Been trying to modify MC scenarios. (Full Version)

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plloyd -> Been trying to modify MC scenarios. (9/28/2004 10:20:16 PM)

As I, and others, have previously noted, there are some peculiar items in the Desert Fox MC. I started last week to try and fix some of them. Many of you know what I mean, the M3 Lees in 304, Mineploughs in 305, Matila 1s and Vickers Mediums running around. We have all run into them. The problem is that when I open the Change Unit window, there are no units in the list. Does anyone have any advice on how to break in?

Also, I would appreciate anyone else's notes who might have traced their career path through the scenarios. It would help me build a more complete scenario tapestry than the single thread I have.



RockinHarry -> RE: Been trying to modify MC scenarios. (9/29/2004 4:16:40 PM)

Just curious, what´s the date set of the scenario when Change unit window does not show any units?[&:]



plloyd -> RE: Been trying to modify MC scenarios. (9/29/2004 5:12:48 PM)

At the momment I have been trying to get into the scenarios dealing with the intial advance and first assaults on Tobruch. The dates are march 24, '41 thru mid-April.

I have applied blank .cmt files to the scenarios. That lets me open them for editing, or individual play. I can redeploy units (don't really want to do that) and change unit data (very tedious). I however cannot get a list in the change unit window. I have tried Freds tools too.



Major Destruction -> RE: Been trying to modify MC scenarios. (10/6/2004 8:07:03 AM)

Which scenario in particular.

pm me and I'll help you/



RockinHarry -> RE: Been trying to modify MC scenarios. (10/12/2004 6:51:14 PM)

First of all I assume that the mentioned scenarios (304, 305..) are not flawed and the mentioned units (Lee, mineplower) fall rather into the "what if" category, which is one of the features of the mega campaigns. However, if you want to change the units for any reason (yes...the Grant was available starting in 1942) you can do as you like.

AFAIK when using the "R-key" changing of units is initiated, the unit list for side 2 force never shows up and I don´t know about the reason. It´s already the same in v7.1 and probably earlier. For changing units, the list actually is not needed, as you might have found out yourself in the meantime. Just click any of the "to be changed to" units on the left hand side of the screen (select unit type) and you see a short flickering of the unit picture in the middle above, indicating that the force structure is altered with the new unit. Hit "exit" button to leave for the map/deploy screen, click the now vacant red outlined hex (or any other) and voila...the changed unit appears on the map! If you´re done with your edits in a particular scenario, then for each side 2 formation edited, hit the F2 button to make it player side 2 again. (watch for the small yellow P1 and P2 unit markers).



Major Destruction -> RE: Been trying to modify MC scenarios. (10/14/2004 6:22:14 AM)

Hi Harry,

I have no trouble editing the scenarios. They can be changed in exactly the same manner as any other scenario. If I go to "Purchase" I can buy more units, or delete a formation and purchase some new formation.
If I go to "Deploy" I can change a unit to another unit available in that year or edit the year and change a unit to any other unit in any other nation.
This works for the Player 1 units and the Player 2 units.

And yes, it is important to watch the P1, P2 labels and make sure they are correct. (Use F1, F2)

Unfortunately in scen304 there are FJ units, too early in April 1941. Italian para units would be more correct in a what-if scenario as they were in theatre at that time. I replaced the FJ units with regular infantry then played the scenario only to be faced with the intro text in which I am informed that FJ units are holding the line while my core fore arrives. [&:]

Oh well.[:)]



plloyd -> RE: Been trying to modify MC scenarios. (10/14/2004 5:55:13 PM)

I have learned, especially after some advice from Major Destruction, that I had paper wall problem when editing. That being since I could not see the list in the unit change window, I would not be able to affect the change. Obviously that is not the case. I have not tried the player switch idea yet, but I shall soon. Thank you Harry.

As to the point of what if, and what should be, what ifs come in various degrees. The MC starts on the premise of “What if the 2nd Armored was able to put up a better fight than it did?” and “What if there are are a lot more Matilda IIs available?”. What if is in all wargames, and is often required to make an interesting scenario. That said, I have problems with what ifs that ignore the historical context, or disregard prior conclusions.

