Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fixed in the first patch?

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Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fixed in the first patch?

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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> Norm Koger's The Operational Art Of War III >> TOAW III Support >> Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fixed in the first patch?

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Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fixed i... - 6/7/2006 1:38:44 AM

Executioner Five

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The units not reconstituting thing is a dealkiller for me--I can't see how the game is playable with that.

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RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/7/2006 1:51:39 AM

JAMiAM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Executioner Five

The units not reconstituting thing is a dealkiller for me--I can't see how the game is playable with that.

Yes, we are testing the patch now, and apologize for the inconvenience. For now, I would recommend playing scenarios that are only 4 weeks or less in game length. This way, the effects of the reconstitution bug is minimized since reconstituted units appear over a 1-4 week period anyway. In fact, and this in no way excuses our gaffe, you might actually find some of the shorter length scenarios play better with no reconstitution of units, as those units are not going to be absorbing all of your replacements and scheduled to appear 10 turns after the scenario is over!

(in reply to Executioner Five)

Post #: 2

RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/7/2006 2:43:13 AM

Erik Rutins

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Getting a patch out to fix that is a priority for us - it won't stay that way for long at all.

Regards,

- Erik

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RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/7/2006 4:21:17 PM

Executioner Five

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Any word on a timeframe for this patch?

Right now I have a $40 coaster and I'm NOT a happy camper. I paid for an improved version of a game I already have because I love the game, and we were promised improvements. There is NO BLOODY WAY this shouldn't have been caught in beta.

(in reply to Erik Rutins)

Post #: 4

RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/7/2006 4:55:09 PM

Temple

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Executioner Five, I'm sure the guys feel pretty unhappy with themselves for letting this bug get through. You know you don't have a coaster, it's still quite playable with the shorter scenarios. If this is your first Matrix Games game, be aware that because they don't have the massive budgets for QA and product testing that Microsoft, EA, Ubisoft and some of the big publishers do, Matrix releases tend to have more day one bugs than might be seen on products from those giants. However, from my experiences Matrix has always responded quickly in bug squashing and works very closely with their customers. Just remember they are human just like you and I. Speak to them as you would wish people to speak to you.

(in reply to Executioner Five)

Post #: 5

RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/7/2006 5:03:49 PM

Executioner Five

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Temple, I play this game...and I bought TOAW III...for the longer scenarios. Just happens that's where my interests lie.

As for the question about budget...this bug has NOTHING to do with budget. Unless you're going to tell me NO ONE tested longer scenarios...which would be ridiculous in and of itself...then there is no way that anyone betatesting a longer scenario should not have caught this and reported it. The alternative is to believe that it was reported and Matrix chose to release in this condition anyway.

So therefore, either the betatesters, or Matrix, dropped the ball here. Bigtime. This is a showstopping bug for me, and I would imagine for many others.

(in reply to Temple)

Post #: 6

RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/7/2006 5:29:42 PM

Temple

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Actually it's a problem that easily could have slipped through. Beta testers are looking for lots of different features and functions to work and with hundreds of scenarios to try it's possible that the problem got reported but the change to fix it got dropped from the final release, or during one of the revisions the fix was thought to be implemented but didn't make it. Or the people who did the testing assumed it had already been reported and was to be fixed before release. That last one happens a lot. I don't know for sure, but I know the Matrix folks will try to make sure that kind of situation is identied and rectified.

And budget has everything to do with it. Big companies have full time testers who only do QA testing with set procedures and reporting systems. Game design is broken down into requirements and specifications, documentation is required for all production steps, and there are people paid just to maintain databases of bug reports and release notes. And they still have bugs slip through.

I've worked in large scale professional software development for almost thirty years and even now we still end up having to assess our processes periodically because problems still slip through.

(in reply to Executioner Five)

Post #: 7

RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/7/2006 5:33:44 PM

Erik Rutins

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I just want to emphasize two things:

1. We're not trying to excuse this
2. It's already fixed internally and we're rushing the first patch out to customers

However, there are many many ways that "something that should have been caught" is not. One of them is that testing is a moving target. You can test everything in the game (and in TOAW, that's a LOT) in Build #1 and then throw all that testing out in Build #2 because feature #852 broke and no one realized it. We understand how this happens, but we're not happy we missed it.

This is the part though, where ongoing support is worth its weight in gold. TOAW COW had a number of significant bugs that never had a patch released for them. With TOAW III, this (and anything else that comes up) will get patched so that the game is rock solid and improving.

Regards,

- Erik

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For official support, please use our Help Desk: http://www.matrixgames.com/helpdesk/

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(in reply to Temple)

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RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/7/2006 5:35:33 PM

Executioner Five

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If this is already fixed internally why not get us a hotfix already? If you've got the fix release what you've got please.

