RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (Full Version)

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Markiss -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/11/2018 4:05:08 PM)

The man has owned his mistake and shown contrition. Time to break off the attack.



Sugar -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/11/2018 4:54:47 PM)

Shows greatness to concede a mistake, and Karma is restored. [:D]

Probably Dorky answered before pjl adjusted his post?



Rannug61 -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/12/2018 8:32:16 PM)

New ELO game, Bolko gives it another try..

Bolko (Axis) vs Rannug61 (Allies)
House Rule: no uber-diplo



Bolko -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/12/2018 11:53:32 PM)

Great PJL1973! I'll set up a game and PM you the password. It will be under Bolkonsky.

Yeah, I've been there too. Right now I have nothing but losses in the tourney so I would be very excited to win a wooden spoon! What an improvement. Glad you want the Allies, I have very limited experience with them.

Can we play with no uber diplomacy?



PJL1973 -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/13/2018 9:39:47 AM)

Yes, I agree with no uber diplomacy.



Dorky8 -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/13/2018 2:23:23 PM)

PJL1973

Considering I am the king of saying things I regret please accept my humble apology for criticizing you.

good luck.



PJL1973 -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/14/2018 5:44:20 PM)

Apology accepted.



Fafnir -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/17/2018 8:30:15 PM)

Looking 4 a strong challanger. Any side.



Dorky8 -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/18/2018 10:47:48 AM)

Fafnir or Sugar.

Has there been a winner of your game against each other. If not some update?

Sorry if I missed it in another post.



Sugar -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/18/2018 11:57:47 AM)

Game ist still going on.



Dmondragon75 -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/18/2018 2:05:48 PM)

Fafnir(axis) won against Dmondragon



Fafnir -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/18/2018 4:38:07 PM)

New game Fafnir(axis) vs Dmondragon75 started



nnason -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/19/2018 5:28:04 PM)

All,
As I said earlier I am on the road in my RV. I just travelled from DC to Oregon. Lucky I only had one bad weather travel day in Wyoming. I stopped at Dinosaur Nat Monument, which was cool. I should have some time this week to update the ELO ratings.



Ktonos -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/21/2018 3:54:26 PM)

Tourney match ended

Fafnir(Allies) vs Ktonos (Axis), Allied victory December 1940



nnason -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/23/2018 9:10:28 PM)

quote:

Demondragon61 (Allies) Victor vs Bolko (Axis)


PJL1973,
Glad things worked out and you are back. Sorry I have been on the road and didn't get back to you sooner.



nnason -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/23/2018 9:23:12 PM)

Game results posted as of 23 November 2018.




Sugar -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/23/2018 10:16:51 PM)

Great work again, Noah, and many thx to you!



Sugar -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/23/2018 11:05:28 PM)

Tourney match ended: Fafnir (Allies) : Sugar (Axis). Winning side: Fafnir.

After 2 years my reign of pain has ended; the king is dead, long live the new!

I will now retire from this tourney. Everyone who likes to play a training game is welcome.



MrLongleg -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/24/2018 11:59:22 PM)

How the hell did Fafnir do that trick? Did he mess with the interdimensional portal that provides your extraterrestrial air force? [:D]



room -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/25/2018 7:03:09 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sugar

Tourney match ended: Fafnir (Allies) : Sugar (Axis). Winning side: Fafnir.

After 2 years my reign of pain has ended; the king is dead, long live the new!

I will now retire from this tourney. Everyone who likes to play a training game is welcome.


I'd like that very much master, teach me again [:)]

I've not played this summer but Started 3 games in the past 2 weeks. I think I'll do better than last time (or I'm really not improving [:D] )



Fafnir -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/29/2018 11:32:03 AM)

Tourney match ended
Fafnir (Axis) and Hberg (Allies)
Axis decisive victory July 1943.



Markiss -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/29/2018 2:43:36 PM)

I would like to thank everyone who offered me a game in this tournament, I enjoyed it, at least for a while. I find national morale's effect on the combat effectiveness of units to be a game breaker for me. When 1 5,000-10,000 man garrison can withstand the combined assault of over a million men and 20,000 aircraft, it becomes farcical. And I am still around 88% nation morale. If I was reduced to 10% or something, I could understand. What is the rational for this? Do the bombs stop exploding? Do the shells no longer detonate? How can you do literally no damage? And once your morale goes down even slightly, you can never recover, since you can no longer can damage the enemy's units, and therefore can no longer advance. I have heard several other players comment on this, it seems to be the number one reason people stop playing this game. Even our top player has stopped playing for largely this reason, if I understand his posts correctly.
I may try some mods, but I am finished with the vanilla version of this game.
Thanks again!
I have resigned my remaining games, they were all fairly won by my opponents. I am simply ending the suffering and unenjoyment.



BPINisBACK -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/29/2018 3:23:47 PM)

Tourney match ended
BPINisBACK (Axis) vs Markiss (Allies)
Allies resign, Spring 1944

I want to thank to Markiss for this long game. A very long one at which axis could take only Leningrad (1943) but hit so hard the russians that they have only 60 units already. Stalingrad was under a severe assault and the Caucasus was in axis hands. Scandinavia joined Axis (diplomacy + allied raiding in Norway).
Spain joined allies but they could not go deep into France until 1943 and then i could move enough forces to stop the danger (Vichy France was neutral).
Africa was fully allied (except Algeria and Morocco) but only at the end of 1943, so Italy was still in the game.
Western allies lost around 100 - 150 MPP/turn by raiding during many months of the game.
I have enjoyed a lot (sorry for Markiss, of course) because i could plan the war very slowly as i like to do.



