It is an amazing game (Full Version)

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magresh -> It is an amazing game (7/31/2004 8:15:15 PM)

I have been playing wargames since about 1970. Board games then. Rule books full of typos and maps that were incorrect. Some rules were ambiguous and some were just wrong. Each person had to figure it out on their own and make it work. Sometimes they might re-release a good game with some fixes (after a few years had gone by). Computers came along and we got some of the same problems and in the early days before patching was available, we had to figure it out and make it work again. The games today are played on home computers equivalent to super computers of ten years ago. And the games have been getting bigger and more detailed. This War in the Pacific game is the most ambitious undertaking to date and I am sometimes in awe that it is sitting there on my monitor and gives me a chance to fight, on either side, the entire Second World War in the Pacific. And at this level!
I have the sound problem, so no sound. Some menus don't show things, so I figure it as just inadvertent fog of war. A map distortion becomes inaccurate maps and faulty inteligence. A crash to desktop becomes....well that is just time for a break. The great thing about all of this is I am not alone this time and that someone, the incredible group of just plain game loving guys at Matrix games, are listening and doing the figuring and are going to make it work and fix what doesn't work and change what is off the mark and it won't take years. I imagine most of them are doing this to earn a living working at what they love. I wish I had the time to sit down and play a game with each of you. Thank you ain't enough for what you have done with this truly magnificent game.



tsimmonds -> RE: It is an amazing game (7/31/2004 10:11:32 PM)

roger that, bro; abso-freakin-lutely!



Titanwarrior89 -> RE: It is an amazing game (7/31/2004 11:10:51 PM)

AMEN![;)]
quote:

ORIGINAL: magresh

I have been playing wargames since about 1970. Board games then. Rule books full of typos and maps that were incorrect. Some rules were ambiguous and some were just wrong. Each person had to figure it out on their own and make it work. Sometimes they might re-release a good game with some fixes (after a few years had gone by). Computers came along and we got some of the same problems and in the early days before patching was available, we had to figure it out and make it work again. The games today are played on home computers equivalent to super computers of ten years ago. And the games have been getting bigger and more detailed. This War in the Pacific game is the most ambitious undertaking to date and I am sometimes in awe that it is sitting there on my monitor and gives me a chance to fight, on either side, the entire Second World War in the Pacific. And at this level!
I have the sound problem, so no sound. Some menus don't show things, so I figure it as just inadvertent fog of war. A map distortion becomes inaccurate maps and faulty inteligence. A crash to desktop becomes....well that is just time for a break. The great thing about all of this is I am not alone this time and that someone, the incredible group of just plain game loving guys at Matrix games, are listening and doing the figuring and are going to make it work and fix what doesn't work and change what is off the mark and it won't take years. I imagine most of them are doing this to earn a living working at what they love. I wish I had the time to sit down and play a game with each of you. Thank you ain't enough for what you have done with this truly magnificent game.



Platoonist -> RE: It is an amazing game (7/31/2004 11:42:01 PM)

I remember dreaming about a game like this back in the late 1980s when reading John Toland's Rising Sun.I had Victory Game's Pacific War boardgame then but no willing opponents. I bought my first computer a few years later in 1992 and then a few months later saw Gary Grigsby's Pacific War in a software store. I had seen no pregame advertising or literature so I thought it was too good to be true until I got it home and found out what a gem it was. (Klunky interface and all)

So good it see it finally have a worthy successor. Problems may persist but games like this have become quite rare. Glad it finally got to see the light of day. [8D]



Banquet -> RE: It is an amazing game (8/1/2004 12:31:21 AM)

Well said! [:)]

WiTP has a spirit, a soul.. it's the reason I buy computers, it's one of the brave few that still dare to portray a deep and complex environment and let us loose to re-examine history.

I salute everyone involved in it's making. To me they are explorers, innovators and creators. Always pushing back the boundaries of what can be done. Increasingly rare, and so ever more special.



Kitakami -> RE: It is an amazing game (8/1/2004 12:41:15 AM)

So much truth in your words...

As a carboard wargamer ot 75+ titles, and an avid computer gamer of games like the veritable Guadalcanal Campaign for the Apple II (and a few here know just how good playing it was, even with its simple graphics), all I have to say is that people nowadays lack patience. I remember fondly SPI's War in the Pacific (yes, THE monster), AH's VitP, and VG's PacWar. I owned all three, and still have PacWar neatly stored.