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Post #: 9

RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/7/2006 5:36:55 PM

Erik Rutins

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So as to not create a new need for a hotfix. It won't be much longer, really - I apologize for the inconvenience but we're working as fast as we can. I would keep checking in today and tomorrow.

Regards,

- Erik

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Erik Rutins
CEO, Matrix Games LLC

For official support, please use our Help Desk: http://www.matrixgames.com/helpdesk/

Freedom is not Free.

(in reply to Executioner Five)

Post #: 10

RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/7/2006 8:55:06 PM

Executioner Five

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How would it create a new need for a hotfix? You say you have a fix for this. You said yourself you're not trying to excuse it. You have something you can do about it. So DO it!

It's not fair to myself or anyone else for whom this is a gamebreaker to say "well, we've fixed your issue, but we're going to sit on it until we're ready."

All that does is piss off people you DON'T want to piss off--you want them to be return customers.

(in reply to Erik Rutins)

Post #: 11

RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/7/2006 9:17:54 PM

SlapBone

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Nevermind me.

< Message edited by SlapBone -- 6/7/2006 9:29:44 PM >

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RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/7/2006 9:25:37 PM

JAMiAM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Executioner Five

How would it create a new need for a hotfix?� You say you have a fix for this.� You said yourself you're not trying to excuse it.� You have something you can do about it.� So DO it!

It's not fair to myself or anyone else for whom this is a gamebreaker to say "well, we've fixed your issue, but we're going to sit on it until we're ready."

All that does is piss off people you DON'T want to piss off--you want them to be return customers.

I understand your frustration. However, we needed to make sure that we weren't going to give you three new bugs, by fixing this one. Or, are you really looking for "a bargain"?...

All joking aside, you can be assured that when we discovered that one of our previous fixes did in fact break reconstitution, a mere 7 hours after releasing the product, while testing on a related but separate issue, there was a minor crisis on our end, trying to make sure that the damage was minimized, and that a fix would be forthcoming to our customers, posthaste.

(in reply to Executioner Five)

Post #: 13

RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/7/2006 9:27:54 PM

Erik Rutins

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FYI, a HotFix will be available for this later today in the form of a public beta patch, which we expect to go official on Friday.

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Erik Rutins
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For official support, please use our Help Desk: http://www.matrixgames.com/helpdesk/

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(in reply to JAMiAM)

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RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/7/2006 9:32:02 PM

ralphtricky

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Executioner Five

How would it create a new need for a hotfix? You say you have a fix for this. You said yourself you're not trying to excuse it. You have something you can do about it. So DO it!

It's not fair to myself or anyone else for whom this is a gamebreaker to say "well, we've fixed your issue, but we're going to sit on it until we're ready."

All that does is piss off people you DON'T want to piss off--you want them to be return customers.

On the other hand, do you really want to have a patch that fixes one problem and breaks something else? It's tough deciding how much testing is enough. The Betatesters were really whipsawed at the end, with what seemed like daily builds for a while. This problem was not related to that, BTW.

TOAW III was released Monday, the bugs were discovered Monday by one of the Beta Testers. Tuesday, a fix was in place. The testers have tested it Tuesday night/Wednedsay. It should be released very soon.

Frankly, I think that's pretty fantastic turn-around by the team.

I understand your frustration. Trust me, I'm more angry at myself for missing this than you are.

Ralph

(in reply to Executioner Five)

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RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/7/2006 9:52:28 PM

Executioner Five

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

FYI, a HotFix will be available for this later today in the form of a public beta patch, which we expect to go official on Friday.

That's all we can ask. Thanks :).

(in reply to Erik Rutins)

Post #: 16

RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/8/2006 12:08:38 AM

Erik Rutins

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FYI, the v3.0.0.14 Public Beta is now available in the Members' Club. Please see the new Public Beta Feedback sub-forum for more info.

Regards,

- Erik

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For official support, please use our Help Desk: http://www.matrixgames.com/helpdesk/

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RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/8/2006 3:46:49 AM

Veers

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Kudos on the quick response to that bug. I'm thinking of starting a PBEM game on TOAW III. First question is: If nothing else is found to be wrong, would a game patched with this beta patch be compatible with a the public patch released when you guys release it?
Second question: Would it be wise to wait a few more days to see if any other major bugs are reported before beginning anything? That, obviously, is a subjective question, so instead: Do you think there will be any other major bugs to be found?:)

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RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/8/2006 4:00:43 AM

Erik Rutins

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1. Yes
2. We don't expect anything else major, the additional wait is just to make sure. I would personally feel confident starting a game with the beta patch, but I can't guarantee it of course.

