Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (Full Version)

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Turbo624 -> Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/5/2021 9:09:41 PM)

Axis is eating my lunch



joey -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/5/2021 9:43:28 PM)

The first couple of months concentrate on short range targets that fighters can cover. The focus on the first few months needs to be building experience and keeping losses low. Bombing long range targets will do just the opposite. Use some of your fighters to strafe Axis AFs. Bring them in after a bombing raid.



anthonykevinluke -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/5/2021 10:58:02 PM)

Hi, I concur with what Joey said completely though I would note that strafing aflds may not actually be that productive. I say this because the German acft industry is, and historically was, quite capable of keeping up with acft losses; the game breaker is killing axis pilots which have a much lower trg start point than the allied replacement pilots, and strafing does not kill pilots (I checked this using the Campaign Summary many times). Also, stagger your bomber stream so that Axis acft chasing damaged bombers are running head on into your next bomber group and escorting ftrs- that is where you get a lot of kills including pilots! Just some thoughts for consideration.

Cheers,

AKL



mark dolby -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/6/2021 5:32:17 AM)

One thing I noticed the Allied AI does which could be used by the Human is to send a recon or 2 at max altitude to sites near the target to arrive shortly before the bombers. Axis fighters scrambled up often find their flight paths cross and 4 or so fighters break off to try to engage the recon. Every weakening of the Gruppe size before they engage the bombers can help and often the recon is too high/fast for the fighters to get him. A human LW will detour his units around them or have dedicated flights to knock down recons with the best high altitude planes.



joey -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/6/2021 1:45:19 PM)

Also make sure you protect your bombers. Have escorts all the way in and out from the raid - and make sure you have enough of them.
Once you knock out enough radar sites, start a night bombing campaign. You don't have to worry all that much from Axis night fighters at the beginning of the campaign, as Window has them at bay. At the beginning of the night attacks, flak is your biggest worry.



Pete McCullagh -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/8/2021 10:30:16 PM)

Break down your components.
1) heavy bombers. Never send without escorts. Use more escorts than you think you need.
) medium bombers. Initially use these on very short missions about an hour prior to launching your heavies. This will dilute the response to your heavies.
3) f /bombers use on airfield bombing missions prior to heavy raids to disrupt interceptor response. Use sweeps about half hour after heavy launch to catch returning LW ac. Always put a high escort on your sweeps. You will take losses here but it is worth it.
4) nite bombers. Only use in dark of moon. Don't worry about radar until it starts to become effective. This is about 11-12 /43. Do not use low morale units they always miss the target....rest them.

Good Luck



JeffroK -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/10/2021 10:48:15 PM)

Versus the AI, though it could be smarter than Goering.

What have you got?
In England,
Bomber Command which can hit a good portion of the map. There are also a number of RCM units and Mossie & Beaufighter Night Fighters.
8AF, Good numbers of B17F & B17G arriving soon, B24D & J arriving in smaller numbers.
A small number of P47D-6, cant escort you to the Ruhr or Emden.
You also get a small number of ADGB Spitfire IX
9AF, A small force of B26B and again, a small group of ADGB Spit IX.
2TAF, Small groups of Mitchell, Boston, Mossie and a good force of Typhoon. Your fighters are a mix of Spits from VB to LXIIand a couple of Whirlwinds & Hurricanes.
In Sicily/NWAfrica.
12AF, small numbers of B17F, B25,B26 and A20, some A26 Mustang dive bombers and a mix of fighters including P39, P40, P38 & P47
The Brits in the Med Air Force are equally a mix of Baltimore, Mitchell & Boston light bombers and Kityyhawk III & Spitfire fights.
There is a for of Wellington night bombers.

First thought is that you are not going to win the war in 1 raid, its more like eating a elephant with a teaspoon, lots and lots of little bites. You are not going to win in 1943, but need to set a base so that when your best weapons arrive you have a force capable of using them.

IMVHO.
1. Recon, I use auto tasking for 95% of my recon, I then make sure they are all at max altitudes and I'll manually add some more lights over specific targets.

