RE: When?

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Jagdtiger14 -> RE: When? (5/15/2009 1:13:35 PM)
Greywolf, I have to say that for the most part what you write is correct, but with some exceptions. I happen to be one of those on-line(however, seldom) WiF players you write about below. Currently I happen to be in 2 seperate WiF face to face groups here in south Florida and one of those games is with someone on the ADG WiF Rules Committee. I also have attended WiFcon in Michigan twice and Euro-WiFcon once. Concerning what you write...I want to emphasize the EiA experience issue. What I plan to do is allow one of my friends to purchase MWiF first since I know he is gung-ho about doing so...get his feedback, borrow the game from him for a week, and if we agree its ok, then I will buy it. There are others in our face to face gaming groups that would buy it as well, but will wait first because some of them had their fingers burned with EiA. Word of mouth is big! Also, I do not consider AI important since my main goal would be to play head to head against humans(there is no AI that can be as fun as playing against a human opponent, and at least with our current technology no AI worth playing since it can be figured out in a matter of a few games you play against it...in which case it loses its appeal. The only "good" AI in games out there are ones that cheat to be challenging(ie...like in MWiF if rolling on average well above 11 on 2d10 land attacks, and below 5 on naval searches...the "hard" button as it were...which becomes un-fun in a hurry)). The points I disagree with you about are: I am not turned back by the changes in MWiF...in fact they intrigue me...the maps are awesome, divisions, our WiF groups here never liked POLIF other than for the units, we hate to use houserules anyway, and more than anything WiF is such a huge game that from time to time you find something new in the rules that you are playing incorrectly(even when playing with someone on the Rules Committee)...as well, some of us see playing MWiF alleviating mistakes that anyone can make in their builds, forgetting to move a unit, etc... I think that if MWiF turns out to be fantastic and gets rave reviews from the various WiF boards, you would probably go out and spend the $60+. However, the $500 price Marklv suggested is ridiculas. One other thing that could drive sales and keep everyone's hard core attention on this product for a long while would be for Matrix and ADG to hold MWiF tournaments(maybe with prizes) and to have a MWiF rating scale much like Avalon Hill did for its games. C quote: ORIGINAL: Greywolf I think the game could impact the computer wargaming community, some of them not being WiF player. The game wont appeal at all to the vast majority of the other gamers : it is dry 2D graphics (even Paradox had to go 3D with Europa Universalis, to my great dismay by the may and alienating quite some fan base), turn-by-turn, long and need to understand nearly 80 pages of rules, even if the computer manage some of them. Let it be clear: its rating on many general newsgaming papers and site will be abysmall (splg?) regardless of the game real quality. That is the way all complexe strategical game with no 3D and real time action go. For them Strategy mean RTS, even if a RTS is not really a Strategy game but a Logistic and Tactics game as we all know. The other trouble is that the previous release of a Matrix game adaptation of a ADG boardgame was very very poorly received, commented and bashed. I know quite a lot of players with burned fingers syndroma about EiA that wont jump on MWiF on fear it suffer from the same bugs and poor AI problems. And no amount of fixing of EiA after release can cure that. As other comments there is a community of online WiF players using cyberboard, Vassal and Zuntzu, and Wiffedit and other PBEM or NETPLAY game support. Thoses players will be interested with MWiF but wont be motivated to pay a lot for something that just do a bit more than their regular programs do and change quite some things too. Thoses people wont care about the AI as they want to play PBEM or NETPLAY only. They could be turned back by the changes MWiF introduce : new map, infinite division, no POLIF, no house-rules because that is the computer that set the rules so you can just adjust the option set but not the way you usually tweak the options, a graphical choice that is nice but not necessarily better than the original nor better looking than the high quality scan of some cyberbox. Thoses guys want a computer to play regular WiF on or with, not something different, and the closest it feel and look to real WiF the better. All considered I think a release price in the WiTP range is what to be expected, but it wont sold a lot of units. Cutting the price down to 49$ would sold a bit more but not that much. MWiF is already a niche project. I think they have quite a clear idea of the number they will sold. If it is sold above 60$ I think I will probably pass on and wait for it to hit to sold-out or second hand bin. There is too many thing you can do or buy nowadays and a lot of high quality games for a lot cheaper than that. MWiF will appeal to the hard-core wargamers but it is not the only that will appeal to them and we are in a time of choice.

