Combat Leader, Close Assault and Modern Warfare Games in Development (Full Version)

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David Heath -> Combat Leader, Close Assault and Modern Warfare Games in Development (6/8/2001 9:29:00 PM)

Hi Guys We have been considering making a new grand Steel Panther type game. Well we have work out a system that will allow us to do this. We also have cancelled the SP Modern Warfare. The reasons and what the future holds are explained below. A) SPWaW can not handle adding the modern warfare items to it. We have been so limited with the new SPWaW that we kept not being able to add item we needed to the game. B) We have seen a lot of gamers either want a Real time game like Close Combat or a pure turn base game like Steel Panthers. As of now you got it. C) Combat Leader will be our tactical WW2 turn based game. It will a true C++ game for windows well advance beyond anything currently available. The fact is we have bben working on this for some long time but have been low and funds to bring it to the table. D) Close Assault will be our tactical WW2 real time game based on the Firefight engine. This will be the next level up for Close Combat fans. E) Both Games will share unit icons and OOB. Both Game systems will start on the Eastern Front and move to other theaters. The new OOB's are highly more detail then the anything yet seen in SPWAW or Close Combat. F) What does this mean for SPMW. Well we have already been coding the hooks to have both these games also be made into Modern Warfare series. Ilja and his team has already started on making the new OOB's. We are just about done on the Graphics for both has East Front games already. Once they are done work will start on the modern warfare graphics. That is all for now we will be releasing more details and screenshots soon.



Figmo -> (6/8/2001 9:55:00 PM)

No No - say it ain't so!! I thought you were close on SPMW. I understand that you must do what you have to do - but PLEASE - reconsider!! Figmo



pops -> (6/8/2001 10:17:00 PM)

...lemme see if I understand....you have changed direction completely on Combat Leader and it is now strictly real time or is it still as was originally stated to be a combination..... ....the new game you mention is strictly turn base ala SPWAW or is it one side goes and then the other...is there a game engine in place for this game or are you starting from scratch?....is it using SPWAW engine with CL graphics.... either way good luck and I will support as best I can...



TheChin -> (6/8/2001 10:48:00 PM)

So the sale of MegaCampaigns has enabled this to become reality? Thats awesome! I'm stoked! I, personally, am sick of real time tactical/strategy games and prefer turn-based. But I'm sure you guys will make a great real-time. Just when my SPWaW release anxiety has dissipated, now I have to deal with this! :D



David Heath -> (6/8/2001 11:09:00 PM)

It not that we have change the direction of Combat Leader we are taken the real time version of it and will be calling it Close Assault. Combat Leader will be the turn based version. Its close to SPWaW but really going all the way. We have been developing the turn base and real time engines for some time... that is why we can use the same new OOB that we have developed. No the MegaCampaigns have not even begun to pay for this we are hoping that Desert Fox and the new Russian Front Mega Campaign sales pick to all us to complete them. Of course our dely in getting the first Mega Campaign out is not help matters.



Ilja Varha -> (6/8/2001 11:10:00 PM)

Figmo, fear aside... This new modern game(s) is going to be a lot better than SPMW could ever have been! Ilja



pops -> (6/8/2001 11:21:00 PM)

So will Combat Leader be turn based like SPWAW or turn based as in the WEGO system?



Paul Vebber -> (6/9/2001 12:10:00 AM)

OK - All we did was change the name of what we were calling "Combat Leader" to "Close Assault" and adding more detail (like some individual man stats) that we felt would make teh game more appealing to Close Combat fans. IT is still based on teh firefigh engine. Combat Leader will be a "more conventional" hex based game that will appeal more to the SP crowd. The combat routines, OOBs etc will be very similar between the two games. We made the decision that try to make to much of a "merger" between the SP and Close Combat communities was not likely to be as successful as targeting each crowd with a specific product. CLose Assault with still be a much different game form Close COmbat - more squad based - being derived from Firefight, individual men will not be "individually modelled" but will have some sort of small range of name, proficiency, morale, weapon, but not to the extent of CC so that much larger battles will be possible COmbat Leader will be like SP , but with an option or alternating formation movement based on initiative. A am pretty sure one game or the other will have a "WEGO" mode - CLose Assault is teh natual candidate as continous time is much closer to CM style "WEGO" than an SP-stlye game. [ June 08, 2001: Message edited by: Paul Vebber ]



Mark Ezra -> (6/9/2001 12:19:00 AM)

These changes sound very practical. I had been a little concerned that developing a new engine that would do both Real time and turn base might end up doing neither very well. I, too, look forward to an advanced SPMW. But the new games must come first. As the Mega Campaigns roll out to keep us all going and providing (finally) some income, Matrix must put all it's energy into Combat Leader/Combat assault deux.