2. August, September and October sees 8AF turning Belgium & The Nederlands red. I try to take out every target and keep within the cover of my small force of P47 & Spits. Usually I have equal fighter/bomber ratios, with a force of high escorts (always the Spits plus anything to spare) If my bomber force is getting tired I add a few fighter sweeps, I spread them around so as to avoid a flaktrap but I'll live with losing 4-5 aircraft if I can take out 10-15 on the ground. I'm trying to build up the experience of both bombers and fighters, pickup a few bombing points and attrit the Luftwaffe.
Bomber Command earns your points in this period, make up your plan and stick to it. Your Lancs & Halibags can make a mess of any target they hit, and as their experience grows they hit more often. Even the Stirlings carry a good bomb load to the Ruhr and Northern Germany. The vital thing is to thoroughly recce your targets. I probably waste my Mossies but enjoy sending them to Berlin, only a nuisance but they draw a few NF to them. I use the RCM squadrons to make a shield of window or the spoof the radars and add a few NF to the Bomber screens, I'm unsure they shoot down a lot but may distract attackers.
9AF only hits coastal or near coastal targets, IMHVO the B26B is a magnet that attracts Fw190 and has paper armour, maybe the Spits dont escort them well??, but they carry a useful load.
2TAF, I use their light/medium bombers a little deeper than the B26 as you have reams of escorts, the Typhoons are similar but are also sent deeper into France to the Paris area. Any airfield with fighters are attacked regularly. These are escorted by my Mustang I & IA and Spitfire Va, Vb & Vc. They have to build up experience so that when you can upgrade them to Spit VIII and above or Typhoons etc they are not a waste.

In Nov 43 you start receiving Mustang III, P51C, P38J & P47D-15 which allow you to escort the 8AF past the Ruhr, the weather will not be great but if you have carefully built up your points you should have an experienced force to take on the Luftwaffe over Germany.

12AF should use its heavy bombers to hit first the Naples then the Rome rail yards, always escorted and I shift them to the Palermo area ASAP. Th mediums, fighters of both 12AF & MAF just pound the tactical targets allowed. When 15AF is mobilized in Nov 43 you move to Foggia and start picking your targets, an interesting region with access to a range of targets within escort range (I try to keep the P51 in England and use P38 & P47 in Italy.

I upgrade 205 Group to Liberator III & VI and also take on those targets thought to be safe in Eastern Germany & Poland.

Just some random thoughts, I faff around a lot trying different approaches (Only P40 & Kittyhawks in Italy, didnt do too bad)



simovitch -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/11/2021 3:45:59 PM)

Don't disregard the land game. You can only influence the game by breaking the Normandy, Westwall, Gustav, and Gothic lines early and you do this by reducing and disrupting the German ground units, but you can't influence invasion dates or the east front collapsing.

Keep up the pressure constantly but the best time to ravage them is after a front line breaks and they are on the move relocating to the next defensive line. Occasionally the game tells you the Allies are attacking, and when a German division is defeated you are an extra day closer to the front collapsing. If it tells you the German defeated an Allied assault you are one day further away. Other results can delay or advance the capture of territory between fronts.

Once the westwall is broken the Reich industry is overrun in a matter of a month or so and victory is yours, but if it holds out you will run out of time at the end of April 1945 (unless you are playing the Jet-Age scenario).



Pete McCullagh -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/15/2021 6:06:02 AM)

If you have escort units with low experience, use them on return legs when their opponents will likely be fatigued



JeffroK -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/16/2021 10:09:36 PM)

Also you need to have 16+ points at the start of November, you are going to hit vile weather and your points will drain away and you will have few chances of gaining points.

I have been sending small raids of about 50 bombers and am getting hits but points are slow.



palioboy2 -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/18/2021 6:54:34 PM)

So I started a new 43 campaign after years of not playing. My strategic points have gone from about 500 too -300 in the first 5 days, I have been launching raids on the low countries and have knocked out a few factories and some oil storage. I haven't expected a large increase in points, but losing 800 points in 5 days while I have been doing damage seems kind of extreme. Any tips other then just increase pace of operations? I have been flying my boys as hard as I can without letting fatigue creep up.

Also is there somewhere that breaks down the scoring system in more detail, as in what each factory type is worth what in points, it seems like the scoring information in the manual is mainly focused on Eagles Day.

As well is there a way to see when future aircraft will become available and what their future replacement levels will be?



simovitch -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/19/2021 12:38:03 PM)

Keep an eye on the sudden death value. If your total score ever gets within 2 or 3 of sudden death you should start to worry. Otherwise just keep trying to hit high capacity targets. Power factories will give the biggest bang for the buck because all the other factories depend on them for max capacity. The health of your rail system near factories impacts capacity as well as other "under the hood" things. The "autoplan raids" menu gives a good description of the different industries but overall its the capacity*damage of the site that determines the most points.

