Insanely difficult as Axis? (Full Version)

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spinecruncher -> Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/26/2016 7:58:52 PM)

It does not seem fun that Germans get such little R&D and Italy is impotent. Seems impossible to win as Germans. Am I doing something wrong?



Hartmann -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/26/2016 8:20:08 PM)

I don't want this to sound condescending, but it seems you still have to learn how to play the game. Maybe it would be a good thing for you to read through the section of the manual with strategic advice. In fact, there are many different ways to win with the Germans and with a little bit of experience you might come to think that it's not a chore either.



spinecruncher -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/26/2016 8:23:23 PM)

I guess I am just comparing with my first impressions vis a vi SC1 & 2. But can anyone respond in terms of generalities of diffrerences? Is my first impression incorrect? Why or why not? Thank you!



Jim D Burns -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/26/2016 8:47:39 PM)

All I can say is I kind of felt this way until I played as the allies. Then you see just how much of an advantage the Germans have in the early game. The allies really need to focus on just a couple techs if they have any hope of standing up to the Axis.

For Russia its inf weapons, for Britain inf weapons, anti-sub and advanced air power. Also It's vital that Britain build at least one HQ (2 if they lose the B.E.F. HQ) and one engineer to send to Africa as low supply and sandy terrain will see your fast collapse there. I'd also send at least 2 additional armies if you can scrape the funds together.

When I played Germany I found my mistake was the order in how I spent my funds. If you spend a lot of money repairing and upgrading after Poland, you won't have time to build up funds again and then build units in time for the attack on France. So build the units first before anything else, even repairs. The same goes for Russia, after France focus on nothing but units and do the other things later. Timing your funds is key for the axis in the early game.

Jim



n0kn0k -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/26/2016 8:49:09 PM)

Most things that worked in sc2 will work in sc3. It's generally the same concept and mostly the same rules. Just the timing and events have changed a bit.



Mountaineer -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/26/2016 10:55:12 PM)

I agree with build first, then repair and upgrade just before the attack. You need mass over technology. Consider limiting things like motorization to a few elites and naval combat to very few aircraft.



Treefrog -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/27/2016 12:30:40 AM)

Having the privilege to be a desultory beta tester I've probably started more games than most this close to release date.

I agree with the suggestion of mass (over modernity).

Start the army going west from Poland along the roads. Save MPPs by not using operate. Give road priority to HQ, armies, panzers, then corps in that order. They will start to file into place in March/April. Not all will be at jump off points for the attack in the west when the attacks starts but, believe it or not, most will be able to participate, if nothing else by penetrating the Maginot Line when it starts to thin out.

The Axis can schedule builds and upgrades in a crescendo that booms on the Allies in May 1940. Consider starting with the best available of tank/tactical air asap. After Poland falls you can build both w/o upgrades. Continue to build tanks/tactical air that will arrive by April (remember they arrive at 50% and don't do anything the first turn on the map). As the arrival dates move past April 1940, that is the time to upgrade as many units as possible. Focus on reinforces panzers to full strength. In terms of upgrades I've never had enough MPPs to upgrade everybody so, per developer's suggestion, upgrade the point of the spear as they will have to cut through the defenses.

Hopefully when you start the attack in the west you'll have 5 or 6 medium or tac bombers plus six panzers, a pzgrn and SP. Then launch the attack, even if you don't feel fully prepared and it is not perfect. The critical point is to mimic history: pound them with planes then follow up with your upgraded anything that will get there. Late arriving panzers (which should have been build with level 1 tanks and mobility so they arrive ready to go) can continue the attack from the point they are deployed on the map.

As for Italy, I transport the army from Albania and the one from Venice plus the armor unit while the army in Libya starts a MPP expenditure free march to the Egyptian border. I send the fighter and tac to help and find they can hold the line pretty well if you have researched the infantry upgrade.