micheljq -> RE: When? (5/15/2009 1:59:36 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Greywolf I think the game could impact the computer wargaming community, some of them not being WiF player. The game wont appeal at all to the vast majority of the other gamers : it is dry 2D graphics (even Paradox had to go 3D with Europa Universalis, to my great dismay by the may and alienating quite some fan base), turn-by-turn, long and need to understand nearly 80 pages of rules, even if the computer manage some of them. As other comments there is a community of online WiF players using cyberboard, Vassal and Zuntzu, and Wiffedit and other PBEM or NETPLAY game support. I don't agree with you, I know many players who are interested in MWiF and are not interested at all by 3D remakes of games like Europa Universalis (3D remakes are often boring, it's not new). MWiF hits a segment where we want strategy and are not impressed by 3D graphics anymore, as for myself I play 3D games like WoW, Company of Heroes, but it's been years, decaces, since I saw a really interesting game on WW2 at the strategic level, and I am really looking forward for MWiF. I just hope either it will have a good AI or being playable via Netplay. And I don't give a darn about 3D graphics in a game at a strategic level. They don't have their place, they are more a nuisance then anything. 3D graphics belong to another genre. The players who play Vassal, ZunTzu and the like are hardcore players you can bet a lot of them will buy MWiF, because they just can't get enough of WiF.

bo -> RE: When? (5/15/2009 3:53:20 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HansHafen Even at $200.00 US Dollars, the price per hour of entertainment will be miniscule! [:)] Are you people out of your mind with these prices, not just you HansHafen, there are others above with some wild guessing. Please dont give Matrix any ideas about pricing, I can see you gentlemen are not married or you would not be talking this gibberish [crap] about pricing. The last game my wife let me buy was MVP 2005 [yes I am a wimp] it cost $30 and she pi--ed and moaned for two months, so please you single moguls with all that money to spend SHUT UP! Please! Willy

macgregor -> RE: When? (5/15/2009 3:54:34 PM)
Everybody who posts in this forum has an agenda, myself included. However my agenda is to play a game called WiF only for the computer. As I remember it, it was a game where usually 3-6 players sat around a big global representation of WW2. The forum at any rate hes been taken over by people who want to play something different; solo(solo?- could do that with the board) or against an AI; who someone told me with 50 pages of rules would take 10 years minimal to code -and I still believe him. It'll move a lot faster as a pbem game, only that's some other new game. As I feared, then later accepted, there have been years of work done to make this a game that'll make all these non-wif players happy. If I've ever known a true WiF player, it would be Steve. Though I'm sure somewhere even he has an agenda. My only regret is that I will only get my game after everyone else gets theirs. As long as there's a way to actually play WiF included in this monstrosity, I should be happy. WiF for me is a social game. It's what brings the gang together, not unlike Bridge, Poker, or Golf. I lost that gang when I moved. I miss WiF, but I miss the gang too. Well there you have it; that's my agenda.

composer99 -> RE: When? (5/15/2009 4:21:47 PM)
Willy, I'm pretty certain Matrix will come up with a reasonable price structure for MWiF. After all, while both games have substantial development costs, unlike tabletop WiF where printing all the maps, counters, &c is expensive, cutting new disks for MWiF is a trivial expense. There's other games MWiF has to compete with to sell (even other strategic/operational-level WW2 games sold by Matrix!) so it can't be non-competitively priced. Nevertheless, you may wish to avoid being too harsh on enthusiasts like HansHafen. While $200 is much too high indeed, there will be a necessarily limited print run (how many units can be expected to sell?) and Matrix has to pay Steve somehow (to say nothing of turning a profit). What that will end up costing us? Who knows?

Obsolete -> RE: When? (5/15/2009 4:23:16 PM)
I have been waiting for this one for quite a while too. In fact, I check the forums regularly every evening now. And then, to top it all off, I had time to burn last night so I threw up one of the counters and did a little sprite coding. Next thing that happened, I compiled it natively to Xbox, and then finished some basic controller input with movement animation. Now... please hurry up and finish this package, before I do something really stupid and get into trouble for copyright violation or god knows what... [image]http://img38.picoodle.com/img/img38/2/5/15/obsolete/f_wifm_cb9d588.gif[/image]

