RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (Full Version)

All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> War In The Pacific - Struggle Against Japan 1941 - 1945



Message

pompack -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (7/31/2004 11:59:17 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: vonSchnitter

Hi Gents,

just came home and had alook for new events on this board - like helpfull things on new findings, new errata, changes of unit mechanics by the patch etc.

And whats up ? A few new threads on how shabbily Matrix treat their customers. Makes me wonder. Really.

Here is my "experience": Bought the game a day or two after release - download went ok first go.

Installed it, ran it without any issues - sound or whatever. Installed the first "quick fix" patches - just to follow suit.
And enjoied plaing the game against the ai to learn the mechanics.

Did burn a CD with the complete installs - including a txt file with the DR confirmation info on the order and serial number. Thats it.

The game runs well - not a single hick up to date - and plays well without real show stoppers - in the self study department. Patches have been announced early and promises with 1.20 have been kept.

Even the download of the patch 1.2 worked at the first go.

I understand, that the wargaming community is different from the say flight simmulation crowd - a lot more of older ( not to say anemic) pc-systems still in use, etc.
But in any case, a little common sense tells, that it pays off to do some housekeeping on a pc - esp on an older one, to keep in good shape and up to the task.

And since we are in 2004 the news about the need of d/l managers to keep slow speed or just lousy and unstable internetconnections usefull should have spread a little more.

To me this is a kind of non-issue. It is just a couple of users, who have not done their homework. It has nothing to do with the game or the publisher.

Now for that serial number registration thing. Matrix just enforces the need to register your legal copy of a software product with them. And if you did, you have acces to the patches. This is just a kind of copy protection scheme, to deny "leaked" copy owners acces to patches. So this is - in my view - a good thing to reduce software piracy, may increase their sales, which in turn will yield better support and probably more games. It is a perfectly sound and sober business practice.

Sorry to say it: But all this type of bickering and bitching is just rediculous - in my view.

Cheers
vonSchnitter

Well said vonSchnitter!!![8D]

I also loaded the game without a hitch, glitch or ... The first thing I did after downloading (of course) was to record the serial number in about five separate places for safe-keeping since I knew that I would need it later. The second thing I did was to burn a CD just in case something happened before the CD arrived in the mail (I didn't need it of course, but it just made me feel better to have it handy just in case I had a disk crash). Then I played the game, began learning the system and enjoyed it enormously.

When people started talking about the patch being imminent, I took the time to register (no problems encountered there either).

When the patch was finally blessed, I downloaded it easily, installed and started running with zero problems, issues or even petty irritations.

I think that most people had experiences like ours but it is hard to tell that just by reading this forum.



gunnergoz -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 12:03:50 AM)

1. Nobody forced anyone to buy this game.
2. Everybody is free to upgrade or not.
3. Matrix is free to run their business as they wish.
4. The marketplace is the only arbiter of what works and what does not.
5. Let nature take its course; If this isn't a good business formula, Darwin will determine what is.



Gudgeon -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 12:15:02 AM)

This thread makes me a little misty-eyed for the good old days of dialup internet surfing. Trying to download something off of the SSI website and after it started going to mow the lawn, walk the dog, take a nap, and then read a book. I used to get a lot more done around here back then. I was a little irritated with the 45 minutes it took to download the game and patch via cable. Thanks for putting it back into perspective for me!

[image]local://upfiles/13356/Xv650762922.jpg[/image]



Erik Rutins -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 12:15:46 AM)

Gentlemen,

I'm glad it worked well for you and many others. We appreciated the support. However, we really need to hear from customers for whom it is not working well so that we can make sure everyone has a positive experience. As is, we've already collected a number of suggestions. I'm doing a review of the Members Area right now after one conference call and we're scheduled to have another tonight. We don't want any of our customers to be unhappy, but if they are, we want to hear it so we can fix it.

Thanks again.

