Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (Full Version)

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timmyab -> Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (12/24/2015 3:52:19 PM)

Bitter end campaign. Mild blizzard and Soviet +1 attack bonus. Non-random weather, Full FOW, server game.

I haven't played a Soviet campaign for a couple of years. The recent changes seem to offer the chance of a more evenly balanced 42 where in recent patches it has been a bit too easy for the Germans to cut a swath through the Soviet armies. The difference between 40 NM and 45 is much greater than the 5 points would suggest. 40 morale troops not only have lower strength but more importantly are far more prone to routing.

Bobo wanted to try the bitter end campaign so that's what we're playing. I'll offer him a win though if he can meet any of the sudden death or VP260 victory requirements.

I've played Bobo before so I'm expecting a tough game. His opening turn confirms this.

Turn 1

All pockets are solid and (I believe) unbreakable.
Like all good players he crosses the Dvina in force on turn 1. Riga is captured but not occupied so I'm able to recapture it although the port is damaged so is unuseable as a supply source and will certainly fall to a hasty attack next turn.
North of the Dvina I mainly cover the standard attack towards Pskov with the hope to prevent a crossing of the Velekiya on turn 2. Of secondary importance is to cover the approach to Velikie Luki. The town itself is held by an infantry division just to be on the safe side. Estonia is virtually undefended except for a brigade in Tallinn and some security regiments.

The center is kind of dangerous looking and maybe where the Axis are making their main effort. I've set up a checkerboard which should slow them down a bit but this area is slightly vulnerable I think. The fact that there are no good leaders in the area is an added problem that I should have corrected but didn't. (Yushkevich got routed into the Minsk pocket). One division is ordered to hold Minsk to the last bullet. Two strong divisions were sent here from SW front this week and more will follow next week.






[image]local://upfiles/36871/E2E2A08344D048D692CCBA6F64F0566C.jpg[/image]



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (12/24/2015 3:56:41 PM)

The Southern opening is unambitious with no attempt to cut off my strong divisions around Dubno. This means that I can form a fairly strong temporary stop line to the North and South of Vinitsa with strong points in front of it. I'm not expecting this line to be seriously breached although the increased cost of railing units means that it's not as strong as it could be. Next week I will retreat another 100 miles roughly to a line Kiev-Nikolaev. Kiev is a victory point location in this campaign game so I'll try not to make it too easy for him to capture although I'm not going to risk losing a lot of stuff by making a huge fight for it. His armor seems to be heading South though so an early capture of Kiev may not be part of the plan.

I enjoy constructing these early game Soviet defenses. Each time is different and there are always vulnerabilities which only become apparent after it's too late to do anything about it. The increased rail costs have definitely made it more of a challenge. A few of my deep reserve divisions haven't moved at all, especially the tank and mech units. Some of these may be held up for weeks waiting for spare rail capacity.



[image]local://upfiles/36871/52FD20CD11EA4752B7541DA309BE20A9.jpg[/image]



Bozo_the_Clown -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (12/24/2015 5:30:39 PM)

821Bobo is a weak player. He quit his game against me on turn 8 after I cut off his spearhead blobs over and over again. Also, be prepared to not get a response from him for 2 to 3 weeks depending how the game goes.

You will have no problem winning this game. I doubt it will be a long game. Enjoy!



Peltonx -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (12/24/2015 6:08:19 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Bozo_the_Clown

821Bobo is a weak player. He quit his game against me on turn 8 after I cut off his spearhead blobs over and over again. Also, be prepared to not get a response from him for 2 to 3 weeks depending how the game goes.

You will have no problem winning this game. I doubt it will be a long game. Enjoy!


Stop hitting the resign button and I am guessing Bobo would send a turn back.

I never had an issue playing Bobo and have heard nothing but good things in all his AAR's

I am guessing your confused again.



Mehring -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (12/24/2015 6:27:34 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Bozo_the_Clown

821Bobo is a weak player. He quit his game against me on turn 8 after I cut off his spearhead blobs over and over again. Also, be prepared to not get a response from him for 2 to 3 weeks depending how the game goes.

You will have no problem winning this game. I doubt it will be a long game. Enjoy!

I don't have this experience of him either. Actually, if he were the type to go around bad mouthing people, he would probably have done so with me as I quit a game 20 odd turns in. Not that he could have known, but it was unavoidable for me. Lesson is, you don't know what's going on around the keyboard at the other end, so accumulate a lot more evidence before you go slagging people, you do no credit to yourself.



