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Hanny -> RE: TOEs question (2/25/2021 7:52:23 AM)
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Light4bettor
lots of interesting data Hammy: here is the book and table I am referencing for this discussion- "Operation Barbarossa: the Complete Organizational and Statistical Analysis, and Military Simulation- Vol IIA. by Nigel Askey"
And here is his TOE and actuals for 1st Pz division right before the invasion (which we already noted is unique in someways- lol just like just about every Heer divison.
In his table, notice that while 1st Pz div is authorized 150 Sdfkz 251 Half tracks, it actually has, as far as the Askey has ascertained at least as the month of June (and before the actual invasion of course) 182 half tracks. Presumably this to make up for its TOE shortage of Sdfkz 250 halftracks.
Also this table shows that each regiment does have 54 rifle squad (1 battalion with 27 squads in trucks and 1 battalion with 27 in halftracks). In my reading I'm still tryng to figure out if you are saying that 1 Pz div. went to war with only 3 battalions of infantry or (2 battalions in halftracks and 1 battalion in trucks)?
[image]local://upfiles/69503/C1B0B2EB4E4348FFB878B5922E3FCCD0.gif[/image]
Amazing what I decide to care about on any given day.....Askey over inflates capabilities(, there are according to him More squad transports than squads to transport) for our game design purposes by use of authorised numbers in general, this in many instances pads the TOE, as you end up with more in game than we’re produced by industry*as the 251 production numbers show, after being produced, and accepted into service, some go to the training depots to train recruits on, others are issued to formations, others held in depots to replace formations requesting replacements, and when depots had large surplus creation of further formations. So the on hand in formations is well below authorised, and total production, on hand in the Heer includes all 4 categories on in service, in local repair short term, long term usually needs a part, and in transit to rear maintenance and cannot be re paired locally. 251 on hand was 61 for the Div.
Hence no on hand number value is present for duty number. since we have records for all 251 chassis built by month, from start of production to end of war, the game should have a hard cap, otherwise the replacement sequence will over time replace vastly more of them than industry produced to do that, so in wite1 your Div template tells the engine what to try and build back up to for 100%, so it’s possible to lose all your 153 PzrGrn squads along with the extra costed equipment, and have them replaced in game as it attempts to replace them, as I understand it. This in game Panzer Ball allows a player to play in a manner that industry could not sustain, for losses compare wite1 251 squads by year, in 42 scn start, use the editor to quickly find the formation with armour, they have all but disappeared, consumption has removed nearly all stocks and replacemnt capacity, leaving next to nothing, you can see this yourself in looking at combat outputs and see the 251 squad is prone to being a casualty in your own games. Where they all came from in 43 scn is another matter, I’d have to use a spreadsheet to give an explanation and doing this on I pad is not fun.
Rifle Brigade for 1 Panzer had 2 Regiments, First and 113rd one Bttn from Regiment one, having 3 Bttns, formed the 113 Regiment, and added a second Bttn for Barbarossa , 2 have 251, two have none, one of which has un hardened 251 chassis. sorry I was not clear I was concerned with squads with added armour protection.
* 760 is hundreds more than industry has built.
Another example of padding in Askey giving 7 and 20 Pzr Div each 95 Panhards, NARA T315h R406 0645
Holds the source document he uses via way of a secondary source book, it gives 7 Pzr 64, not 95, examples such as this appear on every page in Askeys work.
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