More accurate but less fun... (Full Version)

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DavidG3276 -> More accurate but less fun... (1/12/2017 10:18:06 PM)

I am a longtime player of the Strategic Command series of games. The latest version SC WWII War in Europe may be more accurate with a more challenging AI but something crucial has been lost. It's no longer the "beer and pretzels" game where you could turn down the realism and have a game you could finish in a few hours. Instead, one can take naps during the AI's turn and take days to finish games even if you play several hours a day. Is there any way to turn back on the "fun" back in playing this game. It becomes a slog rather than a delight.



Rosseau -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/12/2017 10:32:03 PM)

I am playing SC2 Assault on Communism as Axis concurrently with WWII playing as Soviets only. Turn times are similar, so WWII is more complex.

However, I could not finish any SC2 campaign game "in a few hours." Both are very good - far better than the Pacific game, imo.



bo -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/13/2017 12:04:33 AM)

I agree with less fun but for only one reason, the war in the east is a beast of war just by nature of the war itself. The Axis drive into the east and north to Leningrad is fun for me, but as soon as the winter strikes the game goes a little stagnet as it becomes almost trench warfare while you wait for the allied invasion in mid 1943.

I do not know what can be done, nor if any thing should be done it is the nature of the beast [:(].

Bo



Rosseau -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/13/2017 12:49:02 AM)

In SC2 AoC, I have played Axis with "no weather" option. You are in sight of Gorky by late 1942. And I am a weak player.



freeboy -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/13/2017 12:58:09 AM)

ok
you are certainly allowed to comment but honestly I think you are in the minority. IMO this is by far the best in the series



Skeleton -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/13/2017 1:14:32 AM)

I am totally for respecting everyone's opinion and for all to have the forum, to express that opinion. I couldn't disagree more. In my opinion, this is by far the best in the series. I beta tested this game and it has been the only PC game I have played since. I love everything about it and I think it strikes the perfect balance between beer and pretzels and a grognard monster. To each their own but, for me, this is a total classic.



James Taylor -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/13/2017 1:50:18 AM)

If you want SC1, I'm sure it's still available. You can have one of my copies.

But....I can't imagine going back. I have every version, which I'll never play again!



bo -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/13/2017 1:51:54 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Marcus the leper

I am totally for respecting everyone's opinion and for all to have the forum, to express that opinion. I couldn't disagree more. In my opinion, this is by far the best in the series. I beta tested this game and it has been the only PC game I have played since. I love everything about it and I think it strikes the perfect balance between beer and pretzels and a grognard monster. To each their own but, for me, this is a total classic.


Agreed 100%, there is a few minor adjustments that can be made, but if that is the only complaint then I feel this game is excellent.

Bo



Wolfe1759 -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/13/2017 5:57:50 PM)

I do think SC WWII War in Europe is the best version of the game. I would love to have an SC WWII War in Europe version of Winti's SOE Fast Play (mod) campaign from SC2 Global for a quicker playing slightly more B&P option, don't know if he/she is still around and modding though.



vonRocko -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/14/2017 1:33:54 PM)

I feel this is the best version also. Just having hexes and losing the lousy DRM their previous publishers forced on us, makes it great.



James Taylor -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/14/2017 3:01:10 PM)

If you want to speed things up a bit, instead of using garrisons have a certain amount of MPPs, say 50, to pay to suppress that partisan hex or an inherent defense factor for the hex, just like you apply anti-air.

That way you don't have to move and monitor actual units. Later if you need the MPPs, you just remove the defense factor and recover the MPPs, which of course activates the hex.



freeboy -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/14/2017 4:49:35 PM)

Well
I just had the ai push spain into the Axis fold in 41, could not reinforce G fast enough.. OMG, BUT Italy flaid in Greece and the germance stumbled attacking ussr.. al;l in all a wash, changes 42 objectives to retacking G and killing the Italians in NF

All that to say
WOW



Morelyn -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/14/2017 4:59:10 PM)

Yeah I have to say this one hits the sweet spot precisely for me between grognard and beer and pretzels. I didn't play the earlier versions much, got bored quickly. There is a lot of depth to this game but it doesn't get bogged down by it.

