RE: OT: Saving Private Ryan (Full Version)

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m10bob -> RE: OT: Saving Private Ryan (11/2/2005 4:25:43 AM)

Some of you guys my age (who have also seen this film) have already beat me up about this, but I really liked that Japanese movie released in the 80's called "ZERO"..It had a lot of really nice model planes flying around, with some life size replicas that would make Hollywood envious.
The Movie closely followed events from Saburo Sakai's book "Samurai" (intentional or otherwise).
The planes in the film include different Zeroes, P'38's, P 39's, P 40's, Wildcats, Corsairs, Betty's, Hellcats, etc..Perfect genre for WITP..
Like the film "PH", it included the gratuitis "love interest" segment, (not needed in a war flick,) but get past that and it's a great popcorn movie.[8D]




denisonh -> RE: OT: Saving Private Ryan (11/2/2005 4:31:29 AM)

Just trying to make heads or tails of some of your comments, or should I say insinuations?


quote:

ORIGINAL: Gary Childress

quote:

ORIGINAL: denisonh

It is a hard decision, to try to be funny or be a horse's a$$.[:D] Go for both, why not.

Maybe you can translate you post for a slow foot like myself (Mr Pocketbook, 1000 year reich)

[\quote]

At ease soldier. I'm just joking around. Or am I the one who should be standing at your attention? Remember I'm a civilian. [sm=00000924.gif]





GaryChildress -> RE: OT: Saving Private Ryan (11/2/2005 4:47:55 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: denisonh

Just trying to make heads or tails of some of your comments, or should I say insinuations?



Is that really what you were trying to do? In what sort of way were you trying to make "heads or tails" of them? And no I don't think we are Nazi Germany. Please forgive my hyperbole.




Yamato hugger -> RE: OT: Saving Private Ryan (11/2/2005 5:06:20 AM)

Is there a ransom demand for this thread hi-jacking?

[sm=sterb029.gif] (<- only because no one has used it yet [:D])




witpqs -> RE: OT: Saving Private Ryan (11/2/2005 6:05:36 AM)

A lesser known war movie that is quite good is The Cruel Sea.




Micah Goodman -> RE: OT: Saving Private Ryan (11/2/2005 6:13:49 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: RevRick

I don't know, guys. I'm a little older, and my Dad served in the So Pac in the Corps. I've known a lot of parishioners who are now talking, very quietly about their experiences, including a number in the ETO. A lot of them talk about the things in Private Ryan being all too real - including shooting prisoners, on both sides. And one thing that those who had seen the movie also said was that the opening scenes were almost realistic enough to take them back - but you have to multiply it over 9 km or so.



I am currently reading a book about combat veterans of World War 2. One of the things that the author did mention is the fact that if POW’s survived their initial capture their chances of survival were pretty good on both sides in the ETO at least. A church that I attended as a kid in California had a pastor that was a B-24 pilot in WW II. He got shot down over Romania and was captured by some very angry Germans who lined him up against a wall. He said eight guys pulled the trigger four times and not one round fired. He decided right there and then that the big guy had a plan for his life and swore that if he survived the war he would devote his life to God. My Grandfather who was a Korean and Vietnam War vet often spoke with him about his war experiences some of which I found out later haunt him to this day.

He said something very profound to me after I graduated basic, ‘It doesn’t do you any good surviving a war if what you did to survive kills your soul.” I took me a while to understand what he meant and thankfully I never fired a shot in anger while I was in the Army so I never had to cross that bridge.

On a lighter note another book I read was about a member of the 101st Airborne during D-Day. A group of about thirty paratroopers attacked a fortified position held by a company of German soldiers. The Germans broke and fled because they were convinced that they were under attack by a force that outnumbered them. So the final battle scene in SPR is not completely out of the bounds of possibility.

My favorite war movies, 12 O’clock High, Das Boot, Band of Brothers, All Quiet on the Western Front, We Were Soldiers, Black Hawk Down, When Trumpets Fade, and The Longest Day.

I hated, The Thin Red Line, Platoon, Patton, and Sands of Iwo Jima.





GaryChildress -> RE: OT: Saving Private Ryan (11/2/2005 6:52:40 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Yamato hugger

Is there a ransom demand for this thread hi-jacking?

[sm=sterb029.gif] (<- only because no one has used it yet [:D])


Hi Yamato hugger, only that greater understanding of the world be revealed. And even then I may still keep the hostage. [:)]




Speedysteve -> RE: OT: Saving Private Ryan (11/2/2005 9:47:54 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Damn, 27 flying Spits... Wonder if there's more than 10 flying in the entire world today?


