RE: The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo)

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STEF78 -> RE: The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/5/2016 7:50:38 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: loki100 quote: ORIGINAL: STEF78 Stalino ... After my moves, the southern defence of Stalino is near from collapsing. I have still 3 weeks to take the city ... good tense stuff, nice to see a German player prepared to fight it out on the front lines. I also think that if a German player wants to do real damage in 1942 (especially to industry and manpower) then they need to hold as far east in the winter as they can? it's a really interesting game. My progress were beyond my expectations in front of Moscow but I thought that Stalino would have fallen before end january. Bobo did a great job in this area.

STEF78 -> The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/5/2016 7:56:06 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: 821Bobo quote: good tense stuff, nice to see a German player prepared to fight it out on the front lines. The most important thing for me is that this time the Blizzard was fun. And fights were intense as shown below by the evolution of the OOB. My rifle squads were unable to grow and my AFV were burnt. German arty is also very low. For example in my previous games, at this stage of the war, the germans were between 33K and 36K [img]http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/597442evolOOB.jpg[/img]

beekeeper -> RE: The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/7/2016 11:15:21 PM)
Very intresting game for me ^.^ i'll be reading! PS. i think use PZd for def it big mistake ,better to give the territory, it's not worth it

loki100 -> RE: The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/8/2016 7:40:51 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: beekeeper Very intresting game for me ^.^ i'll be reading! PS. i think use PZd for def it big mistake ,better to give the territory, it's not worth it I'm not sure, think its a trade off. If you fall back too far to the west then it doesn't matter how good your 1942 offensive is. The Soviets will have plenty of space to trade off and still be able to start their 1943 offensives relatively far to the west. I think the second half of the game is all about when the Soviets reach/cross two major river lines. So you need to have driven them to the east of the Don so that becomes the first point of contest in the winter of 42/43 and then the Dneipr is the main focus in the winter of 43/44. Do that and you have a good chance of running the clock down in the end game. Different games have very different dynamics but in my current game vigabrand had an excellent 1942, reduced my net OOB by 1m and took 2m prisoners. But because he started too far to the west (I think), its going to be a challenge to find some means to buy time to hold me back in the later years.

STEF78 -> The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/8/2016 10:29:18 PM)
Turn 35, 12th february 1942 Momentum is lost almost everywhere... Smolensk Time to pay the bill [:(] [img]http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/412580bobo35n.jpg[/img] Stalino I want this city! It would give an anchor for the next spring. Before my moves [img]http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/993941bobo35s.jpg[/img] And after... romanians are routed but there is still a corridor to Stalino [img]http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/913877bobo35s2.jpg[/img]

loki100 -> RE: The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/9/2016 7:52:37 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: STEF78 Stalino I want this city! It would give an anchor for the next spring. Before my moves are you sure about this, realise the latest patch has changed 1942 quite a bit but the Germans are still very dangerous and mobile? I can't imagine that someone as competent as b21bobo won't just outflank it with a relatively simple attack down to the Sea of Azov? Think you are right to take it now if you can, he's fighting for it so its a chance to inflict losses and generate Guards but I'd regard it as no more important for Spring-Summer 1942 than any other hex along the current frontline

sillyflower -> RE: The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/9/2016 8:20:32 AM)
Don't forget the metagame. Stalino has become a talisman for both sides and is now important for player morale. Good game.

STEF78 -> RE: The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/9/2016 9:35:02 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: loki100 quote: ORIGINAL: STEF78 Stalino I want this city! It would give an anchor for the next spring. Before my moves are you sure about this, realise the latest patch has changed 1942 quite a bit but the Germans are still very dangerous and mobile? I can't imagine that someone as competent as b21bobo won't just outflank it with a relatively simple attack down to the Sea of Azov? Think you are right to take it now if you can, he's fighting for it so its a chance to inflict losses and generate Guards but I'd regard it as no more important for Spring-Summer 1942 than any other hex along the current frontline Thanks to Beekeeper I'm now well aware that germans are dangerous in 1942![:(] Even if I take the city, I won't be able to hold it during the whole spring/summer 1942 but these 3 hexes, added to the form of the front would mean an easier defence of this area. The fall of Rostov would be delayed, maybe the city could be held. As you noticed the key in 1942 for the russian player is to keep the Don / Oka line clear. Stalino will not be my "russian Stalingrad" but I have rationnal reasons to take it. And above all, it's fun to have such an aim and fight for it! [:D] On the other side the second key of 1942 will be the ability of germans to recover firepower after having overused their Pzd during blizzard. Spring will tell us if Bobo was right.