Warrior -> (6/9/2001 1:23:00 AM)

Everybody buy 5 extra Mega Campaigns so we can get these babies soonest!



AmmoSgt -> (6/9/2001 1:36:00 AM)

So this means Matrix is finished with SP ? thats a crying shame



Paul Vebber -> (6/9/2001 2:01:00 AM)

We will continue to do "maintanence" patches to it to weed out the bugs, but there will be be no more major upgrades in features. Its reached the limt of what we can do to modifiy it without screwing it up! At some point you have to take up a clean slate...



gators -> (6/9/2001 2:05:00 AM)

Hey REMF wait until people get the ones they ordered before the sales pitch!



Gallo Rojo -> (6/9/2001 2:21:00 AM)

quote:

Originally posted by Paul Vebber: We will continue to do "maintanence" patches to it to weed out the bugs, but there will be be no more major upgrades in features.
And will be more MC (in addition with the newest eastern front I mean)?



Paul Vebber -> (6/9/2001 2:36:00 AM)

I know Wild Bill is chaffing at the bit to get one fom the Aliied point of view going!



Gallo Rojo -> (6/9/2001 2:48:00 AM)

quote:

Originally posted by Paul Vebber: I know Wild Bill is chaffing at the bit to get one fom the Aliied point of view going!
:D :D :D (And please try to don't forget your WW2 Russians Allieds and do a Russian MC some time :) )



DerSoldat -> (6/9/2001 2:50:00 AM)

I think it really sucks the SPMW was cancelled!I was really looking forward to it after all this time.Im sure I wont be the only one to be upset.After all if youve played any of the Close Combat games youve played them all.Why create a clone?After all the games dedicated to WW2 here dont you think its time for a dedicated game on the conflicts after 1945.With all the astounding things you did with SPWAW I thought Steel panthers 2 deserved the same overhaul.Its a sad day for sure. :( [ June 08, 2001: Message edited by: DerSoldat ]



Wild Bill -> (6/9/2001 3:03:00 AM)

First of all, let me say you are right, Paul V! I'm salivating at thought of releasing pent-up creative juices on these new beauties. I have tons of material ready RIGHT NOW for modern war scenarios, Arab-Israelis, Vietnam, Gulf War, plus a few dozen lesser engagements, (Panama, Grenada, perhaps Kosovo if not too delicate) and a double ton of Hypothetical, including the ideal Nato-Warsaw Pact confrontation. Bring it on! :mad: (Wilder War Face!) In defense, Soldat, let me say we do not intend to "clone" anything. But if we can take a concept, improve, enhance and expand it into something much better, we will do so. The CC game was mentioned to give you an idea of what is coming but not to say that we will do something identical. If we can't improve an idea, we should just leave it as is. I truly think you will be more than pleased with what is coming from Matrix. Wild Bill



TheZel66 -> (6/9/2001 3:10:00 AM)

Now that SPMW is out of commission, does anyone know how to get Steel Panthers II to run on a Windows 98 machine? I know that there's probably more to it than knowing the platform (video drivers, etc..), but I have a copy of SP 2, and cant get it to run on my system...



Paul Vebber -> (6/9/2001 3:17:00 AM)

Taking SP:WaW into the Modern era was just going tobe too big a poject to justify the epense of doing it to give away. That is just the reality of economics. Now while Close Assault will be a game similar in format (but very different in execution) Combat Leader will be a hex based game that will be in the format of the SP games. This gives us the ability to incorporate the modern warfare aspects directly int he game as it develops, not "add it on" or try to "get SP3 features working again" as we were facing with SP:MW. We can greatly increase the map size - despite going to smaller hexes, go to a completely overhauled TOE/OOB format and make fundamental improvements to the basic game design.



pops -> (6/9/2001 3:41:00 AM)

I for one could stay in WW1 and 2 (and earlier) forever....don't have much interest in modern conflict.. ..as for SPWW2 I had it running in win 98 until I installed the newst SPWAW and now it won't run anymore so I think it's a conflict somehow between the games rather that operating system...luckily I have another computer so I just put WW2 on that one...