Regards,

- Erik



2Stepper -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 12:19:07 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Xargun

You want annoying ?? Remember a game called SIN ? You paid your $50 (or around there) took it home, installed it and POOF nothing worked... The game right out of the box was crap and you had to download a 40 Meg patch just so it would run.. And thats back in the days before everyone had DSL or cable modems.. Try downloading 40 Meg on a 33.6 modem....

Personally I am happy with WitP right now and may never patch... I luckily didn't have any CTD or sound issues and did not even need the interim patch. I will probably patch some time in the future but for now I see now real point as the game is completely playable as it stands...

Oh BTW, I'd had the game for just over a month and have already gotten my $70 worth..

Xargun


Oh I bet if we all put our collective memories together we could come up with roughly 100 games that have just simply gone wrong. My personal favorite computer disaster is the original Starfleet Command by a company I won't name since they don't exist anymore. LOL!

At any rate, version 1.0 was COMPLETELY unplayable off the shelf. So much so they had 3 patches out within a few days of release... None of which got the game working. I was SO intent on playing it, it took the 4th patch and 6wks of waiting to get going... I then got my moneys worth playing... There's others, but that one is the tops...

My point? I think it shows a TON of class by matrix and 2by3 to do the work to get this game going and KEEP it going for those of us that have the interest. You know the thing about small groups of dedicated players? Well, we have a tendency of telling our friends how great something is... End result is a bigger customer base then expected. So while ya, there might be little glurps and burps over how this is patched or downloaded, I could care less about that. As long as the end result is positive? I'm all for it!!!! These guys are on top of the game and are out for customer satisfaction! That says a TON!

Dare I mention a game that actually got cancelled? Could you guys imagine what that would have done? I followed a game about 3yrs ago for a good 9 months that was in development... Had a solid forum fan base (much like this one), and the company in question just decided that the base wasn't good enough and wouldn't make them any money. They canx'd the game and didn't even look back. Oddly enough? You don't even hear their name much anymore! LOL! Go figure... Matrix has it right, we just need to give them the chance and the credit they deserve... [8D]

<pant> Okay, I'm off my soapbox... Tirade complete! LOL! [:D][8D]

EDIT:
quote:


Gentlemen,

I'm glad it worked well for you and many others. We appreciated the support. However, we really need to hear from customers for whom it is not working well so that we can make sure everyone has a positive experience. As is, we've already collected a number of suggestions. I'm doing a review of the Members Area right now after one conference call and we're scheduled to have another tonight. We don't want any of our customers to be unhappy, but if they are, we want to hear it so we can fix it.

Thanks again.

Regards,

- Erik


Oh, I hear you Erik, and please don't misunderstand from my post that I don't want people complaining... It's important and healthy... Though the louder rumbles are a little rough to read when from ones own perspective things are going so well... You're doing your best to take care of everyone, and I think its of value that you know its appreciated. [8D]



Mr.Frag -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 12:23:03 AM)

I fondly remember various Adventure games where you'll invest 80 odd hours only to run into a show stopper bug that basically prevented you from continuing any further. Bungee had that, Sierra is famous for that, the list goes on and on where the game was completely useless and was NEVER patched to fix the issue.



2Stepper -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 12:25:00 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mr.Frag

I fondly remember various Adventure games where you'll invest 80 odd hours only to run into a show stopper bug that basically prevented you from continuing any further. Bungee had that, Sierra is famous for that, the list goes on and on where the game was completely useless and was NEVER patched to fix the issue.


Sierra was actually the one that cancelled a game that I thought would have been a gem! But it laid out dead on the matt without looking back. Then there was Interplay, but they too are a bad memory for most. LOL! Situations like those are why I have the respect I do for Matrix for making the gargantuan effort this game took. [8D]



gunnergoz -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 12:26:28 AM)

Like I said, market forces will prevail. A company like Matrix will adapt, learn and implement changes to suit the customer base and their business strategy. All is well and working fine in this small corner of the world. [:D]



TheHellPatrol -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 12:37:46 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mr.Frag

I fondly remember various Adventure games where you'll invest 80 odd hours only to run into a show stopper bug that basically prevented you from continuing any further. Bungee had that, Sierra is famous for that, the list goes on and on where the game was completely useless and was NEVER patched to fix the issue.