All that said... There are some equipment issues that bug me a lot. The M3 Grant/Lee's are a problem in that they do not exist yet, even if they did, they would take two months to deliver. Matilda Is are a problem because they never went to Africa, the army was quite happy to abandon them at Dunkirk. Mineploughs simply did not work. There were 12 made, ten are in France, the War department canceled the order for the remaining 50.

I think the point I am trying to get to is that there are practical questions, which should become game possibilities, and the other/bigger/badder monster question which generally does not really belong in serious games. In DF I am only trying to update the scenarios and fix a few technical errors. Suggestions and help doing are certainly appreciated, because this will be a long road.



RockinHarry -> RE: Been trying to modify MC scenarios. (10/21/2004 4:31:25 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Major Destruction

Hi Harry,

I have no trouble editing the scenarios. They can be changed in exactly the same manner as any other scenario. If I go to "Purchase" I can buy more units, or delete a formation and purchase some new formation.
If I go to "Deploy" I can change a unit to another unit available in that year or edit the year and change a unit to any other unit in any other nation.
This works for the Player 1 units and the Player 2 units.

And yes, it is important to watch the P1, P2 labels and make sure they are correct. (Use F1, F2)

Unfortunately in scen304 there are FJ units, too early in April 1941. Italian para units would be more correct in a what-if scenario as they were in theatre at that time. I replaced the FJ units with regular infantry then played the scenario only to be faced with the intro text in which I am informed that FJ units are holding the line while my core fore arrives. [&:]

Oh well.[:)]


Stuart, I assumed he meant the issue shown in the screenshot below! However, as you say it does not affect changing or editing of units in any way. I also don´t see a problem making a "personalized" version of any mega cam, I even thought about making one myself! In example removing infantry smoke loads would make all of them more enjoyable for me.

Plloyd, you can more comfortably change unit and some game data in Freds WaWEditor!

[image]local://upfiles/2345/Pn370295697.jpg[/image]



plloyd -> RE: Been trying to modify MC scenarios. (10/22/2004 5:03:41 PM)

Yup, Harry, that is exactly what my problem was. While I am fairly well read, and have quite good and diverse sources of information, my experience in working on SP:W@W scenario editing is very limited. Thanks to you and, even more, Stuart, I seem to be getting on quite well now. At this point, I have modified a couple scenarios, which Stuart is critiquing. Mostly it is reviewing technical errors and making updates. If you would like to help, or review my notes, just let us know.



Anthony_MatrixForum -> RE: Been trying to modify MC scenarios. (2/7/2005 2:01:11 AM)

From memory, the core force for the MC sceanrios are NOT stored in the scenarios file.
(I think this applies to ordinary campaigns too )

AFAIK

If there are no aux units ......... then the unit list will show up as empty.

The players core force is stored in the XXX.cam file and is added in by the game engine.

Anthony



RockinHarry -> RE: Been trying to modify MC scenarios. (2/8/2005 1:50:54 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Anthony

From memory, the core force for the MC sceanrios are NOT stored in the scenarios file.
(I think this applies to ordinary campaigns too )

AFAIK

If there are no aux units ......... then the unit list will show up as empty.

The players core force is stored in the XXX.cam file and is added in by the game engine.

Anthony


as well as the core.dat file located in particular megacam folder. It can be opened and loaded into Freds WaW Editor. Not much you can do with this knowledge, beside messing the megacampaign! USE AT YOUR OWN RISK![;)]



plloyd -> RE: Been trying to modify MC scenarios. (2/8/2005 9:29:40 PM)

What I have found seems to be this: The core.dat file sets the unit type (armor, infantry or whatever), the unit ratings and leader names. The (MC name).dat file maps the scenario flow through the campaign. Individual unit types are set in the scenario file itself. I began to suspect that last point when I played a scenario by M4Jess, which happens sometime near the Crusader battles.

The scenario was a convoy raid. My tank company appeared as PzIIh's. Wow! Those upgrades finally came through! WRONG. The next scenario I was using PzIIIe's again.

Anyway betwixt the posts here, and the advice and patience of Major Destruction, I have gotten a fairly good idea of what I can, cannot, should and should not do. My progress through the scenarios is slow, but the results look good. Major Destruction has been critiquing my efforts, so I don't do to many stupid things. If any of you would like to consider taking a few scenarios, I would be happy to share the appropriate notes and thoughts. It looks to be a long term project.



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