The final suggestion I have is to use all German MPPs for units until the Fall of France, the start researching. Italy is the opposite: I don't build new units but rather use the MPPs to upgrade the economy and improve unit types.

Hope this helps.



ILCK -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/27/2016 2:28:09 AM)

Playing as the Allies you see very quickly what the Germans are up against. You are on a clock from turn 1. Poland and France have to fall fast. You have to kill Russian units really, really fast. Basically it feels like if the Russians are still standing in 1942 the Axis is in real trouble. I would like to see if anyone can win in 42 or later as the Axis.



xwormwood -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/27/2016 8:30:07 AM)

There is no need to go for mass insead of quality while you play against the AI, at least not from my experience.
The question is how do you spend you money. For what, an when.
What I usually do while playing the Axis is to research industry and production, and Intelligence, too.
I'll try to move over the map instead of using the expensive OP movement.
And I install only thechs which I need for any given task (example: no need to improve the German units around Warsaw until 1941).

While playing the Allies I'll invest again in industry, production tech and intelligence. At least with the USA and USSR. The USA is the most important country, as it will feed the rest of the free world.

When you buy new units, don't forget that you will need HQs to win the war. Artillery units help where all planes have to stay on the ground because of bad weather. All tactic techs help all units, even though they don't have to get a tech upgrade. So I research them first. And finally to buy every tech upgrade for your allied nations like Romania or Hungary. They suck your money aways, as they are the most expansive units to built, repair and improve. I use those for garisson duties, or if at all as second line units. If at all they get infantry tech advances, but nothing else (exception: fighter planes).

Don't spend your money to build a second Hochseeflotte. The germans strength is their army, and they are bound to loose any naval race against the UK and USA.



Hartmann -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/27/2016 9:31:19 AM)

I too rather lean towards the strategy Xwormwood adopts. My first priority - be it as Axis or UK/US - is focused research, not massproduction. Soviets may be a different issue.

In the end, I think this is largely a matter of personal preference, at least against the AI.



n0kn0k -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/27/2016 10:38:31 AM)

There is one huge difference with this new version.
In the old SC you could move and attack, maybe attack, move and move one more unit in.
Now I see the AI attack, rotate out the unit, attack again, rotate out the unit, upto 6 or 7 times.
It almost feels like facing a stack.
The AI was easily breaking my lines this way in France.
So it might actually be more smart to go for more low tech units as you can "stack" attacks.



Hartmann -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/27/2016 12:37:47 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: n0kn0k


So it might actually be more smart to go for more low tech units as you can "stack" attacks.


Yeah, in Fall Gelb that may be the case, but in general I hate it when my lowtech units don't do damage. E.g. in Africa, the British have a real hard time facing German level 2 infantry weapons units even when they themselves got level 1. If in an attrition situation you have to replenish ****loads of strength points all the time while the enemy barely suffers, this can get ugly very soon MPP-wise.



ILCK -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/27/2016 12:58:40 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hartmann

quote:

ORIGINAL: n0kn0k


So it might actually be more smart to go for more low tech units as you can "stack" attacks.


Yeah, in Fall Gelb that may be the case, but in general I hate it when my lowtech units don't do damage. E.g. in Africa, the British have a real hard time facing German level 2 infantry weapons units even when they themselves got level 1. If in an attrition situation you have to replenish ****loads of strength points all the time while the enemy barely suffers, this can get ugly very soon MPP-wise.


You need a handful of "killer" units hidden among a mass of units. Getting my panzers/panzergrenadiers to tier 3 and the tactical bombers to 2 made a huge difference as the Germans.



vaalen -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/27/2016 2:20:05 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim D Burns

All I can say is I kind of felt this way until I played as the allies. Then you see just how much of an advantage the Germans have in the early game. The allies really need to focus on just a couple techs if they have any hope of standing up to the Axis.

For Russia its inf weapons, for Britain inf weapons, anti-sub and advanced air power. Also It's vital that Britain build at least one HQ (2 if they lose the B.E.F. HQ) and one engineer to send to Africa as low supply and sandy terrain will see your fast collapse there. I'd also send at least 2 additional armies if you can scrape the funds together.