"List Air Units" shows the availability month when replacements start to arrive. No way right now to show future replacement rates except through loading data into the unofficial editor.



palioboy2 -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/19/2021 11:41:35 PM)

Thank you for the info.

Is there an approximate amount of industry damage points to aim for for the early part of the war to stop the industry score from decreasing?

Do you get industry damage points directly from rail damage or just secondary points from hurting the efficiency of other industry?

Also I am a little confused about the damage coloring for urban damage, and how do I get my bomber command aircraft to hit different parts of the city? if I select the rail target will they always aim at that point of town and just hammer the same urban area over and over again?

Thanks for answering, its been like 6 or 7 years since I have played. I was so excited when I saw new patches were available, I had been waiting years for one!



palioboy2 -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/19/2021 11:45:45 PM)

Also is there anywhere you can still download the editor? I just did a search for it and the prospects of a download seem less then promising haha.



palioboy2 -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/20/2021 2:51:12 AM)

I think you have the wrong thread, but feel free at answer my questions haha



simovitch -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/20/2021 10:46:38 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: palioboy2

Thank you for the info.

Is there an approximate amount of industry damage points to aim for for the early part of the war to stop the industry score from decreasing?

Do you get industry damage points directly from rail damage or just secondary points from hurting the efficiency of other industry?

Also I am a little confused about the damage coloring for urban damage, and how do I get my bomber command aircraft to hit different parts of the city? if I select the rail target will they always aim at that point of town and just hammer the same urban area over and over again?


1. I'm not sure what that number is, because you are competing with the repair rates of the industries, and only the defender really knows how bad things are getting, so you just have to get a feel for how you are doing by trying different things and watching the counter. The manual needs updating with regard to calculating scores.

2. Rail damage does not produce industry points, it just impacts the capacity of nearby factories and the ability to supply troops and other things.

3. Rail and urban take collateral damage and area bombing is not precise. I'm not sure but I believe the "fires" graphics are just a visual representative of the relative damage of the city, and you score points as long as the bombs fall within the circle. You can usually tell by the messages whether you are causing damage or not. Again, only the defender really knows the true extent of the damage, although recon gives you a fairly good picture.

The editor will show up again soon I'm sure.



palioboy2 -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/21/2021 12:50:35 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: simovitch

quote:

ORIGINAL: palioboy2

Thank you for the info.

Is there an approximate amount of industry damage points to aim for for the early part of the war to stop the industry score from decreasing?

Do you get industry damage points directly from rail damage or just secondary points from hurting the efficiency of other industry?

Also I am a little confused about the damage coloring for urban damage, and how do I get my bomber command aircraft to hit different parts of the city? if I select the rail target will they always aim at that point of town and just hammer the same urban area over and over again?


1. I'm not sure what that number is, because you are competing with the repair rates of the industries, and only the defender really knows how bad things are getting, so you just have to get a feel for how you are doing by trying different things and watching the counter. The manual needs updating with regard to calculating scores.

Do you have a rough estimate that you personally use? I seem to be doing a decent job of building up terror score, but I have only been bleeding points when it comes to industry scores.

2. Rail damage does not produce industry points, it just impacts the capacity of nearby factories and the ability to supply troops and other things.

If it reduces the capacity of near industries does it lower the possible score using the capacity*damage formula?

3. Rail and urban take collateral damage and area bombing is not precise. I'm not sure but I believe the "fires" graphics are just a visual representative of the relative damage of the city, and you score points as long as the bombs fall within the circle. You can usually tell by the messages whether you are causing damage or not. Again, only the defender really knows the true extent of the damage, although recon gives you a fairly good picture.

Good to know about the graphics, for ever I thought I needed to adjust flight paths to hit the none destroyed parts of town. I have been hitting the city lots but wasn't sure if I need to hit the parts of the city that were undamaged when I looked at the graphic screen. Would you suggest only targeting cities with my main BC bomber streams then? Just try to hit industries at night with the high end squadrons


The editor will show up again soon I'm sure.




simovitch -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/21/2021 2:21:52 AM)

Here is all I will offer to you. The rest you must learn in the dangerous sky, or from someone else...