Jack -> (6/9/2001 4:04:00 AM)

Paul or Dave, Does this mean with the newer versions we can expect Battalion level CO's for those of us who like the brigade size stuff. Off topic I like the maintenance that is going on with this forum, that colour is much easier on the eyes.



ruxius -> (6/9/2001 5:57:00 AM)

quote:

Originally posted by Jack: Off topic I like the maintenance that is going on with this forum, that colour is much easier on the eyes.
:D ... uhm..for a while I was asking why my screen decided to display images in black and white... but I can tell my eyes to be more accurate for the future.. Anyway now I can see the "colours" of these fellows because moments like this are what Matrix gave us as a gift ! Today We can see their decisions..and here we are allowed to give comments on that decisions... Tell me my friends and members of the forum have you ever seen this special option elsewhere ? Decisions always make some people feeling enthusiastic while some other being sad... Personally I think I am very lucky : I am extra-happy about these decisions !! I hate real time strategy games, and I am not interested in modern warfare...also since now I can count my busy-waiting days for the dreamful GRAND SPWAW (which for the future you will call Combat Leader) Finally a SPWAW where suggestions by players are less dependant on code constraints and limitations..(we will ask the programmers if...) , it will be a question of design..and so let the best idea to win if it's able to..and no other restrictions ! On the other hand I can understand my friend Figmo and his feelings because you Matrix really decide about our fun ! Everybody here has a word..and at the Matrix they seem to take care of it... Maybe that battle about modern warfare is not lost..even if I understand resources required are very expensive especially if the results are to be GRAND !



Drex -> (6/9/2001 8:28:00 AM)

Alright Matrix, you guys build ity I'll buy it.



Paul Vebber -> (6/9/2001 8:48:00 AM)

The way we are currently working, there is a common TO&E editor that will be used for both games. This editor has 15 unit slots for each of 999 formation and a nukber slot to indicate how many of that type of unit are in the formation. So you assign the right "pile of counters" to each formation, then in the game there will be an "Order of battle" editor. Thi sieditor will allow you to tailor the "pile of counters" into an OOB for that scenario, including the command organization, the ammunition and experience status, the specifcs that customze that "pile of counters" into a force for that battle. The key here is that you will be able to then save that OOB as a seperate file - so you can make a "core force" that you can then import into any scenario or battle, and refit and export after a battle. So you will be able to play battle generator games with your own "core force" and supplement it with aux units so you can finally play "campaign style" versus human opponents. I have SPWW2 and SP:WaW on my "old" PC and they both run together fine. There is nothing inherant in SP:WaW that prevents SP:WW2 from running. SP:WW2 is a DOS game and has little to do with windows... Appreciate the support ruxius!



Alby -> (6/9/2001 9:57:00 AM)

Sounds to me like combat leader will simply be, the Best "SP" game yet!! you got my money!! I think that one guy was speaking of SP2 not spww2 when asking about getting it to run on win 98 ;)



davidcarrell -> (6/9/2001 10:16:00 AM)

I was looking foward to SPMW. You guys do what you feel is right. You have a customer/fan for life. :D



ruxius -> (6/9/2001 5:29:00 PM)

quote:

Originally posted by Paul Vebber: The key here is that you will be able to then save that OOB as a seperate file - so you can make a "core force" that you can then import into any scenario or battle, and refit and export after a battle. So you will be able to play battle generator games with your own "core force" and supplement it with aux units so you can finally play "campaign style" versus human opponents.
WOW.. WOW WOW !! My DREAM ! The promise is superior to each prevision ! This idea moves towards on e of my favourite extremism : customization ! I vote for a flexible modular style for objects in SPWAW which considers each part of the game as a module so that it can be improved,extended,mixed,imported/exported ,parametrized easily.. so maps,list of units ,units' type (CORE,AUX,SUPPORT),unit's role (ammo carrier,sniper,ecc.),players' type (AI human PBEM player,online player),list of names,list of nations, list of flags,preferences,list of weapons,correspondant list of images,videos,characteristics everythings involves its own powerful editor( or maybe just a big one which includes all minors) A lot of this is already realized in SPWAW ! This is only an idea and I will write in more detail about this ..anyway you can see how much enthusiasm this partecipation may bring to us...apart from real contribution to the development , only arguing here is just an intense cool sensation ! and .....may a strong parametrization -modularization also bring towards Modern warfare ? or else the WW1 ? or the medieval period ? ;) ;) ;) Who can say ? [ June 09, 2001: Message edited by: ruxius ]



DerSoldat -> (6/9/2001 8:00:00 PM)

quote:

Originally posted by TheZel: Now that SPMW is out of commission, does anyone know how to get Steel Panthers II to run on a Windows 98 machine? I know that there's probably more to it than knowing the platform (video drivers, etc..), but I have a copy of SP 2, and cant get it to run on my system...
Hmmm,Quite odd Steel Panthers 2 runs fine on my Win98 Compaq 500mhz with 128Ram :D



bluesdawg -> (6/10/2001 7:08:00 AM)

Very dissapointed about spmw..... I love spwaw but I also loved the modern wars of sp. please reconsider the SPMW...... thanks(ooops i mean tanks)



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