When I played Germany I found my mistake was the order in how I spent my funds. If you spend a lot of money repairing and upgrading after Poland, you won't have time to build up funds again and then build units in time for the attack on France. So build the units first before anything else, even repairs. The same goes for Russia, after France focus on nothing but units and do the other things later. Timing your funds is key for the axis in the early game.

Jim



Jim, what do you do with your British engineer once it reaches Africa?



Jim D Burns -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/27/2016 2:34:29 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: vaalen
Jim, what do you do with your British engineer once it reaches Africa?


I build a double line of 2 hexside forts facing west in the 3 hex gap north of the depression. I then fortify all the hexes around Alexandria and Cairo.

Forts aren't tremendously powerful in the desert, but the extra entrenchment levels they allow help you stay alive until your infantry and armor tech catches up with Germany. I have found your units die quick once Germany strips away your entrenchments, and if you've not set up good supplies before they attack repairs will be impossible and readiness losses for swapping units can really see a defense start to crumble against tech 2 panzers.

Against the AI it's sometimes salvageable due to mistakes the AI makes, but a human opponent will rip you apart once you are forced to begin swapping units. So I try and learn/play in a way that I expect to have to play in PBEM. Getting an engineer to Africa ASAP is a priority if you want to have time to get the first line of forts done before the Africa Korps arrives.

Jim



vaalen -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/27/2016 7:30:41 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim D Burns

quote:

ORIGINAL: vaalen
Jim, what do you do with your British engineer once it reaches Africa?


I build a double line of 2 hexside forts facing west in the 3 hex gap north of the depression. I then fortify all the hexes around Alexandria and Cairo.

Forts aren't tremendously powerful in the desert, but the extra entrenchment levels they allow help you stay alive until your infantry and armor tech catches up with Germany. I have found your units die quick once Germany strips away your entrenchments, and if you've not set up good supplies before they attack repairs will be impossible and readiness losses for swapping units can really see a defense start to crumble against tech 2 panzers.

Against the AI it's sometimes salvageable due to mistakes the AI makes, but a human opponent will rip you apart once you are forced to begin swapping units. So I try and learn/play in a way that I expect to have to play in PBEM. Getting an engineer to Africa ASAP is a priority if you want to have time to get the first line of forts done before the Africa Korps arrives.

Jim



Thanks,Jim. That is really good to know, as I am about to start a game as the Allies.

Regards,

Vaalen



zz64 -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/28/2016 7:06:17 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Treefrog

Having the privilege to be a desultory beta tester I've probably started more games than most this close to release date.

I agree with the suggestion of mass (over modernity).

Start the army going west from Poland along the roads. Save MPPs by not using operate. Give road priority to HQ, armies, panzers, then corps in that order. They will start to file into place in March/April. Not all will be at jump off points for the attack in the west when the attacks starts but, believe it or not, most will be able to participate, if nothing else by penetrating the Maginot Line when it starts to thin out.

The Axis can schedule builds and upgrades in a crescendo that booms on the Allies in May 1940. Consider starting with the best available of tank/tactical air asap. After Poland falls you can build both w/o upgrades. Continue to build tanks/tactical air that will arrive by April (remember they arrive at 50% and don't do anything the first turn on the map). As the arrival dates move past April 1940, that is the time to upgrade as many units as possible. Focus on reinforces panzers to full strength. In terms of upgrades I've never had enough MPPs to upgrade everybody so, per developer's suggestion, upgrade the point of the spear as they will have to cut through the defenses.

Hopefully when you start the attack in the west you'll have 5 or 6 medium or tac bombers plus six panzers, a pzgrn and SP. Then launch the attack, even if you don't feel fully prepared and it is not perfect. The critical point is to mimic history: pound them with planes then follow up with your upgraded anything that will get there. Late arriving panzers (which should have been build with level 1 tanks and mobility so they arrive ready to go) can continue the attack from the point they are deployed on the map.

