Knife vs Spear

Knife vs Spear (Full Version)

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scottb613 -> Knife vs Spear (7/30/2015 11:10:51 PM)
Hi Folks, RE: (4) F-5 Tiger II Vs (2) Mig-29 Been playing around with tactics on how an aircraft that lacks Amraams can take on aircraft that does have them... About the only feasible scenario I can come up with is for the aircraft with the short range missile must fly nap of the earth with their radars off (ideally - AEW/Airborne Intercept - is handled by another platform) - in hopes of avoiding detection long enough to pop up when they are close enough for a knife fight... I tried to create a mission that attempts to emulate this behavior- attached... The first issue I have is that the aircraft seem to ignore the settings in the mission for "Speed and Altitude Override"... No matter what altitudes I put in these boxes - the aircraft fly high even when not offensively engaged... Am I doing something wrong ??? [&:] Then while testing this tactic - it really seems to need one other setting to be able to employ it properly... I think we need the ability to define a range for aircraft to go "Offensively Engaged"... As it is now - as soon as the enemy is detected - off go the aircraft ignoring course, speed, and altitude settings - as they should - but not from 50 miles away if all you have is a 10 mile missile... What I envision should happen is - the aircraft on an AAW Patrol stays low and quite as per the mission settings - until x miles away then it goes into "Offensively Engaged" providing an enemy is within the specified range - then pops up and attack the enemy - if it survives and eliminates the enemy it goes back to its low and quite AAW patrol awaiting a surprise attack on the next enemy that approaches withing the specified range... Any discussion welcome... Regards, Scott

thewood1 -> RE: Knife vs Spear (7/30/2015 11:32:21 PM)
First thing I noticed is you didn't tell the mission to follow the altitude/speed override.

thewood1 -> RE: Knife vs Spear (7/30/2015 11:41:51 PM)
After I changed the mission to use the overrides, I also killed the plotted course you had set. This was keeping them from doing the mission. The F-5s flew to the patrol zone and when they entered they went offensive. I didn't see them start to climb until with 7 miles of the Mig-29s. A short range dogfight ended with each side losing two planes. That is a pretty good exchange for F-5s to Mig-29s.

scottb613 -> RE: Knife vs Spear (7/30/2015 11:46:55 PM)
Hi Wood, "First thing I noticed is you didn't tell the mission to follow the altitude/speed override." - - - that may be what I'm missing - let me look again... [;)] Regards, Scott

Tomcat84 -> RE: Knife vs Spear (7/31/2015 10:01:48 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: scottb613 (4) F-5 Tiger II Vs (2) Mig-29 Been playing around with tactics on how an aircraft that lacks Amraams can take on aircraft that does have them... Both these aircraft lack AMRAAMs [:'(] Also the behavior you want might be doable with a prosecution zone, but the placement of both your patrol area and your prosecution zone would depend greatly on knowing the route of the MiGs

thewood1 -> RE: Knife vs Spear (7/31/2015 10:39:08 AM)
I think most of what he was looking for was to make sure his AAW patrol didn't break the mission profile too soon. I think it works pretty close what he wants with the minor change.

Tomcat84 -> RE: Knife vs Spear (7/31/2015 11:59:11 AM)
Nevertheless I felt like trying my idea out and building a little Ambush CAP test scenario. Seems to work decently although they do climb a bit early maybe. Have 2 x 2 F-5s hiding behind the ridge north and south. 2 MiG-29s cross the ridgein the center because that seems to be the weakest spot in the SAM belt. But that's what the ambushcap is for.

scottb613 -> RE: Knife vs Spear (7/31/2015 1:12:17 PM)
Hi Folks, Hah - yep - I missed that first setting Wood - the overrides now work... Thanks... LOL - no AMRAAMS - Tomcat - Ooops ? No wonder why they never shot them... I'll fix it - my expertise is at a slightly lower level... One thing I did notice is that it seems the MIG doesn't detect the F-5's until extremely close... I'll take a look at your scenario tonight - I'm on my iPad at the moment.. Thanks guys... Regards, Scott

thewood1 -> RE: Knife vs Spear (7/31/2015 1:28:02 PM)
It doesn't detect the F-5s easily because they are low and silent until the last minute. I think that is the way you planned it.

scottb613 -> RE: Knife vs Spear (7/31/2015 1:45:50 PM)
Hi Wood, Sorry - I was vague - even when I couldn't get my aircraft to approach at low altitude - and the MIG radars were on - the MIG's seemed to ignore (would turn their backs to them) the approaching F5's until they were very close - I did have the option on for the MIG's to investigate contacts outside of their area... :) Regards, Scott

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