There sure are Mr T.

A couple of years ago when I went to the 'Flying Legends' at Duxford there were 13 Spits in the air at the sametime. Was a truly fantastic sight and sound it was [8D]




Terminus -> RE: OT: Saving Private Ryan (11/2/2005 9:56:25 AM)

I'll bet... Have to find some time to go visit Duxford, methinks...




Speedysteve -> RE: OT: Saving Private Ryan (11/2/2005 12:46:24 PM)

Yes you should. A couple of great museums there and also hangars you can go wandering around in. Whilst in there you may see some guys restoring an engine or plane or two.

Of course if you wait until next Julyish time there will be the Great Warbirds day and a load of flying WW2 aswell [8D]




mogami -> All time worst War Movie (11/2/2005 2:31:23 PM)

Hi, I never see it mentioned on these forums. This is the WITP forum so unless you've seen this turd you can't post about bad war movies.
A friend of mine saw this at a video store and thought it might be good.
We laughed so hard we hurt ourselves.

Zero (1984)
(Review from Stomp Tokyo )
It must be high tech -- It's shiny!
From the creators of Godzilla comes this epic that attempts to tell the entire history of Japan's participation in World War II from the perspective of an airplane. Not a single airplane, but rather a type of airplane. That airplane is the Japanese Zero fighter, which was a technological marvel when it first entered combat. Apparently this was a great surprise to the Americans in the film, one of whom declares, "[Japan] can't make what we would call a good car!"

In case you haven't guessed from that last line, this film is dubbed, and badly. The dubbing was done with same voice actors as those in Last Days of Planet Earth, and whoever wrote the English language script was going for laughs.

The main characters in Zero are Hamada and Mitsushima, two recruits in the Imperial Navy. Scared and disgusted at their treatment by the Navy, they plan on going AWOL until they are stopped by an officer, who realizes what they are about to do and then shows them the prototype Zero fighter. With tears practically streaming from their eyes, their hearts swell with national pride. The two men decide to continue with their training in order to have a chance to fly such a plane. This just goes to prove that men will do anything to have the latest cutting-edge toys.


"We are filled with shame because
our uniforms aren't as silly
as the British ones."
Our heroes are are sent through a training regimen that looks designed to compete with the British in terms of sheer military goofiness (see Zulu Dawn). Crotch jumping and the weird two-person somersaults that the recruits are made to do should be Olympic sports, if you ask us. After the training is done, Hamada becomes a pilot and Mitsushima becomes a mechanic, thus giving us many heart-warming scenes in which grease monkey Mistushima waves his floppy little hat in circles while Hamada bravely risks his life flying around in a tin can. Who got the better deal? We suspect that Hamada and Mitsushima would give you an answer that is very different from ours.

There is an early scene that gives you some idea of the melodramatic territory that this film will cover. The captain of Hamada's squad dies during a test flight in a production Zero, which shimmies itself to pieces when flown at top speed. It turns out that the Zero's designers didn't bother to wind tunnel-test some modifications they made to the plane. So that's where Microsoft got their ideas about beta testing in the field! One of the engineering types defends the policy by saying, "We know there are defects, but we must fly. We can't wait till it's perfect."


It goes from zero to sixty in...
well, never, because it's always a Zero!
Speaking of the planes, Zero contains lots of dog-fighting scenes, and the vast majority of them are accomplished through miniature effects. Those effects were realized by Koichi Kawakita, who would go on to do all the special effects for the Godzilla films from Godzilla vs. Biollante through Godzilla vs Destroyah. In general, the miniature effects are quite good, and they are blended with stock footage quite well. It was nice to see the planes actually flying around and shooting each other down, as opposed to the "fly towards Godzilla, now burn burn burn!" action we're used to.

Hamada soon becomes an ace, and Mitsushima is sent back to Japan to learn advanced mechanics. Once back on the mainland, Mitsushima meets Shizuko, a cute young woman whose bicycle has broken down. Mitsushima fixes her bike, and she offers him some eggs because she "has no other way to thank" him. He's been in the Imperial Navy for the last two years; we bet he can think of other ways she can thank him. After their little exchange of kindnesses, the two become friends and eventually fall in love.


No fertility symbolism here.
Shizuko is a welcome addition to the movie, because her dubbed dialogue is so hilarious. During one example, she announces that being a woman during a war is frustrating because "We never get to test our protection first hand!" No really, she's talking about airplanes. Shizuko is this film's answer to Dr. Hibbert from The Simpsons, because she giggles at the most inappropiate times:

"I never thought we'd meet again -- the war kills everybody [giggle]!"

and:

"How can I [get married], when all the young men are being sent to die? I can't find a bridegroom [giggle]!"