[:D]Elmo's Big Adventure[:D]Why Mr. Frag![;)]



SlapBone -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 12:53:21 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

Gentlemen,

I'm glad it worked well for you and many others. We appreciated the support. However, we really need to hear from customers for whom it is not working well so that we can make sure everyone has a positive experience. As is, we've already collected a number of suggestions. I'm doing a review of the Members Area right now after one conference call and we're scheduled to have another tonight. We don't want any of our customers to be unhappy, but if they are, we want to hear it so we can fix it.

Thanks again.

Regards,

- Erik


Since this thread has been hijacked I'm going to ask this question again before putting out my own topic.

Has there been any discussion of getting the manuals to this game (and Starshatter) on Kinkos Doc Center to make getting them printed a little more affordable to the people (all of us) who paid $70 for the game?



TheHellPatrol -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 12:57:15 AM)

You wouldn't be the first to start that topic as it has been covered before, i believe after the dust settles they were going to look into it as well as Witp merchandise. When??? I don't think anyone knows yet but if i'm wrong we'll soon find out...or not[;)]....SunDevil response is imminent[;)].



SunDevil_MatrixForum -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 12:58:01 AM)

http://www.matrixgames.com/default.asp?URL=http%3A//www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp%3Fm%3D657950%26mpage%3D1%26key%3Dkinko%26%23658112

half way down, official response.



mogami -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 1:09:56 AM)

Hi, Sierra broke my heart when they cancelled Civil War Generals III. But the good news is that is how I found Matrix. There was this forum following the game at another site and someone posted a link to Matrix because there was a post about it here. (I never got around to going back to the other site.)



TheHellPatrol -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 1:12:53 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mogami

Hi, Sierra broke my heart when they cancelled Civil War Generals III. But the good news is that is how I found Matrix. There was this forum following the game at another site and someone posted a link to Matrix because there was a post about it here.
I still have that game installed on what is now my sons PC...great game, i too was sad to hear the news about CWG3...i'm still waiting for him to "mature" enough for a head to head[:D].



2ndACR -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 1:30:05 AM)

I will take Matrix's method over a certain company who did a certain space based 5X style game. It also had a rabid
fan base, they spent 5+ years in developement, released 1 patch and said that's it. Fastest I have ever seen a game
go to the bargain bin. I wiped that game off my HD after the patch broke half the stuff that worked right. Half the stuff in the game, the company still has no idea what it does or if it is working right or how it works.

As someone who has 56K, I will say that I miss the retail stores. But Matrix has yet to let me down with their support.
At least here I know they will do whatever it takes to correct a problem as fast as they can. What other game company do you know of where the staff and developers are this involved after release and on a weekend? I can think of none.



Black Cat -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 1:38:28 AM)

Yeah.. It wasn`t easy to destroy a great franchise like MOO, supported by a huge Fan Base , but they did it with one Game with one " patch ".

Soooooo Sad[:(]



mark24 -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 1:50:25 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

I'm glad it worked well for you and many others. We appreciated the support. However, we really need to hear from customers for whom it is not working well so that we can make sure everyone has a positive experience. As is, we've already collected a number of suggestions. I'm doing a review of the Members Area right now after one conference call and we're scheduled to have another tonight. We don't want any of our customers to be unhappy, but if they are, we want to hear it so we can fix it.

- Erik


Hi Erik,

I was one of those at-the-time-disgruntled-customers for much the same reason as everyone else who has had problems. I understand the reasons for the members area, & anything that stops piracy & makes sure the cash gets into the right place so as you can make more great games is fine by me. So, no complaints that the procedure for patch access changed per se.

The only criticism I think that is fair to level at Matrix, is that the process by which we could access the patch was not made clear enough. I'm sure it was documented somewhere, but us dull creatures of habit expecting to go straight to the d/l area, or members area & it be straightforward were stymied. We really could have done with something waved under our noses before we began to attempt access that outlined the process step by step. Perhaps a sticky thread in the forums devoted to that purpose, or something equally visible & clearly labelled.

