RE: UBER WITP???? (Full Version)

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mogami -> RE: UBER WITP???? (7/24/2005 3:22:31 AM)

Hi, From the credits of WITP
2 Producers
3 design
3 programmers
12 research
3 artists
and 20 testers (many new ones since the credits)
The game required over 4 years before release.



Bodhi -> RE: UBER WITP???? (7/24/2005 3:40:01 AM)

At first glance sounds similar size to the group proposed here. Wonder if everyone that's interested is prepared for a very long development period of 4 years or more, assuming that the UBER team will be almost totally part-time.



jwilkerson -> RE: UBER WITP???? (7/24/2005 3:44:04 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Bodhi

Of course, that's how a project should be done. Probably another case of curiosity killing the cat, but I'm just wondering how the actual team involved in producing WitP compares with the team you'd like to assemble for Uber WitP.


quote:


ORIGINAL: Mogami

Hi, From the credits of WITP
2 Producers
3 design
3 programmers
12 research
3 artists
and 20 testers (many new ones since the credits)
The game required over 4 years before release.


So Mogami found the "body count" ... though the "process" used is probably as important as the body count and we can't infer that from the body count.

WITP project, I think also included UV project - with UV being "test bed" for WITP ( I think I heard this anyway ). Also UV allowed the project to have an intermediate deliverable - which I think is very important, in fact I don't think an "volunteer team" project ( or most projects for that matter ) should go more than 12 months without a major deliverable. But the "body counts" are similar ... if you combine "design and research" as I did. And my hope is that most "testing" can be automated - in fact my current development team ( IRL ) believes you first start by writing the testing specs and then the testing harness ... essentially "test first" .... not that this means no humans test of course they do .... but much testing can be automated. We run hundreds of hours of automated tests ( which would require 10s of 1000s of human hours ) on software before release.



Big B -> RE: UBER WITP???? (7/24/2005 6:48:23 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson



This project would be a dream come true for many. Alass, I have no programming experiance beyond Basic some twenty years ago...however you can always use help in concept work...I would be happy to weigh in there.

Question - if it's an entirely new engine we are talking about why do hexes at all? Seems a great many naval/air games got beyond that many years ago....



Iridium -> RE: UBER WITP???? (7/24/2005 7:50:41 PM)

I would love to contribute to anything needed, however I have no programming experience beyond a little Q-Basic. I could help in research, testing, and concept design. It would be a fun project, I believe.



2Stepper -> RE: UBER WITP???? (7/24/2005 7:58:36 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Bodhi

At first glance sounds similar size to the group proposed here. Wonder if everyone that's interested is prepared for a very long development period of 4 years or more, assuming that the UBER team will be almost totally part-time.


I think this point is "key" to the entire bit. I've mentioned before that I'd be only too happy to help develop a more detailed weather model... Yet, I'm active military now and I suspect while the concept of a finely tuned "war machine" (aka WiTP 2) would be sweet, it'd probably take 4-5yrs minimum to develp. Barring technology breakthroughs of course. [8D][:)]



jwilkerson -> RE: UBER WITP???? (7/24/2005 8:19:58 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: 2Stepper


quote:

ORIGINAL: Bodhi

At first glance sounds similar size to the group proposed here. Wonder if everyone that's interested is prepared for a very long development period of 4 years or more, assuming that the UBER team will be almost totally part-time.


I think this point is "key" to the entire bit. I've mentioned before that I'd be only too happy to help develop a more detailed weather model... Yet, I'm active military now and I suspect while the concept of a finely tuned "war machine" (aka WiTP 2) would be sweet, it'd probably take 4-5yrs minimum to develp. Barring technology breakthroughs of course. [8D][:)]


A few points. The original team doing WITP was probably also part time - i.e. not spending 40-100 hours per week per person working only on WITP ( i.e. all 43 persons in Mogami's ). And in my opinion 4-5 years development time is unacceptable. Technology breakthroughs offer some hope ... but process breakthroughs offer perhaps more hope. Building in Parallelism in design and development, automation of testing ( a.k.a. "AI" ) heavily focusing on design and design of testing up front. Clearly indentifying scope. And insisting on major deliverables every 12 months could significantly reduce development time. These things being said, this would be 2 years minimum project.



Cap Mandrake -> RE: UBER WITP???? (7/24/2005 9:20:38 PM)

OK...here is what I have so far with a 1km per hex, Company/Bn level modification. This is the Lunga/Guadalcanal area. I am still working on Siberia. Getting the Russian unit nomenclature right is a royal pain and I am having trouble with course of the Amur River (some variation between 1933 and 1956 maps). I am running ganged 16 x 3.4 Ghz processors with 1.2 Gig of RAM to improve scrolling.


BTW..I am looking for the TO&E of a 1941 Russian Inf Div horse-mobile med AT battery. Ideas?

[image]local://upfiles/7983/A2E798576BEB415FADFC2025C36F4F3A.jpg[/image]



doktorblood -> RE: UBER WITP???? (7/24/2005 9:35:57 PM)

Oh My!



witpqs -> RE: UBER WITP???? (7/24/2005 9:58:45 PM)

I have about the same length of IT management experience as jwilkerson mentioned. From reading what he has posted here: he knows what he is talking about. If an effort does get off the ground, listen to him!



bradfordkay -> RE: UBER WITP???? (7/25/2005 2:43:55 AM)

" I am running ganged 16 x 3.4 Ghz processors with 1.2 Gig of RAM to improve scrolling. "

Which shows that there isn't that much commercial viability in such a project. Most wargamers are struggling along with fairly basic systems.



irishman -> RE: UBER WITP???? (7/25/2005 4:41:21 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Cap Mandrake

OK...here is what I have so far with a 1km per hex, Company/Bn level modification. This is the Lunga/Guadalcanal area. I am still working on Siberia. Getting the Russian unit nomenclature right is a royal pain and I am having trouble with course of the Amur River (some variation between 1933 and 1956 maps). I am running ganged 16 x 3.4 Ghz processors with 1.2 Gig of RAM to improve scrolling.


BTW..I am looking for the TO&E of a 1941 Russian Inf Div horse-mobile med AT battery. Ideas?

[image]local://upfiles/7983/A2E798576BEB415FADFC2025C36F4F3A.jpg[/image]



Wow! This looks like the game that we we all want!
It has to be admitted that nobody wants to micromanage Iwo Jima in 1942
but the fine details of G'canal are the difference between winnning ad loosing!
I'm a college lecturer in C and C++ so count me in if you need help.



sanch -> RE: UBER WITP???? (7/25/2005 4:48:24 AM)

Ok, I'll toss in.

I have some 25 years programming experience, the majority in C/C++ and 2D/3D on Win32 and Linux/Unix/etc. Currently running a small group of people; my job is to work with product management to tell them what's feasable or necessary or ridiculous and so on, so they develop deliverable requirements. Then our group takes and implements those requirements.

So, I can be coder, or also possibly on the design team.



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