Although the film shows some early promise, it drags on for about forty minutes too long as Japan slowly, agonizingly loses the war, covering nearly every defeat the Japanese suffered. (The use of the atomic bomb by the U.S. forces was strangely omitted.) We see Midway, and Hamada is part of the escort that was with Yamamoto when he was shot down. If this movie is to believed, Yamamato's escort was led by a captain who's name sounds like "More Sake." Who were his wingmen? Jose Cuervo and Jack Daniels?

Because the American planes eventually overtake the dated technology of the Zero, Japanese pilots begin to die and become injured at a prodigious rate. After nearly dying in combat,* Hamada's only thoughts are of returning to the cockpit of his Zero. ("I kill Americans! That's all I know how to do!") Mitsushima, realizing that Hamada has lost his will to live, tries to "give" Shizuko to Hamada, theorizing that Hamada will have something to live for if a girl shows interest in him. Neither party is stupid enough to fall for it, however, and Shizuko's affections remain with Mitsushima.


No fertility symbolism here either.
The remainder of the film is filled with rather maudlin ruminations on the nature of war, the deaths of various cast members, and the wanton destruction of a Zero by the defeated, mourning ground crew. We think this last bit was supposed to be a tribute to the nobility of a plane with a skin so insubstantial that it might as well have been aluminum foil, but we're not really sure. There was an awful lot of screaming and crying going on.

Films made by the Japanese can be hard to figure out, especially when they concern such topics as the war in which they were so soundly defeated that it fundamentally changed their culture and their relations with the rest of the world. Zero tells that story from the perspective of its characters, but we're not sure what message the moviemakers were trying to project. Japan deserved to lose the war because it built planes that didn't protect its pilots? (If so, then why the tearful tribute to the Zero at the movie's end?) War is bad because young Japanese girls have to stay at home to build airplanes and can't go kill Americans? Don't become a pilot?

If this movie had been a lot shorter, and a little less melodramatic, we probably could suggest it. But so much of this film is silly, and it goes on for so long, that our enjoyment dwindled to... well, Zero.




Speedysteve -> RE: All time worst War Movie (11/2/2005 2:39:02 PM)

Hi Mog,

You stuck with it and watched the whole thing? [X(]

Suppose I did the same with a mate watching Pearl Harbour.......

Steven




Terminus -> RE: All time worst War Movie (11/2/2005 2:54:37 PM)

Sounds like it was worth it, just for poops and giggles...




mogami -> RE: All time worst War Movie (11/2/2005 3:02:47 PM)

Hi, From "Zero" 1984 (Actually it is Brady last week at airshow)

[image]local://upfiles/944/AC1877E897234CC5AE1D0C60A787CF25.jpg[/image]




LargeSlowTarget -> RE: All time worst War Movie (11/2/2005 3:23:19 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mogami
He's been in the Imperial Navy for the last two years; we bet he can think of other ways she can thank him.


LOL, he probably like to show her his 'Long lance' and its proper use in night surprise attacks... [;)]




Speedysteve -> RE: All time worst War Movie (11/2/2005 3:41:28 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mogami

Hi, From "Zero" 1984 (Actually it is Brady last week at airshow)


[:D]




anarchyintheuk -> RE: All time worst War Movie (11/2/2005 7:08:59 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mogami

Hi, From "Zero" 1984 (Actually it is Brady last week at airshow)

[image]local://upfiles/944/AC1877E897234CC5AE1D0C60A787CF25.jpg[/image]


That's even illegal in Texas.




mlees -> RE: All time worst War Movie (11/2/2005 9:14:51 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mogami

Hi, From "Zero" 1984 (Actually it is Brady last week at airshow)

[image]local://upfiles/944/AC1877E897234CC5AE1D0C60A787CF25.jpg[/image]


This just goes to show that us guys think with our Johnsons. After all you did say
quote:

. With tears practically streaming from their eyes, their hearts swell with national pride. The two men decide to continue with their training in order to have a chance to fly such a plane. This just goes to prove that men will do anything to have the latest cutting-edge toys.





m10bob -> RE: All time worst War Movie (11/4/2005 12:06:10 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: anarchyintheuk


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mogami

Hi, From "Zero" 1984 (Actually it is Brady last week at airshow)

[image]local://upfiles/944/AC1877E897234CC5AE1D0C60A787CF25.jpg[/image]


That's even illegal in Texas.


But not Arkansas.............




Brady -> RE: All time worst War Movie (11/7/2005 3:15:16 AM)


LOL[:)]




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