A Glimpse into the Future: C41 (Full Version)

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carlkay58 -> A Glimpse into the Future: C41 (8/15/2021 6:40:28 PM)

Introduction:

This is a playtest report of a future version of WitE2. It has some tweaks to the current version that need to be tested to determine if they are in the right direction. As a playtest, this is an attempt to break the game in every way possible.

The Game Options are: Axis player at all 100s vs Soviet AI at all 110s. Theater Box control is ON. AI Air Assist is OFF. The Scenario is the 41 Campaign with the game ending checks to keep me honest and pushing hard.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/8C2BF2A2EBF946A2B38F2B3BDF25B8A5.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: A Glimpse into the Future: C41 (8/15/2021 6:40:52 PM)

Initial Thoughts:

First off I am planning to use Unit Motorization. The Axis get 15 APs/Turn in this scenario so I will start with four infantry divisions motorized on turn 1 and switch to three after turn 1. This will give me some APs for the necessary Depot creations and repair priorities.

Second I will be attacking in the traditional organization because that will allow me to keep the AI honest, along with the ability to manipulate the AI's defensive priorities. If you only attack on one or two of the three paths the AI will cheat and clog those paths. By utilizing all three paths it is easy to manipulate the AI in switching defensive priorities and open up opportunities on the other paths when it concentrates on one of the paths.

Third I will use the motorization to aid Panzer Group 2 with an infantry corps (the XII). This will add more push that should accelerate my push on Moscow - something that HLYA claims can be easily done. I am not as good as HLYA at this but we shall see what comes out.

Fourth I have two other AARs in this forum that show the same type of effort by myself against the Soviet AI as my 'control' group. This will help evaluate the effectiveness and real cost of this approach as well as allowing evaluation of the new tweaks.

Fifth I am playing with Theater Box control. This is a feature that has not been fully tested as of yet and establishing a 'current abilities' posibility is needed. I will detail my moves and the effects for this feature.

Sixth I am not a fan of Super Depots. I find they muck up the Axis logistics too much and it is easier (for me at least) not to use them at all.

Seventh I am going to concentrate the logistics to supply a severe push on Moscow. This will be shown by utilizing FBD 2 to convert rail from Brest Litovsk to Minsk to Gomel. FBD 3 will convert rail through Vilnius to Minsk to Smolensk. FBD 4 will convert rail through Vilnius to Daugavpils to Smolensk. AGN will have to rely on the ports and rail conversion in the Baltics by the independent RADs.

Eighth I will be giving details on my operations to a certain degree. Anything listed above will be in depth my other operations will be less detailed so that this game play will not take too much time to do. AARs can really lengthen the game time.

Ninth the LW will be used in a different manner than most have seen. This will be documented for others to use if they wish (assuming it works!).

Tenth each turn will have the saves posted. There is no advancements that would prevent loading with the latest public versions at this time.

Eleven any and all discussions/ideas/advice are welcome. This is a testing game so feel free to give me ideas or things to test. I am quite willing to do so.




OberGeneral -> RE: A Glimpse into the Future: C41 (8/15/2021 7:02:30 PM)

I will be following this with great interest.[:)]



HardLuckYetAgain -> RE: A Glimpse into the Future: C41 (8/15/2021 10:23:18 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: carlkay58

Initial Thoughts:

First off I am planning to use Unit Motorization. The Axis get 15 APs/Turn in this scenario so I will start with four infantry divisions motorized on turn 1 and switch to three after turn 1. This will give me some APs for the necessary Depot creations and repair priorities.

Second I will be attacking in the traditional organization because that will allow me to keep the AI honest, along with the ability to manipulate the AI's defensive priorities. If you only attack on one or two of the three paths the AI will cheat and clog those paths. By utilizing all three paths it is easy to manipulate the AI in switching defensive priorities and open up opportunities on the other paths when it concentrates on one of the paths.