bo -> RE: When? (5/15/2009 5:19:40 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: composer99 Willy, I'm pretty certain Matrix will come up with a reasonable price structure for MWiF. After all, while both games have substantial development costs, unlike tabletop WiF where printing all the maps, counters, &c is expensive, cutting new disks for MWiF is a trivial expense. There's other games MWiF has to compete with to sell (even other strategic/operational-level WW2 games sold by Matrix!) so it can't be non-competitively priced. Nevertheless, you may wish to avoid being too harsh on enthusiasts like HansHafen. While $200 is much too high indeed, there will be a necessarily limited print run (how many units can be expected to sell?) and Matrix has to pay Steve somehow (to say nothing of turning a profit). What that will end up costing us? Who knows? Composer I did say please, dont give Matrix any ideas[:D], and Steve lives in a little grass shack in Haliewa by the ocean, minor electrical bills so he can run his computer [with 6 monitors] no heating bills, his wife and he eat fish they catch every day, no property taxes on grass huts etc, they dont have to pay him that much, maybe give him a free edition of MWIF so he can play after he gets done surfing all day [tough life!] I think the most I ever payed for a game was WIP, I fell asleep one day waiting for the computer to finish its moves and I never played it again, hope this game is not like that, whew! Willy

Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: When? (5/15/2009 5:21:47 PM)
Pricing will be decided by Matrix Games and they understand this market as well as anyone. From MBA school (and just common sense) I know that there is a price point that optimizes revenue. Price too high, and fewer people buy, with decreased total sales dollars. Price too low, and though a lot of people buy, you receive less total sales dollars. Pricing a product is always a guessing game and there will always be people who bought who would have paid more, and others who didn't buy, but would have purchased if the price had been less. For me, this is an important item (much more so than for any of you), since my contract says I get paid a percentage of total sales. And I am perfectly content letting Dave and Erik decide because their objective is exactly the same as mine. I have a ton of other things to occupy my mind.

Jaimainsoyyo -> RE: When? (5/15/2009 10:29:02 PM)
Steve in my humble opinion you are going to be a wealthy programmer soon [8D] ( well it depends on your percentage[:D][:D][:D] ) Good work

SamuraiProgrmmr -> RE: When? (5/16/2009 12:55:21 AM)
I was in the store the other day and saw some yo-yos. I asked myself, "I wonder if yo-yos are about to make a comeback?" Every 15 years or so, yo-yos make a comeback and are popular with kids again. Can traditional wargames make a comeback? On the one hand, we have video games clamoring for attention and that could keep people from taking up a new hobby. On the other hand, the games youth play are more complicated and involved than the games I played as a youth. Think about the differences between Pokemon, Magic: The Gathering, Yugioh and Sorry!, Monopoly, and Clue. I think that there is a distinct difference between the games that satisfied us (who are now in our 40s) and those who are still in their teens. What we need is a GREAT turn based wargame to bring them over to the 'dark side' --- Bwahahahahahah This could be the one. Signed the Eternal Optimist

theDestroyer00 -> RE: When? (5/16/2009 2:43:58 AM)
Well long time reader first time poster! I have been trying to keep informed of when this game will come out and it does seem very close now. Making it into a computer game will be great for use of use (floor space, PBEM, Online and administration wise). But I wanted to know is there any other game with so much interest as this. Even before Matrix got hold of it so many people were interested in it becoming a computer game, more than 10 years ago I think. And it is the best strategic world war 2 game by a long way.

Obsolete -> RE: When? (5/16/2009 5:59:46 AM)
Every 15 years or so, yo-yos make a comeback and are popular with kids again. Well I don't know, didn't the Poker Craze take a little more than 15 years for its comeback? :P I still can't get over that whole MMORPOG craze. Back before the internet we used to have them all over the BBS community, they were interesting but most computer owns would prefer other games. Then sometime around 2000 people began to re-discover them for the first time after they had been dead for plenty of years, and the next thing you know... computer games were all about MMORPOGs and that was supposed to be the only future in computer gaminging... buwahahah. I never thought I'd see the day where people plunk down a hefty price for a game, knowing in advance that they'd have to pay a monty fee ontop of this just to be allowed to use it. And considering the graphics were always quite poor and so was the boring gameplay in my opinion... well lets just say people never fail to surprise me. And in other news, people keep rediscovering The Beatles end on end...

marcuswatney -> RE: When? (5/17/2009 12:15:23 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bo The last game my wife let me buy was MVP 2005 [yes I am a wimp] it cost $30 and she pi--ed and moaned for two months, Willy Next time your wife buys herself a new dress, you make sure she limits herself to $30. If she doesn't, give back to her a little of what she gave you. She'll get the message.