STEF78 -> RE: The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/9/2016 9:38:03 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sillyflower Don't forget the metagame. Stalino has become a talisman for both sides and is now important for payer morale. Good game. Thanks my dear English invader [;)] Your opinion is fully true in 1941. As loki, I think 1942 for the russians is more about the Don/Oka line

STEF78 -> The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/9/2016 10:11:22 AM)
Turn 35, 12th february 1942 An overall view of the front. Some areas are hidden for obvious reasons as we are only 5 turns ahead the AAR... Somme comments: - satisfied with my winter campaign (buffer created in front of Moscow, 4 guards armies, more than 50 guards infs) - German Pzd has been spread in 4 hot spots to prevent a major fall back. They suffered losses but did well in the north while destroying 2 Cav Corps. - I could have easily advanced more West of Kharkov but didn't want to create a "big bulge" - I've already begun to set on refit on rail in the back several armies - On my last game I was really surprised with the strength of german's offensive in march 1942. I will be more careful this time We shall see how fast and high initiative will go back to the german side... [img]http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/129689bobo35.jpg[/img]

loki100 -> RE: The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/9/2016 11:18:40 AM)
you look to be in good shape, in my game with vigabrand at this stage I had 219 HI and 345 arms and have not had any supply problems - even able to run all my production (incl fort digging) at 100%. So your 222 - 335 is a good basis (actually better balanced than me as I have more arms pts production centres than I can really use). fascinating to look at the pattern of losses and how it reflects bobo's decision to fight the winter. You have 3.62m lost (incl 1.3m prisoners), I had the same total (3.62m) but with 2m prisoners - I think that I was too willing to delay vigabrand in 1941 by offering up sacrificial stay behind garrisons etc. As you know its all about minimising how far you now get pushed east and how much of your army you can keep intact - looks like its going to be a fun game

sillyflower -> RE: The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/9/2016 11:48:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: STEF78 quote: ORIGINAL: sillyflower Don't forget the metagame. Stalino has become a talisman for both sides and is now important for payer morale. Good game. Thanks my dear English invader [;)] Your opinion is fully true in 1941. As loki, I think 1942 for the russians is more about the Don/Oka line Invader???? [:-] I come to free you, though I will be rightly be told off if I explain why on this forum [:D]. Suffice to say that I now have my secret lair, so the next thing on my shopping list is a white cat. I agree with you about the terrain, but I was thinking purely of the psychological effect of you taking Stalino this winter, or not. I would not for one moment think you would expect or even try to hold it in '42. It will be very hard for Bobo now given the strength of your economy and your ever-growing army.

STEF78 -> RE: The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/13/2016 8:44:06 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: loki100 As you know its all about minimising how far you now get pushed east and how much of your army you can keep intact - looks like its going to be a fun game I will do my best! And it's fun

STEF78 -> RE: The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/13/2016 8:45:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sillyflower It will be very hard for Bobo now given the strength of your economy and your ever-growing army. In my previous game I was also in very good shape at the end of february 1942, game is clearly not over...

STEF78 -> The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/13/2016 8:52:48 PM)
Turn 36, 19th february 1942 Great surprise at the opening of the turn: MUD in february on the major part of the front!!!! [img]http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/954341bobo36weather.jpg[/img] Stalino is saved as the northern part of the corridor is now unbreachable... some attacks in the southern part of the city for fun [img]http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/175484bobo36s.jpg[/img]