But to each his own.



freeboy -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/14/2017 6:39:00 PM)

Well, Spain over runs Gibralter.. then invades Portugal?? US declares war in Sept... reinforces Port!! Germans tanks counter and drive the USA INF into the sea... egypt is a standstill USSR a fail for the Axis... ITs about the most fun in an Eastern Front game ever! aside fr4om two player games but man... Italy had not gotten the idea of rushing G, but sits nibbling away in the small pond.... It will be interesting now that Greece fell and its winter 41/42... Seeing German forces in Spain and the like makes my inner Red army general HAPPY
so
I think this game is about the perfect balance for ease and fun
BRAVO

now lets get some 2 player going!!!



Steely Glint -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/14/2017 9:47:58 PM)

I have also played the entire series, and this is the best version of the game yet - and by a large margin.



Ason -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/16/2017 8:43:43 AM)

How would it be better by the fact that you could finish campaigns faster? The longer the better imo, what point is there to build an empire if you lose it all in a couple of hours?:D



BobbyS53 -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/16/2017 12:19:03 PM)

I have the same thing going on in my game. Spain joined the Axis, then declared war on Portugal. I rushed US and Canadian units to save Portugal, now they are fighting a Finland, Italy, Hungary, Spain and Germany, all in Portugal. Bravo, great game!



Dmondragon75 -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/17/2017 11:07:18 AM)

Best of series by a mile



Malor -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/17/2017 2:14:59 PM)

I've only played this version of the game series and think that once future patches adjust the play balance and fix the reported bugs, this game will be very fun to play for a long time.

It is a step above an "Axis and Allies" and below "War in the East/West" as far as learning curve and turn complication go. It also plays much quicker than they do but still provides a challenging and fun game. I've played 3 games so far as allies. Got myself beat bad in the first and managed to win the second two. However all three games played very differently with the main areas of focus in different areas of the map. In each one, I found myself sweating when trying to stop Axis advances and knew that with one bad choice on my part or a few "bad " dies rolls with the combat results, the game would have turned quickly against me. In each game, I found the “play one more turn” mentality to be there, which for me is a very large plus because it means I’m enjoying myself.

I think this game is going to be around a long time because with all of the decision events and choices a player must make on how to spend MPP (buy units, research, diplomacy, convoys, reinforce/upgrade), each game is going to be different right from the start. I can't see it being possible for anyone to follow the exact same plan from game to game once the die rolls start to occur. You may know how to take Poland in two turns, but one bad roll and it takes three to do so. Thus you are one week late moving units west for France. In France, one or two bad rolls there and they hold out a month more. Or possibly the AI (or human) decides that instead of the initial BEF force, they also send everything available to France, ignoring Africa. This slows you down a few more weeks or more. With that, the summer '41 USSR invasion is delayed or weaken making, it easier for USSR to defend.

Malor



Malor -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/17/2017 2:28:37 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: von Warze

I have the same thing going on in my game. Spain joined the Axis, then declared war on Portugal. I rushed US and Canadian units to save Portugal, now they are fighting a Finland, Italy, Hungary, Spain and Germany, all in Portugal. Bravo, great game!


That is one feature in the game that I dislike. The ability to "Operate" units anywhere and everywhere each turn across the entire map is to great and not costly enough. First it makes it too easy to move units in too short of a time. Second, I can't really believe the Finns(or other countries) would ever have let their troops fight in Spain for any reason. It just did not mesh with their goals. I think there should be some morale penalty for units fighting far from home.

I can see eastern European countries fighting in the east against the USSR, but not in the west. Currently when watching the AI Axis fight, you can find Italian troops on all three USSR fronts, in Africa, Greece, Spain if they enter and on Garrison duty in France. All at the same time That does not see right and thus why some penalty should be applied. Maybe if the units are attached to an HQ for the same country (or due to attach limits, it is still nearby), the penalty would not exist signifying a national commitment of forces.