Regards,

- Erik

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Erik Rutins
CEO, Matrix Games LLC

For official support, please use our Help Desk: http://www.matrixgames.com/helpdesk/

Freedom is not Free.

(in reply to Veers)

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RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/8/2006 4:02:40 AM

Veers

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Of course, and thanks.

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RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/8/2006 4:45:56 AM

Belisarios

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It's fixed...already...

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RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/8/2006 6:56:40 PM

roboczar

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Geez. Talk about rude...

People make mistakes and the fact that they acknowledge it is something you don't normally get these days. It's a slap in the face to people who work hard to supply their customers with a better game, to criticise them in such a way for making a mistake. Karma is threefold, man... I hope you've got some good karma saved up.

< Message edited by roboczar -- 6/8/2006 6:57:32 PM >

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RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/9/2006 4:38:55 PM

dennisb55

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Erik & Jamiam;
Excellent and very professional handling of 'the situation'. Your management should be proud.

(in reply to roboczar)

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RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/9/2006 10:13:55 PM

XPav

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Executioner Five, WHICH EB?

Seriously though, E5, man, chill out.

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RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/10/2006 2:37:13 AM

atheory

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I downloaded the beta patch, now when I play Fire in the East, during the supply phase, it won't get past the 5th German Reinforcement Bar. Upon reaching the 5th bar is seems to lock up. Worked fine before the beta patch.

Any thoughts?

Josh

(in reply to XPav)

Post #: 25

RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/10/2006 3:21:46 AM

JAMiAM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GrauWolf80

I downloaded the beta patch, now when I play Fire in the East, during the supply phase, it won't get past the 5th German Reinforcement Bar. Upon reaching the 5th bar is seems to lock up. Worked fine before the beta patch.

Any thoughts?

Josh

Give it more time. Depending on your system, this could take several minutes. If it takes more than 30 minutes, then let us know.

(in reply to atheory)

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RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/10/2006 5:09:48 AM

atheory

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More time? I understand it takes time, but why would the beta patch increase the time needed to caculate supplies? I've waited 12 minutes for the 2nd turn before exiting out.

When I first open the scenario it will calculate just fine, but upon advancing to the next turn, that's when it acts up. I never recall the scenario turns taking 30 minutes to calculate before.

My specs are as follow
AMD 64 4400 Dual Core
nVidia 6800 card
2 gig hyper X memory
10,000rpm HD

I'm sure my specs are enough to warrant no 30 minute calculations. But I could be wrong heh

(in reply to JAMiAM)

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RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/10/2006 5:31:10 AM

ralphtricky

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GrauWolf80

More time? I understand it takes time, but why would the beta patch increase the time needed to caculate supplies? I've waited 12 minutes for the 2nd turn before exiting out.

When I first open the scenario it will calculate just fine, but upon advancing to the next turn, that's when it acts up. I never recall the scenario turns taking 30 minutes to calculate before.

My specs are as follow
AMD 64 4400 Dual Core
nVidia 6800 card
2 gig hyper X memory
10,000rpm HD

I'm sure my specs are enough to warrant no 30 minute calculations. But I could be wrong heh

Can you post or email a copy of a save right before you end the turn?

(in reply to atheory)

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RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/10/2006 5:44:31 AM

JAMiAM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GrauWolf80

More time? I understand it takes time, but why would the beta patch increase the time needed to caculate supplies? I've waited 12 minutes for the 2nd turn before exiting out.

When I first open the scenario it will calculate just fine, but upon advancing to the next turn, that's when it acts up. I never recall the scenario turns taking 30 minutes to calculate before.

There is a lot of heavy duty number crunching as the program is trying to apportion the limited number of available replacements, among the thousand plus units, based on what is available and their replacement priorities. Often, it has to make several runs through to divide up equipment appropriately. On the first turn, there was no need for replacements, and likely not much in the inventory pool, either. Thus, it did not have to devote as much time to that part of the automatic bookkeeping phase.

The reason it didn't take as long, prior to the patch, is that it didn't have to also recalculate as often, to accomodate the diversion of inventory into units that would be scheduled for reconstitution.

quote:

ORIGINAL: GrauWolf80
My specs are as follow
AMD 64 4400 Dual Core
nVidia 6800 card
2 gig hyper X memory
10,000rpm HD

I'm sure my specs are enough to warrant no 30 minute calculations. But I could be wrong heh

The dual core is only firing on half it's "cylinders" currently. TOAW III is disabling one of the cores, because of issues with the audiere sound library. We are hoping to have that fixed soon, and Ralph just released to the Beta Testers a patch for evaluation. We need to test it though, before we release it as an open beta patch.

(in reply to atheory)

Post #: 29

RE: Are the reconstituting/airdrop bugs going to be fix... - 6/16/2006 1:47:58 AM

BigDuke66