But THIS is just soooo much better in comparison. Not to have to write down where everything was because the dinner table will see guests, to be able to save a game and continue it a few days (or weeks) afterwards... that is priceless. And if the price to pay for it is, besides a monetary fee that is lower than what some of the new carboard startegic games cost nowadays, having patience in tweaking the installation and in waiting for the patches, well... I will gladly pay that price.

We live in a day and age that seeks instant gratification, where and when we expect everything delivered yesterday because we want it now. That is a shame because if we want a thoroughly tested and well thought-out product, it will require time. And patches are unavoidable because even if games were released with zero programming flaws, the feedback from the players would merit at least a few patches, whether on interface details, OOB or whatever.

So, kudos to Matrix and 2by3 for an EXCELLENT product. Do not despair if the disagreeing voices are the loudest, the grognards among your clientelle surely appreciate your products and your service.

Again, thanks.



ckk -> RE: It is an amazing game (8/1/2004 2:43:28 AM)

I bought SPI's war in the Pacific in the 80's Hung all the maps, 42+ square feet, over sheet metal and magnetized all 3200 pieces. And played the Game by myself as I could find no takers. Imagine how I feel about Matrix and 2by3"s effort.

Thanks a million guys and don"t let the whiners and people who are changing the art already! You have made my retirement, heaven.[:D][:D][:D][:D][:D]

BTW I think I paid almost $70 in 1981.[X(][X(][X(][X(][X(]

Gives these guys time to make this huge game the masterpiece it wii be.

CKK



Grotius -> RE: It is an amazing game (8/1/2004 6:59:20 AM)

As I just said in another thread, this game is probably my favorite computer wargame ever. (My favorite wargame of all time may still be Advanced Squad Leader, but WiTP is gaining!) It appeals to two of my strongest obsessions: obsession with detailed, complex wargames; and obession with the Pacific War. :)



bradfordkay -> RE: It is an amazing game (8/1/2004 8:25:00 AM)

I agree with nearly every statement said previously in this thread. This game is a dream game, and I am ecstatic to have it in my possession. 2by3 and Matrix have performed wonders with their games, and when you consider the level of support they have always shown, we are assured that the final product will be even more glorious than the masterpiece gracing our screens at this moment.



mutterfudder -> RE: It is an amazing game (8/1/2004 10:42:10 AM)

Second that![&o]



tigercub -> RE: It is an amazing game (8/1/2004 10:59:49 AM)

well said guys!!!



netjam99 -> RE: It is an amazing game (8/1/2004 3:25:42 PM)

Man, I play past midnight. Then wake up, grab a cup of coffee and crank it up again at 7am. Been a long time since I've enjoyed a computer game this much.



Mike Wood -> RE: It is an amazing game (8/2/2004 6:27:28 AM)

Hello...

On behalf of the programmers for the project, thank you. We aim to please.

Bye...

Michael Wood

quote:

ORIGINAL: ckk

I bought SPI's war in the Pacific in the 80's Hung all the maps, 42+ square feet, over sheet metal and magnetized all 3200 pieces. And played the Game by myself as I could find no takers. Imagine how I feel about Matrix and 2by3"s effort.

Thanks a million guys and don"t let the whiners and people who are changing the art already! You have made my retirement, heaven.[:D][:D][:D][:D][:D]

BTW I think I paid almost $70 in 1981.[X(][X(][X(][X(][X(]

Gives these guys time to make this huge game the masterpiece it wii be.

CKK



DrewMatrix -> RE: It is an amazing game (8/2/2004 7:41:02 AM)

Someone (one of the moderators I think) commented that he worried the game "took a quantum approach to a classical physics problem." I worried about that too, before I played it, but one advantage to that quantum approach is that all the right things happen, and happen for the right reasons.

You must worry about your logistics here, and not because of any tacked on logistics rule, but because without that supply line nothing else can be attempted. You have to worry about ASW, and for the right reason, to keep the Sea Line of Communications open. You have to worry about wearing out ships and men, because it doesn't matter how many units you have as much as their health, state of rest and state of repair.

I love the way ASW works well if you coordinate air and ship based ASW. I love the way the various units behave so differently depending on experience and quality. I love the way you have to think so far ahead, working units up in experience and trying to see far enough ahead to decide whether it is time to stop training and board the transports.

What a game!



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