Taxman66 -> RE: When? (5/17/2009 2:39:41 PM)
Has MWIF (or will it be) tested on Windows 7 (obviously only the beta now)?

Anendrue -> RE: When? (5/17/2009 2:43:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: I can see you gentlemen are not married or you would not be talking this gibberish [crap] about pricing. The last game my wife let me buy was MVP 2005 [yes I am a wimp] it cost $30 and she pi--ed and moaned for two months, so please you single moguls with all that money to spend SHUT UP! Please! Willy I am happily married and have been for a long time. My wife and I discuss major purchases but if we whined about a $30 dollar purchase once every four or five years, that would be very sad indeed. The game WiF is expensive. However, compare it to someone who smokes, drinks, hunts, fishes, or almost any hobby for that matter and you will find the cost per hour of entertainment is exceptionally cheap. Even when you include the cost of your PC and internet connection. I wish you and your spouse the best and hope your situation will improve so that a $30 purchase is not so agonizing for the two of you. As for the game cost I would venture a guess that any person who plays WiF would easily pay $100 to $375 but that would severly dampen Matrix Games market share. So in the end I'll make a guess of a release price in the $60 to $75 range.

macgregor -> RE: When? (5/17/2009 3:56:13 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: jaimain Steve in my humble opinion you are going to be a wealthy programmer soon [8D] ( well it depends on your percentage[:D][:D][:D] ) Good work Notwithstanding my lack of knowledge on how that will occur, I certainly hope he does. I hope with all his fame and fortune he doesn't forget the little people. I mean, if he's golfing at Diamond Head, he's going to hopefully hurry home by noon(or not long after-how far is that drive?). With a 6 hour time difference, his old mates on the east coast may be burning some serious late nights to hang in there. After which he can take the wife out for 5-star dinners. I'm thinking he's already worked it out...at any rate, I hope so. The bottom line is...we can't afford to have him go back to working days. At least not full-time.

Joseignacio -> RE: When? (5/18/2009 10:47:49 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Greywolf I think the game could impact the computer wargaming community, some of them not being WiF player. The game wont appeal at all to the vast majority of the other gamers : it is dry 2D graphics (even Paradox had to go 3D with Europa Universalis, to my great dismay by the may and alienating quite some fan base), turn-by-turn, long and need to understand nearly 80 pages of rules, even if the computer manage some of them. To be true, Paradox has received a lot of bad critics on this. First because the easy part of creating a game is to include nice graphics but the hard one is to improve AI. Paradox has not solved the problems with the AI and tries to compensate with graphics. This has been received by the Community with divided opinions. But furthermore, even for the graphics fans, the graphics for EU3 have been so poorly designed that many of the people who supported this evolution have said they prefer good 2D graphics than bad 3D. Not to speak of having to buy a new computer or at least a new graphic card and RAM memory with every new game, just for that. quote: Let it be clear: its rating on many general newsgaming papers and site will be abysmall (splg?) regardless of the game real quality. That is the way all complexe strategical game with no 3D and real time action go. For them Strategy mean RTS, even if a RTS is not really a Strategy game but a Logistic and Tactics game as we all know. Maybe. Anyway, Matrix is behind the project and it means it has a credit originally. Anyway, I believe that, unlike other videogame players, the strategy gamers rely more on opinions of fellow players than in magazines' punctuation. I have seen really mediocre games, that include frequent CTDs, horrible AI, bad graphics, ..., be given a 9 out of 10 points, and so have the rest of players, so everyday more we only believe in reviews, and if possible, of people we know. quote: ... As other comments there is a community of online WiF players using cyberboard, Vassal and Zuntzu, and Wiffedit and other PBEM or NETPLAY game support. Thoses players will be interested with MWiF but wont be motivated to pay a lot for something that just do a bit more than their regular programs do and change quite some things too. Thoses people wont care about the AI as they want to play PBEM or NETPLAY only. They could be turned back by the changes MWiF introduce : new map, infinite division, no POLIF, no house-rules because that is the computer that set the rules so you can just adjust the option set but not the way you usually tweak the options, a graphical choice that is nice but not necessarily better than the original nor better looking than the high quality scan of some cyberbox. Thoses guys want a computer to play regular WiF on or with, not something different, and the closest it feel and look to real WiF the better. I have played at Vassal and I think at cyberboard, but never WiF.I think WiF is too complex for this tool. Anyway, correct me if I am wrong, but maybe calling minuscule to this community is greatly overestimating it.