As for Italy, I transport the army from Albania and the one from Venice plus the armor unit while the army in Libya starts a MPP expenditure free march to the Egyptian border. I send the fighter and tac to help and find they can hold the line pretty well if you have researched the infantry upgrade.

The final suggestion I have is to use all German MPPs for units until the Fall of France, the start researching. Italy is the opposite: I don't build new units but rather use the MPPs to upgrade the economy and improve unit types.

Hope this helps.


this. Haven't read the manual- just can't focus reading but....
I've been very careful and thoughtful on use of MMPS early on.

Took France and Yugo and setting up attack on Russia. I have always moved panzers and corps and even some armies instead of operate which is expensive.
One important thing on both preparation for France and Russia and even Yugo is note when a new unit shows up when purchasing and don't spend the MMP on reinf or upgrade yet. Make sure to have any new units you want in place before the attack. Then since it only takes a turn (or 2 depending on MMPS) you can reinf/upgrade. Don't be tempted to do the latter first just because you can.



Goodmongo -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/28/2016 9:12:46 PM)

I usually don't get all 3 Soviet cities till mid-late 1942 so it's possible. Key is can you reduce the Soviet MPP in 1943 by taking the oil fields. Not accepting the major victory means the Soviets fight on. It's a long slow slog but as Germany with the oil fields you have enough MPP to slowly push them back to the Urals and invade UK.

The only thing I use operate on is HQ's. Force march is fine and gets you there fast enough. Just need to rest 1-2 turns to get stats back up. I also may use operate on air power to quickly move the bombers if they must be somewhere fast.



Jim D Burns -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/29/2016 1:14:00 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: vaalen
Thanks,Jim. That is really good to know, as I am about to start a game as the Allies.


No problem, but it looks like my plan was not sufficient. The Germans landed even more troops (seems to be a second Africa Korps with 2 experience stars for the units, ouch) and they are crushing my lines. I got creative and thought I had time to build more elaborate forts (more than two hex sides) due to the fact I had three armies in theater, bad move. I'm falling back to the few forts I managed to complete, but the Germans are killing one or two units a turn now so looks grim.

I posted a screen shot in this thread (post #18) back when I thought I was in good shape. The Oasis is now gone, both inf corps and the tank are dead and the southern HQ is fleeing into the open desert 1 hex at a time to try and survive. All three armies were hit and are now running back to the forts, though I don't know if I will have time to reinforce them.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4189394

I had been pounding the Italian HQ on the coast, but the Italian navy showed up. I am winning but most of my ships are in rough shape now.

Man things turned bad fast lol, I'm loving this game.

Jim



Hartmann -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/29/2016 9:36:57 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim D Burns

quote:

ORIGINAL: vaalen
Thanks,Jim. That is really good to know, as I am about to start a game as the Allies.


No problem, but it looks like my plan was not sufficient. The Germans landed even more troops (seems to be a second Africa Korps with 2 experience stars for the units, ouch) and they are crushing my lines. I got creative and thought I had time to build more elaborate forts (more than two hex sides) due to the fact I had three armies in theater, bad move. I'm falling back to the few forts I managed to complete, but the Germans are killing one or two units a turn now so looks grim.

I posted a screen shot in this thread (post #18) back when I thought I was in good shape. The Oasis is now gone, both inf corps and the tank are dead and the southern HQ is fleeing into the open desert 1 hex at a time to try and survive. All three armies were hit and are now running back to the forts, though I don't know if I will have time to reinforce them.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4189394

I had been pounding the Italian HQ on the coast, but the Italian navy showed up. I am winning but most of my ships are in rough shape now.

Man things turned bad fast lol, I'm loving this game.