Third I will use the motorization to aid Panzer Group 2 with an infantry corps (the XII). This will add more push that should accelerate my push on Moscow - something that HLYA claims can be easily done. I am not as good as HLYA at this but we shall see what comes out.

Fourth I have two other AARs in this forum that show the same type of effort by myself against the Soviet AI as my 'control' group. This will help evaluate the effectiveness and real cost of this approach as well as allowing evaluation of the new tweaks.

Fifth I am playing with Theater Box control. This is a feature that has not been fully tested as of yet and establishing a 'current abilities' posibility is needed. I will detail my moves and the effects for this feature.

Sixth I am not a fan of Super Depots. I find they muck up the Axis logistics too much and it is easier (for me at least) not to use them at all.

Seventh I am going to concentrate the logistics to supply a severe push on Moscow. This will be shown by utilizing FBD 2 to convert rail from Brest Litovsk to Minsk to Gomel. FBD 3 will convert rail through Vilnius to Minsk to Smolensk. FBD 4 will convert rail through Vilnius to Daugavpils to Smolensk. AGN will have to rely on the ports and rail conversion in the Baltics by the independent RADs.

Eighth I will be giving details on my operations to a certain degree. Anything listed above will be in depth my other operations will be less detailed so that this game play will not take too much time to do. AARs can really lengthen the game time.

Ninth the LW will be used in a different manner than most have seen. This will be documented for others to use if they wish (assuming it works!).

Tenth each turn will have the saves posted. There is no advancements that would prevent loading with the latest public versions at this time.

Eleven any and all discussions/ideas/advice are welcome. This is a testing game so feel free to give me ideas or things to test. I am quite willing to do so.




Three extra normal infantry should prove beneficial. Just assign to one of the PZ or Moto Corps with excellent leader.

Your supply will be better. I did it my last couple games and my current game linking up all my rail. I don't advance as fast but my redundancy is much much better. I also incorporate the Lvl 2 railyards to push more freight. Should work out nice for you I would hope.

I am sure you will do just fine.




carlkay58 -> Turn 01 (8/16/2021 12:28:00 AM)

T01 Air Phase:

My first step is to delete all existing Air Directives. My second is to change the Air Doctrines. I go into Luftflotte 1 and change the following:

Ground Attack -> Unit target priority HIGH, Interdict target priority Ignore.

RECON -> Only fly on days 1 and 7, Escort Percentage 0, Altitude 17000.

Superiority -> Altitude 12000

I apply those changes to ALL air commands.

I then define Ground Attack:Airfield air directives for every Soviet occupied airbase within fighter range. I make sure that the target priorities are Airfield HIGH and the rest to ignore. I also change the schedule to only D1.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/3C91A33522494873855AA074F4CC0CE3.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/16/2021 12:28:25 AM)

T01 Air Disaster:

One Soviet interception near Iasi Rumania showed that there are some Soviet pilots that know how to use their Mig-2s. Fortunately this skill level is MUCH higher than the normal Soviet pilots.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/3D2BFA4611FA4B51A55A0C43DAA106E7.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/16/2021 12:29:54 AM)

T01 AGN:

I split up and motorize the 58th ID of XXXVIII Corps for just this turn. It should de-motorize during the next Axis Logistics Phase. This allows the Totenkopf SS MD to keep up with the rest of PG 4. The 18th Army advances along the Baltic Sea coast and is assigned all of the RAD Labor units for rail repair. The 16th Army captures Kaunus and is the southern edge of the southern pocket. PG 4 is across the Daugava River and captures Riga, Daugavpils, and is at the outskirts of Rezeine.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/6D50F94023BA4C8A9434AA3926674B05.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/16/2021 12:30:20 AM)

T01 AGC:

I motorize all three infantry divisions in the XII Corps to aid 2nd PG. These divisions will continue to be motorized beyond the next turn. This allows the XII Corps to form the southern edge of the Balystok Pocket which allows PG 2 to seize Minsk and protect the eastern edge of the Balystok Pocket. Which frees up PG 3 to cross the Dvina River and capture Poltsk. This riverline is completely in Axis hands from Riga to Polotsk. 9th Army punches through to Vilnius, guarding the northern edge of the Balystok Pocket. Balystok itself falls to the 8th SS Cav Bde while the 4th Army captures Brest Litovsk and forms the southern edge of the Balystok Pocket.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/8A5696C01A60411A81D181985742BB81.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/16/2021 12:30:51 AM)

T01 AGS:

This is actually where I was originally thinking of motorizing the XXIX Corps to give PG 1 additional mobile troops. Then I decided to see if HYLA was right about motorizing an infantry corps would turn the battle for AGC in taking Moscow. 6th Army forms the northern pocket with a little help from AGC infantry and a panzer division. 17th Army forms a western pocket along the initial lines and helps form the western edge of the Lvov pocket with PG 1 forming the eastern edge. This is probably the best AGS opening I have ever done. I did not take Lvov on this turn but I have pocketed some strong Soviet forces.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/D7D25AD901D94695A9901766E7CB5AE8.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/16/2021 12:31:06 AM)

T01 Cleanup:

I fly supply to the airbases along the Daugava River and transfer JG54 air groups along the line. They are in place to punish any Soviet air bombing. I do the same with JG27 into Vilnius, Minsk, and Baranovichi. That takes care of all of the LW I can afford to advance at this time.

Then I go through the Theater Boxes. The Reserve Box is easy and everything over 80% TOE is sent to the map and the rest are put into REFIT. Western Europe is low on all categories and nothing that is that tempting for me to do anything with. Norway is short on Day Air. I do transfer the two RAD Labor units to the MAP as I do not think Norway has to worry about rail damage too much. Looking at the Air Day drop down I THINK it is short low level flak (Light AA) and fighters. I will keep an eye on this and possibly send some reinforcements if needed in a few turns. I do note that one of the two fighter bomber air groups has only 5 of 18 aircraft ready so that could be part of the problem. Finland has low status on both ground and air but it should settle down over the next few turns. North Africa is the most interesting for me. The German Afrika Korps is very tempting. I will do nothing at this time but it is on my radar. I look through Italy and the Balkans but I don't see anything that is pressing at this time.




carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/16/2021 12:31:33 AM)

T01 Files:




modrow -> RE: Turn 01 (8/16/2021 7:11:26 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: carlkay58

T01 Files:




Just wanted to say thank you for doing this detailed AAR and providing valuable data and information. [&o]

Much appreciated !

Hartwig



HardLuckYetAgain -> RE: Turn 01 (8/16/2021 9:21:25 PM)

Could you circle or highlight the Motorized infantry you do please :) Give you a dollar$$$$$$



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/16/2021 11:59:58 PM)

This is the location of the motorized XII Corps in PG 2 at the end of my turn 2 Air Phase:


[image]local://upfiles/35705/262A119DD132486B9F16617BCFCD89A7.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/17/2021 12:43:42 PM)

T02 Events:

Both ground and naval setbacks in North Africa and a setback in the Balkans this turn. Since I did nothing to either of these theaters this is just the start of the game setbacks until the units in the theaters get up to strength.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/71C1CAFF277C452BB153E8C18902786A.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/17/2021 12:44:07 PM)

T02 Supply Net North:

Obviously no real improvement as this is the first turn of the invasion. This sets the bar for future turns.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/B2875DD91F5D4743954E38A13DD726D3.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/17/2021 12:44:34 PM)

02 Supply Net South:

The same as for the north with the additional comment that the Rumanians have just joined the fight.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/9C5F96CA6BE74A3F95BB428A711F4FD6.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/17/2021 12:45:00 PM)

T02 OOB:

The Soviets are below 3M men. The LW outnumbers the VVS. Both good news. The Soviet AFVs are almost three times the Axis AFVs which is a concern but hopefully that will change soon and they are all obsolete and inferior tanks anyways!