Malor



William049 -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/18/2017 5:01:26 PM)

This is a whole lot of fun but it is also a whole lot of work. I can understand it frustrating some.
I have so far started about 10 games from 1939 and have yet to finish a game. At some point my efforts fall apart at which point I begin again learning from my mistakes. Ever effort goes a couple of months farther than the last. I will eventually iron out the problems and come out victorious. Being too easy would be a bigger downer.
This forum has helped a lot as it shows me how I screwed up the campaign and learned tips on over coming the major blocks.[sm=character0267.gif]



bo -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/18/2017 8:11:43 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: William049

This is a whole lot of fun but it is also a whole lot of work. I can understand it frustrating some.
I have so far started about 10 games from 1939 and have yet to finish a game. At some point my efforts fall apart at which point I begin again learning from my mistakes. Ever effort goes a couple of months farther than the last. I will eventually iron out the problems and come out victorious. Being too easy would be a bigger downer.
This forum has helped a lot as it shows me how I screwed up the campaign and learned tips on over coming the major blocks.[sm=character0267.gif]



Excellent post William, I might be wrong in what I am going to say, I to am having the same problem starting over and over, using different tactics etc.

I hope what I am seeing is a mirage, I am in May 1942, deep in Russia, Leningrad has fallen, Kiev has fallen, Smolenx fell a while ago, I have destroyed 95 Russian combat units, I have lost just 2 units, but after the Russian winter struck and the Siberians arrived which according to the book is about 10 units. I am now facing another 60 Russian units.

Where did all those units come from, I am playing with soft build units off.
I do not mind this as it makes it a tough game to win, I am alright with that, maybe the programmers can explain where all these units are coming from.

Not complaining just curious.

Bo



warspite1 -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/18/2017 8:20:02 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: bo


quote:

ORIGINAL: William049

This is a whole lot of fun but it is also a whole lot of work. I can understand it frustrating some.
I have so far started about 10 games from 1939 and have yet to finish a game. At some point my efforts fall apart at which point I begin again learning from my mistakes. Ever effort goes a couple of months farther than the last. I will eventually iron out the problems and come out victorious. Being too easy would be a bigger downer.
This forum has helped a lot as it shows me how I screwed up the campaign and learned tips on over coming the major blocks.[sm=character0267.gif]



Excellent post William, I might be wrong in what I am going to say, I to am having the same problem starting over and over, using different tactics etc.

I hope what I am seeing is a mirage, I am in May 1942, deep in Russia, Leningrad has fallen, Kiev has fallen, Smolenx fell a while ago, I have destroyed 95 Russian combat units, I have lost just 2 units, but after the Russian winter struck and the Siberians arrived which according to the book is about 10 units. I am now facing another 60 Russian units.

Where did all those units come from, I am playing with soft build units off.
I do not mind this as it makes it a tough game to win, I am alright with that, maybe the programmers can explain where all these units are coming from.

Not complaining just curious.

Bo
warspite1

Shangri-La*



* As a wise man once said [:D]



crispy131313 -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/18/2017 11:51:01 PM)

If you have played as the Allies yet you will see what an amazing amount of USSR forces you will deploy over the first winter due to redeployment of the forces destroyed in supply in 1941. It has a lot to do with the timing of the forces destroyed over the summer/fall and the short amount of turns over the winter.



bo -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/19/2017 12:53:45 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: crispy131313

If you have played as the Allies yet you will see what an amazing amount of USSR forces you will deploy over the first winter due to redeployment of the forces destroyed in supply in 1941. It has a lot to do with the timing of the forces destroyed over the summer/fall and the short amount of turns over the winter.


Thank you crispy, I have yet to play the allies I guess for fear of inaction[;)] I just went back and checked destroyed units, the Russians 152 units mostly infantry and armor maybe 1 air unit,I had 6 units destroyed, I then counted active Russian units which was 52, and that is just the ones I can see due to FOW.

Sorry this does not feel right.

Bo



James Taylor -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/19/2017 2:14:38 AM)

I'm thinking you're probably feeling about the same as the German commanders did at this point of the real campaign.[;)]



William049 -> RE: More accurate but less fun... (1/19/2017 4:20:36 PM)

LOL...I am at the same point myself. I am currently reading "The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich and it seems they were saying exactly that...where are all these Russian units coming from?"
The game puzzles me on it's MMP payouts to the Allies. I all but wipe out the British Navy and next turn they are back again at full strength while I have to scrape the bottom of the barrel to replenish a submarine unit.



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