Jim



While I think that the idea to get engineers over is a good one, it's much more important to

1) get to infantry level 2 asap
2) kill all Italian navy in the med

In my current game, playing just the UK, I made alot of grave mistakes (like taking ages to retake Iraq and wasting mpps on stuff like air defense), but I still could hold the line at El Alamein because I relocated a big chunk of the British navy and airforce from the UK to the med where it sank alot of Italian and German troop transports trying to cross over to Lybia.



DeriKuk -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/30/2016 4:29:13 PM)

If there's a flaw in the game, it is the insane TACTICAL (in a strategic game) advantage that the Axis enjoy THROUGHOUT the game. These are the true Aryan Supermen of Nazi propaganda. The result: Moscow invariably falls in late 1942; about the same time that Cairo goes down. This results in an Axis win around that time.

I've been tinkering with Axis MPP reductions (-10% at the start; -20% when Barbarossa commences). It looks better, but the Ubermenschen still kick posteriors.

There is a lot of scope for more historical subtlety in the game model; and much of it can be tied to the game's economic model. As the population gets drafted into the military (e.g. at the start of Barbarossa), the German economy should take a severe MPP hit. Slave labour may compensate for this, but only partially. Also, if casualties mount beyond a certain level in the short term, tactical proficiency of the affected units should take a significant hit - only to recover after a turn or two without casualties. As the game stands, a green MPP is as experienced as a veteran MPP.

The model is still too crude, but it can be improved . . . perhaps in the next release?



mavraamides -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/30/2016 4:47:13 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim D Burns

quote:

ORIGINAL: vaalen
Thanks,Jim. That is really good to know, as I am about to start a game as the Allies.


No problem, but it looks like my plan was not sufficient. The Germans landed even more troops (seems to be a second Africa Korps with 2 experience stars for the units, ouch) and they are crushing my lines. I got creative and thought I had time to build more elaborate forts (more than two hex sides) due to the fact I had three armies in theater, bad move. I'm falling back to the few forts I managed to complete, but the Germans are killing one or two units a turn now so looks grim.

I posted a screen shot in this thread (post #18) back when I thought I was in good shape. The Oasis is now gone, both inf corps and the tank are dead and the southern HQ is fleeing into the open desert 1 hex at a time to try and survive. All three armies were hit and are now running back to the forts, though I don't know if I will have time to reinforce them.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4189394

I had been pounding the Italian HQ on the coast, but the Italian navy showed up. I am winning but most of my ships are in rough shape now.

Man things turned bad fast lol, I'm loving this game.

Jim



I started a new game as Allies and tried a few things some of which might seem a little gamey.
1) France. My first purchase is an engineer. Even though I know I'm going to get one later, I want to start on fortifications around Paris ASAP and when I have 2 of them I'll just be twice as fast. No research at all, build as many armies and corps as possible and use the rest for reinforcements. Keep med navy in med except for subs and destroyers.

2) UK. Build engineer right away. Then Infantry Weapons and Anti-Sub. Send engineer to Egypt ASAP. Send half of navy to med. This is the somewhat gamey part: Send the BEF to the South of France to defend against Italy instead of the more historical north vs. Germans. When they get pushed back to the point of being in danger, evacuate into the med and send them directly to Egypt. This way you have your most veteran, teched up troops in Egypt as early as possible including a second HQ while the French navy is still around to help protect them in transport. This saves 2-3 turns from the normal (at least for me) evacuation first to England and then later to Africa not to mention saving me from having to pay twice for transport.

3) Russia. Ditto Engineer. AFTER researching Infantry Weapons. I used to place my armies 2-3 hexes off the border. As German's advanced, I kept withdrawing them to about that distance. This minimized the ability of the Germans to do the attack, swap, attack, swap, attack, etc move because they first had to close to contact. I still do this after German invasion but I have them start right on the border. Why? Because when Germany first attacks, Russia get's a boatload of valuable troops (fighters, bombers, HQ's, mechs, etc.) right on the border. If my main line is 3 hexes back the Germans devour these before they have a chance to retreat. By placing my troops on the front line, these units get deployed BEHIND the front where they are much safer from that initial onslaught. My front line get's ravaged but these more expensive units largely survive and can retreat, reinforce and upgrade saving me massive MPP's. Plus, these front line troops when destroyed can be cheaply rebuilt (they show up with * in the production screen) while it seems that I don't get that same benefit from destroyed units that get created by script at invasion time. Not sure if it's supposed to be that way but I'm seeing that.