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (12/29/2015 1:18:42 PM)

Turn 2

North and Center

Bobo's opening strategy appears to be pretty much standard. 4th pz group to Pskov, 3rd pz to the land bridge and 2nd pz clearing the West bank of the upper Dnepr. Although it's probably the best overall strategy, one good thing about it for me is that the huge area between 27th army and the Dvina can be left very lightly defended.

An impressive advance in the center where both Mogilev and Orsha are captured. The cost of this rapid advance is that his rear area and flank security is inadequate. The Bialystock pocket is reopened from the South and my units in the new Berezino pocket are able to ZOC his supply routes and restrict the supply of fuel to his lead panzer units. This pocket and the division in Minsk are resupplied by air. The center is definitely looking dangerous though and I may have to abandon the land bridge and Dnepr sooner than I would like.

Pz group 4 manages to capture Ostrov despite my best efforts and holds the town in sufficient strength to make a successful counterattack seem doubtful. With AGN infantry far away it's tempting to just stubbornly hold the river line, but because most of my reinforcements have gone to the hard pressed center I decide to back off. The main reinforcement this turn is 24th army under the command of Aleksandr Vasilevsky which is handed over to the Northern front and given the job of plugging the most likely route of advance to Leningrad through Pskov. 27th army covers it's East flank. A corps from 22nd army covers the Sorot river in case of an unlikely change of direction towards Veliki Luki. As with the center the flanks are inadequately protected. Two divisions from 24th rifle corps attack from the east but both fall just short of inflicting any serious damage, but not by much and this should serve as a warning if nothing else. The attack does restrict supply to the lead pz divisions though and will force his infantry towards the West.

To the South of the Dvina there are also two divisions which could cause problems next turn if the flanks aren't better protected. One in particular lurks in a swamp hoping to go unnoticed. This division could do some damage if it's not detected. When my cavalry divisions arrive on week 4 the flanking danger will increase.




[image]local://upfiles/36871/B8D267D24D1045D8BA1ECA364FDB4946.jpg[/image]



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (12/29/2015 1:23:42 PM)

South

As with the North I'm tempted to more or less hold my ground here for one more week, but again the strong advance of AGC makes me cautious. There's little point in risking losing valuable divisions here which may soon be badly needed in the decisive battles for the center. Therefore I pull back to my second stop line which I don't expect to be breached on turn 3. So as not to make it too easy for him I've left behind 24th mech corps to picket the vacated defenses. This corps will slow down 1st pz group and it's placement is designed to be a menace to it's rear if not properly dealt with.
One mech and one cavalry division draw a short straw and are selected to attack the Axis supply lines to the North West of Proskurov (Codename 'Operation certain death'). Although this is pretty much a suicide mission it does three useful things.
1. It immediately reduces the supply of fuel to1st pz group. Not too much in this case but it'll maybe knock 5 MPs off their movement.
2. These divisions will also be a serious nuisance next turn unless they are dealt with so they are often routed which means that they may live to fight again anyway.
3. Probably most importantly these flanking moves put a seed of doubt into aggressive player's minds. I'd happily swap two dozen cavalry divisions in 41 for that (and probably will)
A similar mission North of Kishinev displaces an FBD unit at Ungeny. This attack is probably a waste of a cavalry division, but again it's main aim is to sow doubt.
Having just studied this screen shot I'm concerned that there may be a pz corps to the West of Kishinev which I didn't spot during my move This pz corps railed to the deep South move is something I've used myself and had used against me in the past and it's surprise element is high.



[image]local://upfiles/36871/A725B6E257FF466C9F2584B2E2334ADE.jpg[/image]



sillyflower -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (12/29/2015 1:57:49 PM)

When playing German, I would gladly swap a little doubt for your having 8 fewer cav xxx in December........

His central advance may look good this turn, but his panzers will be pretty static for 2 or 3 turns as they are a very long way from any railhead.

In the south, I think the displacing of the FBD in Rumania was the best 'waste' of a unit in your turn. It will slow his railhead by half a turn and more if he doesn't rout the cav out of the way. Actually, if I were Bobo, I would just try to retreat the cav I hex to clear the railine from your ZOCs and then kill it on T4.



