A question about KG Kuhlman (Full Version)

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Sapa -> A question about KG Kuhlman (12/1/2012 3:51:20 PM)

and the 1.SS-Panzer..

Why doesent this BG use the SS version of the Panther?

[image]local://upfiles/31937/CC04B43A34354675BF9153CE930CD717.jpg[/image]



Sapa -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/1/2012 4:00:53 PM)

This is the forcepool i think..

[image]local://upfiles/31937/139B95AAA791461ABB64F8603D301211.jpg[/image]



Sapa -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/1/2012 4:16:07 PM)

Hmmm..same thing with 10.SS..

Is the SS armour from the forcepool not used in the game?

[image]local://upfiles/31937/DAE2C42AC7DD401A9975BCB7E406DEA9.jpg[/image]



Sapa -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/1/2012 4:20:31 PM)

renamed the Team names to SS (unit) just to test...

[image]local://upfiles/31937/9282501FE27A4D59A46B8C77B78770DE.jpg[/image]



SteveMcClaire -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/1/2012 11:50:28 PM)

I'm not sure what you're asking -- they do, in fact, use the SS version of the teams.  That's why you're seeing a black icon for the Panther team, and not a grayish one.  The "SS" designation is just not on the front of the team name in Panthers in the Fog.

SS-Pz.Rgt.1/1.SS-Panzer (FPools.txt entry 28) has 4 x Panther company, all unit structure ID 212, which is the SS Panzther Kp, which eventually boils down to AxsTeams.txt team index 127, which is the SS Panther A.



squadleader_id -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/2/2012 2:52:35 AM)

BTW, since Sapa posted pics above.
Minor graphical glitch...better to use stick grenade (Stielhandgranate) graphics for Germans like in previous CC releases.



Sapa -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/2/2012 3:48:23 AM)

Maybe my Enlish is too bad..thats why i tried to show pictures

Renamed the SS Units in GeTeams to SS + Unit name to test..

[image]local://upfiles/31937/CA092CABDC1B445C889D345A38F1B24F.jpg[/image]



Sapa -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/2/2012 4:01:17 AM)

Well...i must be stupid because the renamed armour unit (SS before unit name) doesent show in the game..strange that all the other units SS PzGrenadier aso shows in the game...

[image]local://upfiles/31937/6903FB1941114E919121502FDA750999.jpg[/image]



Sapa -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/2/2012 6:18:27 AM)

Found it..reads the name from the Vehicles file and not from the GeTeams file

Never seen that before..is this new for this game?

[image]local://upfiles/31937/D016613611B74E3899FED5155740669D.jpg[/image]



squadleader_id -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/2/2012 9:43:14 AM)

^
Nice find, Mats!



Rolle 3 -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/2/2012 10:51:00 AM)

Hi! I find something more. SS tank crews use Heer uniforms.





Sapa -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/2/2012 11:58:25 AM)

Is this the reason that the SS BG:s has both SS painted and standard painted vechicles?

If yes..does this mean that it is no difference in morale/experience between SS and the standard Heer and they are using vehicles from the same forcepool?



Tejszd -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/2/2012 6:14:29 PM)

Detective Sapa, good digging!



SteveMcClaire -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/3/2012 7:11:31 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sapa

Found it..reads the name from the Vehicles file and not from the GeTeams file

Never seen that before..is this new for this game?


Yes, it is. The teams file has changed a bit so that you can have several possible vehicles for each team. The exact vehicle the team gets is determined randomly. This is primarily used to mix up the US Sherman models, and to provide the visual variations on all vehicles. In order to specify the exact vehicle, the team is renamed to the vehicle name ... so a US 'Medium Tank' team will show up as a M4 Sherman, or M4A1 Sherman team in the game.





SteveMcClaire -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/3/2012 7:12:32 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sapa
If yes..does this mean that it is no difference in morale/experience between SS and the standard Heer and they are using vehicles from the same forcepool?


Morale and experience are taken from the teams file, so no, the randomized vehicle doesn't affect that.



squadleader_id -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/3/2012 8:05:28 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rolle 3

Hi! I find something more. SS tank crews use Heer uniforms.





Confirmed!
Please fix this...at least give these poor Panzer crews Waffen-SS infantry uniforms [;)]
Or better yet...please release the new gadgetmunger tool so we can manually fix these 32 bit graphic glitches.

BTW, although the rank graphics were redone for this release (CMIIW)...apparently not enough research was done.
I did some research for the custom rank graphics/gadgets used for CCTLD Ground Tactics mod.
Besides German Panzer crews wearing infantry uniforms and insignia...the waffenfarbe colors are not historically correct.
PzGrenadiers don't wear red waffenfarbe, they wear grass green instead.
Also Panzer Crews should wear pink waffenfarbe...not red (this is for arty troops, including Assault Gun crews).

[image]http://9thssaa.tripod.com/waffenfarbe.JPG[/image]



Sapa -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/3/2012 9:46:09 AM)

For people like me that wants to have the "details" right its sad to see SS with "wrong" vehicles just because the Shermans should have variations...

This is a thing that actually prevents me from playing the game further (yes i know im a little "damaged" from CC)

Mats



squadleader_id -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/3/2012 10:21:38 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sapa

For people like me that wants to have the "details" right its sad to see SS with "wrong" vehicles just because the Shermans should have variations...