DaBoost -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/30/2016 5:55:56 PM)

My advise is to just keep the AI on it's toes by mounting small scale attacks on multiple fronts. Seems like the AI is way too keen to pull off too many forces off the front lines. Works even better as allies. Game breakingly so.



Jim D Burns -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/30/2016 6:20:08 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: GordianKnot
3) Russia.


For me in Russia I created a sort of line of units in each city along the line from Riga to Minsk to Kiev with the armies and corps that start on map. I then spent the first 400 points that build up on inf tech so inf tech 2 completes shortly after Barbarossa begins (maybe 3 turns into war I think).

After that big investment I then spend everything on building out the garrison pool. These units act as cheap speed bumps that can stall an advance every time it comes to a city. Destroyed garrisons can come back in 2 turns for cheap 20-25 to build em), so you can constantly be throwing up blocking forces in every city or river along a rail line.

I then focus on nothing but armies while being sure to build all destroyed garrisons first. By the end of 41 I had the entire army pool done, most garrisons on map and was building into the corps pools.

I am finding that the notion of trying to keep a front line is not going to be a big part of this game. Fights will focus along rail lines near cities as supply is scarce in open country and it's far too expensive to ever build enough HQ's to bring supplies into the steppes via HQ chains.

So great strategy game, but not a good WWII sim.

Jim



Goodmongo -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/30/2016 7:02:56 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim D Burns


I am finding that the notion of trying to keep a front line is not going to be a big part of this game. Fights will focus along rail lines near cities as supply is scarce in open country and it's far too expensive to ever build enough HQ's to bring supplies into the steppes via HQ chains.

So great strategy game, but not a good WWII sim.

Jim



This is exactly what WW2 in Russia was all about. Study any operational doctrince fromt he German army and you will see the rail lines were the defacto avenues of attack.



mavraamides -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/30/2016 7:20:58 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim D Burns

After that big investment I then spend everything on building out the garrison pool. These units act as cheap speed bumps that can stall an advance every time it comes to a city. Destroyed garrisons can come back in 2 turns for cheap 20-25 to build em), so you can constantly be throwing up blocking forces in every city or river along a rail line.



Great tip on garrisons thanks! I thought of them as pointless because they are so weak but you make a great point that they slow up advances and essentially protect your more expensive units as Germans waste time and attacks on them. Fortunately, I still have time to use this tip as France is still holding on.




DeriKuk -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/30/2016 8:43:25 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim D Burns

After that big investment I then spend everything on building out the garrison pool. These units act as cheap speed bumps that can stall an advance every time it comes to a city. Destroyed garrisons can come back in 2 turns for cheap 20-25 to build em), so you can constantly be throwing up blocking forces in every city or river along a rail line.


I've tried this . . . TWICE! Research infantry weapons, build speed bumps (garrisons and corps), line them up, keep rebuilding them in addition to some armies as they are destroyed; AND by the end of 1942 the Krauts and their Super-Axis buddies are in possession of the Crimea, Stalingrad, Leningrad, and well east of Moscow. Result: Game Over! What do you expect from Ubermenschen with god-like tactics?

Edit: I forgot to mention that they hardly slow down in winter and the rasputitsa.



Hartmann -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/30/2016 9:43:19 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: hjalmar99

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim D Burns

After that big investment I then spend everything on building out the garrison pool. These units act as cheap speed bumps that can stall an advance every time it comes to a city. Destroyed garrisons can come back in 2 turns for cheap 20-25 to build em), so you can constantly be throwing up blocking forces in every city or river along a rail line.