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (12/29/2015 2:11:19 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: sillyflower

When playing German, I would gladly swap a little doubt for your having 8 fewer cav xxx in December........

lol hopefully it wont be that many. Mind you I've just finished turn six and I'm starting to lose count of how many have gone already :( I'll rebuild some of them in November anyway I expect.
The cavalry corps aren't the uber threat they used to be before the milder blizzard.



821Bobo -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (12/29/2015 2:49:48 PM)

quote:

In the south, I think the displacing of the FBD in Rumania was the best 'waste' of a unit in your turn. It will slow his railhead by half a turn and more if he doesn't rout the cav out of the way. Actually, if I were Bobo, I would just try to retreat the cav I hex to clear the railine from your ZOCs and then kill it on T4.


Actually the Cav div retreated and was killed on T4 [:)]
But displacing FBD was worth it.



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/3/2016 9:06:40 AM)

Turn 3

North

More running away. A rear guard of 2nd line divisions is left behind in a cheqerboard to protect the 1st line divisions in the MLR while a suicide detachment attacks 4th pz group's supply lines. 11th and 8th armies are rebuilt.
I'm still defending in a minimal sort of way against the possibility that 4th pz could turn SE towards VL.


[image]local://upfiles/36871/84C2B3B3B59549BDA63CAA852FAA96AB.jpg[/image]



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/3/2016 9:08:37 AM)

Center

AGC is waiting for the infantry to catch up while it's panzers refuel. I do my best to inhibit this refueling and the air supplied units still in the Berezino pocket are what make this possible. A good mech division is also sacrificed towards this purpose although this division may survive because it's in an awkward spot and could get routed out.
I intend to back off next week from the land bridge. By week 5 the danger from German infantry and highly fueled panzers is too great to risk hanging about. I'll leave behind a rear guard and probably form a temporary line roughly Gomel-Smolensk-Velikie Luki.
An infantry division still lurks in the swamps to the NE of Vilnius hoping for the opportunity to ambush the FBD unit heading out of the city.



[image]local://upfiles/36871/5D4B08D06EDB4A948238423DB1BA3289.jpg[/image]



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/3/2016 9:09:47 AM)

South

Well thank god the phantom pz corps in the South turned out to be just that. In fact 1st pz group did roughly what I originally expected it to do and surrounded 24th mech corps. Lucky for me the tank division in Zhitomir is able to break the pocket with not one MP to spare. This move combined with an attack on it's supply lines to the South means that 1st pz group should be short of fuel next week. My opinion is that these small pockets are often more trouble than they're worth for the Axis player. I use tank and mech divisions in particular for these pocket battles because they have little combat value but do have some useable mobility.
I got caught in two minds on what to do with the main line in the South and as a result it's a bit odd looking. I don't think a breakthrough is likely though.
Two divisions garrison Odessa.

Industry moved
7 Arm 4 HI




[image]local://upfiles/36871/2176E79424B243BCAD22E116D3FDF33E.jpg[/image]



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/9/2016 8:54:16 AM)

Turn 4

North

Another week of retreating right across the front. The Northern fronts will have to fight it out from here on though with the Luga being the first serious stop line of the campaign. Of course AGN wont be stopped but maybe I can hold them up for a month if I'm lucky. My Luga MLR is behind the river with added strength in the vulnerable spot just behind the town of Luga. Here there are two strong divisions under 24th army (Vasilevsky). There's also a strong mountain division in the town which forms part of a line which runs in front of the MLR. This line in front of the river is a new tactic for me and I think it has some advantages, but it's as yet untested in battle so we'll see how it goes.
11th army guards against the right hook although I doubt it will happen because AGN's infantry is too far away to help much this turn. The lead pz corps is again hassled by some disposable units.

Center

I decide it's too risky to try and hold the land bridge for another turn. It's a close decision but my experience playing the Axis side since 1.08 onwards is that turn 5 at the land bridge often produces a decent pocket and Bobo is better positioned to strike than most players at this point. My line anchored on Smolensk may only last for one turn as well because the terrain is not ideal for defense. My first serious attempt to bring him to battle will be about 50 miles East of this line, probably around turn 7. This is a turn or two before I would like and I have a fear that Moscow might fall.
I've left behind a picket defense of the Dnepr and also the bulge to the West of Velikie Luki. I've moved some cavalry into this bulge to threaten the flank of AGN.