Industry points = (Axis Industrial Output-47,500)/500



Pete McCullagh -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/23/2021 12:39:05 AM)

A little trick to help with early shortage of escorts. Plan raid with an airfield you would like to attack on the route. Send in an escorted Medium Bomber raid 30-40 min after launching main raid. The new raids escorts will help clean up those pesky LW types after your stragglers!



palioboy2 -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/23/2021 7:14:44 AM)

I haven't had any issues escorting raids, my bomber loses are actually quite low. I hit every high capacity target in the Low Countries and Paris by the end of August with really reasonable loses and I am still floating around -800 points. Is there just no way you can into the black with Industry score without hitting the Rurh valley? My night raids have been crushing the Rurh valley I am already up to like 9700 points. Though I seem to be stuck at 60 urban damage at Essen, I have launched a few other raids at it to try to top it up but even in clear weather with tons of hits registering at game speed 1 it just stays at 60.

Also I can't see to shoot anything down at night. My NF that I send in my bomber stream register lots of EA found on radar but have only attacked once so far. And my caps over airfields haven't been very effective at all, maybe 1 or 2 down EA a night on average even though I am saturating 3+ airfields a night that I know have NF's operating out of them.



mark dolby -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/23/2021 4:01:10 PM)

If you look at the '44 campaign scores to start at 20/2/44 they are 3 on superiority, 9 on terror and 4 on industry, try to make that 16 points in any form for historical comparison.



JeffroK -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/24/2021 12:09:24 AM)

Yep, at mid Jan44 I am at 2,0,10, though Air Superiority wobbles between 2&3.

A terrible winter where I was too conservative about flying in 50% weather.

I would accept 65% as my limit now, and keep hitting radar & airfields to keep the Luftwaffe
in the air.



palioboy2 -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/26/2021 4:17:33 AM)

Thank you JeffroK and Mark Dolby for the info that does help a lot. I have heard the try to have 16 points before winter theory but giving a break down target helps a lot. I wasn't sure if I was so far behind in my industry score that I wouldn't be able to make it up in the other areas before the bad weather set in.



simovitch -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/26/2021 3:20:10 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: mark dolby

If you look at the '44 campaign scores to start at 20/2/44 they are 3 on superiority, 9 on terror and 4 on industry, try to make that 16 points in any form for historical comparison.

Ever since 1.04 the extent of urban and industrial damage undergoes a minor, random adjustment at the beginning of each campaign so the starting score of every game will be a little different.



palioboy2 -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/31/2021 6:36:54 AM)

I've kind of just adopted this as my help thread haha.

Question, as the Allies will I get more airfields in Italy as time passes? It's Sept 18th and so far I am showing no AF's in the Foggia area other then Amendola. Obviously there are lots more in the area before the invasion. Do these come back at some point or am I SOL? If they do come back and this is supposed to represent some sort of operation delay while the AF's are being set up, is there anywhere one can see a list of what future AF's are on the way and a timetable for their completion?



mark dolby -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (1/31/2021 9:35:05 AM)

They come back and then some. Lots are built in the Normandy area after the invasion as well. Some more appear on the way up Italy after the Gustav line breaks. I can't give you dates except by feb '44 there are over a dozen around Naples and two dozen around Foggia. Most of these are built before the new year.



palioboy2 -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (2/1/2021 12:38:00 AM)

Awesome, I assume that was the case but wanted to get a little more info before I started moving units around.



palioboy2 -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (2/8/2021 12:21:26 AM)

How do you guys like using your Typhoons in 43 and early 44. I started by hitting radar stations early in the campaign just to get them airborne with fighters to try to draw up the LW, but it hasn't been working great. I have been thinking I will just start hammering the units around the coasts in hopes of destroying equipment and putting pressure on industry that way. Is it worth it to hit rail areas near the coast? they largely seem to be heavily covered by flak so I have been avoiding that. Any suggestions on what others do?



Pete McCullagh -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (2/8/2021 2:18:29 AM)

Try working them in conjunction with airfield recon. Dive Bombing raids don't cost as many losses as sweeps but gain your units experience. Use IXCs as high escorts for the same reason. Forcing LW to move bases costs them Morale and prevents heavy losses to your bombers. This also provides diversion for your heavy raids.(if they are going after your fighters, they aren't after your bombers). Play with timing to see what works for you. Have fun!



palioboy2 -> RE: Any tips or guides for 1943 campaign as Allies? (2/8/2021 3:22:46 AM)

Yeah I was using them on AF raids when I could but it seems that the Germans have pulled most of their fighters our of France and the Netherlands by Oct where I now am. Enough so that I'm not consistently finding and being able to hit them day to day. On days when I don't have a viable AF to hit are the raids on enemy ground units worth it at this point, will the effects overtime add up to anything useful or does this not result on a drag on the German economy at all?



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