STEF78 -> The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/20/2016 9:24:39 PM)
Turn 37, 26th february 1942 Last turn of blizzard, time to prepare march german offensive. I need to be cautious. First, an overall view of the front with the red arrows showing my progress during blizzard. Stavka is pretty satisfied with his winter campaign. 20th and 32nd armies are promoted to guards armies! [img]http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/930291bobo37.jpg[/img] Focus in the South, the brave russian recons have identified a strong german Pzg [img]http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/317129bobo37pzd.jpg[/img] We give up the territory between Stalino and Azov sea and the 47th army is sent in the rear to create a strong second line of defence [img]http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/438674bobo37s.jpg[/img]

loki100 -> RE: The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/21/2016 7:17:23 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: STEF78 ... Last turn of blizzard, time to prepare march german offensive. I need to be cautious. First, an overall view of the front with the red arrows showing my progress during blizzard. Stavka is pretty satisfied with his winter campaign. 20th and 32nd armies are promoted to guards armies! .. I'm jealous about your Gds Armies, June 1943 and I still have none. Glad you pulled out of that trap to the south of Stalino. I'm now very cautious about trying to defend anywhere along the Sea of Azov in 1942 as its just too easy to pocket.

STEF78 -> RE: The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/21/2016 6:30:05 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: loki100 quote: ORIGINAL: STEF78 ... Stavka is pretty satisfied with his winter campaign. 20th and 32nd armies are promoted to guards armies! .. I'm jealous about your Gds Armies, June 1943 and I still have none. It's not all about my skill... We are playing mild blizzard but +1 soviet bonus. It allows the russian player to significantly increase the win loss ratio

sillyflower -> RE: The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/21/2016 8:40:14 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: STEF78 quote: ORIGINAL: sillyflower It will be very hard for Bobo now given the strength of your economy and your ever-growing army. In my previous game I was also in very good shape at the end of february 1942, game is clearly not over... Very true - but you are in a good position to win if you do not make major mistakes.

STEF78 -> German march 1942 offensive(STE78 vs 821bobo) (1/24/2016 5:13:48 PM)
Turn 38, 5th march 1942 This time blizzard is over and german army is back at full strength! Bobo attacks on 4 spots: in front of Moscow, near Bryansk, near Sumy and South of Stalino. A guard cav corps and an Inf Div are isolated. I could rescue them while moving the 9 Cv german inf but it would increase the number of units threatened by an encirclement. I decide to abandon them at their fate... sad but necessary. [img]http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/958855bobo38.jpg[/img]

STEF78 -> German march 1942 offensive(STE78 vs 821bobo) (2/1/2016 7:21:31 AM)
Turn 39, 12th march 1942 Second week of german march offensive. Except in the South, Bobo didn't succeed to recover decisive momentum. As shown below, he choosed to divide his mobile forces in 3 groups. This way I have to be strong in 3 areas but he also lacks of "Schwerpunkt". Stavka is also pleased to announce the promotion of the 34th army to 5th guard army! [img]http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/973880bobo39.jpg[/img] South west of Moscow, he made little progress but on the other side, I was unable to counterattack [img]http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/774732bobo39n.jpg[/img] Near Stalino, he is much stronger but I've built a decent major line of resistance. I will try to hold it till mud. [img]http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/959237bobo39s.jpg[/img]

STEF78 -> March 42 german offensive (STE78 vs 821bobo) (2/4/2016 10:05:57 PM)
Turn 40, 19th march 1942 Random weather.... I'm rather lucky as we have mud near the Black sea. German offensive is stoppped South of Stalino [img]http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/947302bobo40meteo.jpg[/img] Southwest of Moscow, the front is quiet but it won't last! [img]http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/623274bobo40n.jpg[/img] The only place where german offensive is still on: Sumy area. I"m always impressed with german MCV. [img]http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/693602bobo40c.jpg[/img]

STEF78 -> March 42 german offensive (STE78 vs 821bobo) (2/9/2016 6:29:15 AM)
Turn 41, 26th march 1942 Last week of march german offensive before mud. Russian army has given almost no ground except in the South and Stavka is proud to announce promotion of 47th army to 6th guard army! [img]http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/217193bobo41log.jpg[/img] Focus on the 3 german axes of attack. Nothing decisive Kaluga Heroic resistance of soviet soldiers! [img]http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/633386bobo41n.jpg[/img] Sumy Our soldiers fought bravely but were outnumered by 600 german AFV [img]http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/855764bobo41c.jpg[/img] Stalino German spearhead is too strong to be pulled back.... [img]http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/587898bobo41s.jpg[/img]