This is a thing that actually prevents me from playing the game further (yes i know im a little "damaged" from CC)

Mats


Most of us still playing this game are somewhat "damaged", Mats [;)]



Sapa -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/3/2012 3:58:17 PM)

"Play single battles, linked operations, or even the Grand campaign simulating all six crucial days of fighting. With 35 linked battlefields and historically accurate formations and units, strategic choices are as important as tactical prowess. New features of long-range interdiction, strategic high ground and adverse weather conditions bring an insight into the challenges faced by those who commanded both sides in this pivotal WW2 battle."



Rolle 3 -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/3/2012 5:14:09 PM)

quote:

Or better yet...please release the new gadgetmunger tool so we can manually fix these 32 bit graphic glitches.


[&o]



SteveMcClaire -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/3/2012 5:32:40 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sapa

For people like me that wants to have the "details" right its sad to see SS with "wrong" vehicles just because the Shermans should have variations...


I am still uncertain why you think the SS are using the wrong vehicles. A Panther is a Panther. The SS did not have their own production line of Panther tanks that was different than they Heer.




SteveMcClaire -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/3/2012 5:44:36 PM)

Yes, the tank crews do share uniform images between the SS and Heer. Technically the only difference between the two (both wore Panzer-Black) would be the rank insignia.  Both are distinct from the Heer infantry uniforms (black vs. field gray) already. The tint of the waffenfarbe is something that may be addressed.

There is some cleanup work to be done on the new modding tools, but I expect them to be available in a week or two.

Steve



squadleader_id -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/3/2012 10:40:20 PM)

Can't wait for the modding tools! Thanks, Steve!

A few notes...
Sure the Waffen-SS Panthers were basically the same as the Heer versions...but...the SS Panzer Divisions did have their distinct camo schemes. So mixing them up with plain dunkel gelb Panthers (Heer camo schemes) ruins "historically accurate formations and units".

Both SS and Heer Panzer crews in PitF (and the other rereleases) are depicted with Heer infantry collar tabs (double Litzen)...instead of Panzer collar tabs (Totenkopf). Minor details but not historically correct. Assault gun crews also wore gray Assault Gun wrap...not black Panzer wrap.

One more annoying thing...I dunno whose bright idea it was to flip the SS ranks graphics (they're now showing the right side/shoulder of the soldier)...the Waffen-SS camo is cute...but if you flip the graphics then there's a problem! The right side should show SS runes unit collar patch...and not the collar rank insignia. Historically: SS-runes on the right collar-patch and the rank insignia on the left. Flip them back please [;)]
The same goes for Waffen-SS Panzer crews ranks...flip them back so they show the left side of the soldier...wait a sec...there are no SS Panzer crew ranks for the current version...they're shared with Heer ranks...my bad [:D]



WoT -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/4/2012 5:12:56 AM)

quote:

Assault gun crews also wore gray Assault Gun wrap...not black Panzer wrap.


IIRC this was fixed in Wacht am Rhein???

The panzer crews also had panzer pink waffenfarbe in Wacht am Rhein



Sapa -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/7/2012 3:24:49 AM)

Even in Sliterhines other "new" game Panzer Gene...oopppss...Panzer Corps did the know how to make the right look of the SS armour[sm=bow.gif]

[image]local://upfiles/31937/0CF25D39AAE34149BD9C78D3A64C647A.jpg[/image]



squadleader_id -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/7/2012 10:36:56 AM)

^^^
And I bet the Panzer Corps crewmen are not wearing black uniforms with double Litzen collar tabs [:D]



Sapa -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/9/2012 12:28:59 AM)

the Americans can drive around with there "variations of Sheman tanks" and my SS armour has cammo[:D] Now its just all the other SS vehicles to fix...

When im done i will upload the two files for FREE!

"What others cant do you have to do on your own"


[image]local://upfiles/31937/A66543B29F1742B68256D8E32D6F6FEF.jpg[/image]



squadleader_id -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/9/2012 1:13:13 AM)

^
Like this!!! Keep digging and fixing, Mats!



thesock -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (12/16/2012 4:28:37 PM)

Nice work



squadleader_id -> RE: A question about KG Kuhlman (1/7/2013 6:48:07 PM)

Thanks for releasing the tools.
Without messing with the data files (still waiting for changes in the upcoming major patch) to swap and add Nations and Styles...some quick tweaks and corrections on the ranks graphics (see previous posts).

Panzer crews with historical uniforms: panzer wraps, totenkopf patches (no more double litzen infantry collar tabs), pink waffenfarbe.
[image]http://imageshack.us/a/img13/9623/ccpitf0001.jpg[/image]

Waffen SS troops with flipped/corrected uniforms: SS-runes on the right collar-patch and the rank insignia on the left, white infantry waffenfarbe (Waffen SS PzGrenadiers also wore white waffenfarbe, not grass green like their Heer counterparts). I like the SS camo design for PitF, but tweaked it a bit...collar rank insignia were not worn on camo smocks.
[image]http://imageshack.us/a/img404/6177/ccpitf0002.jpg[/image]




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