PDiFolco -> RE: When? (5/18/2009 9:05:14 PM)
I'm amazed noone suggested to sell a "basic game" for 30$, then a sh*tload of "expansions" 20$ each... That's what is priced the boardgame, but if you tuck 10 boxes-equivalent into one proggie you can't squeeze as much cash.. I'm playing devil advocate, granted [:D]!

Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: When? (5/18/2009 9:42:20 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PDiFolco I'm amazed noone suggested to sell a "basic game" for 30$, then a sh*tload of "expansions" 20$ each... That's what is priced the boardgame, but if you tuck 10 boxes-equivalent into one proggie you can't squeeze as much cash.. I'm playing devil advocate, granted [:D]! The decision to not do that was made by Matrix Games way back before I joined the project. I had asked them about this then.

Snydly -> RE: When? (5/19/2009 2:09:46 AM)
Keep up the good work Shannon ... I will be first in line to buy this game. For the past 4 years I have been lurking as a guest every month, I can't wait to play many games simultaneously to work the mind to ever greater possibilities ... only to roll snake eyes and have your whole offensive grind hopelessly to a halt for a turn. [:D]

fiskog -> RE: When? (5/19/2009 3:32:17 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets quote: ORIGINAL: PDiFolco I'm amazed noone suggested to sell a "basic game" for 30$, then a shtload of "expansions" 20$ each... That's what is priced the boardgame, but if you tuck 10 boxes-equivalent into one proggie you can't squeeze as much cash.. I'm playing devil advocate, granted [:D]! quote:* The decision to not do that was made by Matrix Games way back before I joined the project. I had asked them about this then. That was a great decision. Imagine trying to test the game with 11,783 combinations of options in play. Gak!

Obsolete -> RE: When? (5/19/2009 9:34:29 AM)
Still desperately waiting for this release. But if purchaser's have to be beta-testers, then I'd rather wait a bit longer.

Greywolf -> RE: When? (5/19/2009 9:39:03 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Joseignacio quote: ORIGINAL: Greywolf I think the game could impact the computer wargaming community, some of them not being WiF player. The game wont appeal at all to the vast majority of the other gamers : it is dry 2D graphics (even Paradox had to go 3D with Europa Universalis, to my great dismay by the may and alienating quite some fan base), turn-by-turn, long and need to understand nearly 80 pages of rules, even if the computer manage some of them. To be true, Paradox has received a lot of bad critics on this. First because the easy part of creating a game is to include nice graphics but the hard one is to improve AI. Paradox has not solved the problems with the AI and tries to compensate with graphics. This has been received by the Community with divided opinions. But furthermore, even for the graphics fans, the graphics for EU3 have been so poorly designed that many of the people who supported this evolution have said they prefer good 2D graphics than bad 3D. Not to speak of having to buy a new computer or at least a new graphic card and RAM memory with every new game, just for that. quote: Let it be clear: its rating on many general newsgaming papers and site will be abysmall (splg?) regardless of the game real quality. That is the way all complexe strategical game with no 3D and real time action go. For them Strategy mean RTS, even if a RTS is not really a Strategy game but a Logistic and Tactics game as we all know. Maybe. Anyway, Matrix is behind the project and it means it has a credit originally. Anyway, I believe that, unlike other videogame players, the strategy gamers rely more on opinions of fellow players than in magazines' punctuation. I have seen really mediocre games, that include frequent CTDs, horrible AI, bad graphics, ..., be given a 9 out of 10 points, and so have the rest of players, so everyday more we only believe in reviews, and if possible, of people we know. Let it be clear, what I am reporting is not what I feel. I didn't like 3D on real strategy games (especially EU3). But what I said is what I think will be the comments in the majority of gaming magazine and site, not in the wargaming specialised ones (not that they are all the numerous but they are the one that count). For non-wargamer or casual wargamer to be attracted to a game like MWiF you need a real good buzz that you simply wont get. A lot of the journalist wont try the game at all, a lot of the game reporter just wont understand it because they lack the background to do so. That's the reason why I think the mass wont be appealed to the game at all. If you say a WWII strategic games they expect a Blitzkrieg, Company of Heroes or Sudden Strike game. Some will buy, get disappointed and bring bad opinion on the game. The game will sell well to computer wargamer, and will attract some to WiF that were scared at the sheer size of the game. But dont expect it to snowball the community and replace RTS. The only wargames that achieve some great public notoriety are the Panzer General/Operation Panzer and Steel Panthers ones, and they were perceived as having good graphics at this time and not so many opponent. My guess is that MWiF will sold decently, hopefully as well as WiTP, but dont expect it to become a blockbuster or even be avaliable at every retailer.