[image]local://upfiles/36871/0B68EB85D8B34799A12C57CDC1F8DDB6.jpg[/image]



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/9/2016 8:56:15 AM)

South

Another week another river line. I'm more comfortable with the situation down here though which is going more or less according to plan. Hopefully they wont cross the Dnepr before turn 7.


This week has seen a purge of senior officers thanks to the turn 4 AP bonus. Pavlov was executed (not on my orders) and replaced at Western Front by Eremenko - nice! Meretskov is given command of the newly formed reserve front and Timishenko takes over the Southern front. Several army commanders also get the boot and are replaced with the best officers available. This restructuring of the high command should see a significant stiffening of resistance with hopefully a lot more held results. (it didn't)

Industry moved
11 Arm 4 HI


[image]local://upfiles/36871/21798207B0DC4851AE128865750544EC.jpg[/image]



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/19/2016 12:00:12 AM)

Turn 5

North

This week is spent preparing for the battle to come. I've given priority to defending the center of the Luga line, but AGN could go for either flank so my strength is diluted. My guess is that they'll try a left hook. There's also still the risk of a right hook to the South of lake Ilman so 11th army is on guard there.
7th army is given a minimal force, only enough to slow down the Finns. I'm not going to try to stop them.


[image]local://upfiles/36871/CBF652D0F11A436CBF55A51E30070BA2.jpg[/image]



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/19/2016 12:03:37 AM)

Center

The first what you might call 'out of book' move of the campaign, or at least not on the first page. 3rd PG makes a left turn to cut off the bulge West of Velikie Luki. To be honest this is something of a relief for me because it releases the pressure on my main force covering Moscow. The other good news is first that the pocket only contains seven replacement starved divisions and second that it's breakable. The worst of it is that two of the divisions are cavalry and I've had to risk a third to break the pocket. On balance though this is a good trade for the easing of pressure on my center and so the Smolensk line can stay for at least one more week.

You'll notice that I don't believe in sheltering my cavalry divisions (maybe wrongly) and I've placed three more in harm's way this week by sending 5th cavalry corps into the Pripet marshes to threaten the rail line being converted towards Minsk. Bobo wont allow his rail to be overrun I'm certain, but he will have to allocate troops to cover it.


[image]local://upfiles/36871/295C1299FB7E4106B20D300ED26D05D8.jpg[/image]



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/19/2016 12:10:58 AM)

South

Yet another river line and probably another one to follow next week too. They've done their job and if AGS doesn't cross the Dnepr on turn 6 then I'll be pleased enough. Starting from next week I intend to heavily defend the Dnepr bend from Kremunchug South, with a much weaker force North of Cherkassy so as to encourage AGS to cross further to the North. This would give me two more river lines to defend in front of Kharkov.
Once again I throw some weak tank divisions under the wheels of the Axis juggernaut to try and slow it down a bit. I'm not certain how effective this tactic is but I wont miss these junk divisions, in fact in some ways I'll be pleased to see them gone.

The German 11th army is heading for Odessa. I thought about abandoning the city but in the end opted for the other option which was to reinforce it. There are now four divisions and two para brigades defending the city and Rokossovsky is given command. 2nd cavalry corps defends Ochakov in a (probably pointless) attempt to distract and delay 11th army even more. Without the port behind them I wouldn't dare leave 2nd cav so exposed. Even with the port it's a little risky.

Getting industry out is more difficult than it used to be especially because forum gurus seem to think that heavy industry is now important. In deference to this consensus I'm railing more HI than I used to. Dnepropetrovsk industry is still intact but I'll try and rail most of it out next turn. I've actually left it there as the bait in a kind of trap. If he has the Mps and goes for it there are cavalry divisions lined up waiting to cut off 1st pz group.

Industry moved
11 Arm 5 HI



[image]local://upfiles/36871/79D14AEBFDA942B8BC850353D4B73FF3.jpg[/image]



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/24/2016 11:13:35 AM)

Turn 6

This week sees the first serious Soviet counterattacks of the war. In the North a cavalry division from 8th army is able to charge straight into the rear of 4th PG because there is no flank guard at all [X(] This division catches two German HQs with their pants down and also overruns two airfields destroying dozens of aircraft on the ground. 27th army under Malinovsky completes the isolation of 4th PG by pushing back a German infantry division enabling cavalry from 24th army to infiltrate into the rear from the East.