I hope you can forgive us blowing off steam, it's just frustration.

Mark

PS. The error I had where I could not extract the download was purely my error, my trial version of Winzip had expired. Doh!



BartM -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 1:56:59 AM)

[:D]

wow :)

actaully, I kinda agree with the original poster, as well as others along this thread, and was it Erik ? who responded, which I was amazed (after the years of seeing companies ignore negative comments). Not a fanboy, just a very old (sigh) really old wargamer.. :)

80$ is alot, for anything, and for a game, which you can buy 2-3 games with the same money, it's even more. :) that said, all here boiught the game, spent the money :) so I assume we wanted the game !

I get really harsh at times with posts about games I buy, if they seem to be really lacking in content or functionality, this has PLENTY of content, and like I mentioned elsewhere, 2-5 patches and it will run smoothly, and actually not be such a monster to navigate.

dunno, bored waiting for the patch to finish :) I still want a sortable leader table, and a way to make computer controlled areas just that (really dont want to run china and russia's stalemate war). more HQ locations (instead of seven, perhaps 9 or 12) leaving the "west coast" alone as it's own entity, same with Japan.

as for the download and SS#, well, not much more can be said that hasn't been. Its very different then what most companies do, but it will get better.

ttfn



Platoonist -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 2:14:40 AM)

I was curious.....did anyone out there ever play Three-Sixty's 1993 Pacific Theater wargame Victory at Sea? Designed by the legendary James Dunnigan . Was only ever available on the Mac. Looked good but I understand it was rife with problems. I still own a copy although I have never played it.


[img]http://ruhkarv.homestead.com/files/BackBox.jpg[/img]

[img]http://ruhkarv.homestead.com/files/Rulebook.jpg[/img]



pompack -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 2:26:09 AM)

I advanced ordered the PC version of Victory at Sea. I waited expectantly for about a year then they were nice enough to send me a message saying they were scrapping it (they never cashed the check either).



Platoonist -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 2:30:20 AM)

Interesting pompacl....I do seem to remember reading somewhere back then that James Dunnigan was planning to completely disown himself from the game. I knew then it was in trouble.



wzh55 -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 2:38:26 AM)

[&:]

Well, I like the game and patch process, I found I had no problems at all. I thank Matrix and Gary and his crew at 2 by 3 for a game that I am sure took many, many hours of research, not to mention the programing, testing, re-works, etc. I helps design a few scenarios for Steel Panthers for the old NovaStar company and on some of those small scenarios I spent much time to research the oob, armaments, history, and such. I commend all for a job well done and even though I was surprized at the cost initally, upon reflection, I figured if I was on the side of the games designers, that would be a fair price for the amount of effort involved in making a game of this magnitude. WELL DONE.[&o][&o][&o][sm=00000436.gif]



myros -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 2:39:56 AM)

MOO3 ...ah the memories :) I did a complete overhaul UI mod for that game thats still kicking around ...didnt help with the death spiral though :(

Did notice recently though that some fans have hacked the exe and are fixing things on their own now, they have actualy made a good amount of progress. Now thats some hardcore fans huh.

Myros



Sultanofsham -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 2:47:57 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: 2Stepper

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mr.Frag

I fondly remember various Adventure games where you'll invest 80 odd hours only to run into a show stopper bug that basically prevented you from continuing any further. Bungee had that, Sierra is famous for that, the list goes on and on where the game was completely useless and was NEVER patched to fix the issue.


Sierra was actually the one that cancelled a game that I thought would have been a gem! But it laid out dead on the matt without looking back. Then there was Interplay, but they too are a bad memory for most. LOL! Situations like those are why I have the respect I do for Matrix for making the gargantuan effort this game took. [8D]


Good old Sierra. I still remember Front office football 99 being recalled from the shelves because it was so screwed up.