[image]local://upfiles/35705/C3462A90837B432495641C1EFE19D9A8.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/17/2021 12:45:30 PM)

T02 Ground Losses:

A good start for Soviet losses. Over half of the losses are permanent (Killed or Captured). This should help keep the Soviet OOB down.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/BB2A355E4EA84006A2C7125D65400AF0.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/17/2021 12:46:01 PM)

T02 Air Losses:

The VVS losses are almost 20 times the LW! I hope to keep this up if possible. I will also note that I lost only 25 Axis pilots - which is equal to the air combat losses - while total aircraft losses were 42.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/387D0F48FB9F4D00994698DDC17D97CF.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/17/2021 12:46:32 PM)

T02 Production:

The vehicle status is looking good as well as the supply situation in the units.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/7AA11530175346D2972000D6E60AB16E.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/17/2021 12:47:00 PM)

T02 Freight:

The front line units are well supplied which is no surprise this early in the war.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/17A4D4654E714D9086B380CF4C787828.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/17/2021 12:47:31 PM)

T02 Trucks:

A lot of unit trucks were used for supply which lowered my MPs in the panzer groups.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/3BD0472BCECC460DBA7702BF7BE560F0.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/17/2021 12:47:55 PM)

T02 Soviet Attacks:

The only Soviet aggression this turn was an attempt to bomb Hanover. This is LW performance at the highest level!



[image]local://upfiles/35705/C9A24259A4E04BB88E8A26353DC20ECF.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/17/2021 12:48:26 PM)

T02 Air Phase:

I go into the Commander Reports screen and set all air groups to automatically upgrade. I then delete all of the air directives from turn 1 (all Ground Attack:Airfields) and set up Recon air directives.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/A0A77472D11F4591AF27C19521302BB6.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/17/2021 12:48:52 PM)

T02 AGN:

16th and 18th Armies clean up the pockets as well as they can. PG 4 continues to advance in the Baltic States. No new pockets but a lot of rail hexes flipped without combat.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/58CF4D86E217434CA9CCC4AB6DCBEDEB.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/17/2021 12:49:19 PM)

T02 AGC:

4th Army and the portions of the 2nd Army already present in the front work on reducing the Balystok Pocket. 9th Army helps with that while sending two corps towards Polotsk to relieve PG 3 from the front lines. PG 3 continue to advance with one panzer division reaching the outskirts of Vitebsk before pulling back a bit to stay safe. PG 2 continues its drive and actually gets a panzer division over the Dnepr between Mogilev and Orsha.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/EFC993E5697A4EF3A8E28B0247A45315.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/17/2021 12:49:46 PM)

T02 Motorized Corps:

The XII Corps is holding the southern flank of PG 2. Their mobility had allowed me to keep a normal Panzer Corps in the front line instead of protecting flanks where infantry are not fast enough to reach.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/6663B555ABDD4327853F554F73302C11.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/17/2021 12:50:19 PM)

T02 AGS:

6th Army is able to collapse the northern pocket and advance to connect the flanks between PG 2 and PG 1. 17th Army is able to reduce the frontier and Lvov pockets and advancing to hold the western flank of the next pocket. There are still a few trapped Soviet units near the Hungarian border. PG 1 is able to pull back and around to form a new pocket. The 11th Army starts to push eastward with help from the Rumanians.



[image]local://upfiles/35705/81AAB2EB7E62486293514020FAE630C2.jpg[/image]



carlkay58 -> RE: Turn 01 (8/17/2021 12:50:48 PM)

T02 Cleanup:

I move the Kolufts (Recon AOGs) forward. I also move the Flieger Fuehrer Ostsee to Rumania and reassign the AOG to Luftflotte 4.

I go through the Theater Boxes. I do transfer two AAA regiments from the Reserve to try and bolster Norway's AIR DAY rating (currently at 57%). Numbers in the section are Air Day 2.86 (5):57%. Night Fighter at 0, Flak (low) 0.16, and Flak (high) 1.10. It will take two turns for the regiments to reach Norway so I will keep an eye open for the results.

T02 Files:




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