East of Kirovograd Vatutin commands a similar operation to isolate 1st pz.


[image]local://upfiles/36871/565E7097820E409FAE6350072E26CEC5.jpg[/image]



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/24/2016 11:19:56 AM)

North

The Luga line is breached, but one of my big stacks gets a rare held result as well (1.98 :1). Given the lack of room in the bridgehead this may have been vital, or maybe not, I don't know. The isolation of 4th PG should give me another week to prepare my defenses.
11th army has to stay guarding against an attack south of lake Ilman because although 4th pz is committed there is now a slight threat from the South because a pz corps from 3rd PG is still West of VL. There is particularly a threat that 11th army could be surrounded if it's Southern flank is too weak so this has been strengthened.
The pocket West of VL only yields two weak infantry and two cavalry divisions in the end. The cavalry losses do hurt a bit though given the current rate of attrition.



[image]local://upfiles/36871/E57D3D6AA4BD4D7492E1E5797369A41C.jpg[/image]



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/24/2016 11:24:58 AM)

Center

The Reserve front retreats another 40 miles because the terrain South of Smolensk is not good for defending. I did intend for Western front to defend the Besed river line with 21st army plugging the gap between the Besed and the Desna. After some thought I decided that I don't much care if 2nd PG group heads off towards Bryansk, but I definitely don't want it to turn the Southern flank of the reserve front. Therefore 21st army defends the Desna and the road to Bryansk is left virtually open. Again Bryansk acts like bait in a trap. All the industry is still in the area so it may be tempting, but cavalry lines the road to Bryansk so any thrust will need to be well secured at the flanks, probably requiring all of AGC's available mobile divisions.
Smolensk has a token garrison of one division (28 CV).
5th cav's foray into the Pripets is parried by Bobo so they retire to look for trouble elsewhere.



[image]local://upfiles/36871/01B106D0FC444EE390A1C600AE64985A.jpg[/image]



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/24/2016 11:31:46 AM)

South

The isolation of 1st PG this week means that I can continue defending in strength North of Cherkassy in the hope of delaying any crossing of the Dnepr for at least one more week. Even the Bazavluk river defenses may not be penetrated, although 1st pz did receive some air supply so I can't be certain. There are still 5 HI and 5 arm in Dnepropetrovsk, but the defenses in front of the city are strong with Vatutin commanding.

The sideshow at Odessa came a bit off the rails this week. A panzer corps was dispatched South to ruin my fun and yet another cavalry division bites the dust :(( My cavalry losses are starting to mount up and I'll have to start saving APs to rebuild some of them. They're the best offensive weapon I have though so I'll keep putting them in harm's way. I'm not so bothered about the airborne brigades. I wont use them in an airborne role under the current rules so I consider them fairly expendable. The good news is that the pz corps that got diverted South may have made the difference in allowing me to isolate 1st PG.

I railed 11 armaments out of Dnepropetrovsk this week. The 5 HI came out of Gomel and Nikolaev because I think those cities are more likely to be overrun next week.
I will undoubtedly lose a lot more armaments factories than I used to, not only because HI is said to be more valuable and combat units are more expensive to rail but also because I want to save the majority of the vehicle factories (more received wisdom). I think the best that the Soviet player can do is to clear industry from where he doesn't want the Axis player to go and leave it be where he does want the Axis player to go. Using it as a kind of lure. For this reason I'm going to leave the Bryansk industry where it is.

Industry moved
11 Arm 5 HI



[image]local://upfiles/36871/C63266CAF18540EF8B169D0D62832A79.jpg[/image]



loki100 -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/24/2016 12:03:41 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: timmyab

Center

The Reserve front retreats another 40 miles because the terrain South of Smolensk is not good for defending. I did intend for Western front to defend the Besed river line with 21st army plugging the gap between the Besed and the Desna. After some thought I decided that I don't much care if 2nd PG group heads off towards Bryansk, but I definitely don't want it to turn the Southern flank of the reserve front. Therefore 21st army defends the Desna and the road to Bryansk is left virtually open. Again Bryansk acts like bait in a trap. All the industry is still in the area so it may be tempting, but cavalry lines the road to Bryansk so any thrust will need to be well secured at the flanks, probably requiring all of AGC's available mobile divisions.
...



really like this gambit with Bryansk, its tempting to defend there (all those wooded river lines) but it does take the Germans into a bit of a (short-term) dead end. Looks like you are trying to make him stretch his supply lines in some sectors (and of course units he commits into those sectors are then less mobile)?