2ndACR -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 2:50:39 AM)

I liked MOO1, never played MOO2. MOO3 completely disgusted me though. Even now I look up from my PC and can see it sitting there. Needless to say those 2 companies will never see another dollar of mine. I have'nt been back to the forums since I removed it from my hard drive. I got WITP now to occupy all my time or BTR if the fancy hits.



rroberson -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 3:34:18 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sultanofsham

quote:

ORIGINAL: 2Stepper

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mr.Frag

I fondly remember various Adventure games where you'll invest 80 odd hours only to run into a show stopper bug that basically prevented you from continuing any further. Bungee had that, Sierra is famous for that, the list goes on and on where the game was completely useless and was NEVER patched to fix the issue.


Sierra was actually the one that cancelled a game that I thought would have been a gem! But it laid out dead on the matt without looking back. Then there was Interplay, but they too are a bad memory for most. LOL! Situations like those are why I have the respect I do for Matrix for making the gargantuan effort this game took. [8D]


Good old Sierra. I still remember Front office football 99 being recalled from the shelves because it was so screwed up.



I kept my copy of that as a reminder to NEVER purchase another Sierra game again. I would like to think I contributed to the demise of that company.



Tankerace -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 4:55:40 AM)

If I can be blunt, I love this game. But, it seems to me that it was released far to early just to make Origins. For all these errors, that everyone noticed on the first day, I feel more like a payign beta tester than I do a gamer. But, because of what this game is, and the fact that given its scope its at least 85% finished and bug free, I'll move past that.

However, going through hoops and stuff to get patches is not a bad thing. That is if the game you got was a finished product, not released early. WiTP, however, isn't. I love this game, but I happen to know enough about programming and such to be able to tell this game was released too early. And given the fact that most of us paid 80 bucks the first or second day of July, and most of that had to either shelve the game or still haven't received it, I feel that going through all this hoopla about getting the patch is too much. I had to suffer with not playing WiTP for weeks, because I was told the patch would have "Major OOB changes needed to fix balance issues". Well, as we have seen, that wasn't 100% accurate. My stance is this. If we had paid you 80 bucks for a FULLY working game, then yes, make us go through hell to get the patch. But if we paid you 80 bucks for a game that we had to wait almost a month before we could play it to its full potential, and even then there are rumors contradicting that, just give us the patch without a lot of hassle.

Don't get me wrong, I am not trying to flame. I love WiTP, and I thank Matrix/2by3 for it. But considering the product didn't work wholly as advertised, I think the consolation to the consumer should be we can get the patches without going through a lot of crap.

Just my $.02



MadDawg -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 5:15:34 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tankerace

If I can be blunt, I love this game. But, it seems to me that it was released far to early just to make Origins. For all these errors, that everyone noticed on the first day, I feel more like a payign beta tester than I do a gamer. But, because of what this game is, and the fact that given its scope its at least 85% finished and bug free, I'll move past that.



Yep, I feel exactly the same way and have said so in the should I purchase thread below. I would have happily waited another couple of months to buy a finished product but as is I am going to be far more cautoius with future purchases. That being said I think this game has great potential and I am looking forward to seeing a finished product.

Dawg



David Heath -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 5:53:30 AM)

Hello

Yes we are working on this but we are not readyyet with Kinkos to start taken orders.

David



David Heath -> RE: Matrix has shocked me with this Patch silliness. (8/1/2004 6:05:22 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tankerace

If I can be blunt, I love this game. But, it seems to me that it was released far to early just to make Origins. For all these errors, that everyone noticed on the first day, I feel more like a payign beta tester than I do a gamer. But, because of what this game is, and the fact that given its scope its at least 85% finished and bug free, I'll move past that.

Just my $.02


Yes there were some problems and we always expect OOB issues do to the scope. We do feel the game was playable and was and currently is being played by many. We as a company will be making changes to our proceedures to get it more right the next time around.

David



Page: <<   < prev  1 [2] 3   next >   >>

Valid CSS!




Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI
1.03125