BillRunacre -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/29/2018 3:47:06 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Markiss

I would like to thank everyone who offered me a game in this tournament, I enjoyed it, at least for a while. I find national morale's effect on the combat effectiveness of units to be a game breaker for me. When 1 5,000-10,000 man garrison can withstand the combined assault of over a million men and 20,000 aircraft, it becomes farcical. And I am still around 88% nation morale. If I was reduced to 10% or something, I could understand. What is the rational for this? Do the bombs stop exploding? Do the shells no longer detonate? How can you do literally no damage? And once your morale goes down even slightly, you can never recover, since you can no longer can damage the enemy's units, and therefore can no longer advance. I have heard several other players comment on this, it seems to be the number one reason people stop playing this game. Even our top player has stopped playing for largely this reason, if I understand his posts correctly.
I may try some mods, but I am finished with the vanilla version of this game.
Thanks again!


Hi Markiss

Sorry to hear this. If the effect of low National Morale on combat is an issue then it might warrant a new thread and discussion so we can garner more data and feedback on it, as we certainly don't want people stopping playing if they are unhappy with a game feature, at least not without some discussion of it.

May I call on you and others to submit evidence so we can gain a better picture of when and where this might cause frustration to see if this is something we should change, and if so to what extent.

Thanks

Bill



Ktonos -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/29/2018 3:50:51 PM)

Tourney match ended Markiss (Axis) vs Ktonos (Allies), Allied victory Dec 1942



pjg100 -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/29/2018 4:09:50 PM)

I don't think the NM system is broken, but a few tweaks may be beneficial. In my last (non-tourney) game as Allies the Axis took much of the ME thereby knocking UK NM down to around 80%. I subsequently pushed them out of the ME and NA and knocked Italy out of the war, with primarily UK units. So the game is not lost just because NM drops by a substantial amount. However, what I found puzzling was that even after recovering my lost territories and knocking Italy out of the war UK NM remained stubbornly stuck at around 80%. Perhaps something could be done about that.



Markiss -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/29/2018 5:15:00 PM)

Thanks for chiming in Bill.
I just have trouble understanding why the effect is so dramatic. In my Game against BPIN, the Allies seem to have everything going their way, except that upon arriving in France, they are permanently stalled. Not only can I not advance against a thin line of corps, I can't even clear the cut off garrisons in Normandy behind me. I have a massive amount of force, but it is ineffective against the German units. When searching for the reason why, I noticed that Germany is at over 120% national morale, even though they have hardly advanced in Russia in year, and the US is under 90%(I'm not sure how). There does not appear to be any way to remedy this situation. Since I can't hurt the German units, I can't get unit kills or advance, and hence have no way to improve my morale. So, the situation was terminal.
A similar thing happened in Russia, where I launched a massive counter attack against a very weak part of his line, but could make no progress at all. Many tanks, shock armies, and mechanized infantry were no match for his garrisons and corps. And before anyone asks, yes, they were supported my multiple HQ's, to no avail.
It just seems like once you are down on national morale, is game is effectively over. No matter how good your tactics, no matter how complete the surprise, your offensive shatters against the flimsiest of defenses.
Anyway, hopefully I will recover my own morale and play again, but I need a break.




Sugar -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/29/2018 6:38:11 PM)

If you`re refering to me, I didn't stop playing because of NM, but I stopped playing Breakthrough WW1 because of the randomization of combat results (resepectively their to big spreading of 2 points), and their decisive luckbased influence on performances of the then smaller army groups.

What I complained about isn't the influence of NM on combat results, but the impossibility to recover NM by reoccupying NM-Objectives. If Italy loses many of them, they're on the brink of capitulation, and even if they manage to retake all of Italy and Libya, their NM is damaged permanently.

That`s a concept I don't understand, since their political instability is already reflected by the lowest NM-points.

NM itself doesn't have a significant influence on combat results from my observation. The issue is a mixture of unexperienced units attacking fortified positions with high lvls of entrenchement; and yes, this will result in heavily equipped attackers doing no damage even to the cheapest units. There are ways to deal with it, but it`s requiring huge effort.

My suggestion has always been to reverse the diminished attack values of all units. This would lead to more overall casualties, and even to successfull counterattacks. And finally let russian inf. behave like all other inf. units and remove their excessive tank defense. I`m pretty sure they suffered heavy casualties historically, as well as their german counterparts.



Rannug61 -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/29/2018 6:59:19 PM)

I don't know how much the National morale affect units over all but to lower a specific enemy unit air attacks are the fast way to get the job done.
I won a game(as Allied) against Hartmann301 once even though the Russian NM morale was down to single digits. It was a very long game that lasted deep into 1946. The UK could perhaps regain some NM when certain objectives are retaken... like Paris or when Italy is out of the war. Late in the war UK units seams to suffer from low NM even when things are going well in the war. One could think they should be happier when victory is in sight.



Markiss -> RE: OFFICIAL Strategic Cmd ELO Tourney (11/29/2018 10:02:25 PM)

In my previous games playing the US, I never had any trouble dealing with units like this. The only difference I could find was the lower national morale(perhaps from all the failed attacks!), and I had read previous posts where it was very strongly suggested that national morale DID effect combat results(especially for the French and Italians, for example). Has no one else noticed that when French morale drops, there units become useless? Maybe I am just imagining it.
Sugar, I apologize for mischaracterizing your views, perhaps I did not read your posts closely enough. Or maybe I am just an idiot. My bad.
The game against Kotonos was going to end in a couple turns anyway, and BPIN was on the verge of finishing off the Russians, which would have lead to a rapid end to the game, with the Allies floundering in France. In the game against Jeff Ahl, I was only receiving a turn or 2 per week, and it wasn't going to end before 2020, so I don't feel bad about ending that one either.
Battle on everyone.



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