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/25/2016 1:59:38 PM)

I do intend to defend the Desna river line South of Bryansk, I'm just guessing he wont have enough to make a secure bridgehead if he goes that way next week.
Yes that area is heading towards the Axis logistical dead zone so I want to encourage them there. Most importantly away from Moscow of course



sillyflower -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/26/2016 7:35:24 AM)

Nice play nicely explained.

To lose one panzer group to isolation may be regarded as a misfortune; to lose both looks like carelessness.



HITMAN202 -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/26/2016 3:29:31 PM)

The problems with this AAR (or all AAR's) is it's special game setting.. nonrandom weather, Soviet +1 defense and mild blizzard. It's impossible to compare AAR's unless 1) the settings are exactly the same and 2) the skill of each player is known. In Sillyflower/Brian, the impact of nonrandom weather gives Sillyflower a predictable supply line and a more aggressive advance. In Pelton/Briam random weather has severely disrupted Pelton's excellent plans, having an impact that has dramatically dulled his initial rapid advance. Granted the Germans benefit from random weather late'42 onward, but '41 sets the tone to the rest of the campaign.

The case with 1+ Soviet attack is similar. The ability for the Ruskies to open pockets (and isolate Pz penetrations in this AAR) is incredible. So the German player has to be far less aggressive in deep penetrations and secure pockets more completely. Similar issues of Soviet 1+ defense. Germans have to spice up the strength of each attack.

Finally normal versus mild '41 blizzard is the most extreme contrast. In normal blizzard games the Germans have to withdraw in open terrain thru late Jan/early Feb and hold with caution in other terrain, but in mild blizzard can hold fast in clear terrain (with some discretion) and even attack Feb '41 with success.



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/26/2016 4:20:24 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: HITMAN202
The case with 1+ Soviet attack is similar. The ability for the Ruskies to open pockets (and isolate Pz penetrations in this AAR) is incredible. So the German player has to be far less aggressive in deep penetrations and secure pockets more completely.

My counterattacks in this game have all been comfortable victories, all over 2-1 final odds so would have succeeded without the +1 rule. I did discuss the rule before the game with Bobo because he wanted rid of it. I feel it's needed during the first blizzard if using the mild blizzard option because the mild blizzard is too mild otherwise and the Soviet offensive will not hurt the Axis player enough. It's still slightly too mild even with the +1 rule imo. The +1 rule is actually overkill during the Summer and I'd be happy to turn it off if that was an option. Unfortunately it isn't.

The problem is more to do with the combat system generally. Overall though the end result is about right I think. Soviet attacks in 1941 were violent and somewhat effective locally.



timmyab -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/26/2016 9:58:02 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: timmyab


quote:

ORIGINAL: HITMAN202
The case with 1+ Soviet attack is similar. The ability for the Ruskies to open pockets (and isolate Pz penetrations in this AAR) is incredible. So the German player has to be far less aggressive in deep penetrations and secure pockets more completely.

My counterattacks in this game have all been comfortable victories, all over 2-1 final odds so would have succeeded without the +1 rule.

Actually this is false now I come to check it. Some of them have succeeded only because of the +1 rule.
Because of the combat system though I do think that enabling Soviet attacks to succeed is important. You can't rely on purely defensive tactics because the combat system strongly favors the attacker. Virtually all your important wins are going to come from counterattacks.



Disgruntled Veteran -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/27/2016 2:42:12 AM)

It would appear to me you've got the 41 campaign bagged against bobo. 2 pzg isolated is very nasty.



HITMAN202 -> RE: Timmyab (Sov) vs 821Bobo (Axis) (1/27/2016 8:16:43 PM)

The benefits of Soviet +1 attack is statistically massive, far more than what one's intuition would consider. A simple example would be a theoretical attack in which the Germen defender had is adjusted defense value range from 1 to 10 (1,2,3,4, etc) and the Soviet attacker's adjusted combat value 11-20 (11,12,13,14,etc). Without modifiers the soviet attack succeeds 76 % of the time, but with the 1+ attack bonus 100 % of the time. Granted this is an example to push my point, but the bonus is far greater than most would realize.



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