STEF78 -> April 42, mud (STE78 vs 821bobo) (2/15/2016 8:41:25 PM)
Turn 43, 9th april 1942 Mud during the last 2 weeks. Below the evolution of the OOB. Should I build more tank brigades? I have plenty of T34 in pool... [img]http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/687805bobo3843.jpg[/img]

loki100 -> RE: April 42, mud (STE78 vs 821bobo) (2/15/2016 9:28:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: STEF78 Turn 43, 9th april 1942 Mud during the last 2 weeks. Below the evolution of the OOB. Should I build more tank brigades? I have plenty of T34 in pool... [img]http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/687805bobo3843.jpg[/img] I wouldn't. Not so much the T-34s as the trucks, I tend to find I have enough tank brigades to fit out all the tank corps I want to build, but I guess it depends on how agressive you intend to be with the brigades?

STEF78 -> RE: April 42, mud (STE78 vs 821bobo) (2/16/2016 6:27:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: loki100 I wouldn't. Not so much the T-34s as the trucks, I tend to find I have enough tank brigades to fit out all the tank corps I want to build, but I guess it depends on how agressive you intend to be with the brigades? We are currently entering may 1942. I use tank brigades in reserve mode and will not be on the offensive during the 2 next monthes. Even divided, german Pzg are powerfull and with clear weather will recover a lot of mobility.... I'm always scary while opening my turns, looking at the front line hoping not to discover a hole or worse a strong encirclement.

caliJP -> RE: April 42, mud (STE78 vs 821bobo) (2/19/2016 9:57:51 PM)
How many Tank Brigades do you have already? I like to build some Tank Corps in 1942 and put them several hexes behind the front line in areas where Pz attack. They can be very helpful for counterattacking German spearheads, and that gives them good experience and morale to prep them for 1943 Red Army offensive, if you get there.

STEF78 -> RE: April 42, mud (STE78 vs 821bobo) (2/21/2016 10:05:07 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: caliJP How many Tank Brigades do you have already? I like to build some Tank Corps in 1942 and put them several hexes behind the front line in areas where Pz attack. They can be very helpful for counterattacking German spearheads, and that gives them good experience and morale to prep them for 1943 Red Army offensive, if you get there. I have currently 100 Tk brigades and most of them are below their nominal %TOE despite the fact that I have plenty AFV available. They are mostly used in reserve mode as 3rd or 4th line of defence. Only one of them managed to get the guard status. They are too weak at the moment to counterattack efficiently. [img]http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/981962tkbrigades.jpg[/img] And my pool [img]http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/637557tkbrigades2.jpg[/img]

STEF78 -> The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (2/21/2016 10:36:35 AM)
Turn 44, 16th april 1944 Snow in central russia, mud in the other part of the front. Stavka is pleased to announce promotion of the 38th army to 7th guard army! [img]http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/468905bobo44.jpg[/img] Kaluga Strong resistance of the 4th guard army. [img]http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/707185bobo44n.jpg[/img] Sumy Some progress od the german Pzd. It becomes annoying... [img]http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/309857bobo44c.jpg[/img] Stalino Bobo has changed his mind and moved a big part of his Pzg north of Stalino. Russian line holds! [img]http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/675238bobo44s.jpg[/img]

caliJP -> RE: The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo) (2/22/2016 5:48:03 PM)
quote: quote: ORIGINAL: caliJP How many Tank Brigades do you have already? I like to build some Tank Corps in 1942 and put them several hexes behind the front line in areas where Pz attack. They can be very helpful for counterattacking German spearheads, and that gives them good experience and morale to prep them for 1943 Red Army offensive, if you get there. I have currently 100 Tk brigades and most of them are below their nominal %TOE despite the fact that I have plenty AFV available. They are mostly used in reserve mode as 3rd or 4th line of defence. Only one of them managed to get the guard status. They are too weak at the moment to counterattack efficiently. Yeah you need to turn them into Tank Corps. Brigades will never be strong enough. Then add a sapper reg, a heavy tank reg, and maybe some other fun SU :). They will then be able to counter attack, although early on they aren't super strong so you'll have to pick easy battes to get their morale up. 100 brigades will get you 33 Corps, which is more than enough in 1942. Later in the war, I build some more to get around 40 Tank Corps which I find I need if I want to make two big pushes simultaneously. But that depends on your situation and strategy at the time.

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