quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

The Allies lost merchant ships, but they didn't lose that many troops transports, and it certainly wasn't even close to the level that it is in the game. How many troops in the Med were lost at sea, really?

What about this as a fix: When a ship is sunk, the equipment is destroyed, but the men go back in the pool. This would provide an incentive to protect shipping, but not a big VP penalty when the ships sink.

Let's assume the ships have lifeboats, and most of the guys are rescued

quote:

ORIGINAL: LiquidSky



At the other end of the scale though, take AFHQ.

It has a transport cost of 34 Troop Ship Points.

Lets assume about 10 hexes of travel through SHIPPING CONTESTED Hexes. For fun, lets assume the axis have level 6 interdiction (60 points) in 10 hexes of travel, but the allies have 9 in each of those hexes...thus making the travel friendly.

Still 64 if travelling from Algiers. However..there is enemy interdiction.

so we now add (60-9)/2 for each hex traveled..10 of them: say..250

Now we are rolling from 1 to 15 to 30 depending. Worse case 30. AND EVERY HEX WAS FRIENDLY. And the HQ needs 34 rolls.


Moral of the story.

Interdiction kills ships. (Higher values added per hex) Distance kills ships. (More values added) Size of convoy kills ships. (More rolls for death)

Friendly interdiction does little. It would be the difference between adding 1, 2 or 3 to the enemy interdiction (which would be at least 20 to cause SHIPPING HEAVILY CONTESTED) so 21 or 23? Phhhttt.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LiquidSky



Okay..Math time! My favourite part of the day.

Naval Path attrition is calculated as follows:

Add for EACH hex traveled through.

+1 if friendly
+2 if SHIPPING CONTESTED
+3 if SHIPPING HEAVILY CONTESTED

+ (Enemy Interdiction - 9) if adjacent to land
+ (Enemy Interdiction - 9) /2 if transport and not adjacent to land.

NOTE: Interdictions shown on the map are divided by 10. So a value of 9 would actually be 90-100 Enemy Interdiction.


+ 1 for RND(10)< 0:Clear, 1:Rain, 2:Heavy Rain, 3: cold, 4:snowfall, or 5:blizzard.

Now Randomize the total between half and full. (50% and 100%)

After this total....divide by 10.

If greater then 180 then it equals 180. Then for each point of transport, PERCENTILE are rolled and if less then RND(AV) then a sink occurs. END MATH


But what does this mean in game? Take the 2nd US Armoured Division for example.

Right clicking on the division shows a Transport Cost of 26998. This requires 27 Troop Transport points.

These 27 points travel from Algiers to just outside the Invasion area....64 hexes.

All these hexes are Friendly...so +64. There is no Enemy Interdiction on the first turn, and weather is clear...so 64 is it.

So the possible range of values will be from 32 to 64....which is then divided by 10 for the final value.

SO...Between 3 and 6.

Now its random time. You roll a die from 1-3(to 6). The computer rolls percentile. If the computer is lower then you, it wins, if you are lower, you win. BUT:

You roll 27 times....for each transport point.

For fun, I pretended it my value is 6. I roll 27 times:

4 4 1 3 3
2 5 1 4 5
2 5 2 5 2
3 3 5 6 2
5 6 6 6 1
4 5

The computer rolls percentile 27 times:

87 39 23 50 33
63 39 4 18 79
73 43 88 17 37
55 96 34 84 25
87 59 37 35 17
33 97

The computer only gets close on the 8th roll..but I rolled a 1 and he rolled a 4...so all 27 troop ship points make it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: NotOneStepBack

THANK YOU. I knew the mathematic rules from the manual, but couldn't really put it into words. This tells the story. Something needs to change so that friendly hexes in clear weather would give you about a .00001% chance of sinking per hex, only if the captain of the ship was drunk. Even then, he'd probably wing it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jakerson

Btw as manual says not all ships that are marked lost are sunk it also represent ships damaged or ships that needs to be repaired. Game also gives a lot more new transports and cargo ships each week than Britain and USA were able to produce per week on average.

USA and Britain were only able to produce 10-15 transports and cargo ships per week on average and half of ships produced went to pacific leaving only 5-7 new transport and cargo ships arriving at European theatre per week. But game gives you 34 new transport and cargo ships each week.

Am fairly sure that USA never produced those numbers of new transports and cargo ships per month what game gives allied eatch month and same time there were very big operation going in pasific that needed thousands of ships.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Joel Billings

The ships are an abstraction as it takes many ship points in the game to equal one ship. I think it's fair to say that the troop losses caused by ship losses is greater than it should be, even if the actual ship point losses are ok. That's because a lot of the losses are damage to ships that might not cause losses to material. I'll talk with Gary about tweaking down the losses to the manpower and material when ships are "lost".

quote:

ORIGINAL: Joel Billings

The ships are an abstraction as it takes many ship points in the game to equal one ship. I think it's fair to say that the troop losses caused by ship losses is greater than it should be, even if the actual ship point losses are ok. That's because a lot of the losses are damage to ships that might not cause losses to material. I'll talk with Gary about tweaking down the losses to the manpower and material when ships are "lost".