Joseignacio -> RE: When? (5/19/2009 10:02:37 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Obsolete Still desperately waiting for this release. But if purchaser's have to be beta-testers, then I'd rather wait a bit longer. I fullheartedly subscribe your words.[sm=Cool-049.gif]

Joseignacio -> RE: When? (5/19/2009 10:10:23 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Greywolf Let it be clear, what I am reporting is not what I feel. I didn't like 3D on real strategy games (especially EU3). But what I said is what I think will be the comments in the majority of gaming magazine and site, not in the wargaming specialised ones (not that they are all the numerous but they are the one that count). For non-wargamer or casual wargamer to be attracted to a game like MWiF you need a real good buzz that you simply wont get. A lot of the journalist wont try the game at all, a lot of the game reporter just wont understand it because they lack the background to do so. That's the reason why I think the mass wont be appealed to the game at all. If you say a WWII strategic games they expect a Blitzkrieg, Company of Heroes or Sudden Strike game. Some will buy, get disappointed and bring bad opinion on the game. The game will sell well to computer wargamer, and will attract some to WiF that were scared at the sheer size of the game. But dont expect it to snowball the community and replace RTS. The only wargames that achieve some great public notoriety are the Panzer General/Operation Panzer and Steel Panthers ones, and they were perceived as having good graphics at this time and not so many opponent. My guess is that MWiF will sold decently, hopefully as well as WiTP, but dont expect it to become a blockbuster or even be avaliable at every retailer. I mostly agree with you, but I will explain what I said between lines before. I think all the distributors have influence (so to say) in the magazines, websites, etc., so I don't think the game will get bad reviews. However, most of us will probably see that other games, easier to make, get more credit, and think it's not fair. Likes (and dislikes) are like the ass, everybody has his, [:D] but i think this game will not reach the public like Blitzkrieg, Company of Heroes or Sudden Strike, however it could reach levels comparable to EU3 (or even more, considering the coverage of Matrix), which can be an intermediate achievement for a strategy game but is a great result for a wargamers niche board game taken to computer.

Greywolf -> RE: When? (5/19/2009 12:42:44 PM)
Hum, good call on reaching a EU3 success. I think we could logically compare it to the number of Hearts of Iron as they are somewhat similar products, except that HOI is real time pausable turn by turn and MWiF is set turn by turn. The trick is how much is MWiF is covered in the news compared to HOI3 ? A bit of goggling show a Gamespot annoncement for MWiF posted in 2003, same for other gamesites. Hearts of Iron III got recent reviews and even video on gameplay and such on dailymotion and you-tube. I think the 2 product are due to be sold at the same time. Perhaps it is time for Matrixgames to send another message about the game progress and release so they could build a bit of expection elsewhere than in this forum or BGG or the World In Flames Annual. I am sure the Beta-tester have plenty of material to post...

Folgore! -> RE: When? (5/20/2009 6:34:02 PM)
As an old WIF players ( tho boardgame) i'm waiting since long time for MWIF. Like many other friends I know, we cant believe that we are near to see the issue of our unbelieved and favorite WW2 game. Almost all wargamers in Italy have played WIF in the 90's. I'm sure it will have a great success. But mi question is: how much time we must still wait ti buy MWIF? Greywolf have reason. Matrix should send a clear message. WIF is well know also out of the community of the PCgamers.

Anendrue -> RE: When? (5/20/2009 7:23:57 PM)
It is scheduled for release on the 27th of July, 2009. So you gotta wait 68 more days.

HansHafen -> RE: When? (5/21/2009 6:10:40 AM)
Don't tell her how much it cost. Just say you forgot or mumble something unintelligible.

werwolf -> RE: When? (5/21/2009 7:12:49 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HansHafen Don't tell her how much it cost. Just say you forgot or mumble something unintelligible. DAY-DREAMER

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