 26 destroyed, 401 disabled Non Combat: 41 destroyed, 153 disabled Engineers: 49 destroyed, 39 disabled Guns lost 50 (1 destroyed, 49 disabled) Units destroyed 1 Assaulting units: 70th Division 3rd Ind.Mixed Brigade 11th Indpt Infantry Regiment 24th Division 3rd Tank Regiment 36th Division 58th Division 4th Ind.Mixed Brigade 37th Division 26th Engineer Regiment 20th Recon Regiment 9th Tank Regiment 11th Tank Regiment 23rd Tank Regiment 41st Division 12th Indpt Infantry Regiment 2nd Ind.Mixed Regiment 9th Ind.Mixed Brigade 60th Division 28th Engineer Regiment 10th Tank Regiment 22nd/C Division 5th Army 1st Army 11th Field Artillery Regiment Defending units: 7th Chinese Corps 3rd Construction Regiment 3rd Chinese Corps 40th Chinese Corps 16th Chinese Corps 2nd Construction Regiment 21st Group Army 5th Chinese Base Force 10th Chinese Base Force 39th Chinese Corps 13th Group Army 1st War Area 1st Construction Regiment

Rio Bravo -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/14/2013 12:12:58 AM)
Bullwinkle58- I have only played war board games with hexes. I am new to Matrix Games. I have been reading your thread for days. I'm up to page 22. I just wanted to thank you for all your posts regarding your war with that pesky 1eyedjack! You write very well and it is fun reading the progression of the war. I will try to get current with your war report as soon as possible. -Rio Bravo

Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/14/2013 1:07:16 AM)
Thank you and welcome. [:)]

erstad -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/14/2013 1:45:42 AM)
quote: We've been playing almost a year real time but are still in Allied dark times. This why there's a set of folks who prefer 2 day turns for PBEM. Not saying it's an obvious decision, there are pros and cons.

Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/14/2013 4:17:07 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: erstad quote: We've been playing almost a year real time but are still in Allied dark times. This why there's a set of folks who prefer 2 day turns for PBEM. Not saying it's an obvious decision, there are pros and cons. I'm playing an AI game in parallel in 2-days. Very big trade-offs when carriers meet. But I'd think hard about it next time in PBEM.

Rio Bravo -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/14/2013 10:47:08 AM)
Reference: Steve's post regarding Chesty Puller (Post #1007; page 33 of this thread). At the Chosin Resivor, Korea, via radio, Chesty Puller was advised that his regiment of Marines of the 1st Marine Division, were surrounded by seven Chinese Divisions. Chesty responded, "The bastards can't get away from us this time." In 1971, when I was in boot camp at MCRD San Diego, every night when the lights went out, in unison, Platoon 1090 chanted, "Goodnight Chesty Puller, wherever you are?" Yep, I'm catching up, on page 33 now. Soon it will be "Howdy Doody Time" and I'll be current with the brawl between Bullwinkle and 1eyedjack. -Terry LCpl, USMC, retired

Bullwinkle58 -> RE: Nothing Up My Sleeve: Magical Moose Tricks--Bullwinkle58 vs.1EyedJacks (7/14/2013 7:07:31 PM)
June 19, 1942 Time To Go 1) Pounded by overwhelming force at sea and in the air I think it's time for the naval defense of Java to end. My task now is to try to get the scraps, primarily Support ships, out. Probably the only way is to try the Sunda route. Last two CLs at Soerbaja do try to run in on Banjo and hurt the landing force. A surface TF, less Akagi and Yamato, intercepts. CL Marblehead is lost. DD Shirayuki takes two shells, but one is massive explosive damage. She might sink. Five Dutch PTs also go at the surface force, but nothing hits. Finally, several subs take a turn. No hits, but S-40 experiences 12 hits, one penetrating. She'll be in trouble. In the air, massive Oscar sweeps at 38,500 take down Soerbaja's CAP, allowing Magic Mavis to sink three coastal minesweepers without a single CAP pass. The carriers down near Flores move into to the SE of Java's west coast. Kaga is confirmed to be the Kate-carrier. Its air strike fails. Morning Air attack on TF, near Soerabaja at 56,104 Weather in hex: Partial cloud Raid detected at 73 NM, estimated altitude 11,000 feet. Estimated time to target is 31 minutes Japanese aircraft A6M2 Zero x 23 B5N1 Kate x 6 D3A1 Val x 13 Japanese aircraft losses B5N1 Kate: 6 damaged Allied Ships CL Perth PT TM-11 PT TM-13 PT TM-10 The Dutch get up 5 Beests escorted by 3 Hawks. Five planes lost, no hits. Banshees high and B-17s low at 4000 feet hit nothing. (Maybe I need an HR requiring B-17s to stay above 10,000 because they're, ya know, TOO accurate?) Various and sundry attacks on Soerbaja and PBang cost Japan some planes for some more AF damage. Everything that could move was railed from PBang to Oosthaven to hide today. I think I will fly out whatever can repair until the heat is lower. Or forever, depending. Japan has shoved five gaggles of icons into the IO side of Java. I expect landing on the open coastline at Djakarta, etc. and use of the rails. Standard. Nothing is defended but Soerbaja, Batavia, and Merak, a bit. Java will delay as long as it can. My main worry right now is getting 32nd ID into PBang. And making life interesting elsewhere. Not going to talk about that yet. 2) In an almost comic footnote, Liberators ordered to hit the Oil at Urmachi in far northern China finally fly and do 7 hits. This river valley has eaten far more Japanese effort than it's worth for the oil it has. Even now the Urmachi refugees are marching south, severing the road. 3) Various bombing in Burma and China, Prome swept, Bassein attack progrsses, Big Stack moves a mile, USS Herring is mauled at Marcus I. after missing. Normal day.

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