I've tried this . . . TWICE! Research infantry weapons, build speed bumps (garrisons and corps), line them up, keep rebuilding them in addition to some armies as they are destroyed; AND by the end of 1942 the Krauts and their Super-Axis buddies are in possession of the Crimea, Stalingrad, Leningrad, and well east of Moscow. Result: Game Over! What do you expect from Ubermenschen with god-like tactics?

Edit: I forgot to mention that they hardly slow down in winter and the rasputitsa.


My experiences are completely different from what you describe. I played UK/US twice,leaving Poland, France and USSR AI controlled. In both games, the Germans were stopped by the Russians in 1942. They made it near Moscow in the North, but only to about Rostov in the South. That was against the AI mind you - if I would have played the Russians myself, they would not have gotten even that far.



ILCK -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (11/30/2016 10:08:56 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hartmann


quote:

ORIGINAL: hjalmar99

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim D Burns

After that big investment I then spend everything on building out the garrison pool. These units act as cheap speed bumps that can stall an advance every time it comes to a city. Destroyed garrisons can come back in 2 turns for cheap 20-25 to build em), so you can constantly be throwing up blocking forces in every city or river along a rail line.


I've tried this . . . TWICE! Research infantry weapons, build speed bumps (garrisons and corps), line them up, keep rebuilding them in addition to some armies as they are destroyed; AND by the end of 1942 the Krauts and their Super-Axis buddies are in possession of the Crimea, Stalingrad, Leningrad, and well east of Moscow. Result: Game Over! What do you expect from Ubermenschen with god-like tactics?

Edit: I forgot to mention that they hardly slow down in winter and the rasputitsa.


My experiences are completely different from what you describe. I played UK/US twice,leaving Poland, France and USSR AI controlled. In both games, the Germans were stopped by the Russians in 1942. They made it near Moscow in the North, but only to about Rostov in the South. That was against the AI mind you - if I would have played the Russians myself, they would not have gotten even that far.


The Russians absolutely wrecked the Germans when I played them. Germans got to Riga but never took it, took but advanced no further than Dneproposk, never made Smolensk and by summer 42 the whole Axis was getting rolled. The Russians have so many guys and so much MPP it is crazy to me. Yes the level 3 tanks suck but there are not enough of them. If anything seems Uber strong it is the German tactical bombers that kill way way too many strength points.



Jim D Burns -> RE: Insanely difficult as Axis? (12/1/2016 1:00:03 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: GordianKnot
Great tip on garrisons thanks! I thought of them as pointless because they are so weak but you make a great point that they slow up advances and essentially protect your more expensive units as Germans waste time and attacks on them. Fortunately, I still have time to use this tip as France is still holding on.


No problem, I also find if you flank an army in a city with one or two garrisons it can add a turn or two before the enemy can whittle down that army and seriously threaten capture as so many soak off attacks get wasted on the garrisons. And if you have more garrisons due to appear on map in the production pipeline you may be able to immediately replace destroyed ones if the Germans fail to occupy the flank hexes.

It also trains up the defending armies and after a turn or two I rail them out with one or two stars of experience so I can build them up with elite replacements in the rear.

Using this strategy by the end of 41 the Germans had not taken Pskov nor the city across the lake north of there yet, Smolensk has 5 experienced armies now defending it and Dnepropetrovsk didn't fall till December 41. I still hold the Crimea, though it hasn't been seriously attacked yet and panzers only recently headed there so it remains to be seen if it can hold out.

1942 may prove to be brutal as hjalmar99 suggests, but so far the Germans do not appear to be a serious threat to Russia. And this is a game with +1 experience and +20% MPP given to the axis.

Perhaps hjalmar99 is playing differently than I and allowing damaged armies to die rather than to try and pull them out for rebuilding. Perhaps the fact I have tech 2 inf and the Germans do not yet for some reason makes the difference.

Jim



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